Nick Holliday
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Blog Comments posted by Nick Holliday
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6 hours ago, Compound2632 said:Curious. In the various readily-accessible online articles I've looked at [W...] the term used is polychrome brickwork or polychromy; certainly in relation to Ruskin's advocacy and Butterfield's use of it. For a non-W instance, see:
Sorry if I came over rather too strongly. The first time I was aware of the style, over fifty years ago, it was described as polychromatic, and the term obviously got lodged in my brain and, since then, I must have been using autocorrect whenever I saw the word polychrome. I did check online before posting, and, although the two words are synonymous, it was only in the polychromatic meanings that Oxford actually quoted “polychromatic brickwork “.
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I've just looked through some of the photos I'd taken of Brighton station buildings in the eighties, and I'd forgotten how popular polychromatic brickwork was through the years on the line. Too many to list, but Leatherhead and Eastbourne are worth checking. Unfortunately Christ's Hospital station was demolished before I visited it, but even the surviving goods shed had some interesting details, but the murky weather made my shots not worth posting, but a couple of views of Tunbridge Wells West just after closure give a taste of the wide palette of brick and stonework types and colours the LBSCR architects had at their disposal.
The details are very similar to Christ's Hospital, and there is a lovely colour view of that onein Michael Welch's Sussex Steam book from Capital Transport.
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12 hours ago, Mikkel said:
Thanks Stephen, I thought you might recognise it! Polychrome brickwork, that's a new term for me but very clear in the photos you show.
The usual term when applied to brickwork is polychromatic. The LBSCR had a wonderful example at Christ’s Hospital Station, but I haven’t been able to find a colour photo on line.
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Just an observation, but, in real life, mortar was seldom actually white, coming in various shades of grey, brown or yellow, depending on the type of cement and sand being used, and sometimes deeply coloured, perhaps black, to suit the architect's whims. There are only a couple of examples of white mortar I can think of. One is where Historic England or a client has demanded that lime mortar should be used, for authenticity, and this does start off white, but slowly mellows, and, when used for repairs, stands out starkly when compared with the, perhaps, hundred year old existing mortar, which may have darkened considerably over the years, particularly if the area was smoky prior to the Clean Air Act; sometimes the restorers will deliberately age the mortar to make it a better match. The other is in tuck pointing. This is a technique to make rough brickwork look superior, and can be seen in places like 10 Downing Street. The façade is built using dark bricks, and the mortar is coloured to match and is flush pointed. After a short curing period a narrow routing tool, perhaps ¼ inch wide, is run along the centre line of the joint, using a straight edge or line, and the resultant groove filled with white lime putty.
A few examples from my area. A Victorian terrace, with London stocks and red brick quoins and arches, with a creamy coloured mortar.
A more modern example - Elizabethan I suppose, with a a dark red brick and a darker shade of mortar. What is interesting is the way the top half here, which is a balcony, shows the effect of weathering, with dark mould and white staining where chemicals have leached out of the modern mortar mix. The lower section has been protected by the overhang of the balcony and shows very little weathering.
And finally, a wall on the house opposite the first example, where the end gable had been painted black, and has been subsequently repointed. Thanks to the contrast the new mortar does look very light, but it is a pale grey in colour.
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This picture may help
https://ba.e-pics.ethz.ch/catalog/ETHBIB.Bildarchiv/r/101334/viewmode=previewview/qsr=rhymney
Sadly, it's of No 64, again.
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I'm surprised you haven't consulted Part Ten of the RCTS Locos of GWR series, as it contains a very clear photograph of No. 64 in its final days, with the K boiler and shorter chimney from one of the more modern side tanks.
To clarify the story, Nos 62 and 63 were converted to 0-6-2 in 1908, and a boiler to the K Class design fitted. This boiler was 3 inches longer than the original, and an inch or so larger, and the firebox was 2 inches longer as well. As the boiler and firebox combination was longer than the original, I am not sure why you needed to be truncated the frames.
No 64, which is the loco that appears in both the WRR photo and in RCTS, was given a revised boiler design in 1906, which was the same dimensions as the original, before its conversion to an 0-6-2 in 1911, so it appears to have retained the original smokebox design and pitch, at 6' 6" after the initial rebuild. In this form it appears in the WRR photo.
However, sometime after 1917 it received a repaired, larger, K class boiler and became "almost standard with Nos. 62 and 63", although it was fitted with a short chimney, which it carried to scrapping in 1923. In this form No. 64 is seen in the RCTS photo, and it is clear that the larger boiler has been raised, presumably to clear the larger wheels/splashers, as the smokebox door is now fully circular, unlike the original, and the tank handrails are much higher than those on the cab side, which, presumably, were not altered, and there is a wider gap between the springs and the underside of the saddle tank. This is not withstanding the RCTS book quoting the GWR Diagram J pitch as remaining at 6' 6".
Without pictures it is impossible to say whether Nos. 62 and 63 actually conformed to this, but with the increased boiler diameter and other factors, it seems likely.
As for the inside motion, I wonder if there is anything to be seen, taking into account the larger splashers fitted, and the amount of equipment on the footplate between them.
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Found this website that has scans of some twenty horse drawn vehicles in the Staffordshire Carriage Collection. You can rotate the views and there is some interesting content in other sections of the site.
http://www.staffordshirecarriages.org.uk/single-private-omnibus/
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Found another example of the second type on Gail Thornton's website, but only three horses.
There are a couple of stage coaches on Shapeways, but only in HO and Z(!) at the moment.
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17 minutes ago, ChrisN said:
Nick,
The next picture is clearer and shows it has no roof. It is surprising how like the stage coach it is in design. I am sure it is a tourist coach for taking people up the A496.
If I modelled that stage coach then Stadden figures would have to walk as only the Preiser ones would fit.
The two vehicles are very different:
I agree the second is a tourist design, but the first is definitely based on a stage coach.
I've located a book published by the BBC in connection with a 1985 programme, and it appears the renaissance of coaching started earlier than I thought, around the end of the 1860's and lasted until 1928. It was more like the current preservation scene. The coaches were not expected to be particularly profitable, and were run mainly for the benefit of the owners who often took part in the driving, and for travellers to experience a way of life that had all but disappeared - much like riding behind a steam loco.
It includes an advertising item from 1909, which shows the seating arrangement on the roof.
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8 hours ago, ChrisN said:
In 1896 there was this,
Surely this one is actually a stage coach, such as this kit - probably in HO though. Wasn't there a revival in interest in stage coaches in the 1890's, some years after the railways had forced the original ones off the road. Four horses and lots of attendants, including a post-horn seems a bit over the top for taking passengers from the station to their hotel. Welcome to Disneyland, Victorian-style!
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Nice work on the wheels, but, just for the record:-
"The first issue is the wheels. As built they had 4’ 6” 10 spoke T section wheels. Later rebuilds had plain spokes, but that's after my time period. Nobody makes them, nearest offering is Gibson 11 plain spoke, so I’m going to have a go at converting them." Phoenix-Paints are listing Jubilee Pug wheels from the Sharman range as currently in stock. https://www.phoenix-paints.co.uk/products/sharman-wheels/4mm-steam-locomotive-driving-wheels/4-6-4-8/sw-m152
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The drawing and photo show what initially looks like a ladder at the rear. Closer inspection shows it to be three vertical rails with no apparent rungs. My best guess is that they are guard-/guiderails for raising and lowering heavy luggage to and from the roof without damaging the sides. Unless anyone knows better? Anyway, I fitted them using more brass wire.
The drawings show fairly substantial rollers at the top of the rails, which would seem to confirm that they are intended for lifting and lowering the baggage, rather like the end of a conveyor belt.
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Lovely model. I must do something with a similar kit stashed away somewhere. Just a thought though, highlighted by the excellent close-up photos; most pictures of similar vehicles seem to show a polished metal (brass?) circular cover plate in the centre of the hub, which I think would set your model off a treat.
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3 hours ago, Tom Burnham said:Mid 1930s? I wonder what the thing is above the coupling? Carriage is one of the two ex-LSWR arc roofed bogie brakes.
Do you mean the re-railing jack?
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In another topic, covering the supply and carriage of horses, I noted
I'm not sure the figures add up, but with a suggestion of around 150,000 working horses in London, and one dealer handling 25,000 dead horses a year, that suggests a working life of only around three years.
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5 hours ago, Miss Prism said:5 hours ago, JimC said:
Was a similar configuration used on any other lines?
Very common, I would say, e.g. M7, O2. (Unless I have misunderstood your question.)
I would think that almost every 0-4-4 and most 0-4-2 designs were similar in this regard. The Caledonian Railway had four locos that show this clearly, and they may have been influenced by the Forney tank design that was developed in the USA for intensive suburban working.
Photo from the wonderful ETH Zurich collection
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1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:
There's all sorts to see, such as the bang plate along the top of the door, and the lack of chamfer along the top of the side-rail*, or along the bottom of the side rail.
Is that a bang plate along the top of the door? There appear to be a pair of prominent door stops off the solebar which would connect with the door about half way up. It is difficult to tell where they are located, but there is an unusual widening of the door ironwork, roughly where I think the stops would make contact. Other wagons of this ilk seem to have had a single door stop, for which the central strap would provide protection.
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4 hours ago, Mikkel said:
That's a good picture showing how the tops of the planks forming the sides have been chamfered on the top outside edge, and are square on the bottom, so that water drains off, and doesn't sit in the joint. 3D printers please note!
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If the glass had to be unloaded at the yard, wouldn't a travelling crane be sent in advance to deal with it? The Caledonian certainly had a couple of 5 ton cranes for such tasks, at least within the engineering department.
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That's looking very promising. Just one point, the ballast doesn't usually stop at the end of the sleepers, as this cross section shows, albeit for a pre-grouping line.
You may want to extend the ballast a bit when you do the final touching up.
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I wonder if it is actually on a train? Given the hand brake is full on, and the wagon is buffered up against the "wrong" end of the brake composite, isn't it more likely that it has been temporarily parked?
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I've found one L C and S R, the Liverpool, Crosby and Southport Railway, incorporated in 1847, becoming part of the L&YR fully in 1855, following earlier negotiations in 1850.
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The trouble with the "preserved" Tilmanstone wagon is that they have followed the AIrfix/Dapol route and taken a modern(ish) wagon and applied a livery that was originally on 8 plank, shorter wagons, using modern graphic/typeface concepts. The lettering is rather too spindly and, because the wagon has a steel underframe, it has been painted black, so a thinly disguised pastiche rather than an authentic replica.
I've had a go at a rough version of what might be a suitable livery. I'm afraid I have used the first vaguely appropriate wagon as a basis, a K's LBSC wagon, which was only in primer, and I have attempted to blacken some of the iron work just to show the general effect. I should have used one of your mouldings, as I have several on the table behind me, just waiting for three link couplings and painting, and very good they look too, many thanks, but I haven't taken any usable photos yet.
I've used Franklin Gothic font for speed, as I think it is quite a good match for signwritten lettering, although others will no doubt comment on the "incorrect" proportions of some of the letters!
A couple of further suggestions. Since you can't see both sides of the wagon at the same time, the two sides don't need to be identical, so you can virtually double the size of your wagon fleet. For example, it's simple to have different numbers on each side, and the lettering can be different, perhaps set at an angle, curved or subtly different, perhaps "coals", or an added "Co", or even a completely different company. Regarding numbers, perhaps you should think big, to give the impression of an extensive fleet. Many smaller companies numbered their wagons jumping up in fives or tens, or started at 100 or 1000.
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Copenhagen to Penzance by rail
in The Farthing layouts
A blog by Mikkel in RMweb Blogs
Posted
Having derailed this thread, I thought this suburban house near me showed a triumph of money over good taste(?) might be of interest. Lots of polychrome bricks combined with plenty of flint and other materials. I have no idea of its history, as otherwise it is a fairly unremarkable building.
In my searching I also came across a PhD dissertation by Moses Jenkins of the University of Dundee on the history of brickwork in Scotland from 1700 - 1900 which goes into great detail on many aspects of brickwork, which makes interesting reading, if you have the time.
https://discovery.dundee.ac.uk/ws/portalfiles/portal/10228188/Jenkins_M_201