IC126 Posted December 11, 2009 Share Posted December 11, 2009 INDEX to main posts in this thread: Introduction (this post) Signalling Diagram & Discussion Drawings of Booking Office Signal box construction Start of Booking Office consruction Disaster strikes during house move Pressing ahead against 2010 Challenge deadline Track painting and ballasting Printing stone in DAS modelling compound More work on Booking Office Time's up! 2010 Challenge deadline Layout outside for photos Life after the 2010 Challenge: Railway room completed ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Original Post: The small layout I've been slowly building for the last couple of years seems to neatly fall within the parameters of the 2010 challenge. This might provide the spur I need to actually get it finished.... Dimensions/Track plan I regularly work away from home and when the challenge was first announced I was away from home and I wasn't sure if the layout was eligible - but once home a quick check shows that the size is well within limits: Scenic Board = 2300mm x 500mm overall - (300mm x 700mm/2) triangle Traverser Board = 90mm x 500mm inlet section (included) + 1200mm x 350mm table (not included in size calculation) Giving a total scenic area of 1090,000 mm2 or 1689,5 in2 in old money. The layout is built in 0 Gauge finescale, so the fiddle yard is excluded from the size calculation, but the Traverser board has a short section of inlet track which I'll ballast, so I've included that as scenic-section in the size calculation. The concept: One side of my railway room is allocated to the 7mm layout and the odd shaped baseboards were decided upon as the best use of available space. I did the original planning in 4/7ths scale in full 3D - that is to say I made a cardboard template of the layout to 4mm scale and had a play about with some 00 gauge track and models to optimise the layout and clearances of the trackwork and the overall look of the layout. I wanted to avoid straight lines and parallel sidings and eventually came up with the idea of an S-bend running through the configuration which suggested a possible location for the layout - The track plan is completely fictional and the sweeping S of the main lines is sadly underscale, but has at least a nod towards the actual topography of the area. Paisley Canal No.2 is the name of the signal box around which I'm building the layout. The box is set to the east of the old station, using the wooden station building on the bridge as a scenic break to the main fiddle yard. On the prototype the attractive wooden booking office was on a road overbridge with with stairs leading down to the platforms. I shall need to greatly reduce the importance of Causeyside Street to avoid too much modelling of tarmac or cobbles on my limited area. 1 or 2 fiddle yards will be used to feed the layout via the main lines. A short traverser has been built for home use at the right hand "Ayrshire end". Possible future exhibition use could use a fiddle yard at the Glasgow end too. Even with one short fiddle yard, possibilities for shunting are quite reasonable - certainly much better than no layout at all..... Trains can reverse on the double crossover on the main running lines (although the likelihood in reality of Ayrshire Coast trains terminating at Paisley Canal instead of Glasgow St Enoch in 1968 are admittedly slim). In addition to the crossovers, I have added a lay-by siding and a siding into an as yet undesignated industry for interest. There was once a whisky distillery with sidings quite near this location - which might provide some varied traffic possibilities - but this was in reality well outwith the station area. An excellent history of the line can be found on the RailScot website with some nice photographs of the line. This one of the Booking office was the most useful to me. Declaration of Progress to Date: As can be seen from the photographs, the baseboards are complete and almost all track and points have been laid. Wiring (with the exclusion of the control panel - which has not been started) is complete. I'm using DCC for sound - but took the unusual step of wiring the layout on the old cab control principles - this will allow me to switch some/all sections over to a DC controller or to the programming track output. Those of you who are MIGO+1 members may have already seen the layout here http://migoforum.co....&st=0&sk=t&sd=a . [sorry - the link only works if you are registered on the MIGO website - but I know a lot of you are....] I've started to make some CAD sketches for the station buildings and was fortunate that one of the members of the G&SWR Association could provide me with dimensions he took from the real thing before demolition. To make up for my head start with the layout, I'll chronicle the building of a loco and some stock to run on it. I'm currently working on a Right Price Railway Company Class 06. Progress on this and any stock I manage to cobble together shall be covered in my Blog Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Unsurprisingly this one ticks a lot of boxes chez Jamie Shall be watching with envy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davknigh Posted December 12, 2009 Share Posted December 12, 2009 Andrew, Is this set in the Robertson's Marmalade era? I have fond memories of the smells from there. :icon_drool: Cheers, David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 13, 2009 Author Share Posted December 13, 2009 Andrew, Is this set in the Robertson's Marmalade era? I have fond memories of the smells from there. Cheers, David Marmalade? I love marmalade. I'm interested in this traffic. Much more interesting than whisky. or oil. Please elucidate. The Canal Line was one of my great childhood mysteries - I lived in Johnstone and of course most of the trains I took were routed via the main line (Gilmour Street). Every diversion via the Canal Line was an unexpected bonus - a bonus that I never believed would end. I used to love to look out for the road to my auntie's house in Foxbar as the DMU squealed it' s way round the frighteningly sharp curves between Canal Street and Elderslie. Magic. That's the thing I love about railway modelling - the "boring" humdrum of everyday life. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 13, 2009 Author Share Posted December 13, 2009 Unsurprisingly this one ticks a lot of boxes chez Jamie Shall be watching with envy Thanks Jamie - It ticks a lot of boxes with me too - spent too many years trying to recreate the West Highland and the Settle & Carlisle line before I realised that the the lines I loved the most were a lot closer to home... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davknigh Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Marmalade? I love marmalade. I'm interested in this traffic. Much more interesting than whisky. or oil. Please elucidate. The Canal Line was one of my great childhood mysteries - I lived in Johnstone and of course most of the trains I took were routed via the main line (Gilmour Street). Every diversion via the Canal Line was an unexpected bonus - a bonus that I never believed would end. I used to love to look out for the road to my auntie's house in Foxbar as the DMU squealed it' s way round the frighteningly sharp curves between Canal Street and Elderslie. Magic. That's the thing I love about railway modelling - the "boring" humdrum of everyday life. My Grandparents lived on Espedair St. so Canal St station and Causeyside St and the trams were a big part of visits to Paisley. Robertsons IIRC (this was over 50 years ago) was in the south west quadrant using Causeyside as the north-south axis. Time period is the early '50s. I am prepared to stand corrected but the smell of the jam being cooked formed an indelible memory. Cheers, David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Legend Posted December 13, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 13, 2009 I'm from Paisley originally and had an Aunt that worked in Robertsons . The Jam Factory as we knew it . It went on into the 70s I think, although she had retired by then. I regret it now, but I overlooked the canal line, preferring the main lines through Gilmour St as you could always catch a train there, whereas there seemed to be much less traffic on canal line. Actually there was more interesting traffic at Canal. with shunting of yard etc. I remember it being done with a Class 20 if thats any help. Anyway good luck with project- will certainly be looking out for your updates Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 13, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2009 I'm not sure I understand the track plan and how it's going to work you appear to have two facing crossovers built into a double junction Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 13, 2009 Share Posted December 13, 2009 Never underestimate the eccentricity of the 'SouWest', beast...! Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 13, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 13, 2009 Never underestimate the eccentricity of the 'SouWest', beast...! Dave. The track plan is completely fictional It was this bit that made me wonder.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Even so, the company wasn't known for its conventional outlook...! Still, looks fun...! Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nortonian Posted December 14, 2009 Share Posted December 14, 2009 Hello Andrew, Looking forward to seeing this one develop too. Have you glued the chairs to the sleepers or are they cosmetic ?. Kindest Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
emac Posted December 15, 2009 Share Posted December 15, 2009 Even so, the company wasn't known for its conventional outlook...! Still, looks fun...! Dave. Couple of links for paisley Canal st Station and goods yard http://www.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-000-570-651-C&searchdb=scran&scache=3proxi594h http://www.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-000-570-665-C&searchdb=scran&scache=3proxi594h goods yard looks like a fun layout Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 Hopefully the attached pdf will explain the track plan. This is my draft design for the control panel - which I hope will go some way to mimicing a signal box diagram. Comments/suggestions welcome. Each of the "levers" will operate points/signals or switch the track sections between DC or DCC power feeds. Paisley Canal Street No2.pdf Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 16, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2009 Hopefully the attached pdf will explain the track plan. This is my draft design for the control panel - which I hope will go some way to mimicing a signal box diagram. Comments/suggestions welcome. Each of the "levers" will operate points/signals or switch the track sections between DC or DCC power feeds. Would you like feedback on the signalling ? I would never advise using signals to route power - your layout, your choice - but it means you either over signal a layout just to get the power or can't make unsignalled moves, and these were quite common. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nortonian Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Hopefully the attached pdf will explain the track plan. This is my draft design for the control panel - which I hope will go some way to mimicing a signal box diagram. Comments/suggestions welcome. Each of the "levers" will operate points/signals or switch the track sections between DC or DCC power feeds. Hi Andrew, Just as a matter of interest, what purpose does the facing crossover serve ?.(no 12) Kindest Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 16, 2009 Author Share Posted December 16, 2009 Beast66606: The track power and the point and signal levers shall be completely separate and independant. I originally thought about doing this (to use less switches) but decided it would not work without a lot of interlocking complication (and extra signals as you mentioned). It means that I need a number of "extra" power feed switches (that wouldn't of course be in the "real" box). I got round this by planning the section switches as white ("spare") levers (ie No.s 5, 8, 11, 15, 18, 21). The plan is that I can make the panel for this layout, but reconfigure it easily for any future layout by replacing/rewiring the switches as required (and replacing the printed signal box diagram). I would appreciate comments on the signalling (not all of which shall be on the modelled section). Ian: The purpose of the facing crossover is purely for operation - it forms half of a runround loop in the 2.3m I have available for the scenic part of the layout. It's basically just a shunting puzzle that could possibly be reused as part of a larger layout in the future. Also - in response to your earlier question - all the chairs are glued directly to the ply sleepers with Tamiya solvent glue. It seems strong enough when it's all in place, but I wish I had followed your idea of gluing down the sleepers in advance as there is very little strength in the sections when they are not firmly in place on the baseboard. Some regluing was required after transferring the track from template to layout. Thanks to everyone else for interesting feedback and links to photos, etc. I'm working away from home this week, so there will unfortunately not be any layout progress until the Christmas vacation. I am however continuing to build stock for the layout and a Parkside "Grampus" wagon is this weeks subject. More on this in my Blog in due course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nortonian Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Hello Andrew, Not wanting to be pedantic, but just trying to get my head around the signalling plan, baring in mind I have still to design my own plan for Byker Gate. Is the trailing crossover(no 3) the other half of the runround loop, or is that `off stage` ?. If so, its a short loop and I am uneasy about the facing crossover for shunting movements where no direct access is required to a facing siding. Also would there `not` be any distant signals in the station limits operated by No2 box, if so, should No7 not be operated by No1 box ?. Should No22 distant not be a inner home or a banner repeater ?. Should No2 distant not be operated by the next box and appear black on the diagram ?. Far be it from me to suggest I know what I`m talking about, just wondering about any pitfalls when it comes to my turn if you see what I mean. I`m sure Beast could answer these questions ?. How close is your signalling plan to the original ?. Micknich of this parish is a leading authority on all things signalling. `Mr NER` particularly. Kindest Ian Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 16, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2009 Micknich of this parish is a leading authority on all things signalling. `Mr NER` particularly. He's not the only one - but he is a very good friend of mine. Flyingsignalman, StationMaster, myself and others know plenty about signalling I will redraw the plan presently Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 16, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2009 My version. You need a limit of shunt on the down main to prevent movements over the facing crossover just heading off into the distance ! I've removed the extra distants. The down starter would probably be slotted by No.1 box and act as it's down home. I decided to make the up to down facing shunt signal a miniature arm for visibility. I've doubled some of the discs - not all companies did that, and not even those that did, did not always provide them, but given you are using it as a shunting layout I've made them doubles so the moves can be seen. hth, Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 17, 2009 Author Share Posted December 17, 2009 Thanks Beast - That's exactly the type information I was hoping for. I was particularly unsure about the use double discs and arrangement for the signal at the platform end. The operational possibilities of such a small layout are quite limited, so I'm quite keen to add interest with signalling. A load of MSE parts are already waiting to be soldered. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Del Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Now how odd is that? I was thinking yesterday afternoon about the thread that talked about a model of 'The Bridge', from the Ian Rankin book of the same name. And that got me wondering about his book 'Espedair Street'. So then I found out via Wikipedia that Espedair Street actually exists, which I looked up on Streetmap. Lo and behold, there's a station nearby and it's Paisley Canal! How's that for serendipity? Or is it synchronicity? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted December 17, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 17, 2009 How's that for serendipity? Or is it synchronicity? I think thats a Police album Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IC126 Posted December 17, 2009 Author Share Posted December 17, 2009 Ian Rankin is one of my wife's favourite authors - I was just thinking of getting her one of his books for Christmas... Spooky. (or maybe a Police album... ) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davknigh Posted December 17, 2009 Share Posted December 17, 2009 Ian Rankin is one of my wife's favourite authors - I was just thinking of getting her one of his books for Christmas... Spooky. (or maybe a Police album... ) Err, Iain Banks wrote The Bridge and Espedair Street (among others). Not to take anything away from Iain Rankin who is also a brilliant author. Cheers, David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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