martin_wynne

Hi Andy, You are welcome to upload BOX files to Templot Club, and then link to them here. Go to: https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?resources/categories/samples-and-examples.12/ and click Add resource. cheers, Martin.

Where did I suggest it as a standard? It's just my own preferred way by a long margin, and I'm not changing now. My eyes are 75 years old. Martin.

Are we short of space? Not many lines of code take up the full page width. Martin.

The tab is the title of this topic, as written by the OP. Martin.

Who's this "we"? I hate camel case. I use underscores, which is 10 times easier to type and read: we_run_words_together. Martin.

@hayfield Hi John, DesignSpark Mechanical (DSM), which is a version of SpaceClaim re-badged by RS. It has a different way of working from Fusion360. The free DSM Explorer version 6 will export only in STL format, but that is all you need for 3D printing. (There are paid-for versions with extra features, but you don't need them for 3D printing models.) It's entirely free, and a proper Windows executable program which runs on your computer, not online. You own your files and know where they are. You can use it for commercial work, unlike Fusion360. For an example of models designed in DSM and printed on a Mars 2 (the Alkaid is a clone of that and would produce similar results), see: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/topic/174102-thinking-about-3d-printing-where-to-start/?do=findComment&comment=4926660 This DSM video is several years old, but it is all still the same: Lots of DSM tutorials available: https://www.rs-online.com/designspark/learn-designspark-mechanical Download from (if you don't have an RS account you need to register for one first -- easy): https://www.rs-online.com/designspark/mechanical-download-and-installation cheers, Martin.

@Jeremy Cumberland Hi Jeremy, Not so. On both the prototype and model in 00-SF, when the flange on one side is running hard against the edge of the rail (i.e. not in the middle of the flangeway), the back of the opposite wheel should just kiss the check rail. For RTR wheels (NMRA RP-25/110 profile) on 00-SF, the back-to-back should be in the range 14.3mm min - 14.4mm max. Many modern RTR models comply with this, but not all. An occasional rogue wheelset may need adjustment. 14.5mm b-t-b will be too wide on many RTR models, and may cause binding between the rails in 00-SF. The 00-SF dimensions and advice on setting various wheels is at: https://85a.uk/00-sf/ The 00-SF standard (then called "EM minus 2") was invented by the late Roy Miller in 1973. It is just a happy accident that most modern RTR models run nicely on it. That wasn't the original design intent -- at that time RTR models were children's toys. Martin.

@MarshLane Rich, you addressed your remarks directly to me in John's topic on RMweb, without quoting anything I had posted here to which you might be replying. If you wanted to ask me a question about Templot plug track, the place to do that is on the Templot Club forum. Or if you wanted to hear the opinions of everyone here experimenting with 3D track, there was no reason to mention me specifically. Martin.

@MarshLane I object very strongly to the suggestion in the above post that it is my responsibility to provide answers about anything. I am tinkering with 3D printed model railway track for my own interest and amusement -- nothing more. I have made my hobby interest open for anyone else to join in if they wish. That is all. I am not in any sense pushing or promoting or selling 3D printed track, and I have no more knowledge of the long-term stability of the materials I'm using than anyone else. FDM materials are thermoplastics. Thermoplastics are widely used in the hobby -- for RTR locomotives and rolling stock, wagon kits, flexi-track, buildings and structures, scratch building with plasticard, etc. There is no reason to believe that 3D-printed thermoplastics will behave any differently in the long-term from any others. Everything will depend on the conditions and circumstances in which they are used. The oldest FDM printed track bases I have here are 5 years old. I can detect no change in them in that time. UV-cured resin models are a relatively recent introduction into the hobby. No-one yet knows for sure how they will behave long-term. It is however clear that painting them will help to protect them from long-term UV damage and extend their service life. The oldest resin models I have here are 2 years old and unpainted. I can detect no change in them in that time, but they have been stored indoors in normal conditions. Had I left them out of doors I'm fairly sure that by now they would be looking a bit sad. How much less sad if I had painted them I have no way of knowing. For the resin-printed chairs, I have suggested that it is very important that the rail is an easy sliding fit and free to move. So that the chairs do not come under any stress due to thermal expansion and contraction of the rail. To that end I'm including a means in the timbers to restrain the rail from moving too far out of position, using integral dropper wires as a flexible restraint. This illustrates an important point -- the long-term stability of 3D-printed track is likely to depend very much on exactly how you build it. If resin chairs are made a tight fit on the rail, similar to injection-moulded thermoplastic chairs, it wouldn't surprise me if they crack and break after a few months. Likewise the processing of the resin is important. I am now using a water-washable resin for the chairs -- this one: https://uk.anycubic.com/collections/abs-like-resin-v2/products/anycubic-abs-like-resin-v2-package The manufacturers make it clear that the water-washing and drying should take place quickly, and that the uncured model should not be left soaking in water. Also that the model must be fully dry before UV curing. Taking care to comply with such instructions may have a significant effect on the long-term stability of the models. I shall continue to have fun experimenting with 3D printed track. If others want do the same, that's great. Martin.

@MarshLane Under NO circumstances whatsoever am I promoting anything. Templot is my hobby, nothing more. Others are welcome to join in if they wish, or not if they don't. Martin.

Yes, for a B-7 turnout in P4 the total cost of resin chairs and FDM printed base is about 80p. Slightly less for 00 and EM. But please bear in mind that Templot plug track is simply my experimental hobby project. We are still a long way from a fully usable system. For example only yesterday from John's post here I realised that a modification to the switch rail jigs would be beneficial. So far it is possible to build ordinary bullhead turnouts and crossovers of any gauge or scale, but for more complex formations such as tandem turnouts, diamonds and slips I have not yet done the required chairs. I'm hoping to do some of them early in the New Year. There are also many other unfinished loose ends in the project, and some current Templot functions may change before we are done. So far only REA chairs are done. Hopefully GWR chairs will follow in due course. Flat-bottom remains in the sunny uplands far away as far as Templot is concerned. But maybe not if someone else comes along with a similar system? Anyone? Martin.

@hayfield Hi John, Many thanks for posting those photos. After thinking about them and tinkering with the filing jigs, I have decided to make a couple of changes: 1. for the switch front jigs I have increased the default slope angle from 17.5 degrees to 20 degrees: This will better protect the rail foot from being filed at the blade tip. This will be in the next program update. You can of course set this angle to whatever you want. 2. for all the switch jigs, front and back, I now suggest applying a strip of sticky tape down the face of the jig at the working end of the jig: This will allow the bolt at that end to be tightened without pushing the rail at that end up out of the groove, causing over-filing. I previously suggested leaving the bolt at that end barely more than loosely nipped, but that is very subjective and I suspect most users were likely to over-tighten it. This is electrical insulating tape, which is 5 thou thick. So increasing the groove depth at that end by 10 thou. This won't significantly affect the accuracy of the jig, but will ensure that the rail can lie flat in the groove. The bolt at the other end can be fully tightened to ensure that the rail is prevented from moving. This applies only to the switch jigs and does not apply to the crossing jigs. I shall experiment with adding this 5 thou padding in the STL file, but I suspect the use of tape will actually work better, and can be applied to any jigs which have already been printed. cheers, Martin.

Hi John, I think you had the rail too far forward in the jig. If you trim it here with sharp flush cutters, I think you will have a good blade, after fettling it in position: For an "A" size blade, the planing length from the tip to where the filing runs out should be 22mm in 4mm/ft scale. The filing should run out at the same place on the front as on the back. _________________ While still in the back jig, mark the rail at 20mm from the end of the jig. This will be the position of the finished blade tip. After removing it from the jig, you may want to pre-trim it at the 20mm mark using sharp flush cutters (e.g. as supplied with the Kingroon printer). When inserting it in the front jig, the trimmed end should again be at 20mm from the end of the jig. At that point the end of the rail foot should be just flush with the filing face, so that it doesn't get filed. If not you can move the rail forward or back a little until it is -- this is due to normal variations in FDM printing. At that business end of the jig the bolt should be barely tight (almost loose), otherwise the rail will be pushed away from the jig and over-filed. Tighten the bolt at the other end fully to prevent the rail moving. After filing, the blade should come to a sharp knife edge at the tip, with the rail foot barely touched. Some care is needed in locating the rail in the jig to achieve this. If filing the back has caused the filed end to curl slightly, it needs to be straightened to lie flush in the front jig. The default filing angle for the front jigs is 17.5 degrees. If you find with your rail section that you are filing too much of the rail foot, the angle can be increased in the Templot settings and another jig made. There is more to these jigs than meets the eye, and some practice is needed. 🙂 Full jig instructions: https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/using-the-templot-rail-filing-jigs.728/ cheers, Martin.

Hi John, The point you didn't make is that the front jigs are designed to accept blades which have first been filed on the back in a back filing jig (of the same switch size). While still in the back jig, mark the rail at 20mm from the end of the jig. This will be the position of the finished blade tip. After removing it from the jig, you may want to pre-trim it at the 20mm mark using sharp flush cutters (e.g. as supplied with the Kingroon printer). When inserting it in the front jig, the trimmed end should again be at 20mm from the end of the jig. At that point the end of the rail foot should be just flush with the filing face, so that it doesn't get filed. If not you can move the rail forward or back a little until it is -- this is due to normal variations in FDM printing. At that business end of the jig the bolt should be barely tight (almost loose), otherwise the rail will be pushed away from the jig and over-filed. Tighten the bolt at the other end fully to prevent the rail moving. After filing, the blade should come to a sharp knife edge at the tip, with the rail foot barely touched. Some care is needed in locating the rail in the jig to achieve this. If filing the back has caused the filed end to curl slightly, it needs to be straightened to lie flush in the front jig. The default filing angle for the front jigs is 17.5 degrees. If you find with your rail section that you are filing too much of the rail foot, the angle can be increased in the Templot settings and another jig made. There is more to these jigs than meets the eye, and some practice is needed. 🙂 Full jig instructions: https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/using-the-templot-rail-filing-jigs.728/ cheers, Martin.

Putting used resin back in the bottle of fresh resin will shorten its shelf life. Filter it into a separate jam jar and wrap it in kitchen foil to keep out the light. Martin.

@hayfield Hi John, 3D printing using water-washable resin on the Alkaid printer: 1. negotiate a cease-fire in the kitchen. 2. shake the bottle of resin well, and leave it to stand for a while for any froth to clear. 3. if cold, run the bottle under the hot tap to warm it up. 4. remove the protection films from both sides of the tank base, and fix it on the printer. 5. remove the protection film (if any) from the build plate, and clean the build surface in hot soapy water before using it for the first time. Rinse and dry it. 6. fix it on the printer. Tighten the top knob firmly. Unlike FDM printing, there is some force involved in resin printing and things can come loose if not tightened firmly. 7. make sure the 4 levelling screws are loose, and switch on. 8. perform the levelling process as explained in the manual and in James's video: Alkaid video 9. take some time to get this right -- with luck you will only need to do it once. Nip up all 4 screws first, and then tighten them very firmly without disturbing the levelling. 10. exclude all daylight, and then half fill the tank with resin. 11. put the yellow cover on the printer. You can allow daylight while the cover is on. 12. plug in the USB stick containing the CTB print file. On the Alkaid the USB socket is at the back (and upside down). It's a lot easier using one of these: https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00DX59EAG 13. use the touch screen to find the file and start the print. While printing some slurping and sucking noises are normal. 14. for 4mm scale chairs it will take about 25 minutes. Leave it dripping for about 5 minutes afterwards. 15. exclude daylight again. Remove the yellow cover and place an old biscuit-tin lid or piece of card over the whole tank area to catch any further drips while removing and handling the build plate. 16. swish the build plate in a bowl of warm water. At this stage the chairs are soft and delicate, so don't bump them against the bottom of the bowl. Using a soft brush such as a pastry brush, wash 95% of the surplus resin from the build plate and around the chairs. The water will be contaminated with resin, so don't pour it down the drain. 17. plunge the build plate up and down vigorously in a bucket of warmish water. This is to remove the remaining 5% of resin, and force wash water through the tiny slots for the loose jaws, and ensure there is no surplus resin left in the slots. 18. cover the tank with kitchen foil, and put the yellow cover back on the printer. You can now allow daylight again. 19. dry the build plate and chairs with a hair dryer, or leave them on the radiator while you have a nice boiled egg and read the latest issue of the Railway Modeller. The chairs must be fully dry before UV curing. 20. examine all the chairs carefully. Make sure none are missing or only partially printed. If so it is bad news -- you will need to clean out the tank and filter the resin to find the missing bits before you can print again. N.B. if loose jaws are missing they may have printed normally and be found detached in the wash water. 21. holding the build plate over a soft landing such as a piece of foam or bubble wrap, gently prise each raft from the build plate using a window scraper. At this stage the chairs are still soft and delicate, so handle them carefully. 22. collect up the rafts and expose them on both sides to UV light using whatever means you have available, until they are fully cured. Depending on the power of the UV this might take 10-20 minutes. Or if using a sunny window cill, several hours. 23. they will harden further over the next few days, and the rafts will very likely curl. cheers, Martin.

You put toast back in the toaster when you like it darker than it came out the first time.

@Donw Hi Don, For printing PLA filament (used for plug track timbering bases, filing jigs, model parts such as point-motor brackets, etc.) FDM printers are very user-friendly. PLA is made from sugar-cane and is non-toxic and emits no significant smell. The printer can be run in living areas, although there is some fan noise so perhaps not in the quietest rooms. (Using other types of filament, such as ABS (which is the similar to plastic kits and can be assembled with solvent) or flexible rubber-like materials, the fumes can be unpleasant and not suitable for living areas.) Resin printers are not generally suitable for living areas. The resin is toxic and smelly, although the water-washable resin we are now using for chairs has little smell. The resin needs to be at 20-25degC for good results, so an unheated outbuilding is not really suitable. The resin printer needs to be in a heatable room with a door, away from living areas, such as a model railway workshop or spare bedroom. Also while using a resin printer there needs to be no natural daylight, so that means working on winter evenings, or with a window blackout board. Additional items needed for FDM printers are none. Additional items needed for resin printers when using water-washable resin are a pastry brush, a small bowl, a plastic bucket, and some means of UV curing. That can be sunshine on a window cill, or a simple UV lamp such as the ones used for curing nail varnish. cheers, Martin.

@figworthy Hi Adrian, The resin cost for the chairs is more difficult to calculate because it depends how tightly they are packed on the printer build plate. For Amazon Prime members the current cost of resin is £25.64 per kg, see: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0C7BFQZ2C/ A single S1 ordinary chair in 4mm/ft scale uses about 0.08g (some of which is wasted in the printing supports), so the cost of such a chair is about 0.2p (i.e. 5 chairs for 1p). A full chair set for a B-7 turnout in 4mm/ft scale uses about 15g of resin, so the cost is about 38p. Total material cost for a B-7 turnout base in 4mm/ft scale is therefore 34p + 38p = 72p at current Amazon prices. cheers, Martin.

@figworthy Hi Adrian, A 1kg reel of filament is currently showing as £13.56 (it varies), see: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07FQKP7NS/ Using the default settings, a timbering base for a B-7 turnout in 4mm/ft scale weighs about 25g. You can therefore make 40 such bases from 1 reel, and each one will cost 34p. cheers, Martin.

@figworthy Hi Adrian, Templot can show you the total length of timbers and sleepers. After making some test 3D prints you should be able to calculate the numbers you want. I have no plans to add such calculations to Templot. Just to add that Templot is not a software product. It is my private hobby interest. Everyone is welcome to share it if they wish. Or not, if they don't like it. cheers, Martin.

@Jol Wilkinson Hi Jol, Current UK price £84 + £7 postage. 2-3 day delivery from a warehouse in Leicester: https://www.geeetech.com/alkaid-lcd-light-curing-resin-3d-printer-p-1210.html Martin. (no connection with Geeetech).

The plastic is toughened PLA. The file skids over the surface and barely harms the jig. The jigs are good for several dozen rails or more. See the jig instructions: https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/using-the-templot-rail-filing-jigs.728/ Martin.

Hi Jol, Which ones? Recommended by who? 1. Geeetech Alkaid resin printer, £90 delivered in UK. Excellent. 2. Kingroon FDM printer, £180 post free in UK. Excellent. cheers, Martin.

Hi Ian, As John says, there is nothing to prevent anyone from building finished turnouts and crossovers now, and installing them on a layout. But as far as I know the only person who has actually reported doing so is Michael Woods in S Scale. See: https://85a.uk/templot/club/index.php?threads/experimental-plug-track-continued.673/post-9002 I'm sure there will be many more soon. I would be building some myself, but for my recent injury. cheers, Martin.