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Showing results for 'Templot' in topics.
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The Goal I have two basic objectives for this layout - exploring new skills, and providing somewhere interesting to shuffle a few wagons around until I can build a larger/more permanent layout. In terms of track plan, the features I was looking for are: shunting uses on-scene paintwork if possible, and not a sector plate or traverser simple S&C, preferably including a diamond, to see how I get on building track plenty of car spots, to give purposeful activity realistic layout, plausible wagon variety Space is not particularly constrained - I want to keep this small, cheap, manageable, and moveable, because I'll be moving in 3 years, but the only definite limits are that it has to be less than 9' × 4'6" (including fiddle yard) and I certainly don't plan to fill that space. The Plan I was hunting around the old OS maps for inspiration and found the northwest side of Railway Dock, in Hull (for context, Trinity Dock Street Bridge is inspired by the northeast side). Viewed from the cemetery, there's convenient scenic breaks at both ends, and a run of buildings along the back. By squinting at Britain from Above's photographs (especially this and this) they appear to be wooden sheds, but I'm considering swapping one of them for one of the brick-built transhipment sheds between the railway and Humber Dock, because of the interesting weathering. The site also seems good because it has car spots at the transshipment shed, a crane on the curved loop, a weighbridge by the crane which would need to be unloaded before it can be locked to allow a locomotive over, and so on. As a first rough concept sketch, I put this together with setrack to get an idea of sizes (small loose-heel switches seem most plausible for the location and date it was laid out). The loop marked "6 wagons" is around scale length, but the segment marked '8 wagons" should be more like 14, so when I draw it in Templot I'll try to tweak the proportions. Having thought about it a bit more, it would probably be better to slant the tracks so that there is room at the left hand end for a barge or coaster, to make the view across the docks to the backscene more convincing and to break up the regimented alignment A peculiarity of that particular location is that it is accessed from a kick-back off a track alongside Prince's Dock (now under the Princes Quay carpark) with no way for a loco to run round, so it seems likely that trains would be propelled on- and off-scene. Questions Can anyone think of operational problems/frustrations with this design? I envision the sequence being a train arrives and is stashed in a loop, empty/reloaded wagons are collected from the crane and warehouse (leaving behind those which still need loading), and the incoming wagons are spotted at the right location for unloading, then the loaded wagons leave. Assuming someone doesn't know what was actually there, do you think I should attempt to make that diamond into a slip? It is marked as a diamond in the OS maps but in 1937 and 1952 photos there's some fuzzy curves that could possibly be slip roads on the inland (bottom) side. Do you see any benefit in terms of "play value" to stretching the right hand loop out to full scale? Uncompressed, the prototype scenic area is 586' long, which would be 2.34m so I could fit it but I don't think it adds anything. Do you know of any sources with photos of that side of the dock before it was redeveloped? There are loads of photos of the other side with its distinctive buildings, but the only photos of this side I've found so far are aerial photos in the Britain from Above collection, most of which are focused on somewhere else but have tantalising hints of interesting details, especially the earlier photos.
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Not yet as all I have to show is a Templot file and a timetable at the moment, but I’ll post a link here as and when I get going. In the meantime it’s building research at the moment; in particular measurements/drawing of the station buildings and goods shed. The station seems to have been pretty camera shy from the books I’ve seen.
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Certainly trying to create some of the designs using Templot shows up some issues with tight radii.
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Hayfields 3D printed track workshop
hayfield replied to hayfield's topic in Handbuilt Track & Templot
The difficulties I have had with some of the Bricks** were totally down to human intervention and not Templot, having drawn up a crossover using Templot automated crossover facility, its only takes slightly more effort to make it 3D printable than producing a brick** for a single turnout . The main issue is that this project was started as Templot producing a 2D plan and had two people indpendantly working on it over several months plus changing the size of turnouts. Sorry if I seem to be making it look much harder than it should be ** Brick(s) is the terminology for each printable section Brick 5 under way
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Tom Its very easy to get terminology wrong, I seem to do it all the time. Likewise we are always talking about switch and crossing angles when we talk about turnouts, so its an easy mistake to include it into the conversation about slips. Then when you get erstwhile sources talk about points, when in reality they are talking about turnouts. Lets face it when I was young turnouts purporting to be scale were classified in Radii not sizes. But I guess at times in various subjects we all fall into similar traps The problem lies in RTR turnouts where the tip of the blades terminate between timbers, which is totally non prototypical. The problem is that even manufacturers at times get it wrong, I brought/was supplied a timber Diamond fret described as EM/P4. Simply it cannot be both as Martin explained. Certainly for EM gauge it was too long if you wanted both Vees supported on timbers. I think sometimes the more we learn about a subject we realise the less we know. Wayne has done a super job with his kits and as you say they work very well. I don't recognize Templot moving the length of switch blades, but I guess this may be something some modellers do to make life easier. Flangeway clearances are usually set by the modeller with most setting them to gauge requirements rather than to scale Thanks for contributing, that's how we learn from each other
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Sorry Martin, Templot is a wonderful resource. Tom -
This is an OPTION in Templot. You can set it to whatever you want: I get a bit irritated when folks say Templot does this, or Templot does that. Templot is a workshop TOOL -- it does whatever you set it to do. cheers, Martin. -
Now I'm confused. I thought the A and B in A5 B7 of these Turnouts and Slips referred to switch size as per this table: https://85a.uk/templot/companion/real_track.php If you change the Switch Size in Templot using "Template" then "Switch Settings" an A5 is extended when you change it to B5. Isn't that what The Fatadder is asking about? What am I missing here? -
Big locos certainly look good and run well through the Finetrax 1:7 slips. I believe in Templot t for a double slip the blade tips start one further timber towards the centre to allow space and clearance for soldering to the tie bar arrangement and for flange clearance. Single slips could be one timber closer to the V crossings, and that maybe the default for a single in Templot. Wayne’s singles use the same spacing as the doubles. Initially I was wondering if it was worth extending the blades on the singles somehow, but the only solution would have been to do a lot of butchery or start from scratch and Wayne’s just are too good for that :-)
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Hi Rich, The switch size doesn't make any difference to the overall size of the slip which is governed only by the crossing angle and the track gauge. If you used the make slip function in Templot, a 1:7 slip will have B-type switches. It doesn't matter whether you start from an A-7 turnout or a B-7 turnout, the 1:7 slip will have B-type switches. I believe Wayne uses the same Templot designs for the Finetrax kits. The kits are supplied with suitable machined switch blades, so there is no actual need to be concerned with the size of the switch. The only way to create a 1:7 slip with A-type switches would be to create it yourself in Templot using multiple partial templates, instead of using the make slip function. It would still fit in the same overall size footprint as a 1:7 slip with B-type blades. cheers, Martin.
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I should really have checked this already, can anyone confirm if the double slip is an A or B switch? My templot plan has it drawn as an A7 slip but I have a feeling I should have drawn it as a B7... (or does it not make any difference with a slip?) From what I can see on the website it just describes it as a 1:7 slip -
Hayfields 3D printed track workshop
hayfield replied to hayfield's topic in Handbuilt Track & Templot
Before I start I must emphasize that in its basic/normal form Both Templot and Templot 3D are very user friendly and easy to use However I have been asked to help someone with their new layout, this started out with assisting with a Templot plan with tidying it up in a 2D format One area I had not paid too much attention is restricting partial Templates plus sometimes pressing save too many times Anyway after mastering the easy part which was printing basic turnouts and plain track, which is very easy I have been learning how to print a layout with many templates, which involves separating the plan into printable sections, which in Templot are called bricks Here are the first three bricks plus a section which will be spliced in, as I made a couple of errors on 2 adjoining bricks. (Quicker and cheaper than printing 2 new bricks). Brick 4 is now printing, took no time in making the brick then creating the print file. It took longer for the print bed to warm up. Anyway I can get on with day to day chores in the knowledge that at mid afternoon another brick will be printed. Now to set up the resin printer, just need to recap on setting up the machine, then use the raft of chair file Martin kindly prepared for me (and anyone else) to use
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Hayfields 3D printed track workshop
makeitminiature replied to hayfield's topic in Handbuilt Track & Templot
Hi John, It's all looking pretty good. Maybe this video will be of some help. :) Speak soon, James Creating Chair Rafts from Templot -
Hayfields 3D printed track workshop
hayfield replied to hayfield's topic in Handbuilt Track & Templot
Two months have passed since my last update, the resin printer has not printed anything yet (waiting for James video to be released or revisiting his previous videos. But I have been enjoying a phase of building/finishing two Springside locos On the FDM printer I have been developing my skills. At one end of the spectrum making a template in Templot can be very easy, likewise FDM 3D printing is also very simple. On the other hand making a set of multiple templates into a layout plan can at times be challenging with some formations. Well I have been approached to assist someone with their layout plan they designed. Mostly due to my own understanding of how Templot 3D printing works it been a steep learning curve but also an enjoyable exercise Due to the size of the print bed the track plan has to be printed in sections, in Templot 3D these sections are called bricks. This photo is of the second brick and part of a crossover, the two right hand long timbers are each made from 2 partial templates. Unfortunately they are out of register, it is a test print and I stopped it early (error missed during a late night bit of work, plus a small laptop screen. Thee revised brick is now printing and as you can see the two long right hand timbers now match each other. As for templot 3D printed track minor updates have been released making the job of printing easier and the risk of poor prints less. Martin is a genius I have also expermited in increasing the scale to 7mm. The results are very promising Anyway I have hopefully overcome the obstacles that prevented me to print the more demanding bricks and once I have a few more bricks printed I will need some chairs
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The next step on 37057, which has now been fitted with custom Railtec transfers for the EW&S logos and numbers. It just needs varnishing before it will be ready for reassembly. work on the double slip has now halted as there was an issue with the baseplate (British Finescale have been excellent in their resolution of this, but I need to wait for a replacement part before doing more work on it). I had confirmation today that Grainge and Hodder have dispatched the baseboard kit and I should receive it early in the week. The plan is to temporarily fit it up to the existing board to mark up the alignments, before getting the templot plan glued down. in the mean time I picked up a non running Hornby 153 from the classifieds. The plan is to finish it as 153328 in the condition running as half a 150. To this I needed to be able to properly control the lights, meaning they need converting from Hornby’s common negative to the standard dcc common positive. For this I will junk the Hornby pcb and replace with my own board. The lighting units are modified cutting across the centre as indicated in red, to brake the common negative. Then soldering on a replacement wire (shown in white) and joining together the two positives. This means the existing wiring from the cab at the dummy bogie end can be used to connect to the circuit board at the other end. before refitting the lighting boards a dab of translucent orange paint was applied to tone down the overly bright white lights. I will also be fitting working cdl lights (so it will now need a 6 function decoder to work it all. Longer term I now plan to do the same modifications to my other 153 which will enable me to run 153s as a single, a pair or with the 158. (The Bachmann 150 also has odd wiring and if I recall correctly is not possible to isolate the tail lights)
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OK here we go. Take 2. I redid the timbering and printed out a new set of Templot sheets: I had a question about the timbering around the knuckle on the crossings. I knew that unsupported rails as a principle were obviously a no-no. But I also had an idea that knuckles were also always supported. So should I add timbering like this? But that didn’t look possible, so I went with: Copperclad at key locations, especially through the crossings where there would be short rail sections and checkrailing, enabled me to maintain gauge and clearances in these crucial areas. Copperclad tinned where needed. I tend to annotate plans to help with speed of timbering and adding chairs to often lengthy stock rails. The copperclad had a strip of card glued to the underside to bring it to the same thickness as the ply timbers. Build beginning: Small pieces of brass strip were soldered to those copperclad timbers where rails would need to be soldered without brass chairs. For all of the 16 small vees necessary through the checkrailed crossings, I printed out extra copies of the plans so I could construct those separately. The rail pieces were hand filed and soldered to fret waste before cleaning up, which hopefully left me with vees of exactly the correct angles. None of them were identical, with slight curvature through all three tracks in the formation. Hoping all this makes sense - more to come….. Iain
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I’m 3 way point I’ve been working on for the last week or so. Although this was t a full kit, I’ve used pre-etched parts from DCC Concepts and some of there stainless steel rails. The actual plan was drawn up by myself using Templot and then printing out the plan. The lengthiest part of this was actually placing the sleepers in place, once that was done, cutting and bending the rails didn’t take long at all. Believe it or not, I’ve used just over 2m of rail in this point! I used a completed plastic truck kit (with no additional weight added yet) and gravity to check the operation of the point, I’m pleased to say it works very well, the truck passed through all the crossings with ease in both directions. For a first attempt at any sort of track building, I think I’ve done alright. The photo above was taken, just after I’d finishing and cleaning it of flux etc, but before the isolating gaps had all been cut. These have now all been cut and the point has also been electrically tested etc. The next stage will be to solder on some dropper wires so that I can switch the polarity of crossing vees to suit the chosen route, this will hopefully get done tomorrow.
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Good evening everyone Well I spoke too soon this morning, before I’d even got to the workshop it was raining, since then, the weather has been awful most of the day, the wind picked up late in the afternoon, but thankfully it’s died down again now. I wouldn’t have liked to have been any of the tree fellers (although there could have been more) working down the road in this weather, that’s for sure. I’m pleased to say that I’ve completed the 3 way point I’ve been working on for the last week or so. As requested by @polybear, there’s a photo included below. Although this was t a full kit, I’ve used pre-etched parts from DCC Concepts and some of there stainless steel rails. The actual plan was drawn up by myself using Templot and then printing out the plan. The lengthiest part of this was actually placing the sleepers in place, once that was done, cutting and bending the rails didn’t take long at all. Believe it or not, I’ve used just over 2m of rail in this point! I used a completed plastic truck kit (with no additional weight added yet) and gravity to check the operation of the point, I’m pleased to say it works very well, the truck passed through all the crossings with ease in both directions. Really, really pleased about that, so that’s big ✔️. For a first attempt at any sort of track building, I think I’ve done alright. The photo above was taken, just after I’d finishing and cleaning it of flux etc, but before the isolating gaps had all been cut. These have now all been cut and the point has also been electrically tested etc. which is another big ✔️ then. The next stage will be to solder on some dropper wires so that I can switch the polarity of crossing vees to suit the chosen route, this will hopefully get done tomorrow.
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This Templot system is obviously very impressive, versatile and developing. And you are making a very good job of it. I'm about to start flat bottom track building on my new layout and am, in comparison to you, going back to the stone age with copper clad sleepers for the pointwork. But I am likely to use wooden sleepers and spikes for the visible plain track. I think that a Templot flat bottom rail system is some way off!
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Martin Wynne of Templot fame prints track bases directly on the build plate for fdm prints, but emphasis that it it needs to be flat and level. He uses a glass build plate. Hayfield of this parish, has some experience of 3d printing. -
Query Regarding Crossing Vee Filing Jigs
hayfield replied to polybear's topic in Handbuilt Track & Templot
Brian Prior to Templot Plug track I would have made an offer, having said that the Scale Seven Soc sell these quite cheaply -
Update Study / Workshop complete and organising all but complete. Did consider using Templot to make the template but too many things to adjust, move and hide so used the drawing tools in MS Word. Have been using it for years and it is amazing what you can do with a little thought. I drew sections 5 sleepers wide at 5 times scale for accuracy and then reduced to size and linked them together. Bearer spacing (as they are called for Flat Bottom turnouts) is 710mm for the prototype with a width of 290mm, so 9.32mm apart and 3.8mm wide (same as PECO timbers). The turnout is some 400mm in length and so I saved as a Pdf and used poster printing option(available in the pdf viewer) to print out on an A4 laser printer. Amazingly it is quite accurate with the distance between tracks of just over 18mm. The template is just a guide for bearer positioning and which baseplates to use. All the data, vast amounts of it, came from the latest PWI manuals. The common crossing dimensions have been adjusted for a 1mm flangeway. The first 4 bearers are plain with V baseplates followed by stock rail in full height rail and shallow height switch rails. Transition from shallow to full height rail occurs between the orange and blue sleeper. Not a lot of filing required, just the crossing V and the switch rail planing. I'll begin assembly with laying the bearers and fitting the straight stock rail in a few days time. Patrick
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Good evening everyone Well, just like yesterday, the rain began falling just before dinner and it stayed like that for the rest of the day. Despite that, shopping was shopped and the fridge is now groaning under the weight of it all. As planned, Charlie called round this afternoon and he and I spent a very productive afternoon in the workshop. He continued painting his models, he’s currently working on 3 different ones. Whilst I carried on with the 3 way point I’m making. Today I got all the sleepers fixed in place. For this I’m using a diagram printed out from ‘Templot’ which has been fixed to a marble slab, about 18in by 10in. This is actually a kitchen device for rolling pastry on, which I picked up in a kitchen shop for a few quid and very handy it is too. It also gets used for building coaches and truck bodies on, so I can ensure they are perfect flat/straight. Once happy with that, I made one to the crossing vees. This is the first time I’ve ever made anything like this before and very pleased with it I am too. ION. Over the last week or so, we’ve been entertained by a pair of dunnocks that continually sit on the handles of our French doors in the dinning room. For those who don’t know what they are, they are small birds, about the same size as a sparrow, with similar markings, but with a light grey head and face. They initially land on the handrail of the balcony and then hop back and forth between the handrail and door handles. They even tap on the door, but I think they are feeding or small insects etc that hide on the handles. I took a photo of one this morning, whilst it was feeding on one of the bird feeders. Sorry about the poor quality, but I only had my phone with me at the time and it was taken through the window too.
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Hayfields Springside Models rebuilds
hayfield replied to hayfield's topic in Kitbuilding & Scratchbuilding
I have had a bit of a brake on loco building the past two weeks for various reasons, today I have received an email from Springside that my order for the outstanding parts are/will be on their way to me Secondly after meeting a friend demonstrating a layout at Alley Pally I have agreed to print some Templot EM gauge plug track turnouts and chairs using a plan he drew up using Templot. This threw up a slight redesign to make it plug track compliant (printable) The easier part is printing the track bases, once I have edited the plan and printed the bases, I then have to learn how to set up the chair files then learn how to print them in resin Martin Wynn challenged me to test out plug track in 7mm scale whilst learning/confirming how to do the alterations needed to the EM gauge track plan. Given the size of the print bed the turnout needs to be printed in 3 sections. The start of the FDM printing ( base of the turnout) Nearing the end of the first print Two of the 3 sections waiting to be spliced together Plug track is in development and is exceptionally good, primarily being developed in 4mm scale, though useable in most scales in various formats. developments are in TT, 2mm and S scale that we know of . For instance in 2mm scale its all resin printed, larger scales use either FDM printed or laser cut bases and resin printed chairs. Turnouts only fully covered at the moment whilst obtuse chairs are designed, but there are a few work arounds in some cases for diamonds and slips, for those unwilling to wait. The FDM turnout base will cost about £2 to print In 4 mm scale the chairs cost about the same as a turnout base, so perhaps £2 per turnout in 7mm scale, plus 2 and a bit meters of rail. Also I can print off reusable filing jigs to the exact size and or angle required for the Vee and switch rails, Other than finishing off the turnout base I will not be printing chairs for at least 2 weeks
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More thoughts on signalling, my logic is that everything would be signalled from Goonbarrow box, so I have added the required point rodding and signals to the templot output below. I am assuming that for the double slip you would have a hand leaver frame controlling both sides from one position, with rodding between it and the switches (but if that assumption is incorrect it will of course be easy to just have leavers directly aligned with each switch on the slip. Thinking some more I will probably shift this to the other side of the track to keep it away from the running line. The signal protecting the approach to the switch from the right would be just off scene, I guess a question would be whether the shunt signal would be mounted on the same post as the through signal pushing it off scene as well. (A situation I wouldnt be completely adverse to seeing as it would be one less working shunt signal to build!) All of which does involve shifting the layouts location slightly further up the line, I always had it located somewhere around Luxulyan (part because of it has provided a lot of the inspiration for the station, but also having Goonbarrow down line gives more interesting through traffic.) This throws me a bit of a dilemma, in that ideally I do not want to be having to lay point rodding on the existing Wheal Imogen board. Its been enough of a pain in the backside layout rodding on Brent post ballasting where I had at least laid the slabs for it in advance. It will be much worse doing it here!) Which either means shifting the location past Goonbarrow, or flipping the orientation so that Newquay is on the right of the layout not the left. I am less convinced by this given that looking at the prototype the point to enter the works at Goonbarrow was aligned to the direction of travel so that a train from Par would head straight into the works, not pass the point and propel in. I will dig out the 2mm Assoc. book later and see if it confirms what the absolute maximum length of one rod (inc compensators etc) would be to double check there is no chance this could have been controlled from Par (as the crow flies Luxulyan to Par is about 2 1/4 miles) Would welcome thoughts from those who understand the topic better than I.
