Pteremy

As mine has now arrived I can confirm that it has two lamp irons. A set of lamp irons is listed amongst the spares so I think that the top one should be easily removed, leaving only a small hole to be filled and requiring a dab of paint.

As the owner of several I sincerely hope not! For all the possible issues about the accuracy of the bodywork and livery the one thing we should be guaranteed with any new version of a model that is 1 or 2 decades old is an improvement in 'performance'.

Some photos show 2, others just 1! Hopefully the new arrivals are correct.

A couple of enlargements from an undated late period photo (i.e. late crest + additional piping) of 18000 apparently at Swindon station. Looking at the right side of the cab/photo it would appear that the thick chrome orange band is immediately next to the roof grey/silver, without a gap between them, and has a thinner line below it. So similar in style to the side lining but not identical. This near front on view also clearly shows the additional piping attached to the boiler drain cock. I wonder if this late addition to 18000 might reflect some generic change in practice in the late 1950's about how water was to be drained?

Is the roof band clear in this photo? I ask because I have found another colour image in which it looks as if it might be the same style as the side band - that is, one thick stripe in the middle of two very thin ones?

By chance I have come across another good colour photo of 18000 out of service at Swindon dated 9/3/61 on page 46 of British Railways Western Region in Colour. ((John posted a grainier B/W version earlier in the thread). Alerted to existence of a lower body stripe you can just about make it out - but it is hardly discernible, unlike the roof and side body stripes. The reason for posting though is that the 'additional pipework' is clearer and looks very much like it is connected to the boiler drain cock.

Computer calibration issues aside I don't think there is any doubt (e.g. looking at the 'Huntriss photo' earlier in the thread) that the buffer beams are red - as per the 1956 repainting specification - and that the lining is some shade of orange. I am happy to defer to others on what precisely that was, but logically it would be something that Swindon had in stock for other (similar) uses.

I had hoped that the information here https://davidheyscollection.com/pages/david-heys-steam-diesel-photo-collection-23-br-western-region-3 might shed some further light. But unfortunately the reporting number '211' is missing from the lists during the relevant period.

On the pipework - also just for discussion - the 'ladder' period photographs, green early crest, do not have any pipework. So the pipework was not added during the period in 1956-57 during which 18000 was overhauled, repainted and then returned to traffic in early February 1957. In the RTCS archive there is a photograph of 18000 approaching Reading General with a Passenger train dated 27/8/58 with the pipework visible. Robertson has a photo (p125) dated 4/3/58 clearly showing a late crest but apparently no pipework. Discussing visits back to Swindon in 1958 Robertson (p126) refers to a fire in some of the control cables. This event is not dated, but 18000 was apparently noted at Swindon Works in April 1958. Could this be when and why the pipework appeared? If so it may be reasonable to conclude that the pipework was present for the final 18 months of 18000's active life. But prior to that it was in service between Feb 1957 and (?) April 1958 in green/early crest and then green/late crest, with no pipework.

Yes, that is much clearer - in black and white the lining and light refraction from the top of the bevel must blend together.

I think that I would be happy to 'stick' while we are ahead. Here is a crop from, I think, from an RTCS photo, similar to the 'propped ladder' photo referred to above. Here it looks like there might be some sort of colour band above the bevel. But the bevel itself is less distinct than in other photos. And the colour band is less intense than either the roof or side stripe. Which may be due to weathering. Or maybe it is some trick of the light, enhanced by cleaning - the top of the bevel does stand out even in black livery photos.

Yes. Sales of the large Prairie and the Manor depend on the Mogul being a success. I am sure that they will do all they can to make sure that it is a success.

Thanks Phil - yes I have seen that suggested before, although the Class 40 boxes are a different design. It is just that the Kernow D6xx versions look spot on for the WR style boxes, as bolted on to some of the early D63xx's, before they took the decision to rebuild the front ends.

On the transition from black to green there is contemporaneous evidence in the 'Locomotive Notes' on p143 of the 1957 Railway Magazine. Relating back to December 1956 it is noted that at Swindon '...18000 had been given an undercoat of green paint, which suggests that it is about to come back into service.' Which it did, in February 1957. The Swindon repainting memorandum of 25 October 1956, referred to by Robertson (p122) does not mention the lining at all so the colour used has to be the subject of an educated guess.

Out of interest are the head code boxes a separate attachment or a continuous mold? I ask because if they could be made available on their own they could used to modify the Dapol 63xx to the first head code box variants.

The excellent colour photo showing an orange roof band with the early crest looks pretty conclusive to me. Kevin Robertson's book has an 'official Swindon' photo (p121) dated to 'late 1957', also with the early crest. Being a black and white photo the roof band is a subtle colour variation but does appear to be there. If there is good photographic evidence that the roof band was not present when 18000 re-entered service in Feb 1957 then there might be a case for the early crest version to be issued without the roof band, but, as above, there doesn't appear to be any doubt that the late crest version should have the band. Would the error stop me buying the final version? No. But as a livery issue it would seem to be a relatively straightforward thing to correct?

Volume 3 still due at the end of this month.

According to the service record in Kevin Robertson's book after it failed on 24th September 1959 it was taken to Swindon and never worked again before official withdrawal in December 1960.

Had a look over the weekend and my impression is that the prices have already dropped, except for 93XX/73XX versions.

Save up for the retooled versions, whenever they appear!

The classic Modellers BackTrack article describes them as based on a 1938 Shell-BP design, which was '..a refinement..' of the 1927 RCH design. A key difference/innovation in the Air Ministry orders was the provision of a catwalk and ladder. Initially two small catwalks either side of the filler cap, subsequently one longer one. But not all of the tank wagons built for the Air Ministry had a catwalk, so there was quite a lot of variation. Post war conversions saw catwalks and ladders added where absent, and some catwalks repositioned. So all in all a lot of variety for some willing manufacturer to make a fortune out of.

I don't know how accurate it is (in a rivet counting sense) but the underframe is certainly a thing of beauty, really capturing the 'skeletal' look of the real thing.

Indeed. Guess we will have to wait for the first test samples to find out.

The colour is described as being 'BR green'.

Possibly. To be honest I don't really associate Dapol with 2020 standard wagons. Too many wagons of distant vintage or generic design, for my era of interest at any rate. But if they have done a good job of a 7mm version then I would be in the market for a few scaled down versions. I know that some of the others they have scaled down, the Bolster E for example, have gone down well.