Kernow Model Rail Centre - Bulleid Diesel

[Gwiwer]

There don't now appear to be any on their website - unless I'm being dense - so presumably all gone.

 

John.

 

Sold out.  Unless another production run is ordered.

 

Proof if ever it were needed that there is market enough for a very limited prototype which had a short life in a small area.  If the product and quality are right.

[JSpencer]

IMG_4775.JPG

 

Quite an easy modification, though.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

Providing it is not the black version.

[jonnyuk]

Sorry to track this back up. Had a play tonight using the cvs below and it made no difference. I changed cv10 to 1 and that cured it, however until I get to 10 (speed 28) the loco does not move. I can hear the motor starting to turn.

Out of interest what do the cvs 151/152 do, read the Hornby TTS manual and it’s all foreign to me.

 

1: i assume i can't use the cab lights as the tts chip has no function for this

They will either come on with the main lighting function or not. You are converting from 8 to 21 so you either loose lighting functions or they get grouped togethor.

2: which speaker is best, the tts speaker or factory fitted from kernow

The Kernow and TTS speaker are the same (though Hornby provide a sound box for it). Probably no difference in sound quality

3:at slow speeds the running is very lumpy when using the tts chip. i have turned of back EMF but apart from that i don't really know what to play around with in terms of cv values.

The TTS is set up for a railroad single powered bogie model. The Kernow loco uses a much bigger motor. I used a TTS chip targetted for the railroad model in the super detailed one. It too stuttered but went when I set CVs 151 and 152 to 35,

 

BTW - the 40 had horns and the Kernow Bullieds have whistles.

[Covkid]

Sold out.  Unless another production run is ordered.

 

Proof if ever it were needed that there is market enough for a very limited prototype which had a short life in a small area.  If the product and quality are right.

Agree to an extent, but you might be drawing an easy conclusion here.

 

Plus points are ;

 

1) Transition era diesel

2) "Top link" express loco

3) More than one livery

4) More than one area of operation

5) Attractive design

6) Operated "south of the Thames"

 

Perceived negative points are

 

a) large and long 8 axle mechanism including "carrier wheels" - complex engineering.

b) buying "blind" from a retailer with no prior photographic evidence or review.

 

I disagree over the "short life" and "small area" because these locos worked much of the WCML route - 400 ish miles Euston - Glasgow as well is Liverpool, Manchester and Wolverhampton. Additionally working on the Southern Region probably Waterloo - Exeter and maybe Brighton and Eastbourne too.

 

Short life ? Perhaps longer than some BR standard steam classes ?

 

 

My decision to buy a green 10203 from Kernow was based on wanting a Bulleid diesel as working on the LMR in the Birmingham area in the very early 1960s. Also based on KMRC dealing directly with China rather than using their previous "facilitator" gave me confidence. I am applying my own grey roof twin horns and yellow warning panel, pretty much as John Isherwood's upthread.

 

Going back to your comments though "Gwiwer" i think 2) and 6) are relevant. Many modellers like Southern subjects, particularly express locos.

 

Thats my tupennyworth anyway

[JSpencer]

Sorry to track this back up. Had a play tonight using the cvs below and it made no difference. I changed cv10 to 1 and that cured it, however until I get to 10 (speed 28) the loco does not move. I can hear the motor starting to turn.

Out of interest what do the cvs 151/152 do, read the Hornby TTS manual and it’s all foreign to me.

It is going to be trial and error. Some on the Hornby diesel TTS thread said this for Bachmann class 47 settings:

 

Quote

Slow speed jerkiness is usually cured by setting CV150 to 1, and then fine tuning CV's 153 and 154. My Bachmann 47s are very smooth with CV3=35, CV4=20, CV 150=1 CV153=215 and 154=0. Of course, your 45 may be different! Very much trial and error I'm afraid, but well worth spending time tuning the CVs especially, as you say, when the sound chip is just £34.

End Quote

[jonnyuk]

I found the thread you mention and tried those settings, made no difference. The only setting that makes a difference so far is turning bemf off effectively by setting it to 1. However this now means speeds 1-10 do nothing, you can hear the motor starting but the loco does not move until you get to 11 (up to 28)

Ta

[brushman47544]

My Bachmann 47s are very smooth with CV3=35, CV4=20, CV 150=1 CV153=215 and 154=0. Of course, your 45 may be different!

End Quote

With an ordinary Bachmann decoder, my Bachmann 45s and 47s run perfectly well on the same CV settings, so might it be reasonable to expect that other decoders will be the same?

[Tim Hall]

They've just emailed and put on FB that new batches available Q1 2019.....small discounts for previous purchasers....

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/c/1102/Diesel-Locomotives/2

[Andy Y]

KERNOW MODEL RAIL CENTRE PRESS RELEASE - BULLEID DIESEL ANNOUNCEMENT

 

Following the total sell-out of the Bulleid diesels within two months of delivery, we are pleased to announce that in response to customer demand a further batch of Bulleid diesels has been arranged.  This batch will feature the same four models as the first batch with two additional versions added.  The first four will be certified limited editions of 150 pieces and will be supplied with numbered certificates of authenticity and an appropriate named train headboard.  The headboard will be supplied loose in the box for customer fitment.  The remaining two models will feature 10201 and 10202 in BR Green with Late Crest for the first time and are not limited editions.

 

 

The models available to order are: -

K2701A – 10201 in BR Black with early emblem and Bournemouth Belle headboard

K2702A – 10202 in BR Black with early emblem and Golden Arrow headboard

K2703A – 10203 in BR Black with early emblem and Atlantic Coast Express headboard

K2704A – 10203 in BR Green with Late Crest and Royal Scot headboard

K2705 – 10201 in BR Green with Late Crest (Grey roof)

K2706 – 10202 in BR Green with Late Crest (Grey roof)

As previously, these models will need to be paid for in advance to obtain the prices shown below. To reward the loyalty of our customers who previously pre-ordered these models a special offer will be sent to them direct.  If customers wait until they arrive they will pay a higher price, assuming they have not sold out prior to release. 

 

The models will be £179.99 for DCC Ready or £309.99 for DCC Sound Fitted.  By paying in full immediately customers will save £10 (£15 for DCC Sound fitted versions).

 

Delivery is expected in the 1st Quarter of 2019.
 

 

Please visit the dedicated Bulleid Diesel page for further information or to place your order: -

 

 

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/pg/111/Bulleid_Diesel

 

 

 

 

 

Further information and direct product links to each item are below:

The four limited edition versions are shown below:

 

K2701A Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10201 BOURNEMOUTH BELLE in BR Black livery with early emblem £169.99

 

.   
K2701ADS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10201 BOURNEMOUTH BELLE in BR Black livery with early emblem £294.99. DCC SOUND FITTED 

 

K2702A Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10202 GOLDEN ARROW in BR Black livery with early emblem £169.99

 

K2702ADS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10202 GOLDEN ARROW in BR Black livery with early emblem £294.99 DCC SOUND FITTED 

 

K2703A Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10203 ATLANTIC COAST EXPRESS in BR Black livery with early emblem £169.99.

 

 K2703ADS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10203 ATLANTIC COAST EXPRESS in BR Black livery with early emblem £294.99.  DCC SOUND FITTED

 

K2704A Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10203 ROYAL SCOT in BR Green livery with late crest £169.99.  

 

K2704ADS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10203 ROYAL SCOT in BR Green livery with late crest £294.99. DCC SOUND FITTED   

 

K2705 Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10201 in BR Green livery with Late Crest £169.99.  

 

K2705DS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10201 in BR Green livery with Late Crest £294.99. DCC SOUND FITTED

 

 
K2706 Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10202 in BR Green livery with Late Crest £169.99 
K2706DS Bulleid 1-Co-Co-1 Diesel Locomotive number 10202 in BR Green livery with Late Crest £294.99 DCC SOUND FITTED

[tetsudofan]

Yipee, just what I wanted! Had originally purchased 10203 in green but upon receipt had really wished that I had ordered 10203 in black so today's announcement is great. Now I'll get a black one ..... with the added bonus of an ACE headboard.

 

Happy bunny,

 

Keith

[rembrow]

Have e-mailed Kernow to get more info on their proposed 10201/02 in BR green, as the accompanying prototype photos show the loco in green but with flat cab front. AFAIK the diesels were transferred to the LM Region about the time they were repainted in green and were fitted with cab end connecting doors by the LM Region so they could work double headed on the Euston-Glasgow express, so if I'm right, would not have been in BR green with flat front, for long.

[JSpencer]

Tempted by 10202 - the only one of the trio I don,t have with GA boards.

[Ian Hargrave]

Have e-mailed Kernow to get more info on their proposed 10201/02 in BR green, as the accompanying prototype photos show the loco in green but with flat cab front. AFAIK the diesels were transferred to the LM Region about the time they were repainted in green and were fitted with cab end connecting doors by the LM Region so they could work double headed on the Euston-Glasgow express, so if I'm right, would not have been in BR green with flat front, for long.

10203 certainly did work the "Royal Scot" singly for a period in the summer of 1957 .Not sure about multiple working between the other pair though.My own recollection is of them on Euston - Wolverhampton turns solo.

 

Am I correct in concluding that if like me you ordered one of the first batch,you get a discount if you order one from this latest series ?

[rembrow]

10203 certainly did work the "Royal Scot" singly for a period in the summer of 1957 .Not sure about multiple working between the other pair though.My own recollection is of them on Euston - Wolverhampton turns solo.

 

Am I correct in concluding that if like me you ordered one of the first batch,you get a discount if you order one from this latest series ?

Kernow have e-mailed me back, very quick response. The BR green versions of 10201 and 10202 will be with flat fronts and NOT with the connecting doors fitted by the LM Region. They have advised that they do have the tooling option for the connecting doors, which is likely to be on a future release. Without the doors I'll not be ordering as this version is for a short timeframe on tbe LM Region. They were repainted into BR green at Derby on transfer to the LM Region and were fitted with the connecting doors so they could work similar turns with 10000 and 10001 which were built with connecting doors for double heading.

Ian, my understanding about the discount is that there is standard discounting for pre ordering and pre paying and if you have purchased one of the previous versions, you also qualify for 1000 loyalty points by requesting them when you order.

I'm not sure if you can use these loyalty points

for this order as they normally can only be redeemed against later orders.

10203 had a higher power diesel engine, so could work express diagrams solo, 10201 and 02 were of a similar lower power as 10000 and 10001, which worked the Royal Scot double headed.

Edited October 18, 2018 by rembrow

[railroadbill]

It is going to be trial and error. Some on the Hornby diesel TTS thread said this for Bachmann class 47 settings:

 

Quote

Slow speed jerkiness is usually cured by setting CV150 to 1, and then fine tuning CV's 153 and 154. My Bachmann 47s are very smooth with CV3=35, CV4=20, CV 150=1 CV153=215 and 154=0. Of course, your 45 may be different! Very much trial and error I'm afraid, but well worth spending time tuning the CVs especially, as you say, when the sound chip is just £34.

End Quote

I got this advice on the TTS thread, and set up my Bachmann 45 accordingly, using those values.  It now runs with no slow speed jerkiness. Motor etc the same on 47 models, I believe, so should work ok there as well.

[Ian Hargrave]

Kernow have e-mailed me back, very quick response. The BR green versions of 10201 and 10202 will be with flat fronts and NOT with the connecting doors fitted by the LM Region. They have advised that they do have the tooling option for the connecting doors, which is likely to be on a future release. Without the doors I'll not be ordering as this version is for a short timeframe on tbe LM Region. They were repainted into BR green at Derby on transfer to the LM Region and were fitted with the connecting doors so they could work similar turns with 10000 and 10001 which were built with connecting doors for double heading.

Ian, my understanding about the discount is that there is standard discounting for pre ordering and pre paying and if you have purchased one of the previous versions, you also qualify for 1000 loyalty points by requesting them when you order.

I'm not sure if you can use these loyalty points

for this order as they normally can only be redeemed against later orders.

10203 had a higher power diesel engine, so could work express diagrams solo, 10201 and 02 were of a similar lower power as 10000 and 10001, which worked the Royal Scot double headed.

Yes I realise that. But you raise an interesting point.Whereas 10000/1 worked for a time in multiple on the Royal Scot,I can find no evidence for 10201/2 having done so.Maybe someone else can ? The Bulleid diesels were around for only a relatively short period of time on the LMR before the arrival of the EE Type 4 2000 hp D210 onwards which effectively rendered them redundant from late 1959.

[rembrow]

Yes I realise that. But you raise an interesting point.Whereas 10000/1 worked for a time in multiple on the Royal Scot,I can find no evidence for 10201/2 having done so.Maybe someone else can ? The Bulleid diesels were around for only a relatively short period of time on the LMR before the arrival of the EE Type 4 2000 hp D210 onwards which effectively rendered them redundant from late 1959.

 

Ian, the attached link from 'Rail - Online' is captioned as 10201 and 10202 double heading the Royal Scot at Crewe on an unknown date in 1958.

 

https://www.rail-online.co.uk/p148015493/h2E12AE0#h2e12ae0

Edited October 18, 2018 by rembrow

[Ian Hargrave]

Ian, the attached link from 'Rail - Online' is captioned as 10201 and 10202 double heading the Royal Scot at Crewe on an unknown date in 1958.

 

https://www.rail-online.co.uk/p148015493/h2E12AE0#h2e12ae0

Excellent.Thank you for that.Wonder how long the period of working lasted ?

[dagrizz]

I remember seeing 10202 and 10000 double heading a train northwards along the TV line, at Bulkington. It would have been around 1962. Unfortunately I don't know the type of train, whether one or both locos were powered up or if they were working in multiple. I don't even remember which loco was leading. My excuse is that I was 7 years old. I've been waiting for a green 10202 to go with my Bachmann 10000. But, like Ian, I need the version with doors.

 

Graham   

[rembrow]

Excellent.Thank you for that.Wonder how long the period of working lasted ?

I have some doubt about the 1958 date being accurate and I suspect it is earlier, as magnifying the photo shows no connecting door on the front of the leading engine. As they transferred to the LM in 1955, the doors would have been fitted well before 1958. Does anyone have accurate info about when this modification took place?

I also suspect their use in double heading was limited, as a prototype class with a new power system for BR at the time, their maintenance and repair needed engineering support from English Electric, so individual engines spent times out of use awaiting parts.

Edited October 19, 2018 by rembrow

[cctransuk]

I remember seeing 10202 and 10000 double heading a train northwards along the TV line, at Bulkington. It would have been around 1962. Unfortunately I don't know the type of train, whether one or both locos were powered up or if they were working in multiple. I don't even remember which loco was leading. My excuse is that I was 7 years old. I've been waiting for a green 10202 to go with my Bachmann 10000. But, like Ian, I need the version with doors.

 

Graham   

 

Given that Kernow have the tooling for the end door version, and that many prospective purchasers will, like me, be stretching a point to justify running the Bulleid diesels at the end of their existence, I would have thought that it would be wise to produce the end door version next.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[The Stationmaster]

I have some doubt about the 1958 date being accurate and I suspect it is earlier, as magnifying the photo shows no connecting door on the front of the leading engine. As they transferred to the LM in 1955, the doors would have been fitted well before 1958. Does anyone have accurate info about when this modification took place?

I also suspect their use in double heading was limited, as a prototype class with a new power system for BR at the time, their maintenance and repair needed engineering support from English Electric, so individual engines spent times out of use awaiting parts.

 

Not too long before 1958 as there are photos of them in green with the second emblem and no gangway doors - and the second emblem was introduced in early 1957.

[Ian Hargrave]

I have some doubt about the 1958 date being accurate and I suspect it is earlier, as magnifying the photo shows no connecting door on the front of the leading engine. As they transferred to the LM in 1955, the doors would have been fitted well before 1958. Does anyone have accurate info about when this modification took place?

I also suspect their use in double heading was limited, as a prototype class with a new power system for BR at the time, their maintenance and repair needed engineering support from English Electric, so individual engines spent times out of use awaiting parts.

I believe summer 1957 to be the correct date .All five LMR diesels worked the Scot,the 'twins' for their final appearance in multiple .All bedecked in BR green.The question of the use of interconnecting doors is unclear.From a personal recollection,the only time I observed the facility in use was with the Metrovicks CoBos on St.Pancras-Manchester turns and with the first batch of NBL hydraulics type2 at Plymouth North Road

These date to 1959.

[peteskitchen]

I believe summer 1957 to be the correct date .All five LMR diesels worked the Scot,the 'twins' for their final appearance in multiple .All bedecked in BR green.The question of the use of interconnecting doors is unclear.From a personal recollection,the only time I observed the facility in use was with the Metrovicks CoBos on St.Pancras-Manchester turns and with the first batch of NBL hydraulics type2 at Plymouth North Road

These date to 1959.

 There's a picture of a pair of 22s in the late 60s running with doors connected, I think the caption said that it was the last known recorded event of this happening. They might have even been in BR blue livery but I don't remember for sure. I don't think I've ever seen a picture of anything other than co-bos, 21s and 22s using the connecting doors.

[JSpencer]

Given that Kernow have the tooling for the end door version, and that many prospective purchasers will, like me, be stretching a point to justify running the Bulleid diesels at the end of their existence, I would have thought that it would be wise to produce the end door version next.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

Maybe it is organizing production of the two different types at same time that makes it difficult (you might end up with end doors on the black ones as well as they try to keep assembly the same).