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Showing results for 'Templot' in topics.
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Hayfields Springside Models rebuilds
hayfield replied to hayfield's topic in Kitbuilding & Scratchbuilding
I have had a bit of a brake on loco building the past two weeks for various reasons, today I have received an email from Springside that my order for the outstanding parts are/will be on their way to me Secondly after meeting a friend demonstrating a layout at Alley Pally I have agreed to print some Templot EM gauge plug track turnouts and chairs using a plan he drew up using Templot. This threw up a slight redesign to make it plug track compliant (printable) The easier part is printing the track bases, once I have edited the plan and printed the bases, I then have to learn how to set up the chair files then learn how to print them in resin Martin Wynn challenged me to test out plug track in 7mm scale whilst learning/confirming how to do the alterations needed to the EM gauge track plan. Given the size of the print bed the turnout needs to be printed in 3 sections. The start of the FDM printing ( base of the turnout) Nearing the end of the first print Two of the 3 sections waiting to be spliced together Plug track is in development and is exceptionally good, primarily being developed in 4mm scale, though useable in most scales in various formats. developments are in TT, 2mm and S scale that we know of . For instance in 2mm scale its all resin printed, larger scales use either FDM printed or laser cut bases and resin printed chairs. Turnouts only fully covered at the moment whilst obtuse chairs are designed, but there are a few work arounds in some cases for diamonds and slips, for those unwilling to wait. The FDM turnout base will cost about £2 to print In 4 mm scale the chairs cost about the same as a turnout base, so perhaps £2 per turnout in 7mm scale, plus 2 and a bit meters of rail. Also I can print off reusable filing jigs to the exact size and or angle required for the Vee and switch rails, Other than finishing off the turnout base I will not be printing chairs for at least 2 weeks -
ECC Wheal Imogen: OO rebuild
The Fatadder replied to The Fatadder's topic in Creating Cameo Layouts - The Challenge
More thoughts on signalling, my logic is that everything would be signalled from Goonbarrow box, so I have added the required point rodding and signals to the templot output below. I am assuming that for the double slip you would have a hand leaver frame controlling both sides from one position, with rodding between it and the switches (but if that assumption is incorrect it will of course be easy to just have leavers directly aligned with each switch on the slip. Thinking some more I will probably shift this to the other side of the track to keep it away from the running line. The signal protecting the approach to the switch from the right would be just off scene, I guess a question would be whether the shunt signal would be mounted on the same post as the through signal pushing it off scene as well. (A situation I wouldnt be completely adverse to seeing as it would be one less working shunt signal to build!) All of which does involve shifting the layouts location slightly further up the line, I always had it located somewhere around Luxulyan (part because of it has provided a lot of the inspiration for the station, but also having Goonbarrow down line gives more interesting through traffic.) This throws me a bit of a dilemma, in that ideally I do not want to be having to lay point rodding on the existing Wheal Imogen board. Its been enough of a pain in the backside layout rodding on Brent post ballasting where I had at least laid the slabs for it in advance. It will be much worse doing it here!) Which either means shifting the location past Goonbarrow, or flipping the orientation so that Newquay is on the right of the layout not the left. I am less convinced by this given that looking at the prototype the point to enter the works at Goonbarrow was aligned to the direction of travel so that a train from Par would head straight into the works, not pass the point and propel in. I will dig out the 2mm Assoc. book later and see if it confirms what the absolute maximum length of one rod (inc compensators etc) would be to double check there is no chance this could have been controlled from Par (as the crow flies Luxulyan to Par is about 2 1/4 miles) Would welcome thoughts from those who understand the topic better than I. -
I have started making my own points in N Gauge. I saw someone using them for setting the frog point between the 2 stock rails. My club has a small lathe which I used to manufacture a couple of buttons. Using them requires the 2 stock rails to be correctly positioned to start with. If using Templot I would fix the point according to that and then use the buttons to set the stock rails. Neil
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I am afraid to say I have no idea about either the RTR or collecting (RTR) side of our hobby. But kits and kit building is another story, my knowledge mainly lies in 4mm scale and now learning about 7mm. I would not know a good buy in the RTR/collecting area and thankfully no one has asked me to assist in disposing of their stock. I buy to improve my own collection or find parts to assist in building kits I have. However I am getting much better at letting things go that I don't need, in fact selling these unwanted items actually is much appreciated by like minded modeler's who actually want/need the items I don't require and reduces the cost of my modelling activities My last job lot allowed me to sell off unwanted items at starting prices far below what I would list my own items I want to dispose of, in fact made the items I wanted very cheap (for once). The bulk of which has now gone bar a few items, which hopefully will have totally gone in a month, probably with the exception of 1 item I don't need but is so rare I will not sell it off cheap These are 32mm 0 gauge track gages, the top two are very similar to the Brook Smith P4 track gauges, which in themselves are not too common, but I have never seen them in 7 mm scale. With the inception of Templot plug track the need for gauges is very limited, but to a track builder like myself I would only want to let them (the two black ones) go to someone who would treasure them as I do. I seem to value them far more than anyone else.
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I've no doubt that you find it simple enough, Paul, but I have trouble understanding basic DC electrics, never mind DCC. It's like other stuff too, such as new software. I really need to get some trackplans drawn up in Templot in the near future, but I know that I will never get my mind round the software and I also begrudge the (inevitable) waste of time, trying to understand it. I'd rather be cutting and gluing bits of plasticard etc....
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I've got the tracing, scanned and loaded to usb stick. This is necessary if you are using Templot on Applemac on Crossover or similar as Templot is windows-based. Then import the jpeg to Templot from the usb stick. The problem now is remembering how to do that!! The trouble with getting old is having the memory in my head for so many computer commands which is why I will stick with DC control for my layout. I am not of the computer generation.
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Looking at this logically, the six foot in 00 should actually be 28.46mm between rails. 18.83-16.6=2.23 2x2.23=4.46+(6'x4mm)28.46. if my maths are right. None of whic answers my query about Wane's single slip curving to about 60" radius...I've got a tracing of the hand-built one but as usual computer won't let me load it to Templot, blame Apple for that!! Pah.
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Templot sorts it out for you. Select the required prototype WAY dimension and Templot will calculate and use the required model track CENTRES. For 00 etc. the distance between the rails is increased accordingly. On sharp curves increase the WAY setting to ensure adequate running clearance. Or you can use the dummy vehicle function to find out and set the required increased track centres. Martin.
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Quite, it alters the geometry of switches and crossings as Martin Wynn has pointed out many times on his Templot forum and on here. It alters the six foot way which on the EM formation was too narrow anyway! Platform clearances were "quite tight". It suggests the gent who made the layout was a superb modeller of buildings and scenery and the basics of track, but didn't quite get it right in places. ISTR the track was made with steel rail which had shown signs of being stored somewhere damp over the years.
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This was a problem with the Folkestone MRC's Alkham Valley layout, a superb bit of modelling to EM gauge. The owner died and left the layout to the club but his widower sold all the stock. Nobody in the club had any EM stock, so they took the decision to convert it to 00 gauge which is where I came in. I got volunteered to convert it which involved taking up all the EM track and making new. As we found, track centres are different and so is the distance between V crossings on the points. Nobody bothered taking a tracing of the old geometry which may have made the job a bit easier. I took measurements from spots on the baseboard where the switch ends were and holes for wiring. Guesswork and Templot came to my help, all built and nearly running, but not quite right in places.
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The issue with diamond crossings and slips is that the distance between the two V crossings is determined by the gauge as well as the crossing angle it is only about 2% between 16.5 and 16.2 but can introduce some slight distortion. Templot allows you to set the correct gauge but there will be slight differences. Don
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Speaking of slips, would I be right in assuming that a B7 double slip drawn in Templot will match the finetrax double slip? If not what will it need to be drawn as to match? About to order the board for the layout extension so will be needing to get the track sorted soon. But before I do I wanted to ensure that my Templot plan is actually going to match the track that I am going to be building.
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Playing around with Track planning software
roythebus1 replied to Trainnoob's topic in Layout & Track Design
Personally I find Templot better than all of them, at least I get realistic curves. But then it's no good for set track. -
This thread has been a bit quiet just lately, has Wayne extended the range recently? New additions? How are sales doing? I'm looking at replacing a hand-built single slip on my layout, the problem is that it's on a curve of possible 60" or 72" radius, I can't remember, I lost the Templot plan for it many years ago. ISTR it's either a B6 or B8, 00 gauge. the slip road is on the outside of the curve and is almost straight. Would one of Wayne's curve to that sort of radius?
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Building the track Well the pointwork has been basically completed and appears to be satisfactory. Much better than my previous attempt so far, although there is along way to go till the track can be properly tested under working conditions. For my second attempt at using the Easitrac plastic chairs on ply sleepers I thought that I’d follow the general principles that I have used in the larger scales. Use a few key attachment points to which the rails could be soldered to give strength and location combined with supplying the power. When finished half chairs are fitted to cosmetically disguise/hide them. I think following a method I am familiar with has helped to get a better result. Previously I struggled to get the track to hold gauge and consistent flangeways with checkrails that worked as they should. The locations I use are the first past the last slide chair, so the two rails, the stock and closure, are bonded together electrically and this also gives strength to the closure against the twisting forces involved when the blades are moved back and forth. The others are under the crossing nose and the sleeper behind it where the wing rails end. These again both support the crossing nose and bond the whole lot electrically which of course changes polarity depending on the throw of the points. All the turnouts are A6’s, but only one is straight, the other two being contraflexed to differing degrees to fit the track design. An aspect to note is that while it is often stated that an ‘A’ switch has 5 slide chairs, a ‘B’ 6, and a ‘C’ 7 and so forth, there are actually another two slide chairs of a different type fitted before the first fixed chairs. So using ‘A’s the location I bond them at is sleeper 8 from the point tips. Now of course you can’t solder to ply, plus the rail needs to be held above the sleepers by the same amount as the chairs do. In 4mm I used copper rivets to do both, provide a solder point and raise the rail away from the sleeper. For 2mm I decided to try and use the Versaline etched chairplates normally used with the pcb sleepers, but drilling them 0.3mm in their centre to take soft iron wire soldered into place. With a matching hole drilled in the ply sleeper the wire is threaded through so the plate sits on the top and the wire then bent over and pressed (squeezed with pliers) into the underside and run to the edge and beyond. This then retains the plate on the sleeper at a fixed point and provides the means for electrical connection. The sleepers themselves are cut from 1/32 ply which is just about the same thickness as the pcb type. It was a slow process using butanone to glue the chairs in place. You can see I marked the template with different coloured dots to remind me where the different chairs went. This helps when threading them on the rail. This construction was done on the workbench on a printout from Templot with the sleepers held in place on the plan with two thin strips of d/s tape under the rail line. A digital multimeter was used to keep checking the electrical connections remained good as the soldered track joints were made. A bespoke roller gauge was used, one made on the lathe some years back. This differs in that it has two square flanges at flangeway width (0.5mm) and wheel flange depth (again 0.5mm) set at the track gauge. The resulting look of the trackwork is pleasing even in it's raw state. As the three turnouts were together in a line I decided to try and make them as one conjoined unit for ease of laying on the baseboard. They will be laid first, and all the plain track fitted after as it's easier I find to 'adjust' plain track for alignment if any small errors creep in. This is my standard method of laying such track. The plain line track will also be produced using the chairs on ply sleepers to keep the look consistent. How all this will actually be done is still being worked out. This is because aspects like tie-bars and how they will be operated is still to be decided. There are a few options and I am unsure as to whether I will remove the trackwork from the paper template or glue it down as it is. I have read of others doing it this way, or even building trackwork directly onto the baseboard, but up until now I have always removed the track from the template and then laid it onto the cork. This can make it tricky as sometimes the slide chair timbers come loose. Leaving the paper in place seems easier, and especially in 2mm but I only tacked the sleepers down with the two thin d/s strips so I'm wary as to whether this may cause issues. Bob
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Thanks for the replies folks! I’ve been playing on Templot and this is what I’ve come up with: Oddly enough, this very closely resembles my first design, the only difference being that bottom siding curved toward the RH edge rather than the bottom corner. Still undecided…
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The Track Plan As the idea was just to use three points the basic track plan didn’t take too long to generate. There has to be, or I want there to be, a run around loop so I can use it with just one loco if I choose. So that means it’s that plus two sidings. But the actual formation has only just been decided after trying a few different designs in Templot. Printing them out, testing with rolling stock etc. It was only three sheets of A4 a time, so it wasn’t too onerous. In order to help decide the basic way it would all work I have drawn up a full plan of how I imagined the sidings would exist alongside the main line both sides of the bridge. I also imagined there was a low bank between the running lines and the exchange sidings after the overbridge. All rather contrived but it all helped to set the scene in my mind. I made the assumption all points would be trailing. There would be a fairly long headshunt along the running line, and the line to the cement works would come off the loop. This then bought up an interesting revelation as regards the operation of how trains arrive and depart the sidings. Which would depend on the direction they arrived from, and departed too. In the down they would be propelled backwards both in and out, while in the up they would be as you normally see, loco first. Two basic designs have been drawn up. One uses a twin arch bridge with the tracks thus well spaced and the other a single arch with the tracks in a pair. I placed stock on both in turn and couldn’t decide which was best, would be more likely to have existed in real life. The reason for the twin arch was the idea this might hide the fiddle yard better, make it not quite so obvious. With this plan I also spaced the sidings out at the minimum distance used for sidings of 15’2” (so 31mm) rather than the minimum standard 11’2” used for plain line tracks. After some consideration I’ve decided to go with this design. I like the twin/multiple arch approach which I have seen used to really good effect on other small layouts when used for the same purpose, as the scenic break. As this is meant to be something to play around with in terms of trying out odd new ideas, for the track I have toyed with using the new British Finescale 3D printed base turnouts alongside Easitrac for the plain line. However, historically plastic based track and I have not generally got along. Indeed it was struggling with plastic based OO RTL track in the late ‘60’s that first pushed me to try making my own track. At this time soldered construction using rail on pcb sleepers was the latest thing to arrive. I never looked back. In later times I switched to using functional chairs on ply sleepers. At first this was with whitemetal chairs but when plastic moulded ones arrived in the 1980’s I changed to using them. This has been in several different scales, all somewhat larger than 2mm. I have in the past tried using Easitrac chairs on ply sleepers for pointwork combined with plain line Easitrac but the smaller size meant it was a struggle for me at the time, the pointwork, and so I reverted to soldered construction using etched chairplates on pcb sleepers. I did that for all the track to keep it looking consistent and matching. I have kept meaning to give it another go, chairs on ply sleepers, and so I have decided this is the time to do just that. To see if I can find a way to make it work. Whether I can or not it will be good to give it a try. So it may be a while before there is another post dealing with the track construction….. Bob
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Funny you should ask, but I just did a test fitting of Piko ICE3 wheels. These bogies are printed in 'Anycubic ABS-like V2'. This was my first go with ABS V2, but it's very popular with in the Templot forum for printing chairs. This wheelset popped in quite easily - but the resin hasn't been fully cure yet. It might be that it becomes too rigid and cracks once it's cured. However, it's predecessor, the 'ABS-like +' , remained slightly pliable even after curing so I'm hopeful that it will be ok. I tried to fit a mueller 8.3mm tillig/bttb wheelset, but they have slightly longer pins. I'll need to re-version the bogie for those wheels if I use them and I'm also going to add holes for Peco NR-91 bearing cups anyway... these bogies are designed for the bin ultimately*, so that's no loss, but it's a promising start. (*There's also a weird print defect on the back of the bogies where it skews off at 45 degrees before finishing off the print.)
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Thanks Lez. I am pretty close to finishing the trackwork now. Only 4 simple turnouts plus this formation to go, and I have plenty of ply timbering left. I think my simple turnouts are ok as built with ply and plastic chairs now. I only used copperclad through the diamonds for the stability of soldering those very short pieces of rail needed to maintain electrical isolation through the crossings. Once I realised the issue with thickness I thought I’d better use as much copperclad as I could through the turnouts too, and plug the gaps later. Adding the n/s shim under the rail significantly complicates the process too. I am using pieces slightly too large and then using the Dremel to remove the excess leaving space for chairs to be added. If - or more likely when - I restart, I think I will use brass chairs on copperclad selectively through the turnouts, with ply timbers and plastic chairs between these. Only through the checkrailed diamonds and where the rail pieces are so small will I need to use copperclad and shim. I think, at least. I also noticed a problem with timbering through the second diamond. I only have one timber between v and k crossings each side, but I need 2 to give a sensible look to the rail break. Probably the timbering which interleaves from the first diamond and the two adjacent turnouts should be revisited too. That seems now to be not as logical as it felt when I did the Templot plan. Iain