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Signs, posters and adverts


Mikkel

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Here's a selection of the signs, posters and adverts that I've used on "The bay" to help enhance the ambience.

 

 

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The station sign for Farthing, summarizing the fictional geography of the old N&SR line. The sign is printed, a temporary measure that may become permanent now that the RMweb competition is tempting me to move on quickly to the next layout in the series. I intended to use Smiths 4mm and 2mm etched letters for the job, although testing suggested that it would be very time consuming as there is so much text here. The sign was printed using fonts stored in the files section of the always excellent GWR e-list.

 

 

 

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The Smiths etched letters are good though, and for a simpler station sign the job would quickly have been done. These are 4mm and 2mm scale respectively. This type of letters appears to have been introduced on the GWR around 1906, replacing an earlier more elaborate style.

 

 

 

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The screen for the Gentlemen's lavatory. The posterboard is a modified card item from Tiny Signs. I built up a frame from thin strips of Plastikard to bring out the relief. The posters are reduced and printed from examples found on the web. I've since noticed that many GWR posterboards from the period had a darkish frame. I assume it is the brown colour discussed in this thread? In that case I'll need to send in the painters.

 

 

 

 

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The posterboards from Tiny Signs as they come. An alternative set is available from Smiths.

 

 

 

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Enamel adverts, mostly from Tiny Signs. I tone them down slightly with satin varnish and weather them with eg a little rust at the edges. I've also made a few adverts myself, based on real prototypes that I've reproduced on the PC. Unfortunately my printer can't match the sharply printed commercial offerings. New insights from David Bigcheeseplant here on RMweb indicates that when the painters are done with the posterboards, they can move on to the window frames and apply the same brown colour.

 

 

 

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A sheet of adverts from Tiny Signs. It can be quite hard to tell what period the different adverts are from, as appearances can be deceitful and a check of old photos doesn't always help. I seem to remember there was a series of articles about enamel ads in Model Rail some years ago. Does anyone remember what issues they were?

 

 

 

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Etched station signs from Scalelink. These were painted all-over black while still on the etch, after which the paint was wiped off the raised letters. The letters were then painted white by carefully dragging a broad flat brush across them.

 

Edited by Mikkel

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Hand painted. If you pore over the photos in the OPC books you'll find less consistency than you'd think - especially on the 'Tons.Tare'

 

See Russell "Wagons & Loads" figs 123 & 124. P.14 Grampus No. 14351 showing both sides on the same date & plenty of variations between them.

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21 hours ago, flyingbadger said:

Hi Mikkel

A awhile back you did some veneer printed crates. What sizes did you decide on for tea chests? I would like to gove it ago having come across a very nice company who gave me some thin veneer sheets to play with. Any help you could give would be much appretiated. 

Regards Goods Agent Fisher SE&CR note, change of role here.

 

Good to hear that you found some veneer sheets! I have just measured my crates. I made different types, based on photos. The  "standard" looking ones are 10.2 x 8.9 (with, ahem, variations!).

 

image.png.24faa91be955102c9c3199a60316eaa5.png

 

But please note I can't remember where I got those measurements.  Subsequently Ray measured his own real-world tea crate:

 

On 04/04/2015 at 11:41, Silver Sidelines said:

Hello Mikkel
 
Just added a picture of our tea chest. 

16840860720_83f05a76b6_c.jpg

Just spotted that there is an interesting 'porter's trolley' next to it - came from the Liverpool area.
 
Regards
 
Ray

 

Edit - Height 610mm, width 510mm and depth 410mm (24 inch x 20 inch x 16inch)

 

According to my scale calculator, in 4mm that is 8.0 x 6.6 x 5.3 mm

 

Edited by Mikkel
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5 hours ago, K14 said:

Hand painted. If you pore over the photos in the OPC books you'll find less consistency than you'd think - especially on the 'Tons.Tare'

 

See Russell "Wagons & Loads" figs 123 & 124. P.14 Grampus No. 14351 showing both sides on the same date & plenty of variations between them.

 

6943977590_e3f02487ae_c.jpg

 

Lettering Mineral Wagons at Faverdale Wagon Works, North Eastern Railway, Darlington. by Man of Yorkshire, on Flickr

 

BTW I was interested to see this stenciling method for smaller lettering. I wonder if something similar was also used in some cases back then: 

 

https://quornwagonandwagon.co.uk/2018/04/02/final-touches-and-signwriting/

 

 

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No sign of marking-out in the Ferndale photo. I suppose if you were at it all day every day you'd not need such. I wonder if these men specialised and whether there was any seniority? From my own experience, I'd say that doing Ns was a step up* from Es. I bet there was much muttering about de-skilling when the lettering was changed from N.E.R. to N E! I recently did a back of the envelope calculation for the Midland, based on a 7-year repainting cycle, that 120 sets of M R initials were painted every day, counting each side of a wagon separately.

 

Note the key piece of equipment, the signwriter's Mahl stick,  and the way they've painted up to the diagonal ironwork, then on it, finishing off with the final bit below.

 

*literally so, in this case!

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1 hour ago, Nick Holliday said:

That's a good picture showing how the tops of the planks forming the sides have been chamfered on the top outside edge, and are square on the bottom, so that water drains off, and doesn't sit in the joint.  3D printers please note!

 

There's all sorts to see, such as the angled brackets supporting the side rail of these 8'0" wide (?) wagons, the angled plank at the bottom of the door to give a smooth passage for sack barrows, the bang plate along the top of the door, and the lack of chamfer along the top of the side-rail*, or along the bottom of the side rail. On older wagons, the latter was quite prominent; I've assumed it was a weight-reducing feature. Altogether a highly sophisticated modern wagon.

 

*but there is a chamfer on the end floor plank - also daylight between that and the bottom end plank, showing that the weight of these is being taken by the end stanchions.

Edited by Compound2632
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1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

There's all sorts to see, such as the bang plate along the top of the door, and the lack of chamfer along the top of the side-rail*, or along the bottom of the side rail.

Is that a bang plate along the top of the door?  There appear to be a pair of prominent door stops off the solebar which would connect with the door about half way up. It is difficult to tell where they are located, but there is an unusual widening of the door ironwork, roughly where I think the stops would make contact. Other wagons of this ilk seem to have had a single door stop, for which the central strap would provide protection.

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29 minutes ago, Nick Holliday said:

Is that a bang plate along the top of the door?  

OK not a bang plate as such, protecting the woodwork on contact with the doorstop (the middle vertical ironwork does that) but a wrap-around piece of steel sheet that protects the top plank of the door when it's dropped onto a loading bank or similar, or just from the wear and tear of having barrows etc. hitting it. 

 

It all depends what "bang" you have in mind!

Edited by Compound2632
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Thanks for the tea crate sizes Mikkel.

By way of thanks, in 1875 an act was passed that required towns, not villages, hamlets etc, to have pavements, street lighting and rubbish boxes. Not dustbins, very 20C, but any biscuit tin, box or other container and household could and were fined for failing to put theirs out for collection. So as Farthing has both it must be a town assuming the gas supply must also be used by the GWR.

Edited by flyingbadger
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11 hours ago, Nick Holliday said:

That's a good picture showing how the tops of the planks forming the sides have been chamfered on the top outside edge, and are square on the bottom, so that water drains off, and doesn't sit in the joint.  3D printers please note!

 

Don't anyone tell Airnimal (S7).

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6 hours ago, Adam88 said:

 

Don't anyone tell Airnimal (S7).

 

Mike chamfers correctly.

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7 hours ago, flyingbadger said:

Thanks for the tea crate sizes Mikkel.

By way of thanks, in 1875 an act was passed that required towns, not villages, hamlets etc, to have pavements, street lighting and rubbish boxes. Not dustbins, very 20C, but any biscuit tin, box or other container and household could and were fined for failing to put theirs out for collection. So as Farthing has both it must be a town assuming the gas supply must also be used by the GWR.

 

Thanks badger. Definitely a town. Got the pavements in place, street lighting to come. Currently working on trees. Rubbish boxes will be off-scene I think, on the residential side of the street.

 

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K14

Posted (edited)

Quote

On 21/03/2021 at 06:54, Mikkel said:

 


    BTW I was interested to see this stenciling method for smaller lettering. I wonder if something similar was also used in some cases back then:


    https://quornwagonandwagon.co.uk/2018/04/02/final-touches-and-signwriting/
 

 

 

AKA 'Pouncing', although strictly speaking a proper pounce is made from a piece of oiled card which is then perforated with a needle to give a dotted outline. The card is then patted with a muslin bag filled with French Chalk which goes through the holes.

 

When I was doing it, I just printed the design onto 80 gsm paper & chalked the back to transfer it rather as Mr Baker has done at Quorn.

 

As to historical examples... There are plenty of examples showing a guide lines - top only if you're using the plank edge as a bottom guide - but very few showing anything else. I did turf up these though:—

 

March 1938: This looks as though the G W and 12T have been pounced, & maybe the number too (that 8 is very nice & both the 5s are suspiciously similar):—

 

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August 1948: Not sure about this one - the 'dotted box' is something I've not seen elsewhere & the general wonkiness suggests freehand:—

 

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June 1958: Plenty of chalk lines here, & a suspicion of sketching out on the number - sort of a halfway house between pouncing/tracing & freehand:—

 

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Edited by K14
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Excellent illustrations, many thanks.

 

I was not aware of the term 'pouncing' (or did we discuss it on here long ago - argh, memory!). I suppose we have all done something similar at some point, but I didn't realize it was an established method. 

 

Has anyone modelled a wagon with chalk lines for numbering still visible, I wonder. Might be a bit tricky to make it subtle enough in 4mm scale, but presumably not too hard.

 

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Pouncing is also a technique used, I believe, by tailors.

You can buy "pouncing wheels", which are essentially toothed wheels (gears!) on a bearing at the end of a stick, for running long patterns, creating holes for chalking material.

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1 hour ago, Regularity said:

Pouncing is also a technique used, I believe, by tailors.

 

Also by our cat, leaving small holes in material or skin.

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