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Broadway Clive

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  • Location
    Ilford, Essex
  • Interests
    Transport and industry in GB 1950s - 1960s era. "59 Broadway" London Transport buses, service vehicles and trains - model collection, dioramas and layouts representing 1959. "Springcoates" BR layout circa 1960s inspired by Hull yards and docks. Also Pickfords and BRS lorries and depots.

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  1. I'd have thought the EFE car transporter would be the ideal choice for this. What I would like to see is a BRS Albion Chieftain with Holmes cab somewhat similar to the Bristols. I suggested this several times to Frank but he didnt like the look of them!
  2. Yes indeed, and fancy them choosing D6121 as their first one - we must be careful to check it's not numbered D6122 on the other side! https://www.rcts.org.uk/features/diesels/loco.htm?id=diesels/D6121
  3. The 08/9 wheelbase is actually 11ft 6", so 1ft 10" longer than the Sentinel. I'm not aware of lack of weight being a factor in detection. In fact the 16 ton axle load of the Sentinel was considered too heavy by the Civil Engineer for their short wheelbase and their movements were restricted so as to protect bridges. My understanding of the detection issue is that it relates to reversing movements over crossovers and the need for track circuits to be crossed so as to release points and clear signals. To deal with such very short vehicles the signalling system at certain locations would needed changing, possibly to the detriment of normal operations.
  4. Another quote, this time from J Graeme Bruce (hope he passes muster), in 'Workhorses of the London Undergound' p.38. 'In October 1954 a BR diesel-electric shunter, No.13018, was borrowed and trials conducted at Lillie Bridge and Neasden. However this trial was received with little enthusiasm by either the local management or the operators and the problem of the replacement of steam locomotives was again shelved by the acquisition of Western Region steam engines'. (Note that no actual problems are recorded with the 08.) Further down the page we read of the arrival in 1971 of Sentinel shunters DL81-3 and the following paragraph commences:- 'It became apparent that the short wheelbase of 9ft 8" of the 0-6-0 wheel arrangement was insufficient for the proper clearance of the signalling system, so that the vehicles were forbidden to move onto the track circuited areas beyond the depot precincts.' (Note that the track circuit problem has come as a surprise so it could not have been present with the 08.)
  5. Track circuits were never an issue for the 11ft 6" wheelbase 08/9s anywhere on BR as far as I can ascertain and one regularly stabled at Farringdon for banking duties on the CWL. However class 03 204hp shunters with their shorter wheelbase of 9ft did sometimes require match wagons, when working as pilots at Hull Paragon station for example. I would imagine the Sentinel's wheelbase was somewhat similar which is why they needed them too, and perhaps someone else will know what that was.
  6. Why is that? It sounds like a rather a bigoted remark unless you can explain your reservations and offer an alternative explanation as to why the SR alone chose a bigger diameter wheel for their EE shunters. Lets debate stuff properly with some references we can all look up and comment on.
  7. Quote from The Diesel Shunter (Marsden) P 28. re 15201-3 Ashford built shunters:- '..........followed the previous LMS designs except that it was slightly heavier (4 tons) and had larger diameter driving wheels - 4ft 6'' compared to 4ft 0.5'' of the LMS design. These larger diameter wheels were stipulated as the locomotives were destined to operate over the third rail and the extra diameter gave the necessary clearance.' It also goes on about the need for a higher speed (30 MPH) to do trip work amongst passenger trains, which tallies with the reason given earlier for 20 MPH 08s not being suitable for trip working over LT.
  8. Dont worry about it. I live in Ilford near east London and garages around here have been changed into all sorts without any one caring. I took the doors off mine 15 years ago and replaced them with windows that make it look rather like a small signal cabin! Next door neighbours both demolished theirs in order to extend their houses, and further down the road other garages have even become bungalows 30A etc! Local councillors know all about it and no problems - things have changed a lot since I was young!
  9. No, the concern was on the original English Electric shunters as pioneered by the LMSR, LNER and GWR that had 4' wheels, and spawned the class 11 (12033-12138). (I'd love an RTR model of them, by the way!). But BR increased the wheel to 4'6" for the 08 so as to alleviate the concerns over 3rd rail and connecting rods that the SR had.
  10. Trip cocks are fitted to trains, train stops are fixed to track.
  11. I bought and tried it many years ago but found it wasn't really practicable for my layout which features freight sorting yards, docks etc. Wagonflo requires each individual wagon to be identifiable so the system can keep track of it and direct it to its next destination. This is just not possible with closely spaced or distant sidings holding many BR wagons with their tiny numbers. It then instructs wagons be moved to destinations on the layout and redirects them days later, but many of my local destinations don't actually exist as they are 'reached' by outgoing pick up freights that enter the same fiddle yard as those returning 'abroad'. Manually removing wagons from the fiddle yard is not practicable, and any obligations on the frequency and timing of operating sessions is an anathema to me. Nevertheless there are some excellent ideas behind Wagonflo such as those that require one to estimate the type of goods and the quantity of wagons needed at each of ones local destinations on different days, and the frequency of movements, and I've used those to make my own system on an Excel spreadsheet that overcomes the problems I've outlined. Basically I just identify the type of wagon along with any visible load, and their position in a train arriving from 'abroad', and the spreadsheet gives them local destinations based on the odds for each.
  12. First thing I saw was a message I'd missed two months ago - so that was a nice surprise. Looks like a very useful feature.

  13. My copy has finally arrived from Peco and I see a blooper on page 9 in the picture of Jool's Underground station, which my friend John Howe built for him. The 1938 stock is sat in the far platform with a trailer car leading, and the driving motor car possibly removed for repair! That train was supplied by Metro-models with a spud motor at each end and was reportedly an unreliable performer - a double motored UNDM (trailer) being their preferred method these days. John had seen an S Stock train on his visit the previous week, sat in the near platform obscuring the view, and had not looked too closely in case he was asked to enlarge tunnels and lower tracks for it to move! All goes to show what I've long known to be the case, that all the money in the world is no substitute for some personal knowledge and skill! Bad marks for the photographer and the editor for not noticing.
  14. Thanks Keith, I've now ordered mine from Peco too - just never thought they sold it directly. I'm grateful for your help because my friend John Howe has been telling me about Jool's layout for several years as he has been making buildings and constructed London tram and Underground sections for him. Over the years I've found it amusing to hear of the turf wars between his projects and others like the Minic Motorway as spaces and gaps were filled. His last visit to prepare the layout for the article brought a surprise when he found his 1938 tube stock had been replaced with a new Bachmann S (surface) stock in the same underground platforms!
  15. I was unable to find a copy in my local Smiths or even at Waterloo Station when visiting just before Xmas, and now I see one is on Ebay for £9.99 so maybe its a better investment at the moment than my ISAs!
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