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According to the Michael Harris MK 2 book - appendix C. There were 5 early MK2's assigned to the London - East Anglia services (along with 180 MK1) in mid-1972. He doesn't state that they were FK's but I assume that is what they would be. Don't know when they moved over but, of course, they would be repainted by 1972. Towards the end of the 70's he says a lot more of this stock moved over to the GE lines. Rob

Anyone know what happened when the train was put back together in the up direction? That would involve more shunting I presume. Rob

Hands (assuming you still have them) up those who want to work like the guy in the first few seconds of this video https://www.youtube.com/shorts/0lFs4DVC2kY Thinking back to when I was around 9 or 10 (early 70's) there certainly were deaths due to misadventure. In my class (not just my school - in the 30 kids in my class) I can remember two kids who died. One got caught on something while swimming in a canal lock and drowned. Another died while playing chicken running in front of cars on a fast road. The thing that strikes me now about it was there was little fuss made - just an announcement at the start of class and nothing more. If that was the norm then you are unlikely to have heard about these deaths unless you were in that class. Rob

On further research in the RCTS book 92023 and 92050 were on tests going north to Kilmarnock. The tests were to compare the standard 9F with a Crosti version. These were road trails after tests in the Rugby Testing Station. The test trains consisted of 600 tons of empty passenger stock - which sounds like an expensive train to model! But there was another road trail with 92013 between Skipton and Carlisle in September/October 1954. This was a shorter train but would be unique as it consisted of a Dynamometer car and Mobile Test Units. Crewe did send them north for testing on completion. But I don't know how far north. Other than that it seems 9F's didn't start appearing in general use until 1958 when they started to run on the Settle and Carlisle. Rob

Seems 92023 (a Crosti) and 92050 were allocated (for a month) to Kingmoor in 1955. There were there for tests - no clue what tests though. Edit to add - the RCTS book on the 9F's says 92015-7 and 92161/2 were allocated to Newton Heath in June 58 and used on fitted freights from Manchester to Carlisle via the Settle and Carlisle route. Rob

To me this sounds like a triplet not a pair of coaches. 90 people would be hard to fit in two coaches along with the Restaurant facilities. No. 209 - Stock - TOV (Alexandra Laundry party), G. W. Articulated Restaurant Car (30 seats, Alexandra Laundry party; 60 Pioneer Spiritualist party) ; TOV (Pioneer Spiritualist party) ; 2 TKL ; 2 BTKL Rob

Yep - i worked with him in the 90's. The dart incident itself happened around 77 long before I met him. Rob

Back in the early 90's I worked with the guy who got the dart in his head. He said he didn't know it had happened and was wondering why everyone was staring at him - eventually his friend did tell him. Luckily he had a lot more hair at the time than the above guy in the cartoon. He brought in all the newspaper clipping about it. Strangely enough no one had pointed out that there was a big picture of his face on the front page underneath the headline 'The ugly face of football'. He did not appreciate me bringing up that point! He seemed to be a person beset by strange problems. I remember him coming into work a little late and a little wide eyed. On his way to work he was just coming out the newsagent when the house next door just collapsed all over his car. Rob

The Modern Railways mag of the time has a number of articles about this topic at the time. They start with rumours and gossip and end up with what actually happened. The gossip was that in 1962 the SR was getting concerned with the losses west of Exeter so were considering refocusing their efforts into a diesel semi-fast service to serve the stations up to Exeter (not sure if single line or not). Then comes the discussion mentioned above - should the Westbury line be closed and all traffic diverted by the SR route. Then the rumours really start - if the West of England is going to the SR and the old GW lines were going to the LM is there any need for the WR at all. Could the remains be combined into the LM? Of course that didn't happen. They kept the Westbury route - reasons, not sure Waterloo could handle the extra traffic on a weekday, too slow to reverse at Exeter, Taunton was too big a place to abandon and most existing passengers were used to going to Paddington. I am sure the WR folks were happy with that decision! Edit - just to add. None of the articles mention anything about the SR line being closed. Modified yes - but not closed. Rob

Actually I think they would look at that and think "Cut down an entire forest and get $20?? - way too much like hard work. I wouldn't get off the couch for $20!" Rob

That land was used by the up and down goods lines which avoided the station and sidings. The goods lines were taken out in 1968 during the changes in preparation of Trent Power box. J1544 also shows some of the work in preparation for Trent. The layout has been changed and the semaphores changed to match. The biggest change seen here is the distant signals added to the gantry. These were only added in 1968 - they just look like they have always been there! Rob

Scenes from the Past: 33 Bury to Heywood and Rawntenstall has a photo of the BP in Bolton Street station. It is on platform 3 (train 1Z65) in the evening and is signaled to go towards Castleton. Rob

According to the John Swift version of Birmingham Central diagram - 2 was a home signal on the other side of the tunnel. While 3 was a starter also on the other side of the tunnel. However the rest of the Swift diagram doesn't really match the above diagram so this may not be one of his best! Rob

Even if I am a employee in working hours I still wouldn't read all the emails I get - there is just far too many of them! Rob

Well I will try to redirect it back to Clans! A number of posts imply that the Clans were supposed to be built in small numbers - mainly for the highland line. Is that true? I haven't seen anything written that they were that restricted - they seem to be another type to be built and used all over the system. As far as I can see they were intended to be a replacement for Jubilees (and equivalents) across the system. It does seem that the first batch was intended for the highland lines but didn't make it there. The reason given by the RCTS book is that they didn't have the automatic token exchange equipment and it was decided it wasn't worth the cost fitting them when there were new black fives to do that work. So they got moved to work alongside Jubilees. Also according to the RCTS book the following extra Clans were planned. 1954 0 SR 5, ScR 10 1956 NER 20 1959 ScR 17, NER 15 1960 Scr 16 NER 25. The 1959/1960 ones were put on the plan after the Modernisation Plan was announced! Obviously got cancelled soon after. Wonder what the NER were to be called? Rob

So, let me rephrase the question - how many Clans and Brits did they think they were going to build? Or to be more general - how many standards were they thinking about? I assume they meant to build them in large numbers (for example there was no 74xxx class so does that imply more than a thousand 73xxx?). It doesn't make sense to me that they would do all that design work if they expected to build a small number of engines - might as well just build a few more of already existing classes. Just building a few engines with a different set of component parts is just going to complicate things even more - especially in an already heavily standardized area like the Western. I don't think I have seen how many they planned to build per year and for how many years. Of course, steel/money shortages and diesels ruined whatever plans they had. Rob

How Clans were they thinking of building when this decision was being made ? I assume they must have been thinking in the hundreds to justify the costs of developing another 'standard' class. Obviously 35 wasn't what they were thinking - they wouldn't have considered it worth it. I suppose, based on the numbering scheme, it was at most a thousand. Rob

Shouldn't the Atlantic Coast Express count as well? You don't just get one pacific with that train. Rob

Did you go to Eastleigh in 1973 as 92203 and 75029 were there between their stay at Longmoor and going to Cranmore. Rob

Is it the approach to Manchester Victoria (or maybe Exchange depending on the date) on the LNW lines with Threlfall brewery in the background? Edit - as two of the tracks seem out of use then Exchange has probably closed by this time. Rob

You can get a lot more nerdier with this joke! It works because OCTober means Eighth month and DECemeber means Tenth month which leads to lots (and lots) of nerdy stuff about the changes in the calendar with March once being the first month of the year. Just be glad for this thread that Caesar Augustus wanted a month named after him so there is no month called Sexember! Rob

I think I read that they did consider bi-mode when designing the hasting units but the benefits were out-weighed by the extra costs so they didn't do it. As for West of Salisbury I also think that the cancelled 3rd stage of the Kent Coast electrification was supposed to have released units from the Hastings and Oxted (and possibly others) lines for transfer to the west. Rob

This is the picture by David Holmes showing one alongside the platform at East Leake station. Rob

I have found the other picture - from Station Master's reflections by David Holmes. Picture of 73010 5.59PM 29/6/62 at East Leake on a "Darnall-Ruislip special" running as a class 8 (assuming this http://www.wheeltappersdccsounds.co.uk/page72/index.html is correct). Note it has a match wagon and brake van on the front. Rob

I have seen at least two pictures of A60/A62 stock being hauled along the GC to Neasden. The one I can find easily (Steam Memories: 1950's and 1960's Great Central Lines) shows B16/3 61463 hauling a set past Bagthorpe Junction. Date sometime around July 61. I would have to hunt harder to find the other picture. I have it one of my books - somewhere. Rob