Kernow Model Rail Centre - Bulleid Diesel

[stewartingram]

Just a thought. Some diesels/electrics had fibreglass panels in the roof, ostensibly to let in a little light to the engine room. These had a yellowish tinge when new. Was the BR spec of yellow roof chosen to "match" those?

 

Stewart

[Ian Hargrave]

Just a thought. Some diesels/electrics had fibreglass panels in the roof, ostensibly to let in a little light to the engine room. These had a yellowish tinge when new. Was the BR spec of yellow roof chosen to "match" those?

 

Stewart

I think I am correct in saying it had more to do with Derby works having a certain shade of paint when they transferred from the SR to the LMR and were repainted in BR green.The same was applied to the Derby twins ....for a while.

[locoman462]

I think I am correct in saying it had more to do with Derby works having a certain shade of paint when they transferred from the SR to the LMR and were repainted in BR green.The same was applied to the Derby twins ....for a while.

Some of the Woodhead electrics were also given the primrose roof treatment for a while before returning to the familiar grey.

[xm607]

10203 seen on Bigbury at the Sevenoaks show.

[phil gollin]

.

 

Did the green livery version ever run on the Southern Region ?

 

.

[Dunsignalling]

AFAIK

 

.

 

Did the green livery version ever run on the Southern Region ?

 

.

 AFAIK, none of the pioneer LMR or SR diesels were repainted into green until after they had left the SR.

 

John

[dcordingley]

My Bulleid arrived towards the end of last week, so I've spent the weekend customising it to represent its condition on the WCML circa 1958. The most important change has been to repaint the ludicrously lurid roof, which is now in standard BR diesel roof grey. I've adjusted the discs to denote haulage of a Class A/1 passenger train at one end, and added the earlier type of "Royal Scot" headboard consistent with photographic evidence from the period. (The loco lacks a top centre lamp bracket, but a dab of superglue fastens the headboard in the appropriate position.) The other end displays a Class B/2 headcode denoting an ordinary passenger train - the prototype was frequently seen at the southern end of the WCML on these duties in its latter days. The loco is an excellent runner out of the box, and it has now completed a few hours of running in. Very pleased with it!

 

David      

[SRman]

The model does look superb in BR green, even with the primrose (read 'lurid yellow'!) roof. I find all these recent photos are making it so-o-oo tempting, but I simply cannot justify a green one for my SR-themed layout. If (a big 'if') I was to get one, I think I'd retain the yellow roof but try to tone it down somewhat, then weather it.

Edited July 10, 2018 by SRman

[lochlongside]

I was impressed by 10201/2 when they arrived but had had 10203 in green (and lurid yellow - don't remember that ) on order for even longer.

Putting it on test it walked off with my normal 16 coach test train so having a fairly eclectic set of coaches to hand I thought I would load it up until it slipped.... but failed.

My test track is a sort of continuous 4-5ft radius circle of Code 75 which includes (all Peco) 3 inside radius LR curved points, 3 outside radius curved and one straight point with approximately a 50% mix of facing and trailing points and with 8 baseboard joints. There is a slight just about perceptible gradient due to the floor which I have not measured but because the test track is a circle(ish) it balances out. .

This was a fairly non-scientific test. I simply added coaches as follows - Bachmann birdcagex3/RoyalMailx4/ThompsonBrakesx4/ObservationCar/4-TC (I said it was eclectic) Hornby LSWRx4/Collettx5/RailroadMk1x5. I loaded up with 30 coaches ( at which point the driver could see his own tail lights but with that load on probably could not stop in time without derailing the train even in 4mm) and the loco simply pulled away - no slipping no fuss.

The loco started taking up the coupling slack at around 3v and pulled the full 30 coaches away slowly and steadily at around 4.6v and 0.1Amp at any point around my circuit regardless of slight gradient.

Winding the voltage up to 12v (My controller will deliver 16v DC fullwave but since blowing the lighting cct on another loco I now have a self imposed limit of 12v approx ) and with 0.25Amps consumption the loco took the 30 coaches up to a scale 62mph and maintained this speed steadily and evenly for several circuits.

I would be extremely interested if someone with a bigger circuit could test the loco hauling capacity and the slipping point - my guess is it will take around 35-40 bogie coaches.

It was rock steady through all the pointwork (Peco code 75 livefrog), and across all the baseboard joints. Performance wise it is outstanding - very well done to Kernow they have done a brilliant job.

Now the (only) downside - probably peculiar to my layout situation but it is a b***** to put onto curved track  - even a railer is not a great deal of help.

This is probably due to the flexibility (floppiness) built into the bogie, however once properly on it is an immaculate road-holder- as I said above rock steady. (so swings and roundabouts) and something I can certainly live with - there is no way I would mark it down here because railing it on straight track is pretty ok..

Would I buy another well I certainly would if I hadn't already got 10201/2/and3  - perhaps if funds allow a black 10203 would be nice !!

Now to calm the roof down!! (and the white bogie front idler wheels - unlike with the black locos these idler wheels just seem a tad too visible and unbalance the front side view  - but that is probably only a personal perception).

[Godfrey Glyn]

Like lochlongside above, the arrival of 10203 on Friday completed my collection of all three of the Bulleid diesels, but in my case all three are in the black livery. I am absolutely delighted with all of them, its been a long gestation period but well worth it. Very many thanks to Chris and his team down west and to the manufacturer and his staff out in the far east, they have done a fantastic job. I am afraid I can't relate any results from haulage experiments, my track availability is very limited at the moment, but I do agree that you need a piece of straight track to place it accurately on the track!

If I could find an excuse I would get one of the BR green ones, but I have so much stock on order it might create a cash flow problem!!

 

all the best

 

Godfrey

Edited July 10, 2018 by Godfrey Glyn

[locoman462]

Ditto, and I think I will need to do something about dulling / dirtying the shiny silver engine block.  I have a feeling that by 1960 the original would have become very less shiny than that !!! Also considering whether to modify the bodyside window into the open position. 

Whilst I have not yet  decided what to do about the roof colour - leave it primrose and weather it or repaint it grey, I have toned down the engine block visible through the centre window and modified the window itself by modelling it in the dropped / open position as was usual on the real locos. I painted the block with a mix of gunmetal with a touch of aluminium to lighten it slightly. After removing the windows, I carefully cut one of them approximately one third / two thirds and smoothed the cut edges with a fine needle file before painting a fine edge to represent the window frame. The windows were re-inserted and lightly glued in place. The unused window has been saved as a spare. 

 

The modifications have given 10203 a much more prototypical appearance. 

[locoman462]

Has anyone experienced problems with their Bulleid consistently de-railing in one direction while running perfectly in the other over the same piece of track?

Mine runs without fault in one direction but when turned round, the rear bogie drops off the track. The back to backs on both bogies are correct. The section of track

concerned is at immediately after a base board joint at the start of a long slack curve. There is a very slight undulation in the track but the alignment is smooth.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[mikesndbs]

Has anyone experienced problems with their Bulleid consistently de-railing in one direction while running perfectly in the other over the same piece of track?

Mine runs without fault in one direction but when turned round, the rear bogie drops off the track. The back to backs on both bogies are correct. The section of track

concerned is at immediately after a base board joint at the start of a long slack curve. There is a very slight undulation in the track but the alignment is smooth.

Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

Hi, I recall a similar issue and explained how i fixed it in my review video.

 

Can't remember now, but it might have been one of the pony truck screws needs very slight slackening off.

Sorry to be lazy but I am just dashing off to work when your question came in.

[locoman462]

Hi, I recall a similar issue and explained how i fixed it in my review video.

 

Can't remember now, but it might have been one of the pony truck screws needs very slight slackening off.

Sorry to be lazy but I am just dashing off to work when your question came in.

 

Hi Mike,

Thanks for your suggestion which I will certainly try. However it is the driving wheels on the rear bogie that seem to be de-railing in one direction

only. The bogie in question is the one under the speaker assembly and I am wondering if it this that is slightly restricting the movement of the bogie at the top of

the gear tower. Will investigate further at my club on Monday.

[ikks]

Having just reviewed my photos of 10203, I note that the last photo amongst them, probably taken at Derby after withdrawal, shows that the loco was fitted, probably late in life, with a pair of standard 'trumpet' horns in place of the whistle that was carried for most of its life.

 

 

10203_14.jpg

 

Something to bear in mind if, like me, you intend producing a 'parallel universe' 10203 which survive longer that it did in this universe.

 

I also note that, despite the engine-room drop windows being open, the engines are not visible in photos. Mine will receive a coat of the same 'grot' that will be applied to the roof.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Any idea when the horns were fitted?

 

Rgds........Mike

[Dunsignalling]

Any idea when the horns were fitted?

 

Rgds........Mike

Very possibly at the same works visit when the yellow panels were applied, I haven't seen any pictures with the horns and without them.

 

Cue someone to post one showing exactly that.

 

John

Edited July 15, 2018 by Dunsignalling

[The Ghost of IKB]

Some slightly off topic questions,

1.How do the bogie frames compare to a class 40 (footsteps aside).

2.could these offer a route to upgrading the Bachmann loco?

3.and if so, could spares be available?

[Clive Mortimore]

Warning: reading this post may damage your eyes. Please wear sunglasses.

 

10203 arrived this afternoon...3E7FA7E7-C13B-4DF7-A0D8-E201753D9F77.jpeg92FFA752-82B2-4667-9493-54AC161AB6BA.jpeg

 

Its a fantastic model but I think the warning panel was put on the roof by mistake ?

 

One headlamp became detached in transit, and push fitted back on..

9574821C-4719-49ED-90C1-B7D9545A9F80.jpeg5FC3F3AD-36D2-4094-BDD2-53C076A701BC.jpeg

 

 

In case anyone is wondering what is the difference, 10202 also arrived today, giving me the fleet

 

First the roof is very different

 

CD0FC36A-C4B5-4E51-9DFD-F00CC29ACD83.jpeg

As are the grill sizes on the sides

BD1DABD1-DFD4-4369-BBD7-ECE0A3C4DBBD.jpeg

 

Here’s both90BB6875-584E-42E7-BFC8-5C4D698EDA6D.jpeg

 

The floating bogie is worthy of merit, as is the detailed wheels....0D8417F5-2D9A-4836-A105-63AD2EA43B66.jpeg

 

It’s been a long story I ordered 10201 / 3 in December 2014 and I was so impressed with 10201 at Warley last November I added 10202 to my basket in January 2018, both arrived today.

 

Really smooth models, weighty and excellent paint finish.

My only question is how accurate is the yellow roof ?

Hi

 

The difference between the grilles on 10201/2 and 10203 is correct, number 3 had deeper grilles, possibly to give more ventilation to uprated engine. 

 

As for the roof on 10203, it doesn't look right to me. The roof on 10202 has four exhaust ports, like all 16 cylinder English Electric engined locos, LMS twins, DP2, Classes 40 and 50. 10203 looks like it has two very wide exhaust ports. When I built my model, after finding the MTK brass model was too high, I just copied the roof bits and bobs. My model has 4 exhaust ports. I am not saying I am right but looking at my friends Krenow model the other day it didn't seem right.  I have looked high and low for a photo showing the roof clearly.....so far I have not found one. I have looked at several drawings I have, Skinley and Fox show no exhaust, the BR diagram doesn't have a plan view. The MTK drawing supplied with the kit shows four rectangular ports. 

 

 

The MTK drawing is better than the model as it is the right height.

[SRman]

Hi

 

The difference between the grilles on 10201/2 and 10203 is correct, number 3 had deeper grilles, possibly to give more ventilation to uprated engine. 

 

As for the roof on 10203, it doesn't look right to me. The roof on 10202 has four exhaust ports, like all 16 cylinder English Electric engined locos, LMS twins, DP2, Classes 40 and 50. 10203 looks like it has two very wide exhaust ports. When I built my model, after finding the MTK brass model was too high, I just copied the roof bits and bobs. My model has 4 exhaust ports. I am not saying I am right but looking at my friends Krenow model the other day it didn't seem right.  I have looked high and low for a photo showing the roof clearly.....so far I have not found one. I have looked at several drawings I have, Skinley and Fox show no exhaust, the BR diagram doesn't have a plan view. The MTK drawing supplied with the kit shows four rectangular ports. 

 

392.JPG

 

The MTK drawing is better than the model as it is the right height.

 

I can't give you a correct answer, but my old MTK kit (also too high!!) has the four exhaust ports. However, even though it was labelled, and built, as 10203, the side grilles are wrong for 10203 and more correct for 10201/2. MY MTK one uses a severely cut down Mainline Peak chassis, but I have it in mind to see if I can get a cheap Hornby RailRoad class 40 to use - that would also enable me to convert to DCC, which is not worth the effort for the Mainline chassis.

 

I may have posted this pic before - apologies if I am repeating.

 

Kernow 10201 and MTK 10203 - 2 by Jeffrey Lynn, on Flickr

 

 

[GeoffBird]

Like lochlongside above, the arrival of 10203 on Friday completed my collection of all three of the Bulleid diesels, but in my case all three are in the black livery. I am absolutely delighted with all of them, its been a long gestation period but well worth it. Very many thanks to Chris and his team down west and to the manufacturer and his staff out in the far east, they have done a fantastic job. I am afraid I can't relate any results from haulage experiments, my track availability is very limited at the moment, but I do agree that you need a piece of straight track to place it accurately on the track!

If I could find an excuse I would get one of the BR green ones, but I have so much stock on order it might create a cash flow problem!!

 

all the best

 

Godfrey

Did any of the Bulleid diesels ever carry a shedcode plate in SR days?  If so, where was it fitted?

[DavidB]

As for the roof on 10203, it doesn't look right to me. The roof on 10202 has four exhaust ports, like all 16 cylinder English Electric engined locos, LMS twins, DP2, Classes 40 and 50. 10203 looks like it has two very wide exhaust ports.

Brian Haresnape's British Rail Fleet Survey No.1 (Early prototype and pilot scheme diesel electrics) has a high level photo of 10203 in Tring Cutting. The loco has a clean roof showing the twin transverse exhaust cut outs as portrayed by the Kernow model. The preceding page has a photo of 10201 at Exeter Central, also with a clean roof and no indication of any kind of transverse exhaust cut outs - it's a lower angle shot, but it's clear that 10203 had a different arrangement.

 

David

[Clive Mortimore]

It must be great not to have dyslexia so you can make fun of other peoples mistakes.

Edited July 16, 2018 by Clive Mortimore

[robertcwp]

It must be great not to have dyslexia so you can make fun of other peoples mistakes.

Apologies, Clive!

[adb968008]

Did any of the Bulleid diesels ever carry a shedcode plate in SR days? If so, where was it fitted?

These images of 10203 show a plate removed from below/in front of the “1” at the front end..

https://goo.gl/images/AWqfWn

Same for 10201

https://goo.gl/images/rLHLV7

Edited July 16, 2018 by adb968008

[SRman]

Did any of the Bulleid diesels ever carry a shedcode plate in SR days?  If so, where was it fitted?

If you mean Southern Railway by "in SR days", then none of them did because they weren't actually in service until BR days (1951 and 1954). Otherwise, there is evidence of such plates being carried at one time.