Thanks for posting this! I'm way behind you in understanding German signalling, so can you please explain how the signal next to the double slip would be used?

Nick

Thanks for posting this! I'm way behind you in understanding German signalling, so can you please explain how the signal next to the double slip would be used?

 

Nick

From "Usage and placement of signals"

On freight yards or freight tracks Group Exit Signals may be used. This is a single signal placed after the last point where all tracks it governs join. Additionally at the end of each individual track a high line-close signal (Sh 0/1) is placed to be able to show which track exactly is cleared with the group exit signal.

HTH! It's one of those practises I couldn't quite accept in my own mind!

Looks scary and complex!

On the expense front, is there anything you can do to move some of the signals off-stage? It might also be worth thinking about from a visual clutter point of view - since the length is necessarily compressed, everything's a lot closer together than on the prototype, and I'd be worried it'll look busy. I don't know, maybe sleepy German branch lines really have forests of signals though?

With light signals, the number of posts in that image would go down from 8 to four and one ground signal. As for the prototype, it would seem to be a forest or none at all- without signals though, it would be a "one loco" layout. Some of the signals on the plan are offscene, they're just there to give context, as if I were drawing the plan for the actual signalbox.

Addendum: For an example of a branch terminus not-too-distant from Bad Horn's supposed location, see Wuppertal-Cronenberg.

Cheers for the info Rich. So the two at the left-hand end are offscene, and you'd end up with four posts around the "exit" end of the loop and perhaps two at the other end?

From "Usage and placement of signals"

 

HTH! It's one of those practises I couldn't quite accept in my own mind!

Thanks, I've yet to digest all the details on placement...

Am I then correct in thinking that this one would control access to the main line, and the two shunt signals in the lower right of the photo permit access to the headshunt?

Nick

The shunt signals both permit access to the headshunt, and as I understand it, clear with the departure signal for whichever road the route is set for. I think, if the heashunt wasn't there and it was a single turnout for the loop and siding, it could be a hand thrown point with a single shunt and main signal both adjacent to it.

Also, I put in a derailer symbol thinking it was the symbol for a points indicator (right hand headshunt in the plan). So that's superfluous. If the bay wasn't a passenger road, it could be controlled just with a shunt signal and derailer, although this wouldn't allow a direct departure.

I was wondering if the headshunt would work better as an industry spur as well - it could go off-scene under the bridge happily enough. Have a nose at http://www.ahrtalbahn.de/index-ahr.htm and then the gleisplan of Adenau in 1975 to confirm signal placing and the prescence of a very similar kickback siding.

traben-Trarbach http://www.kbs621.hochwaldbahn.info/reload.html?trabentrarbach.htm have a look for the 1965 gleisplan uses only 1 hp1 for departure and an hp2 for arrivals - that would work.

Hi Kev,

The crucial question for me over Traben-Trarbach is whether it allows multiple trains to be in the station at once. Looking through the pictures, I can only see one item of motive power in the station at any one time. Adenau is signalled more akin to Bad Horn, with tracks 1 and 2 having Hp1 and Hp2 signals respectively. I could position an Sh1 only for track 2 on Bad Horn, but that offers no saving compared to having a group departure signal for tracks 2 and 3 (let alone operational flexibility), although it is perhaps more likely that track 2 would only have an Sh1 while track 3 would have Sh1 and Hp2 signals. I probably don't actually need the shunt signal on track 4 (assuming passnger trains only using it) now I think about it, that was just following W-Cronenberg. That said, looking at similar termini, track 4 probably wouldn't be a passenger track, rather it would be the track for public freight, and as such only needs a derailer.

So, I've got my head around things enough to signal for maxium flexibility. Now I need to think like an accountant and work out the minimum neccesary!