MAP66

I think we’re all a bit guilty of looking at models we worked on years before and thinking, I wish I had done that bit differently, I certainly do. Even stuff I’m working on now, I constantly ask myself “why on earth have you done it like that.” Thanks again for all the comments and for sharing that image of your Pannier which I think has definitely stood the test of time and those window bars look dam good to me. Fifty years ago, that would have been the envy of every modeller to own it and It still looks amazing now.

That’s a shame, I missed SWAG last year as the Mrs was in hospital. I do hope your able to attend the shows again soon.

I'm using Peco code 75 flexi track which is nickel silver.

Thanks are in order for the avalanche of likes just received on this thread and the layout one. I must be doing something right then! It would be nice to meet up at the SWAG event and put a face to a name. Best Regards Mark

The helix is still getting taller, but its progressing very slowly. Let’s face there’s nothing much exciting about building a helix and how many images can you post, it all looks the same just a bit taller each time. In other news, while trawling the interweb, I came across a second hand Bachmann Fowler 7F 2-8-0 which had already been weathered, re-numbered and re-liveried to LMS ‘13806’ and at £65.00, I thought that was a bargain. 13806 could be found at Bath in the late 1930’s, so it would not look out of place on my, at the moment, fictitious stretch of SDJR railway. I went ahead and purchased the model anyway and it arrived today. It was transported immediately to the railway room, where it received a thorough visual inspection. All looked in good order and so, to the test track. A sigh of relief was expelled when the motion and wheels all moved and turned as they should. 13806 ran nicely up and down the helix and across the diamond crossing without issue. The testing concluded with the loco hauling a maximum of 5 coaches up the helix without wheel slip. This loco, I thought, could potentially manage 8/9 coaches with say 2 magnets fitted. That will be tested at some point but my next venture will be to fit a sound decoder to 13806. I was trawling that interweb again and found a feature from the April 2021 edition of Hornby magazine where the very same loco was subjected to having a sound decoder inserted into its tender. I have never installed a decoder before and I thought following a step by step installation guide, would be the way to go. With that said, I ordered a back issue of the mag and am currently checking how deep my pockets will go for that sound decoder, speaker and probably stay alive. Watch this space for further developments… Well here it is, my latest purchase 13806 is about to ascend the helix in charge of a rake of 5 coaches. And only because you love these pictures so much, yet another view of the helix which is currently about two thirds through the second circuit.

The Traction Trials - Results are in I shall summarise; my findings have resulted in no less than 5 magnets to be fitted on the underframe of the 51XX to haul 7 coaches up the first 4th radius circuit and even then, some minor wheel slip was observed. A disappointing result and certainly not the expected 2 magnets to do the job. The full 12V was required from the controller and it will be interesting to see if running under DCC will make any difference. Unfortunately, that test will be some time in the future as I do not presently own any decoder installed locos. Maybe, some further minor tweaking is possible to enhance performance by way of securing the magnets under the loco, so that they are slightly closer to the track to increase their pull. Failing that, if I want to run 9 coach holiday specials then I guess there’s always double heading. So now I am embarking on building the second circuit and will soon need to order a load more powerbase. There was also a pleasant realisation and that is, you can never have too many clamps when constructing a helix. That impulse buy of a set of clamps from the middle of Lidl paid off 😄 A ridiculous amount of magnets was necessary for the tractive power required. These are all temporarily secured with blac-tac. It will be a real head scratcher to come up with a workable solution to fit the magnets permanently without covering any of the cover plate screws. Side view showing the magnets which are held within the blister bubble carriers which form part of the powerbase packaging. You are advised to secure the blister packs with the tiny screws supplied drilled into the locos cover plate. With 5 magnets the cover plate will end up looking like swiss cheese. Beginning of the second circuit, start collecting clamps if your taking one of these on.

Ahhh, that's interesting to know, I think I must have an earlier version as the tops of the wheels foul on the bottom of the sole bar on the 3rd radius. There's a few things I can try to improve the extent of pivot rotation on the bogies, including modifying the sole bar where the wheels catch it and of course introduce a bit of side play on the wheel sets. I'm grateful, however, that I haven't any 1st radius to contend with 🤪 Thanks again for the heads up.

The Somerset Levels I thought it was appropriate to introduce a landscape feature attributed to the region and here is my version. A pretty handy tool for those wanting to get their inclines sorted quickly. The helix rises 80mm each circuit, I have also introduced a slight camber of about half a degree so the tracks lean inwards a fraction. I need a total rise in height of 300mm. Four complete circuits equates to 320mm from point of entrance, so I have planned the helix for the exit road to be at a height of 300mm which is 3.75 circuits. Coaches have arrived, a mixture of Airfix, Hornby, Mainline and a Lima utility van. All came with fine scale wheels already fitted apart from the Lima wagon. Amongst the lot was a 12-wheeler restaurant car. Unfortunately, it does not negotiate the 3rd radius curves. I noticed that the wheels which had been fitted have absolutely no side play. I plan to slightly under gauge the wheel sets and take some material away from the insides of the bogies to introduce some side play. I think that should do the trick as it only binds slightly but enough to de-rail. Next step will be the traction trials and results (favourable or not) will be reported in due course.

Its been a bit quiet on here recently, there is a reason. Well, two reasons actually. I am waiting on an order from Squires and I have also been working on the new layout and have now started a new thread for it. There’s nothing exciting happening on there yet, all the boring stuff has to happen first and that’s going to take some time. Anyway, for those interested, here’s the link for the new thread https://www.rmweb.co.uk/forums/topic/185439-shepton-mallet-charlton-rd-for-now-yet-to-be-renamed/?do=getNewComment

The last couple of days has seen me laying on my back staring at the undersides of the baseboards while routing out and securing the 2 power buses around the helix. Not the most enjoyable of tasks but necessary, none the less. It also allowed me a closer inspection of the carpet, an area which normally escapes my attention, there was quite an accumulation of detritus from my recent activities. Time for Henry to make an appearance and for a general tidy up, as soon it will be time to test my track laying capabilities. Just as soon as I have completed the 3rd radius on the first circuit and soldered in all the droppers to the track rails. For electrical continuity and to confirm that I have not crossed any wires anywhere, I will be checking frequently with my multi-meter. I am using solderless connectors for attaching the droppers to the power buses. As you clamp shut each connector it cuts through the outer insulation of the cable and makes an electrical bond with the cable conductor. I have also started to glue down the powerbase to the outer 4th radius up line, this could prove expensive as I am going to need quite a few. For this reason, I will not order any more (I have enough for one circuit) until I have conducted some traction tests on the first circuit. I have zero coaching stock, so I need to source some cheap second hand stock for testing. In an ideal world I would like at least 7 coaches to glide up the helix without causing the loco in charge any wheel slip. I will need to experiment with how many magnets are required to be slung under the loco to achieve this, or not as the case may be! The loco I have chosen for this task is a Hornby R3719 class 51XX Large Prairie, as its literally the only large loco I have and it will be under analogue power. Lets hope the results are encouraging. The first circuit of the inner 3rd radius is nearing completion, just the droppers to sort out. The power base is also being glued down in place. View from another angle. I found the Peco code 75 flexi track a little challenging to connect together on the tighter radius. Staggering the joins between the inner and outer rails made it easier and helped maintain the seamless curvature of the rails at the join. It has resulted in a few sleepers missing between track ends and these will be replaced later. Underside of the infill section of baseboard, showing the 2 power buses running from right to left and the solderless cable connectors for attaching the droppers.

Well done for cracking on with it, looks like those track rails are not going anywhere. As long as it provides smooth running then that's done the trick. Unfortunately, I can't comment on the adaptability of the Modeltech product in its use on curves and angles, if indeed that is possible. Reviews for it are good though.

What about this as a solution from Modeltech, haven't used it myself but looks like a good bit of kit for aligning track over baseboard joins. https://www.marks-trains.co.uk/shop/layout-accessories/modeltech-ho-oo-protrack-rail-aligner-standard/?gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5fTRjuewhQMVD5dQBh2aCQwkEAQYByABEgLK-PD_BwE

He, he, he, one of my traits. I cut something and then think about the mess only when the Mrs points it out 😄

Some painting of the baseboards has occurred since we last visited. I’m not painting the cork underlay on the lower non-scenic levels, that can stay au naturale. On the underside of the boards I have started to route and install the power bus, I am using 2 power buses, one to serve the up lines and one for the down lines. I have started to lay some track, starting with the inner track on the first circuit of the helix and also the lower diamond crossing. Past the diamond crossing the up and main lines curve off to the left across the infill baseboard and will lead into their respective fans of point work to create the entrance and exits to the through fiddleyard. View of the diamond crossing where the up and down lines cut across each other. A start on track laying is also in progress on the inner 3rd radius of the helix. An underside view of the large angle brackets used to support the baseboard, apologies for all the clutter! No warping so far but eventually I plan to fit angle iron along the front edge to prevent warping.

Thanks for sharing, always good to have additional supplier resources when needed 👍

The first helix is under construction and I decided that it would be better to complete one circuit at a time, then add the cork underlay and then the track. Then get that tested and running before moving onto the next circuit. That way it would be easier to work on and sort out any potential problems without the circuit above getting in the way. I have done my best to plan this and think ahead, this is due to a concern I have and that concern is traction. I would like to run trains of up to 9 coaches but I don’t have the rolling stock available or a pre-built helix to test the hauling power required. Therefore, the best I can do is to build in measures which should improve traction. One of the easiest and simplest wins is to have the 4th radius, outside and larger of the two track radii, designated for ascending trains only. This would alleviate some of the friction on longer trains as they travelled upwards through the helix. Then, after some deliberation, I have decided to also install the powerbase solution from DCC Concepts. I am now at the stage of preparing to stick it down onto the cork track bed of the 4th radius first circuit. Time will tell if this was a good decision and investment. I took another trip to that DIY store and came away with another sheet of MDF cut in half along its length, giving me two baseboards measuring 8’ x 2’. One of these boards has now been installed along the longer wall along with an infill piece which bridges the gap between the helix baseboard. All point motors, accessory decoder’s and interconnecting cables are going to be surface mounted on these lower baseboards. For now, I wanted to keep the areas under the baseboards clear for storage and have supported the new baseboard section using large L brackets screwed to the wall. Supporting legs will appear later which will also play a part in supporting the upper scenic level when I get to that stage. First circuit completed with cork track bed glued down. Plus additional baseboard and infill piece installed. Laying down track next.

Not too long ago, I was researching Helix kits online and found a possible contender from DCC Train Automation (no affiliation) and was surprised that they were actually based fairly nearby in Somerset. A quick conversation over the phone with the owner James, resulted in me taking a drive down to the shop and showroom to take a look at the real thing. Glad I did, James is a very helpful chap and seems to know a vast amount relating to DCC and the many brands and products he sells. He even came up with a solution for me to resolve my lighting problem for the old Airfix autocoach I was upgrading. Sometime later in the shop, I had opted for the 3rd and 4th radius starter kit for the helix and an extension kit. This would enable me to build 2 complete circuits, I would need more but that’s enough to make a start. I needed a baseboard for the helix to sit on and this was too expensive for me so I went about building my own from sheet MDF. The nice man at our local DIY store was able to cut two 8’ x 4’ sheets down to size following my cutting diagram. This was going to be a permanent layout so weight was not an issue but getting it cut to size to be able to fit into a Kia Picanto was. Anyway, it was good to get it all back home and to actually make a start, some of that early progress is shown below… The helix baseboard is complete and I am laying out the 8 individual segments to form the first circuit. This will allow me to mark out and drill the centres for each of the supporting threaded rods and the centre for cutting out the access hole. The big hole in the middle is complete. I tried to design the baseboard with adequate access from within as its position is within a corner of a room. Its not possible to walk around the baseboard but easy enough to work within it if you don't mind getting down on your hands and knees to get into it. Remember earlier I mentioned my Autocoach and getting it illuminated. The problem was, lighting was an afterthought and I had already completed the underframe of the coach with the Dart Castings detailing kit and was reluctant to attempt removing all the rodding and wheels to fit pickups. James suggested a solution whereby I could drill directly into the underside of each coach bogie and screw fit a spring pick up without disturbing any of my previous work. He reached for a yellow coloured packet from one of his display stands and said this will do the job, and it did, images below... This was the product and luckily as my German is 'nicht gut' the diagram is self explanatory and there are only 4 components for each bogie side. Pick ups installed, the pack includes parts for 2 bogies. The installation didn't require the removal of the bogies, wheels or any of the rodding which was a result. A close up of the lighting effect and interior within the coach provided by an ESU lighting bar, installed under the carriage roof. I thought I would mention the autocoach now as it will eventually run on this layout separately to the main lines on its own branch track which is P4 gauge. More on that later. It will be permanently coupled up to an upgraded Airfix 14XX, soon to be 48XX, again more on that later. But here's a snippet of the cab interior for the 48XX which I am in the process of scratch building...

Hello folks, Several months ago, circumstances finally allowed for the planning and dare I say it, the construction of my first layout since returning to model railways eight years previously. Prior to this, I had been making the odd diorama or two, the odd tree or two and of course my experimental test track in P4 gauge ‘Tyteford Halte’ which incidentally is still in progress and found over on the Boxfile and Micro layout thread. So why now, well a house move from London to Somerset provided a house with an attached annexe which I selfishly claimed for a railway room (after first ensuring the Mrs was set up with a hobby room in the spare bedroom). The railway room itself is on the first floor with a room below used as a store/workshop. The room itself is long, at almost 22 feet, and narrow in shape. In fact, the available room width at one end of the room is narrower due to the stairs leading up to it. Even so, this still gives almost 9 feet at the wider end and around 6 feet where the stairs eat into the room. For track planning, I really wanted the benefits of a roundy, roundy layout, allowing for a mixture of full train automation and manual intervention when I felt like it. The room shape, however, lended itself more to an end to end layout. I like a fair amount of realism and wanted to avoid any sharp radius curves which would be unavoidable for a roundy, roundy. I then entered a period of several weeks wrestling with ideas of reverse loops, cunning scenery to disguise tight curves from view and then, I entertained the idea of two levels with a helix at each end connecting the two levels and this is what I have settled on. The upper level would be scenic and the lower level would be for the through fiddle yard and would allow for continuous running. My advanced apologies to all post steam enthusiasts as this will be steam era, late 1930’s and located somewhere in the South West. To me it doesn’t need to be an actual location, fictitious is fine but I’m liking the track plan of Shepton Mallet (Charlton Rd) station on the Somerset & Dorset Railway. So, I plan to borrow the Shepton Mallet track plan, introduce a slight curve through the station with a bit of compression to allow for the sidings etc. That’s enough reading for now, I don’t want to bore you all, but before I sign off, I should mention that this will be OO gauge with hand built track in all the scenic areas and Peco code 75 for the Helix and lower level. The helix and lower level will be constructed first. I dabbled in Anyrail and came up with the above track plan for the lower level. The reason for the cross overs at Helix B are due to the fact that in my haste I started to build the Helix the wrong way around. I'll try and explain that in more detail later. This is the scenic upper level, track plan which is loosely based on Shepton Mallet. The final version will see the station moved slightly over to the right and the trackwork to the right of the station will be slightly compressed to allow this. Then I will rename it. The start of Helix B, I am not known for my MDF skills but all surfaces and all exposed edges will receive undercoat and top coat to keep out any moisture. I have also allowed for access into the centre of the Helix.

As promised, I have put together a few images showing in a bit more detail the process I used to fit the rear window grills. It’s nothing fancy or complex but it worked for me… Here, I have drilled all the top holes first. Some are a little askew but I can open them up a bit with a small broach to get them back inline. A length of 0.2mm brass rod is cut to size and a 90 bend made at one end. The bent end is inserted loose into the first hole and allowed to lay over its corresponding lower hole. I am only drilling the lower holes one at a time to maintain parallel alignment with the previous brass rod. The next step is to mark on the brass rod using paint the point where the second bend needs to be. Now, remove the rod and line up the white mark in the jaws of a pair of pliers as shown above and form the second bend. With the second bend made, the rod is offered back to the window for a test fit. Its a good fit but the lower hole needs a slight opening up to the right to bring the rod over to the right. The right edge of the window aperture acts as a vertical guide for the first rod and then each subsequent rod is lined up to the previous one. The gap between each rod was determined by the marks left in the plastic after the original window grills were removed. when your happy with the fit, glue the rod in place. For this I used Deluxe materials rocket card glue applied with a small brush to feed the glue into the holes while the rod is in place. The glue will also help seal the hole and for any enlarged holes feed in some liquid filler. That's it, just repeat another eight times.

Much appreciated Rob. I won't lie it can be a bit fiddly and I do have sausage fingers but I got into the groove with it and was fitting a bar every 3 or 4 minutes. When I do the other side I will take some more images showing the actual process, better than explaining sometimes, an image paints a thousand words. For information the brass 0.2 rod is by Albion Alloys available from numerous model shops at about £5.50 for 10 x 300mm lengths. I also broke my last 0.3mm drill doing just the one side, so there will be a slight delay in doing the other side until I order some more. I do have an etch of various spectacle plates and grilles with one for the 9 bar 14XX, I think from Wizard. When I offered the grill up to the window aperture it was far to big and a lot of plastic would need to be removed to accommodate the grill. I didn't like the idea of that, so I opted for the brass rods instead.

Thank you @DarthHelix and welcome to RMweb.

Today, I ventured to outside of the cab and cut out the horrendous looking plastic moulded window bars (see below). Some very careful filing was then required to tidy and square up the sides of the window apertures. Now came the moment to see if I had made a disastrous decision or not. In other words, can I fabricate and fit some convincing looking window bars to replace the offending ones? Yuk, those window bars need to go. The protype window bars have an O/D of 17mm over the paintwork. Which equates to approx. 0.22mm O/D in 4mm scale. I had a few lengths of 0.2mm brass rod which would do nicely for the job. How the bars should look. These windows on the 'Tivvy Bumper' are protected by 10 bars each. The Airfix model and I think a number of actual class 48XX loco's had 9 window bar, so I'm having 9. So now we come to the task of getting a straight length of brass rod to resemble a window bar 18 times over. To make it more interesting, the bars are also slightly different lengths as the window aperture along the top edge is higher at one end and lower at the other. The obvious answer here, apart from don’t tackle this in the first place, would be to build a jig to form the bends in each rod at the required measurements. Then another jig for accurately drilling the required holes top and bottom of the window aperture to locate the window bars. As I often don’t do the obvious, I did instead as follows; I drilled all the holes required using my pin vice and a 0.3mm drill. The window apertures still had marks where the plastic moulded bars once where, which I used as markers for drilling the holes. I then started on the window bars. A 90 bend was formed at one end of a piece of rod cut to a few mm longer than required. The bent end was inserted into the first hole and held there flat against the window aperture. Using a fine paint brush and white paint, I then marked onto the rod the point at which the second 90 bend needed to be. The second bend is in line with the opposite corresponding drilled hole. Using this method, I have completed one window with 9 bars without any major cock ups. One more window to go! Fully committed now, the point of no return! You can experience a bit of drift on the drill bit as seen above in a few places, this can be remedied by opening up the offending hole slightly to get it back in line. When the rod is in place it then becomes hardly noticeable. Note in the foreground , two of the broken pieces of the original window bars and compare how thick and chunky they are compared to the nice slender brass rods. First side done, phew!!! All reasonably equally spaced and parallel to each other, good enough for me anyway and a vast improvement to what was there originally. View from the other side, the surplus ends will be cut back flush when glue has dried.

Thanks again Kevin, all very appreciated.

Thanks Steve much appreciated. I might be after some tips when I finally get to the stage of weathering the 48XX and Autocoach. I'm really impressed with the results you have achieved with your Diesel stock, I guess adopting some of the same principles would work for a steam loco.

Thanks Bill, much appreciated. This was something which could very easily be over engineered for a workable solution. Turns out it needn't be and was quite a simple fix if you happen to have the materials to hand. Actually, the most testing part of the operation was to accurately cut out the door from the moulded cab-side where the plastic looks to be about a scale 6" thick!