Switcher102

Oh they are working well now Giles. Some impressive modelled movement there. Well done. What you need now is an RC fella to guide the hooks for you Actually, such a future is already here, but not for our wallets:- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-d8jkxdCgROk/UdkagDTyIXI/AAAAAAAABzQ/mjDpTTreD1c/s1600/TINY%20ROBOT%20MOSQUITO.jpg Rich

Nope, never get bored of this thread Giles. Wow, you're a man after my own heart. You look at the same things I look at and try to conquer them. That is a very interesting discovery about the different performance of starts from motor /gearbox both are 100:1. Your work in this field of modelling I am finding extremely usefull for my future projects. I have discovered that my belief in flywheels, although I think it does slow down acceleration I am not sure if it significantly slows down that actual transition between stop and go (if you see what I mean), but it certainly will not allow a quick stop, which is very much like the real thing. I look forward to another video of your crane at some point. Rich

Another brilliant job Giles. You are an inspiration. I still haven't got around to road transport myself yet, too many other modelling projects but I did make a New Year's resolution to, and at 14 days in, my other NY resolutions are surviving, which for me is pretty good going. I look forward to an on-layout video. Rich

These look interesting, but there is a vital piece of information missing, the gear ratio. You need at least 100:1.

Wow, I also haven't visited RMweb for a long time and it's great to see Giles pursuing another road vehicle project. Thanks very much for the link Squirrel, all information gladly received, but I think this will have to go in My Favourites for a time when I am more experienced in electronics, which will hopefully be during this year.

Ah, well if that is the case I'm buggered with that idea. They are very reluctant to give dimensions for these things but I did find this one:- http://modelshopleeds.co.uk/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=11374&gclid=CNmBgNP21s4CFdaRGwodHoAOtQ ... which initially I thought was a micro version (which is what I Googled) but heck, at 35 x 18 x 8mm it is half the length of my Fiat. Long time since I've seen The Exorcist Simon but I'm guessing he turns his head like an owl. Yes, I know about that creepiness, I'm not going to allow the driver that much head flexibility

Thanks for that Squirrel, I didn't know there were such things. After many readings I think I understand now. Initially I thought the servo slow was connected to the receiver and of course, at the scale of the models we are dealing with there would be no room, but now I see that they fit in the transmitter. Am I right that it is the same as the inertia control I have on my transmitter?:- http://www.deltang.co.uk/tx24a-kit.htm If so, then that might solve the problem I have with a stick transmitter as I don't think they have inertia control. Would it be possible to add inertia control to a stick transmitter using a servo slow? So you reckon the servo slow should be able to slow down one of these:- http://www.micronradiocontrol.co.uk/servo.html#sm-os1300 That would be great if they could. I wonder, would they also be able to slow down sufficiently a motor on its own with no gears, or is that asking too much? Perhaps I could attach the shaft to a screw thread, I'm thinking of one of these tiny little things:- https://www.precisionmicrodrives.com/product/103-100-3mm-dc-motor-8mm-type .... used as a servo, slowed down using a servo slow in the transmitter. If a servo slow could be fitted to a stick transmitter could it be fitted so that it was dedicated to just one channel? Alternatively one of these used as a servo?:- http://www.tgauge.com/product/154/7/motor-with-gearbox Is stopping them an issue? If they were fixed to a steering mechanism so that their travel was limited could their motors be easily burnt out? If so, could a resistor help, could a resistor be used to also slow them down? If they could be used as servos, especially the tiny little motor on its own, it would save a hell of a lot of space, which is the main problem I am having with my modelling projects, and talking of space ….. As well as the 1:43 scale Fiat 126 I want to motorize I have another project on the go which last week resulted in me buying my first T gauge …. yes that's T gauge …. locomotive. Within O gauge T gauge can be used to represent 5 inch gauge. I have joined the main T gauge forum, and I don't know if you can see this page:- http://www.talkingtgauge.net/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=d0714e82cd638b83f76485813296bfcb …. and open the threads if not a member, I think you can but just can't join in. I have used my same Username on that forum and hopefully you will be able to see two of my threads there, one called Using T Gauge within O Gauge and the other Wireless Control for T Gauge. I have got into conversation there with a guy called Kupzinger about using infrared (IR) in order to wireless control T gauge (as standard gauge, not what I am doing). It may be of interest to folk here, it certainly will for me because although I will not be using T gauge as standard gauge I aim to motorize everything on my railway. Anything that moves in the real world I aim to make move, like reversing levers on steamers, bells swinging on American locomotives, back loader lorries' deck lifting to drop load, working JCBs etc, even a driver's head turning when reversing, so micro scale wireless control will be of interest to me even though I model in O gauge. Also, if any 4mm scale modellers here fancy motorizing their road vehicles, IR would be more suitable because the receivers are smaller, and as I have linked before on this thread (and is linked again on one of my T gauge posts), it is already being done with road vehicles at HO scale, which is slightly smaller than OO scale. Wheeew, that was a long one, I'm worn out now Rich

Thanks for that Simon. Interesting, still a bit puzzling but I reckon I understood most of it. Simon quote:- "4 seconds is a bit quick!". Remember we are in the 7mm part of the forum Stephen quote:- "... the track was moved backwards as the loco moved off ...". Cripes!

My point being that you have to first know what 60mph actually looks like scaled down before you can judge how to accelerate up to that speed at whatever the rate it would be for the particular prototype.

Crumbs Simon, that's some tech talk there (or tech type). You've lost me with 'mu' and 'g'. Should that not be a capital 'G'? A lower case 'g' means grams. An easier way to measure scaled speed for models is by how long it takes to travel a certain distance. Our local club layout sections are 4ft. It has been calculated that to travel two of those sections scaled 60mph takes about 4 seconds. Remember being fascinated by the Decapod when a kid. Film of that beast would be interesting. Rich

Hi Simon Oh yes, I've had a few jerky sudden starts on the local heritage railway myself but the real thing could never accelerate at the rate our models can. They can do 0 - (scaled) 60 in 3 seconds no problem. Also remember, what a sudden start, accel / decel rate feels like from inside looks entirely different from outside i.e. not as dramatic. Keep driving prototypical folks Rich

Wow, thanks very much for that comprehensive reply Giles. That's a great help. I sometimes take a while to reply but usually do eventually. I have been doing some more reading of Deltang's web site with reference to the info you have given and the mist is clearing a bit. So that's what ADD boards do. When I've done some more studying I will contact Andy and I know I have this thread to ask questions aswell. Funny you should mention reed switches, I bought one just recently, one of the smallest you can get, and with a very tiny magnet only 3mm diameter (which does close the switch) it looks like that will do the job for what I want. For the motorising projects I am looking into at the moment I am going to try button batteries. The motors will be so tiny that I think button batteries might be sufficient, and the only LiPo batteries small enough to fit anyway would have to come from China. Yes I can understand that you are right about having a dedicated transmitter for something like a crane. I may have to move over to the stick transmitters for those … BUT …. do they provide inertia control? As you probably remember I am a firm believer in flywheels and their electronic equivalent. I don't believe it should be the operator's job to make a model move accurately, I believe that should be the model maker's job (with help from the transmitter if possible), it should be inbuilt within the model itself and it should be incapable of moving in any other way. It makes for much more realism. After all, a driver of the real thing does not have to carefully move the throttle bit by bit in case a 100 ton locomotive (or 10 ton road crane) shoots off like a Ferrari ….. and likewise when stopping. It would be interesting to see more of the stabalising jacks in action next time you do a video of your crane. Anyway, more studying required on my part. Thanks for the help. Rich

Thanks for that Giles and Otherplanet. At the moment radio control is still a bit of another language to me. There is jargon in it that I don't understand. Even though I've read definitions I still don't really understand what a channel is. I understand a frequency and a band, but a channel has got me flumaxed. What does a function need, a frequence or a channel? The Deltang system requires prior knowledge of electronics and radio control. For the likes of me it might be best to wait untill Protocab get to the stage of providing the facility for such projects:- https://www.protocab.com/welcome They also provide LiPo batteries with safety features both in the batteries and their equipment so that they don't have to be removed each time for recharging, and they aim to make the recharging process itself possible without ruining the realism. They make the switching on and off process more realistic aswell i.e. more hands free, light touch switches. They will eventually get into sound aswell. Anyway, in the meantime I will struggle with the Deltang system. I hope Andy remembers what he's doing with your transmitter Giles because if I get to understanding this better I might be asking him "What he had please" It seems from what you are saying Otherplanet that for my Tx24 I would have to have more than one receiver in my crane, two for the jib, one for the hook etc. I did ask Andy to add two two-way switches to my Tx24. There wasn't room to make one of them work both ways, so I do have 3 switches, but they just switch something on and off. Rich

Well done Giles. What great innovative modelling, and Chopin again, you seemed to have decided that this crane goes well with Chopin, no complaints there from me, one of my favourite composers. I haven't got properly into radio control yet. I have converted two locomotives but all I've got involved in is forwards and backwards. Doing more functions is a bit of a mystery to me at the moment. Am I right that you are using six functions? I make it:- 1. Forwards / backwards 2. Steering 3. Jib horizontal turning 4. Jib vertical movement 5. Hook 6. Stabalisers This I presume means you have to have a receiver allowing six connections. I've seen you use the normal type of hand held radio transmitter which I think is called a stick transmitter so you might have difficulty answering fully the following questions because I have bought the Deltang Tx24:- http://www.deltang.co.uk/tx24a-kit.htm As you can see the two bottom dials can be used for speed and steering. The Selecta dial (top left) has 12 positions. I hope just ONE of those positions would be used for both forward / backward AND steering otherwise I'd have to click the Selecta dial to another position every time for steering. The other four functions I presume need to be assigned to four of those Selecta dial positions so it looks like it would be difficult moving the hook and jib at the same time because the Selecta dial would have to be switched each time (in the Deltang system moving the Selecta dial to another position does not make the previous function stop working, it just means it carries on at the same speed and cannot be altered until you click the Selecta dial back). I don't want to change the Inertia dial's function (top right), inertia is very important to me for loco / vehicle movement, in fact so important I have it permanently set. That will mean the other functions will have it aswell, which is not so desirable, but so be it. Rich

Excellent work Giles. It's coming along brilliant. If anything else happens I'll miss it now until next Wednesday. Keep up the good work Giles Rich