Painting locomotives without (much) paint.

[MikeTrice]

A couple of suggestions. As alternative free software to PagePlus try Inkscape. Lots of people on RMWeb that can help you with it if necessary.

 

To touch in the exposed edges of printed paper overlays buy a cheap set of multicolour felt tip pens then just pick the nearest colour and run around the edge before applying.

[BG John]

To touch in the exposed edges of printed paper overlays buy a cheap set of multicolour felt tip pens then just pick the nearest colour and run around the edge before applying.

I've just bought these, that seem OK so far on a Scalesenes building I've been making. There's lots of choice in felt tipped pens, but it was hard finding exactly what I was looking for, as I wanted a variety of fairly subdued colours, and lots of them seem too bright. Suggestions for better ones would be appreciated, as they are little use on thick edges that have glue on them (although that won't apply to overlays locos and rolling stock).

[kirtleypete]

I do use felt tips Mike but I've found that over time the colour can fade, which paint doesn't do. I agree that they are more controllable, though. 

 

Inkscape looks good but I'm not going to learn a whole new system when Pageplus does everything I need. The point of this thread isn't to push Pageplus, it's just the technique, the tools can vary but the method is what's important. 

 

Peter

[MikeTrice]

Inkscape looks good but I'm not going to learn a whole new system when Pageplus does everything I need.

I don't blame you. Better the devil you know as they say.

[kirtleypete]

Here's the finished loco, with a driver who looks very at home working in a brewery!

 

 

 

 

 

Peter

[Crewe North]

Very colourful Pete......much better than the somewhat dowdy LMS red

 

 

John

[Edwardian]

Well, I lifted my present moratorium on non-life supporting expenditure to the extent of purchasing Peter's Book.  It arrived yesterday and I have now finished reading it.

 

Is it interesting, helpful, instructive, thought provoking and useful?  Yes!  Does it inspire and embolden me to have a go?  Yes!

 

It has served its purpose.  Admirably.

 

One point I would make, which is in no way to detract from the book, is that the threshold issue is some mastery of a graphics package.  Peter uses Page-plus to illustrate his technique.  Not only is it not his purpose to teach people how to use this, or, as he puts it, to reproduce the manual, but there are other such software programs, and you couldn't sensibly cover them all.

 

What this means is that, unless you are already au fait with at least one graphics package, you cannot go off and start doing what Peter does having only read his book.

 

The Memsahib commentated that she thought the job could be done with, for example, Illustrator, with which she is familiar.

 

This is where I do suffer some trepidation.  While I can do a lot of things (well, I think I can) on computers, I seem strangely inept at learning to use any kind of graphics package or similar, at least by myself and trying to learn it from the manual.

 

I tried Templot.  My head exploded.  All track layouts will, therefore, now revert to using PAD (pencil aided design).  I really, really want to use a Silhouette cutter.  I tried Inkscape and despaired.  I am now, very slowly, trying to go through the manual for the Silhouette software, but confidence levels are at zero and, frankly, I am not optimistic.  What chance would I have with Illustrator?  The Mem won't let me use it at home, she fears for my mental equilibrium. 

 

Pathetic, I know, but, at least with books and threads like Peter's I can summon the will to have a go.  So, well done and thank you.

Edited February 12, 2016 by Edwardian

[MikeOxon]

...................................

 

Pathetic, I know, but, at least with books and threads like Peter's I can summon the will to have a go.  So, well done and thank you.

Not pathetic at all but a serious criticism of the way in which a lot of software has developed.  Competition has led to the suppliers adding more and more features that have made the programs baffling to the beginner.  They have also blurred important distinctions between different types of program, by trying to make it appear that their product does everything!

 

The most popular software, aimed mainly at photo-editing, is Adobe Photoshop Elements and I find that it works well for the tasks Peter describes.  I have written about how I use it in my blog at http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/blog/1405/entry-12905-home-made-lining-lettering-1/ I have stuck with an early version of the software, since I find that all the extra features of newer versions simply get in the way and slow me down!  There's a free software package called GIMP that does very similar things and also works well.

 

There's a distinction to be made between two types of graphics software, which work in quite different ways.  In the jargon, these are 'vector' and 'bitmap' graphics.  A 'bitmap' program creates the final image as an array of coloured dots on the page.  The program stores the positions and colours of every dot.  A 'vector' program creates a series of 'shapes' (lines, circles, etc) and stores the information about each shape (called an 'entity' in Autocad) in the overall image.  Specialised technical drawing programs (CAD) use the vector method, because each entity can be described precisely, in terms of dimensions and location.  The trouble is that you, as the designer, have to be ready to supply all this information, since the computer cannot guess what you want!  That need for precision, at the outset, makes getting started a somewhat daunting task!  Inkscape and Studio are programs of this 'vector' type.

 

Photoshop, and similar programs, produce a 'bitmap' result but can also draw some shapes as 'vectors'.  These shapes, however, have to be 'simplified' to bitmap form, before finally saving the image.  This means that the shapes cannot normally be edited separately, later.  So, if you are drawing, say, the side of a coach, with lots of windows, a vector drawing program will let you place each window in exactly the right place and will let you specify all the sizes and radii of corners, etc.,  More importantly, it will let you 'tweak' things later, if it's not quite right the first time!

 

My advice would be to pick a popular program (or perhaps a couple) for the types of things you want to do and then practice with some simple designs, to get the hang of how things work.  Invest time in that program and stick with it!

 

Mike

[ianmaccormac]

Hi Edwardian

We tend to use graphic packages in a very simple way to get the results like Peter has managed. If your Memsahib can show you how to draw basic shapes: rectangles, squares, circles and lines to a specific size and then be able to colour them in, then you should be able to produce something like Peter has done. He has done this using a desk top publishing type programme (I think) or only used a graphics program at the easy end of its capabilities.

You need to try the thing out and then practice, lots. The nice thing about this technique is you are only printing on paper so it is quite a cheap thing to do and doesn't matter too much if it is wrong, you just adjust things and print again.

I would say you need to get in the Memsahibs good books on Sunday and then get using it at home and don't worry about head explosions cause it doesn't actually happen!

Cheers

Ian

[BG John]

I'd never managed to get anywhere with any sort of graphics program, until fairly recently. I think it was the various topics on using Silhouette cutters that finally helped me to make some progress. I started to get quite proficient with Inkscape, but then I didn't touch it for a while, and found I had to start relearning most of it. I chose Inkscape to concentrate on because it will create cutting files, as well as the types of graphics needed for painting without paint. If I'm going to achieve what I'd like to do, I need to be able to produce the physical parts of models, and colour them, and it makes sense to use software that does both. The colour layers for printing can then be part of the same drawing as the layers for cutting the parts. I also use GIMP for some things, as sometimes it's quicker than Inkscape, and it's Perspective Tool is very useful for straightening photos to be traced in Inkscape. An advantage of vectors over bitmaps is they will work in any scale, so I could use the same artwork in 4mm and 7mm scales, and potentially we could all exchange our artwork regardless of the scale we work in.

 

I think Inkscape is worth persevering with, and it makes sense to start off with very modest ambitions. Follow the tutorials for it on RMweb, and maybe anything else you can find that's specific to railway modelling. I've always found that software manuals, tutorials etc., teach things that I can't see any practical use for, and miss out, or over complicate, the really useful features. I then get so bogged down in trying to make sense of it that I give up. About all you need to be able to do is drawn lines, boxes and some simple curves, add text, and do some basic colouring. Everything else the documentation insists on teaching you is a confusing distraction.

 

I installed the latest version of PagePlus, but it's changed so much from the version Peter uses in the book, that you may as well use different software, unless you already have the same version. I didn't see anything in the text that is really specific to PagePlus.

[Edwardian]

Thanks for the support.  It helps (as I am such a wimp).

 

Well, I downloaded Inkscape again and I have just been through some of Mike's very clear and helpful tutorials (as opposed to online guide - you don't want to see how my Swedish flag turned out).

 

I have now managed to draw a rectangle.  If and how I can get from that to side tanks in IEG or coach sides for a Silhouette cutter remains to be seen. 

 

So far, however, I have, like Kung Fu Panda before me, at least shown that there is now a Level Zero  

Edited February 12, 2016 by Edwardian

[ianmaccormac]

Something to build up from then!

Best wishes

Ian

[Harry2013]

I received my copies of Scratchbuilt buildings the Kirtley Way & Using Printed Papers in Railway Modelling yesterday.

 

That I now feel motivated to see what I can do for myself & intend to buy both Station Colours & Decorating model locomotives & rolling stock using printed papers, should be enough to tell you that I regard my initial purchases to be value for money.

 

That the books focus on the use of Pageplus doesn't bother me too much since I'll have to learn the necessary skills in other software packages - since Pageplus is now a legacy product & tho still sold, will not be further developed by Serif.

 

I intend to look into using a combination of Scribus Inkscape, PaintDotnet, all of which are open source products

 

I would appreciate hearing what other members are using for their scratchbuilding endeavours

[kirtleypete]

Good luck - I'll be very interested to know how you get on with different software, and I'm delighted that you've enjoyed my books.

 

Peter

[Harry2013]

Good luck - I'll be very interested to know how you get on with different software, and I'm delighted that you've enjoyed my books.

 

Peter

 Thanks Peter, yes I'll certainly let you know. I'll probably order the other two titles I have my eye tomorrow or Fri, & take further advantage of my 30 day "Prime" trial :-)

[Caley Jim]

I would appreciate hearing what other members are using for their scratchbuilding endeavours

I have been experimenting with Smart Models downloadable building papers (www.smartmodels.co.uk ) and AutoCAD.   My initial efforts for a little diorama challenge our Area group set ourselves.

 

 

The weighbridge office went straight onto my layout, but the warehouse building for that is larger and details of it can be seen from the end of this post on.

 

Quite pleased with the results.

 

Jim

[Harry2013]

I have been experimenting with Smart Models downloadable building papers (www.smartmodels.co.uk ) and AutoCAD.   My initial efforts for a little diorama challenge our Area group set ourselves.

 

Quite pleased with the results.

 

Jim

 

 

 

That's very impressive, good luck with your future experiments

Edited November 4, 2017 by Harry2013

[Caley Jim]

That's very impressive, good luck with your future experiments

Thanks.  It's likely to be a wee while before I do any more in that line as I've just sent off a sheet for etching for the signal box for Kirkallanmuir.

 

Jim

Edited November 1, 2017 by Caley Jim

[sir douglas]

just found the thread, excellent idea which i have seen done a few times in 4mm but never tried it myself, but your locos look so good its worth trying

[Guy Rixon]

The Memsahib commentated that she thought the job could be done with, for example, Illustrator, with which she is familiar. ... What chance would I have with Illustrator?  The Mem won't let me use it at home, she fears for my mental equilibrium. 

 

 

Don't go there. Seriously. Learning Illustrator is like an icepick through the ego. Granted, it is a gold-plated and jewel-encrusted icepick, but the UI is utterly horrible for casual use. Excellent, no doubt, if you can invest the time to learn it in depth, but useless otherwise.

 

I know why Templot is awkward for sketching layouts (Martin explained the UI rationale elsewhere on this forum and it's very specialised to another use-case), but I cannot explain why Illustrator is so hostile to beginners. Adobe hired the wrong Martians to code it, maybe.