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  1. Not post-war but I also have a photo of the streamlined King c1939 which was mentioned above... 6014, M10, H46 (rebuilt Saloon with kitchen), G60 (Saloon), H45 (rebuilt Saloon with kitchen), H49, H39, E109, C44, D82. You should definitely look out for Model Rail Journal, especially number 217 and 248 - the Kingstorre layout is set post war and covers some lovely Super Saloons - I remember being quite taken in by a photo with a 70' parcel van, Siphon G, 3 Saloons (the middle one having a kitchen) followed by another Siphon and a K38 or K40. According to the author it was quite prototypical but I do not know if he had hard evidence of that formation.
  2. Good grief - cannot believe it was 2012 when I first started this thread! Anyway I have been back in build mode and research mode and I came across a rather interesting segment in one of my books that had something called "The Log of the first Special Train from Plymouth to Paddington with passengers from the "Normandie" June 1935. As can be seen there are 4 of the Ocean Saloons (all pre-modified) with a stowage van leading, a kitchen car, which I assume was from the Riviera stock or maybe a converted single unit from the articulated coaches, and a Brake 1st bringing up the rear. As far as I know, the brake firsts were made for the Fishguard boat trains so would have been 70 footers. I would love to know whether there are any more logs like this out there!
  3. Just following up on this for anybody interested... In my Post Office GWr book which has an extensive chapter on the Ocean Mails, there is a photo of an M15 taken in 1937 still in full lined livery. And then on HMRS there are 3 photos of interest... An M15 taken in 1929 in the lined livery https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs/70-apos-12wheel-ocean-mails-stowage-van-gw-1206-diag-m15-at-plymouth-millbay-side-built-10-1910-lot-1185.html An M9 taken in 1935 in the 29-34 livery https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs/70-apos-ocean-mails-stowage-van-gw-824-d-m9-at-plymouth-millbay-side-one-pair-of-doors-open-corner-of-dock-foreground-shed-background.html A K38 taken in 1935 in the 1929-34 livery https://hmrs.org.uk/photographs/57-apos-ocean-mails-brake-van-gw-1169-d-k38-at-plymouth-millbay-side-corner-of-dock-foreground.html So in summary, a 1935 Ocean Mails train with either M9 or K38 was 100% prototypically painted in the simple livery, but at least one of the M15's were not repainted from lined as late as 1937. You have to love the GWR!
  4. I think I did mean the M15. I have a book on the GWR Post Offices and it shows an M15 at the harbour being loaded in 1937 and it is in fully lined livery. Thanks for the link to the K38 thread.
  5. Hello all I have a couple of new questions regarding repainting, particularly of the Ocean Mails 70' stock, the Ocean Mails K38s and the Articulated Dining Cars. I have photos of the 70' Ocean Mails coaches that purport to be taken in 1937 and they are still in full lined livery. they were originally crimson when built in the early 1900's so it makes sense they received the lined livery some time in the late 10's early 20's but then seem to have been unpainted for 10+ years if they are still lined in '37. I also have plenty of photos of the K38 Ocean Mails vans in 1925 lined livery or in post 1947 livery, but nothing in between. And finally I have plenty of photos of the Articulated dining cars in fully lined livery or in 1935 shirtbutton (the photos are dated 1936), but again nothing in between. No 1932 (7 years after they were built) pictures at all. I cannot find any photos of any of the parcel vans or articulated stock in 1929-34 livery. So my question regards special trains around 1935, the period I model and the trains I am interested in. From my research it would appear that in 1936 I should have a rather eclectic mix of liveries if I am modelling Ocean Mails and / or Ocean Liner expresses with lined livery on the Ocean Mails vans, lined livery or Shirtbutton on the Dining car triplets, and the 1929-34 livery on some of the other coaches. What do you all think?
  6. Thanks all for your thoughts. I do not have Bradshaw, it sounds like it may be worth tracking down. Can you let me know what the Paddington trains are that took that route and I can compare to my 1931 Formations book to see what they were made up of.
  7. Hello all I love to model full length trains that are prototypical in length and coach types used and most of my models are designed to run in the garden on a line I am building that represents the sea wall around Dawlish. I focus on the express services that ran from Penzance / Plymouth through to Paddington but also the cross country services which went north to Crewe and carried a mix of LMS coaches. Making heavy use of "Train Formations & Carriage Workings of the GWR" which details the 1931/32 timetable, I have embarked on creating quite a few prototypical formations, all of which would have been seen along the sea wall in the early 30's, But I have just got clearance from my wife to build a decent sized shed which will act as a fiddle yard but also may have the space to have a long thin scenic area and I have always loved the vibe from Sydney Gardens. And this is where I get confused. Looking at the current map (attached) showing the train lines from Swindon to Bristol, the 2 different routes are clearly shown and today, as in the 30's I assume, the route to the north of Bath is a bit faster. I am assuming therefore that the main express trains to Paddington and also the trains heading North to Crewe and beyond, all travelled upwards and not via Bath and Sydney Gardens. I am prepared to use some artistic licence and propose to running my trains on a day when the Northern line was undergoing work and all the trains were diverted via Bath, but if I could find something more concrete I would be delighted. Is this If anybody can help or point me in the right direction to do more research I would appreciate it. Many thanks
  8. Hi Macgeordie

    I just came across your wonderful build of the Night Ferry Fourgon and wanted to know if you ever got photos of the whole rake when completed? I am hoping to model the night ferry c1956 myself in O Gauge and was impressed with your work.



    1. macgeordie




      HI Noel


      I'm sorry to say I don't have any photos of the full train. I built the Fourgon and a SR ferry brake van for a friend not for myself. I'm pretty sure I did a thread on the Ferry coaches as well but can't find the thread now. I think I still have some photos of the various builds if you need them. 

      I'm away this weekend exhibiting the layout at Milton Keynes but could put the photos onto a disc next week if you want them.





  9. Hello all I am normally to be found lurking in the GWR forum but having moved house recently to a Southern Railway region have started to pay a lot more attention to the trains that ran near my home many years ago. One of my favourite trains I have modelled is the GWR 1929 Torbay Pullman with the white Pullman livery and this fits in with my preference for modelling trains I wish I could have travelled on. One of the reasons I like the GWR is the Ocean specials and obviously Southern had its fair share of them too. I have discovered that the earlier Golden Arrow trains and the 1929/30 Ocean specials would often have had both Maunsell stock and Pullmans and I think I would like to model one of these. I am however finding it hard to get a clear answer on one question... Was the Olive paint / livery on the coaches of this era the same as the one used on the Lord Nelson and King Arthur locomotives? any help would be most appreciated. Many thanks
  10. I am working on a single O gauge line around my garden and having been lucky enough to take the Orient Express back from Venice at the end of my honeymoon, I really want to reproduce it in 1/43. I don't think I can affors a full rake of Elettren coaches, but see that MTH made some rather nice 5 car sets. #20-60004-2 is the main 2-rail 5-car set and then #20-60023 is the add on set. If by any chance anybody has either of these they are willing to part with, please do get in touch.
  11. That is very helpful. A 7 year cycle makes sense unless there was a major change (crimson to lined or lined to simple). Assuming that is the case, I therefore need to model the 1929 CRE stock as rolled out because it would not have been repainted by 1933. The roofs would also not be very white at all by now! I did see a rather nice photo of the 1925 articulated stock repainted in 1935/6 with the shirt-button. Given the above info, I think it would therefore be fair to assume that these coaches were painted in the simpler livery around 1930 and then the crest was swapped out for the shirt button in 1935/6. Of note, the roofs of the newly painted 10 year old coaches are immaculate white so I think it fair to assume that the 1930 repaint would have been white too.
  12. I have read all of the coach books I can find, especially Harris and Russell, but am struggling to find an answer to a reasonably simple question I have. I am in the process of building rakes of coaches to represent the Britannia Halt end of the Kingwear line in 1933/34. I have always enjoyed the variety of stock in a GWR rake and am trying to capture the feel of a top line express in this era. By now, the mainline coach livery incorporated double lining below the windows and the crest. Now as far as I am aware, 1929 marked the start of the newer, simple livery, and the 1929 Cornish Riviera / Torbay Limited stock was the first stock to receive it. At the outset, the livery did not include the double lining. This was phased in soon after (I still do not know the exact date but have found photos of old 70' coaches that were refurbished in 1931 with it). Given my time period (33/34), what I am trying to work out is whether the 1929 stock would have been overhauled within 4-5 years and if so, would the double lining now be on these coaches? If anybody know how frequently mainline stock would have been given a fresh paint job, that would be amazing to know. I would also love to know whether roofs were repainted frequently too. I am guessing that 5 year old roofs would be very dark by now, but if they were given an overhaul after 4-5 years, then maybe I should have a few coaches with white roofs. I look forward to hearing anything about re-painting, re-lining etc in this era.
  13. They look really good! Cannot wait to see how you are painting the teak effect on. Also are there any plans for restaurant cars? A dining triplet and a full brake for a Flying Scotsman rake would be rather compelling.
  14. Really interested in these new releases, particularly the coaches. Are there any actual photos yet or are we still only able to see CAD representations. It will be interesting to see how the teak effect is handled.
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