zedcell
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Posts posted by zedcell
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John that looks like a great idea didn't realise you could use 2 BM1 modules connected to 1 cobalt this could save me a lot of time and confusion, i am assuming the power would be 9V DC from terminal 5 from the cobalt.
Thanks again for your invaluable advise on this issue.
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20 hours ago, Nigelcliffe said:
The above will work, but is excessively complex unless it is really important to wait for the point motor to throw half-way before changing the signal.
Simplified version, where signal will change as turnout motor switch is changed:
Completely Remove the relay and external 12v supply from the diagram.
Take wire 6(relay) from signal, connect to wire 1 on Cobalt
Take wire 8(relay) from signal, connect to wire 8 on Cobalt.
And there are still two un-used change-over contacts on the Cobalt.
I've shown two resistors, one to each signal line. That's probably an unnecessary detail compared to one resistor, but my arrangement does ensure the reverse voltage over the un-lit LEDs is zero.
- Nigel
That certainly does simplify things just one question am i right in thinking terminals 6 &7 can be the feed for the BM1.
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There are some good examples on youtube of garage conversions.
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John am i right in thinking the relay pins 8 & 6 connect to the BM1 & PINS 9 11 & 13 return via the resistor to the 12 v dc supply on the above diagram.
If using the cobalt 9v supply what number connections would need to be made between the cobalt terminals and the relay pins.
Example connect cobalt terminal 5 to relay pin 8 with reference to any diodes or resistors in line.
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Hi John
Thanks for walking me through this much appreciated.
The cobalts are the originals with the 8 terminals and are set up and working for point operation via a 9v dc supply.
The signals i want to add are the berko 2 aspect and are common negative with just the 1 resistor.
Not sure on the best option for power supply to the leds would be the 9V DC from the cobalt or from the 12V DC from a dedicated signal bus that i originally installed for this.
The relay would be the one in the link on page 4 12v DPDT 2A on page 4 at the top code 22-002 http://www.squirestools.com/files/e22.pdf
What would you recommend for the above and would you have a diagram.
Thanks again .
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On 06/04/2021 at 12:17, John ks said:
I can see 2 ways to control a relay from the cobalt
1---- Use a set of contacts in the cobalt to control the relay
2----- Provided that that the 12V relay will work with 9V then control the relay from the point switch ( relay coil is in parallel with the cobalt motor)
If you decide to go for the 2nd method it would be wise to test the 12V relays on 9V to see if they work reliably
A disadvantage of method 2 is that the relay is controlled by the point switch
If the point fails to change the relay still operates & your signals will give a false indication
On a real railway i wouldn't consider this circuit to be fail safe but for a
toy trainmodel railway it should be OKThe advantage is you still got the 2 sets of C/O contacts on the cobalt
The diode D2 (flyback diode)supresses back EMF from the relay coil
Diode D1 only allows the relay to energise when Orange is positive & Grey is negative
With the point switch in the drawn position the relay will be off
Any 1A 100V or higher diode would be suitable eg !N40041, 1N4004 or similar
John
Great information thanks .
If I decided on option 1 where would I connect the 3 wires from the signal.
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10 hours ago, Nigelcliffe said:
If wanting a relay to separate things John's is fine.
But, there is a MUCH simpler way, no relays, no other stuff. One switch on Cobalt for the frog, other switch for the BM1 brake section isolator.
Connect the common wire from the LED signal to the frog wire going to the track. Take the other wires from the signal (each via their resistor), and connect one to each of the DCC bus wires. As the frog changes (which is when the blades are moved), the signal will change.
Doing it really well would mean a small increase in the resistor values from those rated for 12v (but probably doesn't matter). And, would add a single diode in the common line to the frog to resist reverse bias over the LEDs (theoretically reverse bias will cause a LED to break down over time, in practise most modern LEDs seem remarkably robust against it).
- Nigel
Thanks for the reply on this what size resistors would you recommend using, the track bus is 5amp.
Regards Richie
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Found this very helpful thanks.
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Hi Brian
I know this post is now over 5 years old but i am now due to lockdown ready to tackle this project .
All the parts have been purchased could you please draw my a wiring diagram to make this as easy as possible .
Connecting a cobalt classic powered via 9 volt dc to the relay for berko led signal and bm1.
Regards Richie
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Anyone planning a large or complex layout may want to purchase a software program like anyrail which lets you plan and design a layout on the screen and makes you aware of whats possible and whats not.
The software has all the main tack manufactures and scales to work with and i found it invaluable.
Once the track plan was finalized it was exported to another program called trainplayer from which you can add and run train formations to your track plan.
This really did show where i had accident black spots and where some form of semi automation was required via a planned signal system.
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Nice weathering the fuel tanks look good.
How did you apply the cant rail.
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Have just finished detailing 2 Hornby class 47 to top and tail my fm blue pullman here is the link if your interested.
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Thanks for the reply did check the factory fitted frog wire it looked ok will check that again as i know it is fragile.
Checked all 4 parts of the frog area with a bulb no power.
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Hi can anyone give me some advice with a problem with a electrofrog point have converted approx 40 peco code 75 points operated via cobalt analogue point motors and everything was running fine.
Just recently one started playing up it was ok when set to diverge but loco would stall when set straight.
Originally thought it was a bad solder connection to the dropper re-soldered and found locos now stall when set to diverge also.
Checked power to points and found the frog area has no power, so i suspected the polarity switch on the cobalt was faulty changed the cobalt motor re-checked all connections and have still no power in the frog area.
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I have always had more luck selling by setting the price as low as possible to attract more buyers , well that's my theory anyway.
From my observations many people who set a buy it now price quite often fail to get any buyers as most people are looking for a bargain even if that means bidding in auction.
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Yes I think you could use copper tape but my personal view would be it may be a bit fragile.
Could you not drill holes in the wood posts for the dropper.
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Dcc concepts do working table lamps suitable for pullman coaches.
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Thanks for your help on this much appreciated.
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Sol that sounds good can you give me a bit more detail thanks.
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yes they are electrofrog
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Do you know if there is a different wiring configuration when wiring points back to back as opposed to stand alone as the stand alone operates without fault.
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Hi all have just started installing some cobalt point motors all the points have been modified for dcc electrofrog running and have insulated fish plates fitted, the first left hand point ran perfect when tested, unfortunately the same cant be said for my attempt at a back to back left hand to left hand point.
They have been wired for operation via a single switch for tandem movement that works ok the issue is when a loco approaches it shorts out as soon as it is in contact with the point.
My concern is i have not wired correctly with regard to the droppers and cobalt i have connected the droppers from both points to the bus and tapped into the droppers and connected to terminals 2 and 3 on the cobalt motor.
image 1 with the large choc blocks are the droppers to the points if you look close the smaller red and black wires from the blocks runs to terminals 2 and 3 on the cobalt.
Image 2 is where the loco shorts out.
Any advice would be appreciated as im starting to scratch my head.
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13 hours ago, jjb1970 said:
I watched this last night with the family and thoroughly enjoyed it, as a fan of the old Jon Pertwee show and after last years remake of Watership Down i was a little worried about what they'd do to old Wurzel but I thought it was wonderfully well done. They did the sensible thing in avoiding trying to remake the Pertwee show and instead applied their own interpretation of the old Wurzel stories. There was a delightfully whimsical quality to it all and it was all hugely enjoyable. If anyone gave it a miss I recommend giving it a go.
Can you give me more details i will try and watch this on catch up.
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On 17/06/2014 at 20:41, Suzie said:
There is the potential to corrupt the DCC waveform by attaching a poorly designed piece of equipment to the track feed, but that could be anything and is most likely to be a rake of lit coaches.
There is nothing to worry about if you are just adding good quality accessories. If you start running low on power you can easily add a booster, but you are likely to be having a pretty busy layout before that happens.
I suspect that what you were told does not come from experience. Attaching accessories has to be given proper consideration as to how it is done to get the most from your system, but there is no reason not to do it. Good quality accessories will have flexible wiring arrangements to suit your situation.
Sorry i know this is an old post, only i was doing a bit of research on a corrupt dcc signal and this post sent the alarm bells ringing , with regard to a rake of lit coaches.
My problem is i a have a fairly large DCC layout, power is supplied via a NCE DB5 and SB5 supplying 5 amps each to 2 power districts , i have 2 rakes of hst fitted with coach lighting and one of the rakes has been a bit erratic on certain sections of track including jerky and unresponsive to some commands like horns but when the power car is tested on a rolling road on the program track it runs perfect .
Would be interested to hear what your thoughts on this .
Anyone planning a large or complex layout may want to purchase a software program like anyrail which lets you plan and design a layout on the screen and makes you aware of whats possible and whats not.
Extra switch for cobalt
in DCC Help & Questions
Posted · Edited by zedcell
Hi John /Nigel
i can now confirm following your advice and guidance i have successfully set up signal operation via the cobalt with the aid of your last diagram
Unfortunately im not having much success with the abc braking, having competed the wiring as in above diagram soldering the feds 1 and 2 to the track via the bm1 module and connecting back to the cobalt via terminals 5 and 6 have also cut the track for the isolation sections.
Selected a Bachmann class 20 loco with a ESU v4 chip for the test and turned on cv 27 = 1 slow approach cv 123 = 100 (default) abc sensitivity cv 134 = 12 (default)
Started test, set signal for spad protection and to my dismay the loco did not respond, back to the program track to check cv changed bm1 module changed loco no luck.
Have only connected the approach for one side of the point for testing.
The only difference i can find is in your diagram you show the feds to the track bus as red in the direction of travel where as mine are black in the direction of travel and it states in the lenz instructions always connect to the right hand track in the direction of travel, there is no mention of polarity.
Would be good if you could help kick me over the line with this issue.
Regards Richie