nickb4141

Apologies if this issue has already been answered within this thread (I’ve had a quick look and can’t see anything). Ive just fitted 4 HM7000 21 pin sound decoders in 4 Hornby HST power cars and although they seem to work fine on Hornby’s Bluetooth app, when trying to read them on my Z21, I just get the following options; 1. absolutely nothing - the program address screen just times out and nothing is shown. 2. a decoder read of 3, but then when trying to run as loco 3 in the control Panel, the loco doesn’t respond to any functions (ie after switching on functions F0 & F1 the lights and sound on the loco don’t respond at all? 3. an error message saying CV read error? I’ve tried switching the track wires on the Z21 from Program track to Main Track, but this makes no difference? Im baffled as I fitted some other HM7000 21 pin sound decoders last month and they worked fine on the Z21! If anyone has any ideas how to resolve this, they would be very gratefully received! Thanks in advance, Nick.

I totally agree with you. Widespread use and a myriad of liveries. I’d also add to that, the Class 950 Ultrasonic unit as well - 3 liveries and it has operated EVERYWHERE on the UK network, so everyone would have an excuse to operate one!

I can’t help thinking the Class 185 DMU in both 00 & N gauges would suit Revolution perfectly. Only two main liveries, which you seem to prefer than offering multiple versions. It complements your N gauge Mk5 TPE sets, Pendolinos and forthcoming 175’s and 180’s in various locations across the North. Requests for the 185 crop up very frequently (see Accurascale’s new model request thread). Accurascale (rather bizarrely,) have discounted tooling them, as the potential transfer to Ireland for re-gauging didn’t happen. I think the biggest obstacle to them being produced seems to be the ‘Chinese Whispers’ that another manufacturer is already working on them! This seems to be the case with various multiple units at the moment - Electrostars, Class 120’s, 313/314/315’s, 153’s all have rumours floating about (as did the 320/321’s for seemingly ages, before Revolution took the plunge and announced an 00 version). So how about it Revolution?

Hi Fran, That’s a shame that you’ve decided against the 185 - they seem to be cropping up in quite a number of posts on here. If Hornby can justify tooling the Flirt DMU’s, which are restricted to a much smaller geographical area and only have one livery, the 185 would seem commercially sound. Apparently the Flirt DMU’s have been selling well on pre orders, according to my local model shop, so maybe there are a few more multiple unit fans out there, than we are given credit for.

I would agree with everything on your list apart from the IEP’s. Hornby’s model, whilst a bit overpriced, is still a good model and I’d rather Accurascale tooled some of the missing DMU gaps, than duplicate a perfectly good model. I would also add the class 195/196/197 DMU’s which have a lot of generic similarities in the design.

Well said! 👏

Don’t disagree with you on that Adam, although not sure the Revolution guys see it that way, hence there are more livery options in N gauge for the Class 175’s and 180’s than there are for the 00 gauge versions!

Yes, but frustratingly, not in 00! They seem to be under the impression that another manufacturer is looking at it in 00, but whether this is true or just ‘Chinese Whispers’ , who knows?

Another vote for a Class 185 DMU! It seems to be getting requested as much as the Class 120 DMU has for the last few years, but strangely none of the manufacturers seem to have picked up on either…yet!

In your opinion! I’m not sure many people on here, would think the same way as you. At the end of the day, if a customer is giving you their business, most model shops (thankfully,) have the common courtesy of contacting the customer if there is an issue with the card. Rails did this, but only by email, and almost a week after the models were released! Bear in mind, the order was placed two and a half years ago and, like a lot of people, I have multiple credit cards, so I don’t always remember which card has changed details since then! It was a genuine oversight. I paid a £30 deposit in May 21, so I don’t think it’s being unreasonable to expect my choice to be reserved for me. So why on earth, do you think I should ‘take responsibility’ for that?! I sincerely hope you don’t work in any industry that is customer-facing, as charm is not one of your strengths, is it sunshine?! 😜

Rails sent me an email to say they couldn’t process my credit card late last Saturday, which I didn’t see until after they closed (they have my mobile number on file, but didn’t think to ring me) In the meantime, they sold out of the sound version online so I purchased a non sound version, as everywhere I looked was selling out. I sent an email reply to say what I had done and I got a reply on Monday morning to say they wouldn’t be refunding my deposit and I ‘well and truly had my legs slapped’ for doing this and as a gesture they would offer a gift card for the £30. I told them this was taking the mickey and eventually they relented and refunded the £30 deposit. They didn’t acknowledge the fact that they’d taken over a week from the 56’s arriving to contact me or the fact that they didn’t hold the version I pre-ordered. They also saw fit to sit on my order for five days before sending next day delivery, eventually arriving today. The moral of the story is Rails do what works for them, definitely not the customer!

Thanks for your very speedy reply! Rails were not very helpful at all this week. I felt like I’d been told off by the Headmistress in one of their emails! I was a bit peeved to say the least, as had preordered a sound fitted model two and a half years ago, but my credit card had changed in that time and in the week that they took to contact me after the 56’s were released, they had kindly sold my sound fitted version to someone else and are now showing they’ve sold out! I’ll order the Class 60 elsewhere! 😆

I wonder if anyone can help with a couple of questions re the model I received today. I pre-ordered a sound fitted Colas 56 from Rails in May 2021, but they managed to cock up my order and I’ve got an analogue one instead! 1. Does the analogue model come with a speaker pre fitted? I’ve had a quick look through the manual, but strangely it doesn’t seem to mention DCC sound fitting? 2. The fans appear to be non operational? Is this just on the analogue models (I’m sure I read the model had operating fans, but I could have got that wrong!) Thanks in advance, if anyone knows the answers! Cheers, Nick

Thanks for the recommendation! Just had a quick look and the only Class 28 is, (you guessed it,) sold! 😁 I will however check back periodically, so hopefully, I’ll strike gold!

If you look at sold prices on EBay, there are quite a few reaching over £200, so while, yes,I agree it’s not an exact science, it does suggest there is at least some demand for these. The only alternative is the ‘expressions of interest’ polls which, in my opinion are a complete finger in the air and absolutely meaningless. It’s been quite a while since the last batch sold out everywhere, so I would have thought it’d be worth a punt in releasing some more at some point? Incidentally, I wasn’t interested in Class 28’s when the first two batches were released, as they didn’t fit in with my layouts at the time. Currently, I’m planning a model based on the Furness line, so these are very much part of the scene, so I’d be looking for 2-3 if they ever do become available again. Yes, that’s only me, but I’d imagine there are other modellers whose modelling interests ‘evolve’ over time.

Is it only LNER 9 car sets Kato are producing? Just seems a bit strange not to offer the GWR equivalents, unless I’ve missed something?

The prices these reach on EBay are stratospheric! I’m really surprised that no one at Heljan has picked up on this and announced a new batch - there definitely seems to be a pent up demand, based on what people are prepared to pay for them!

Definitely agree about the 4CIG! Three mouldings, with no significant changes made to the prototype throughout a 40 year plus life and multiple liveries, operating across all three sections of the Southern Region! In addition, it has lots of current models that complement it. Probably makes sense for Hornby to utilise their soon to be released, revised Class 423, but I won’t hold my breath!

I think the simple answer to how much people are prepared to pay for units, is to be at least in line with competitors. Bachmann have produced many units over the years, so there must be a market for them, as they wouldn’t continue to invest in new ones. Their Class 158’s and 117’s and 121’s are excellent models at pretty reasonable prices, so would provide a good benchmark for prices of 1/2/3 car models, both DCC Ready and Sound Fitted, (although I do feel their CEP’s and BEP’s were overpriced at an RRP of £500!) Dapol also seems to have pitched the price and specifications of their recently announced Class 323 well. Accurascale have already demonstrated their capabilities with their Irish units, so I’m surprised Fran is trying to gauge opinion on the commercial viability. I wouldn’t have thought a UK outline multiple unit wouldn’t be any more of a risk than an Irish outline unit, taking market size into account. Yes, the prototype picked I will be a definite factor, but reading through this thread there seems to be a lot of people requesting what appears to be some sound commercial choices. I do wonder if Fran’s question was to deflect that Accurascale don’t have any immediate plans for UK units? My personal opinion is that they’ll still be in the ‘Space Race’ in the immediate future, to produce high spec loco replacements for some of the ‘low hanging fruit’ of ageing models from other manufacturers (Class 08, HST, West Country/Battle of Britain, A4 all spring to mind). That said, as someone who is ‘crazy’ about multiple units, I sincerely hope I’m wrong and Fran has all sorts of goodies ready to announce!

Has anyone heard who the ‘mystery manufacturer’ is for a newly tooled 153 yet? (Charlie alluded to one being in work at the moment, but was tight lipped as to who it was!) ….Would have bet it was Heljan, with the new 7mm version currently in work , but Charlie said it’s not them?? Accurascale? Rapido?

Just checked my preorder for five 142’s and thankfully the order is not cancelled (at least not at the moment!)

Really? Please do enlighten me…….I haven’t seen anything that explains the phenomenon of N gauge being more viable than 00 gauge products? Block wagons, I could possibly understand, but we’re talking about a 2 or 3 car multiple unit here? Is it? I see Mike has already put you straight on that one and confirmed Revolution isn’t run as a side line hobby. Even if that was the case, Realtrack manage to produce multiple liveries of their products and I wasn’t aware that there is an army of people working for Charlie Petty? Just to reconfirm (as I’ve said many times before,) I love the products Revolution have produced and my wallet has been considerably lighter as a result, in both 00 gauge and N gauge! I’m not attacking them, but merely trying to provide constructive feedback regarding some of the decisions that have been made, with a view to them maximising their success and potentially reinvesting that into further projects. I genuinely wish them the very best for the future and look forward to what else they have up their sleeves. Merry Christmas everyone! 😁

Haha! I’m not sure who’s ’stamping their feet’ here?! I don’t think you have understood the point I have been making. The 00 market is the same group of consumers whether you’re a modern or steam era modeller and every permutation in between. They don’t suddenly metamorphosise into a different species when purchasing Revolution products. Accurascale are far from a predominantly steam manufacturer, so why you feel Accurascale sell to a different market, to Revolution is a different view, but everyone is entitled to their opinion. As a previous purchaser of Revolution products, there are many items that Accurascale produce that also appeal and complement the Revolution products produce or are planning to introduce. The fundamental difference between Revolution and most other manufacturers is that they other a range of liveries which cover the timeline of the products they’re producing, thereby maximising the return on their investment, by appealing to the widest possible audience. Similarly, Dapol, Bachmann, Heljan, Realtrack and even Hornby follow the same practice, so it must work, as they’re all still in business! I’ve fully accept that Revolution have no plans to produce the livery I would have a purchased a couple of units in, but I just think some of their business decisions are a little strange, but it’s their business and that decision is entirely their perrogrative. Interestingly, no one has countered my argument that if the missing First livery can be viable in N scale, then why it wouldn’t be in 00 scale? Even Ben has said ‘N gauge items can sell at least as well as 00 scale’ which kind of contradicts the decision that has been made. Anyway, Merry Christmas everyone, I hope that clarifies the point, I’ve been trying to make and here’s to a ‘spitting your dummy out’ - free 2024! 😆

Because you could only be ‘not interested’ if you actually saw the ‘expressions of interest’ in the first place! Revolution seem to have a very low profile compared to for example, Accurascale. At the end of the day, all manufacturers are selling their products to the same 00 gauge market, but I can’t imagine Accurascale only offering 2 liveries on an 00 DMU (if they ever produce one,) and Dapol are able to offer 7 liveries on an arguably more restricted EMU prototype, than the 175 and 180 DMU’s? So why is the 00 market so different to Revolution’s eyes?

Hi Charlie, that’s sounds a bit like a cryptic crossword! Can you expand on what you mean please?