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Track laying part 3 "The 32 foot panels!"


wenlock

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Thanks to a timely intervention by Buffalo who pointed out my error in assuming that my track should be built from 60 foot panels http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1131/entry-13638-track-laying-part-2/ , a slight rethink was nessessary! My project is set in 1905 and as 60 foot track panels didn't come into existance on the Great Western Railway until 1929, this length would be completely inappropriate for my layout. Thirty two foot rail sections first appeared on main lines in the 1870s, with their use spreading onto branch lines at a later date. Eleven, twelve or even thirteen sleepers were used to support the rail, this number being dependent upon how soft the underlying ground was found to be. I'm assuming that this rail would still be in use on a branchline around the turn of the 20th century. The sleepers were arranged on 3 foot centres, closing to two foot centres at the rail joints. In 7mm scale, 32 feet equates to a rail length of 224 mm. A 10 inch wide sleeper scales out at approximately 6mm, 3 foot sleeper centres scale out at 21mm. This means that i needed a 15 mm space between each sleeper, decreasing to 11 mm at the rail joints. Fortunately the track that I've built using my jig allows the sleepers to slide up and down the rail, so the incorect spacing wasn't a problem and could be easily corrected. In order to get the sleepers in the right place, I cut some pieces of balsa to act as jigs between the sleepers. I also made some jigs to hold the half track at the right distance from the run round loop line. Copydex was then used to fix the sleepers and half track in position on the baseboard.

 

Half track and balsa sleeper spacers.

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Half track from fiddle yard end.

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Half track from incline end.

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I built the points as individual pieces of trackwork, so once they had been placed in position it was nessessary to add or lengthen sleepers to support the rail. This was particularly important on the crossover at the end of the loop and the on the double slip/point combination.

 

End of loop crossover and baseboard joint.

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End of loop crossover with additional sleepers.

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Double Slip/Point timbers

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Once the half track had been put in position and the glue had dried, roller gauges were used to position the other rail. to improve the appearance of the track, I'm planing on cutting the rail part way through to represent the 32 foot pannels and applying cosmetic fishplates across these joints.

 

32 foot, 11 sleeper track panel

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Completed mainline and loop from fiddle yard end, with celebratory glass of red!

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Completed mainline and loop from incline end

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Well that's the state of play so far, I'm making progress but I've still got along way to go before the trackwork is finished. I've also discovered that there's a suprising amount of satisfaction to had just by pushing a wagon about with you finger tip on track that you've built! I can't say I'm looking forward to the wiring and I've still yet to settle on exactly how I'm going to operate the points. I don't like the impact on the tiebars caused by solenoids, so I may use some type of servo system. As usual your thoughts and advice are much appreciated.

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

  • Like 13
  • Craftsmanship/clever 1

20 Comments


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  • RMweb Gold

Nice to see the trackwork and wine flowing nicely!

I'm really not sure which one I enjoyed flowing more!

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I cannot see any marks / lines on the formation so please tell us how you have achieved the line of the permanent way.

 

thanks Graham

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Dave,

That is looking fantastic, I really love the way that the whole complex is built on a curve - adds a little more interest to my eyes, and more importantly looks realistic.

Ian

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  • RMweb Gold

I guess you've considered slow action point motors, in addition to servos, Dave? I used Tortoises on the 4mm layout, and invested in some Cobalt ones as well before deciding I didn't need as many points as originally thought. But they are nicely compact and seem relatively easy to install.

 

In terms of servos, I've yet to see Peco's new product in the flesh but it looks promising for a whole range of applications, such as crossing gates and so on.

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  • RMweb Gold

I cannot see any marks / lines on the formation so please tell us how you have achieved the line of the permanent way.thanks Graham

Hi Graham, I simply drew the whole plan out on wallpaper using a long piece of flexible wood to plot the curves. Once I'd built the points, I cut holes in the wallpaper template and fixed them in position. Once the points position had been fixed, the single track just linked these points together using the best possible curve.

 

I hope this explanation is ok.

 

Dave

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  • RMweb Gold

Dave,

That is looking fantastic, I really love the way that the whole complex is built on a curve - adds a little more interest to my eyes, and more importantly looks realistic.

Ian

Thanks Ian, I've got a "thing" about trying to avoid straight track if I can. As long as you're building your own track work and points, then its no harder to build on a curve really.

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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  • RMweb Gold

I guess you've considered slow action point motors, in addition to servos, Dave? I used Tortoises on the 4mm layout, and invested in some Cobalt ones as well before deciding I didn't need as many points as originally thought. But they are nicely compact and seem relatively easy to install.

 

In terms of servos, I've yet to see Peco's new product in the flesh but it looks promising for a whole range of applications, such as crossing gates and so on.

Hi Al, yes Tortoises and the like are on my list of things to be considered. I'm going to have to do a bit of research on this topic, things have moved on in the 20 years since I last built a layout!

 

I had a look on the net and I agree that the Peco servos do look very promising

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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The sweeping curve looks fantastic Dave, and the short track panels between the switch & crossing work is full of character.

 

Looking ahead, and apols if this is teaching granny to suck eggs, but it's worth thinking about the point rodding before ballasting, particularly placing the stool sadles and where rods pass under the rail.

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  • RMweb Gold

The sweeping curve looks fantastic Dave, and the short track panels between the switch & crossing work is full of character. Looking ahead, and apols if this is teaching granny to suck eggs, but it's worth thinking about the point rodding before ballasting, particularly placing the stool sadles and where rods pass under the rail.

Thanks Adrian, glad you like curve and the 32 foot panels.  I'm really glad Nick commented when he did because as you say the shorter track lengths do add character.  In regards to the point rodding I'm fairly clueless and am going to need all the help I can get!  I'd planed on leaving the ballasting until after I've fitted the uncoupling magnets and formed the basic scenic contours.  On a previous layout many years ago I knocked a bowl of Plaster of Paris over some freshly ballasted track and the result was not pretty!

 

I suppose one of the first decisions to make is whether or not this little branch line terminus would have warranted a signal box or not.  If not then I could either have a small platform mounted lever frame to control the slip point complex along with individual levers for the crossover at the end of the run round loop.  I'd appreciate any thoughts or advice on this aspect of the layout, this and the correct type of signalling are definitely on the "Need to find out more list!"

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

 

p s  I hope things are beginning to dry out in your part of the world! 

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Dave

 

32' rail lengths are right, the Tintern branch at the quarry was still laid in that on the main line - and that was after closure!

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  • RMweb Gold

Dave

 

32' rail lengths are right, the Tintern branch at the quarry was still laid in that on the main line - and that was after closure!

Hi Tim, that's really good to hear! It's prototype information like this, that when applied to a fictitious layout helps with credence.

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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  • RMweb Gold

The trackwork looks really good. I find it suits me to build the turnouts in situ with the rails flowing through then create the rail joints afterwards as I always seem to make small adjustments from the plan.

I adopted tortoises some years ago, the great advantage is they only need rough adjustment the stall mechanism then adjusts itself so no problems with changes in temperature.

I have not tried any servo types yet would they need to be reset if the temperature changes widely?

Don

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  • RMweb Gold

Hi Don, glad you like the track work. In an ideal world I would have built it all in situ as you suggest, but I find it easier with points to build them on a smaller board that I can view from all angles during construction.

 

Your point regarding the Tortoises being self adjusting during temperature changes is very interesting and an aspect of point control I hadn't considered. My only experience of servos was in my radio control aircraft modelling days, I've never put them to use in a railway setting.

 

All food for though, so many thanks for your response.

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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In regards to the point rodding I'm fairly clueless and am going to need all the help I can get! 

 

Then I can recommend the comprehensive and fully illustrated (photos and diagrams) 13-page guide to point rodding in the most recent Great Western Railway Journal #89 and is worth the cover price alone (the 25 page article on West Ealing was right up my street too!).

 

I suppose one of the first decisions to make is whether or not this little branch line terminus would have warranted a signal box or not.  If not then I could either have a small platform mounted lever frame to control the slip point complex along with individual levers for the crossover at the end of the run round loop.  I'd appreciate any thoughts or advice on this aspect of the layout, this and the correct type of signalling are definitely on the "Need to find out more list!"

 

There are a number of members on here who have a comprehensive knowledge of GW practice in this area - you're much safer taking advice from them! Wouldn't want to make the layout look like a subshed of Stratford ;)

 

 

 

 

p s  I hope things are beginning to dry out in your part of the world!

 

 

Thanks, but very slowly, unfortunately. Trying to get the loss adjuster, insurance company and surveyors to even talk to each other to progress the claim is...frustrating. Problem is that there are so many people in the same situation and manpower resources are not only finite but stretched to the limit. Latest estimate to completion, now nine weeks in, is at least another six months.

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Looking good, Dave. I agree with Adrian about getting the rodding in early. I didn't and the need to dig out the ballast every six feet is putting me off getting on with it.

 

The GWRJ article is very good, particularly on the dates of the various length requirements and the layout of compensators. However, I found it disappointing on the earlier round rod types. There aren't many photos or drawings of the early roller boxes and no mention of what was used before the 'A' shaped type. The author is not alone in this as I've not seen any mention of what, for want of a better term, I call the tubular type. These appear to date from the 1870s, or earlier, and are seen in a number of photos, e.g. at Rattery box (p41 in The Great Western in South Devon) or at Brislington (p9 in Through Countryide and Coalfield). I'm sure some of these would have survived into the Edwardian era, but you're probably safe with the 'A' shaped rollers.

 

Bearing in mind that there would be at least one crossover or turnout + trap off-scene to the left, the layout is probably complex enough to warrant a small signal box. It looks like you need about seven levers, including FPLs before considering signals. Signalling might be minimal, relying mostly on handsignals especially if operated one engine in steam. Of course, there are examples of both minimalist and full works approaches on the GWR. It would be interesting to see what Mike (The Stationmaster) has to say on this.

 

Nick

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  • RMweb Gold

Then I can recommend the comprehensive and fully illustrated (photos and diagrams) 13-page guide to point rodding in the most recent Great Western Railway Journal #89 and is worth the cover price alone (the 25 page article on West Ealing was right up my street too!).

 

 

 

There are a number of members on here who have a comprehensive knowledge of GW practice in this area - you're much safer taking advice from them! Wouldn't want to make the layout look like a subshed of Stratford ;)

 

 

 

 

Thanks, but very slowly, unfortunately. Trying to get the loss adjuster, insurance company and surveyors to even talk to each other to progress the claim is...frustrating. Problem is that there are so many people in the same situation and manpower resources are not only finite but stretched to the limit. Latest estimate to completion, now nine weeks in, is at least another six months.

Good to hear at least some progress is being made with your claim, I can imagine how frustrating it all must be!

 

Thanks for the "heads up" about GWRJ 89, I'll try to get hold of a copy on the way home tonight.

 

I thought I might post up a request for a signalling diagram for my trackplan on the "questions" section of the forum. There are as you say some very knowledgeable members on RMweb!

 

Dave

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  • RMweb Gold

Looking good, Dave. I agree with Adrian about getting the rodding in early. I didn't and the need to dig out the ballast every six feet is putting me off getting on with it.

 

The GWRJ article is very good, particularly on the dates of the various length requirements and the layout of compensators. However, I found it disappointing on the earlier round rod types. There aren't many photos or drawings of the early roller boxes and no mention of what was used before the 'A' shaped type. The author is not alone in this as I've not seen any mention of what, for want of a better term, I call the tubular type. These appear to date from the 1870s, or earlier, and are seen in a number of photos, e.g. at Rattery box (p41 in The Great Western in South Devon) or at Brislington (p9 in Through Countryide and Coalfield). I'm sure some of these would have survived into the Edwardian era, but you're probably safe with the 'A' shaped rollers.

 

Bearing in mind that there would be at least one crossover or turnout + trap off-scene to the left, the layout is probably complex enough to warrant a small signal box. It looks like you need about seven levers, including FPLs before considering signals. Signalling might be minimal, relying mostly on handsignals especially if operated one engine in steam. Of course, there are examples of both minimalist and full works approaches on the GWR. It would be interesting to see what Mike (The Stationmaster) has to say on this.

 

Nick

Hi Nick, on your recommendation I treated myself to a copy of Through Countryide and Coalfield, so  i'll have a look at the rodding on page 9.    As you say, there would be more point work on the other side of the planned road overbridge on the left of the layout.  I'm toying with the idea that there could have been an engine shed and turntable on this off stage part of the layout.  The main merit of this is that I could run and turn passenger tender loco's on the layout, should I ever get time to build them!

 

I like the idea of a small signal box, if only because I find them such attractive little buildings!   I think a small box mounted on the end of the platform might look right, but I'm open to other ideas!

 

I bought a copy of GWRJ 89 on the way home last night.  I've not had chance for an in depth read, but it does appear to be just what I need to get me started!

 

I think asking "The Stationmaster" for his views would be very useful!

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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  • RMweb Premium

Simply superb craftsmanship - art full, in fact.  When track is laid like this it's just like looking at the real thing.   Oh, to be able to get curves so right!

 

Mike

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  • RMweb Gold

Simply superb craftsmanship - art full, in fact.  When track is laid like this it's just like looking at the real thing.   Oh, to be able to get curves so right!

 

Mike

Thanks Mike, I'm very flattered and delighted you like the progress so far. I'm hoping to get the track work completed over the Easter break, but I get the feeling Mrs Wenlock may have other ideas!

 

Best wishes

 

Dave

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