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Everything posted by C126

  1. Please forgive my coming to this particular story a decade late - I have just discovered these posts, and am working my way through - but it is a delight to see a railway scene with beautifully dressed ladies and gentlemen. As one who goes weak-kneed at a crinoline, and flounces round in a frock coat at any opportunity, it is a shame there are not more layouts thus. As a useless piece of information, I believe the (otherwise wonderful) Charles Frederick Worth of Paris decided the 'full' (round, bell) crinoline passe in 1862, his designs moving towards one with a flatter front and more Edwardian 'bustle' shape. And do not get me started on the replacement of 'white tie' evening dress with casual 'black' by the Prince of Wales/Edward vii. in the '80's... Wonderful blogs, and I look forward to reading more as time allows.
  2. If you will forgive me for 'blowing my own trumpet', I did my best to photograph it comprehensively when parked in Eastbourne Goods Yard in 1987: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/gallery/album/4674-br-s-dept-wagons-and-stock-1980s-and-90s/ Scoll to the second page of photos. Hope this is of help if you were thinking of modelling it!
  3. Please permit me the honour of presenting my compliments to your mother, and expressing the hope she would have enjoyed travelling in a 2H to Town occasionally, and perhaps home in a nice Mk. I. during the peak hours! I have not forgotten your and others' kind words of advice over the years, and these are no exception. Looking forward to purchasing a triple of Accurascale MDVs in the summer for my coal yard very much. Still got the idea of a canning factory rattling around at the back of my mind; I need to find out what sort of sheet coils to buy, but am having a bit of a crisis with the pointwork in the passenger station to-day, redesigning it so the loco platform can 'release' onto a loop directly, instead of needing part of the other platform as well. A post to follow soon, I hope!
  4. Inspired by @Ray Von 's musings and the contributions re his blog - Third Rail N Gauge Shelf Terminus - while waiting for the weekend, my thoughts turned to Atherington's location, industries, and train services. While not a simple re-naming of a real town, being an 'ex-Central Division child' I wanted somewhere on the Sussex Weald, inland to model imagined fish and milk trains, all in a 'declining 1970's aesthetic' with both electric and diesel services. Inspired by memories of the East Grinstead and Seaford branches, I then 'stretched reality' to a more optimistic 'history', where freight could be struggling on still with a more supportive economy and government. My solution was thus: Atherington’s 'successful' west station is on an electrified main line direct to the Sussex coast, with another branch South-westerly like the Three Bridges - Horsham - Littlehampton line. Atherington Victoria station, 30 miles and 41 mins. from London Bridge, was opened later by a rival company, celebrating Her Majesty the late Queen of course. Its line South-east is to a mythical industrial port, the 'poorer cousin' to the 'Brighton Line'-ish route of its neighbouring station. This 'cousin' was electrified southwards just before W.W. II., but the northwards scheme cancelled. With this in mind, it would appear to suit the sites of Ashurst or Eridge, but with the Hastings main line going there, not to Royal Tunbridge Wells, which remained only on a 'loop' from Eridge to Tonbridge. I wished a link with the latter as an excuse for a second freight service. Despite the slower service on its less direct route to London, commuter traffic from Atherington Victoria remains buoyant, fares being cheaper than its whizzy electric rival and with a wealthy First class passenger-population living in the villages on the Weald, and using also the stations northwards. Similarly, commuters, school-children, and sixth-formers travel to Atherington for work and teaching from the north, east, and south-east. Consequently, there are two '33'-hauled peak-time trains to London Bridge morning and evening to supplement a basic hourly service by DEMU, that joins and divides further up the line serving another branch. This is a blatant attempt at catharsis, my being born too late to have been 'something in the City' and commute daily behind a '33' in Mk. I compartments, a standard of comfort now vanished from to-day's trains, and not appreciated by me until seeing their replacements. Both Atherington and the port's manufacturing economy is stable, if not growing significantly, with the 'legacy industries', agriculture, and reliable coal merchant excuse to run an 'optimistic' 1970's vacuum-braked (and predominantly drab bauxite) wagon-load goods service. A morning train from Norwood Jn to the port and back stops both north- and south-bound to exchange wagons. Lacey's Aggregates receives a cut of wagons of various minerals from a larger train from Acton to other terminals, and also contributes local chalk, sand, and gravel. This service might have a wagon or two added direct from the Western Region for speed and convenience. Additionally, there is a daily after-noon service from/to Tonbridge Yard, that can also include a wagon or two to/from the port. Depending on traffic, there is a TThO Norwood Jn/port goods train to 'mop up' any excess wagons, running 'Q' as required. With the introduction of the SLK 'Speedlink' air-braked service and recession of the early 1980's, goods trains are reduced to a twice-daily stop on a service from/to Willesden Yard to the port. The aggregate train from Acton is now a 'COY' company block-train, but booming in the era of expanding road building... I have yet to satisfy myself as to the delivery of coal in hoppers, not wanting to dig holes in baseboards to model a huge Concentration Yard. Apart from the coal merchant, I considered an extra private delivery for a coal-fired greenhouse plant nursery, but wonder if this would thrive on the chilly slopes of the Weald, even if heated. There is probably a good reason why the fruit and vegetable growers are along the Brighton-Portsmouth line on the warm coast. I hope to build some sort of cheap 'under hopper over rail' elevator to use the HKVs, HBAs, and HEAs. Loco-hauled and Non-Passenger services are run with similar 'modellers' licence', if based upon examples from an early 1980's Working Time Table: an early morning Parcels service from/to Bricklayers Arms, the Newspapers from London Bridge arriving at 04.27, fish dropped off in a 'Parcels' train from the port, and a milk train to take some of the Weald's dairy production to London for bottling. There is a short van train late morning to convey the greenhouses' produce to Bricklayers Arms for market, and the portion of an inter-regional service to Newcastle via Kensington Olympia once a day, with more lovely Mk. I. coaches. Sketching all these on a draft, clock-face time table, it had never occurred to me how complicated platform dwell-times, running-round, etc., could be. With their charming, arcane, artisan compositing I like so much, I should mock up a W.T.T. in 'Word', but lack the creative flair to compose three-dozen fictional names for the lines' subsequent stations. No doubt there are many errors as to the suppositions above, if only owing to the physical geography of which I know little. However, I hope this is of interest, and any ideas for improvements will be received gratefully.
  5. It is pl. 103, by "R. E. Ruffell", in Marsden's 'The diesel shunter - a pictorial record', 1981. Caption: "A rather interesting scene photographed at Waterloo station on 30 June, 1973, when D4114, later 09 026, hauled the daily milk train from Clapham Junction to Vauxhall and thence Waterloo, formed of one GWR milk tank wagon and a BG coach. D4111, later 09 023, has been attached to the country end to haul this train back to Clapham Junction. The 09 on the rear will now take up the duties of station pilot." The BG is certainly not a B.R. Mk. I, but I do not know enough to say if it is L.M.S. or not. It is in B.R. blue/grey. Interestingly, searching for this turned up another photograph by Ruffell on p. 69 of Pallant and Bird's 'Diesel and electric locomotives of the southern region', 1984. Caption: "No. 74.001 and empty milk tank at Waterloo in March 1976. An '08' class shunter normally worked this humble duty." It is just a tank, and no van.
  6. If you can get him to 'download his brain' about this work, I am sure I will not be alone in being most grateful!
  7. I finished a model cab office yester-day to use for my aggregate merchant. It has not endeared me to white-metal kits - the brick-work is decidedly 'un-matching' and I glued one side out of true - but I am ridiculously pleased at how the colours have turned out. The mortar was painted in acrylic first, all over, and then a sponge dipped in brick-coloured brown no more than caressed over the walls, so as not to paint over the mortar. This needed to be done a few times, to get a darker and darker shade. Then one starts the never-ending cycle of painting doors, windows, and sills, re-painting walls that have been dabbed with fittings paint, then re-painting the fittings, then touching up the walls again, until one goes quite doolally and has had enough! The interior needs to be done, and eventually, I fool myself, I will be able to scratch-build my own from brick-sheet and with a chimney for a coal fire, but overall I am content. Owing to the lack of a local aggregate merchant's name to steal in the 1972 'Brighton Area' telephone directory, I used the one of a much-loved toy-shop from my childhood instead. I thought it sounded right, and must decorate the tipper when I find the lettering. That vehicle's livery is chosen quite at random, of course...
  8. Thanks to @SED Freightman for the timings. I came across a photograph in 'BR Diesel freight in the traditional era' - OAKLEY, Michael, Truro : D. Bradford Barton, [n.d.], by F. R. Kerr, of 09 002 pulling a single milk tank and guard's van at Vauxhall (it is a zoom close-up from above, showing only the viaduct and running lines as surrounding). There is a half-page of text explaining the routing via Waterloo, and how milk, "the aristicrat [sic] of general freight work", receives "special attention everywhere". Just need those OO milk tanks to be delivered from China to purchase a.s.a.p.!
  9. May I just thank you all for contributing to this thread, the result being I have assumed my Milk Empties arrive at the siding by the station at around 09.30, and depart loaded for London at around 22.00. All this is pure phantasy so far, having yet to find the desired milk tanks to buy, but there is no rush... I hope the information has been useful to others as well. With my best wishes to you all, and thanks again.
  10. Just as this was posted, I started trawling through Flickr for such images under the simple "milk train" search term. Some lovely pics out there, and interesting info. from a user about moaning lorry-drivers stopping the reuse of Chard Jn by EWS in the '90's. Many thanks to you all for this and all the contributions so far. I will start drafting my time table on Saturday...
  11. Hurrah! I am so glad for you. Inspired by your example, I tried plotting a 'pattern' to my (still theoretical) passenger trains yester-day, and trying to interweave parcels, news, milk, etc. Never knew platform occupation and usage was so complicated! Happy reading, and let us know how you get on.
  12. Many thanks @Fat Controller for such a prompt reply. I had forgotten to allow for the processes of chilling, pasteurisation, etc.! However, that is just the sort of timings I need.
  13. Sorry to be so dull-witted, but there is a big 'milk train following' on RMWeb, so I hope someone can answer a simple question for me: How many days old was the milk in the tank trains from the West Country by the time it was discharged at the London terminals (particularly Vauxhall)? The farm milks its cows twice a day (Day 1), morning and evening. If a farm had its milk taken (say mid-day) on Day 1 to the nearest 'concentration depot', in Devon, for example, was it then loaded that evening to be taken by train over-night to London, and so unloaded/ discharged on the morning of Day 2? Or would the 'supply chain' be slower? I would just like to know when the milk tanks arrived to be loaded, to get up to London a.s.a.p. I am planning a milk siding for my Southern Region layout ('Rule 1'); when must one 'slot in' the arrival of empty tanks (mid-morning?), and departure to Town of filled ones (early evening?). All help gratefully received, and thanks as always for giving this your consideration.
  14. Waiting for pay-day and a trip to B. & Q. for more Araldite for the aggregate merchant's office, I could put off the cleaning and electrical testing after ballasting and painting no longer. Two naughty points caused problems, but with much track-rubber, rag and meths, and ultimately sand-paper, their sidings functioned again. Not as bad as feared, so I thought this was a photo-opportnity for my second-hand (Douglas J. Fryer of Lewes!), Hornby breakdown-crane. We saw one of these (or so it looked to my inexpert eye) whenever going to Brighton, so the model has always had a place in my heart from childhood, even if I have no need for it now.
  15. Actually, I think, looking at: https://britishrailwaybooks.co.uk/wtt/sregion/sregionindex.php ...it might be Section WB, "SOUTH EASTERN DIVISION - MAIN LINE (via North Kent and Chatham)". Do check before you buy one.
  16. Spent a couple of hours playing around with my partner's camera to get a shot of a 'Handsome Hymek' on the layout, and a lovely '73'. Anything to put off cleaning and testing the track and point-work...
  17. You really do need a Working Time-Table (W.T.T.) for the line (Section WA) in the relevant period to model your service. Can you find one for sale on certain web-sites? If you have never read one before, you are in for a surprise...
  18. Just a quick note to dispel the superstition of thirteen 'posts', and show my bodged soldering of the wires to the control panel for the main 'East Yard' part of the layout. Of course, one pair of power-input wires was too short, so I had to solder 6" extensions to reach the correct input socket. The back of the panel: The two isolation sections (Goods arrival and departure), with wires on the right of each track (away from the viewer): I will fill the gaps with painted modelling clay in an attempt to make the holes less obvious.
  19. Glad to read the last two blog postings, and the draft time-table above. It was a source of constant annoyance when we went on holiday to France in the early 1980's that S.N.C.F. did not copy the Southern's 'clock-face' practice. Anyway, I attach two quick photographs from an early 1970's 'Mandatory' W.T.T. (i.e., Freight), to express a hope for exquisite artisan time-table compositing in this style. Or perhaps not! If someone has the relevant passenger W.T.T., I hope they can post a few pages. I regret I have only the Central Division.
  20. @Compound2632 Thanks for your kind remarks. Yes, the B.W. packs are white, although perhaps they could receive a satin varnish to represent the plastic's gloss, and you are quite correct in voicing concern about the 'end loading' in the Opens. It is the only way I can get them to fill the wagon neatly. The 'narrowest' way lying flat is to have two packs side-by-side giving a scale 'load width' of 32mm., 2 mm. too wide. No wonder they went by lorry. If anyone can shed light on any wagons used 'in reality' for these packs, I would be interested. Some sort of sheeted 'Timber open'-style wagon, with bolsters?
  21. Waiting for the garage to warm so I can do some soldering, I have been churning out six-dozen 'wool sheets', thanks to @enz and 'British Wool' (formerly the British Wool Marketing Board). I will edit this post later to provide additional information if the latter's kind correspondent permits, but these white polypropylene sacks took over in the mid-1970's from the smaller, brown, 60lb. hessian sacks to be seen in pictures of the Tetbury wool sack races. These will be another project. Thanks to @enzfinding a document with their dimensions, I bent and soldered a piece of 6mm. nickel-silver strip to make an oblong with internal dimensions 16x22mm. This was my first attempt at a butt-joint, and I was rather pleased, even if I did use to much solder. The two prototypes next to the lorry are before I knew the correct dimensions. Then it was just a case of rolling out a lump of modelling clay 6mm. thick, pressing out oblongs with the above 'cutter', and pushing them out and smoothing the shape with wet fingers. Took a day to dry. Not perfect, but they will do, I think. Now I need to ponder how to do any lettering, if at all. A pleasing wagon-load, if having to invoke 'Rule 1' to use it. Annoyingly, they do not stack inside a OO wagon of 30mm. width, and are not 'pallet friendly'. Of course, now I am wondering if I should have moulded them in one large 'lump' instead...
  22. Fair enough. I was acting under the assumption Grove Ferry remained open, as a 'Barnham-style' junction station. This was the example I was trying to remember.
  23. Sorry to make things more boring for the sake of 'realism', and I stand to be corrected, but I think the service would be a simple shuttle to a junction at Grove Ferry and no further, for a change onto the train to Canterbury West. In the late '70's, things were being run down, as the future was the motor-car. The only occasion which springs to my mind (admittedly of limited knowledge) of a branch-line train going onto a larger station as it were is Seaford-Brighton, connecting at Lewes for the Hastings/Eastbourne-Victoria. I am not sure why you would want pl.1 to be used for passengers; please could you elaborate?
  24. Mornin' all. May I just hold my hand up to the confusion about trains through to Ashford and Hastings. This was when I thought the location was inland, half-way on a line of longitude between Faversham and Charing. Now it has been relocated, I defer to everyone's local knowledge, and also admit to being confused by the original railway company initials rather than the lines' main stations, so please forgive any mistakes I make. If pl. 2 is to remain electrified, what is to be done with the loco-hauled Mk. I.s, other than occasional inter-regional portion and Saturday excursions? Also, I would hold out for a commuter service joining at Grove Ferry for lowly-paid plebs unable to afford to live in Canterbury; it is not just London that has commuters. Like the Lymington and Sheerness(?) branches, a one-unit shuttle connecting to a main line. Sure there was something else to add from a previous page, but I have forgotten now. As to Suder's business, think of 'anything in a van'. To increase interest, it would be nice for her/his business to be served by an extra 'Q' (as required) Speedlink train, as presumably the Zanussi warehouse would have a daily block train north to their depot. And personally, I find block trains boring...
  25. Well, I am glad my summary is largely all right. May I still argue for the de-electrification of pl. 2 to allow use of peak-time supplementary commuter loco-hauled stock (as I am not sure for what else it would be used), please, perhaps on a rambling semi-fast route via Canterbury, Ashford, and Maidstone West to Town, or to Hastings (I think this would be far enough for it to terminate, and there were(?) run-round facilities there). Or both (one with the mini-Buffet)! However, it is your railway, I must remind myself...
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