Manchester Victoria carriage sidings at Red Bank and Newtown

[GordonC]

There used to be 2 areas near Manchester Victoria station where there was carriage sidings. One on the loop line at Red Bank where the vans for the newspaper trains were stored between nightly duties and I've seen pictures of DMUs stabled there too (Class 104s and 108s mainly).

 

But there was also Newtown carriage sidings a short distance up Miles Platting bank just before Rochdale Road. Was Newtown used for any particular purpose? Why was there 2 sets of Carriage Sidings for Manchester Victoria?

[Jim76]

Purely due to the sheer number services requring hauled carriage and later DMU stock. Up until fairly recent times there was also Cheetham Hill and Queens Road sidings (now the Metrolink depot) both of which bordered Red Bank. I am aware there were once even more sidings some serving the adjacent Manchester Exchange station.

[Arthur]

 

Ordsall Lane carriage sidings served Manchester Exchange.

[GordonC]

ah I wasn't distinguishing between the different areas of sidings around Red Bank. Were they used for different things?

 

How were the carriage sidings used by the 1980s? Were they used to save platform space at Victoria for terminating trains to do the engine running round in the carriage sidings? Presumably there was still the newspaper vans gathering during the day until a nightly exodus and I assume stock was stored there between the morning and evening peaks. Would terminating trains often wait for long in the carriage sidings before returning as stock for another service?

 

Was stock cleaned in the carriage sidings - either internally or externally? Was there any fuelling facilities there for locos and or diesel units?

 

When did Newtown CS close?

[flapland]

I can't answer many questions but I can state the Newspaper Vans were never cleaned when I saw them returning most lunch times near Middleton Junction. I should know more about Red Bank as my dad worked down in the valley but I think I only visited him once at work so never really got that close. Trouble was we took it all for granted I suspect we didn't think it would ever close. I was certainly more interested in catching Deltics on the Liverpool Newcastle trains in their final years and if lucky and a quick dash behind one to Staylebridge or on a Saturday or Sunday perhaps a WCML 86/87 drag through the middle of the station.  

[Fairburn]

ah I wasn't distinguishing between the different areas of sidings around Red Bank. Were they used for different things?

 

How were the carriage sidings used by the 1980s? Were they used to save platform space at Victoria for terminating trains to do the engine running round in the carriage sidings? Presumably there was still the newspaper vans gathering during the day until a nightly exodus and I assume stock was stored there between the morning and evening peaks. Would terminating trains often wait for long in the carriage sidings before returning as stock for another service?

 

Was stock cleaned in the carriage sidings - either internally or externally? Was there any fuelling facilities there for locos and or diesel units?

 

When did Newtown CS close?

A few links to whet the appetite:

 

http://railwayherald.com/imagingcentre/view/156306/PL

 

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8311/8062932679_f1769245c5_b.jpg

 

https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7271/7783109836_646663547c.jpg

 

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3821/10983577946_25f08f8672.jpg

 

The last image with the DMU's stabled was, I think, Cheetham Hill sidings - as noted in an above post. I've seen photos of this with a covered shed in green DMU days.

 

And I've read elsewhere that one of the now in preservation jinty boilers was a stationary train heat boiler here.

 

On the whole, a fascinating area.

[Fairburn]

Pic from 1935 showing Cheetham Hill carriage shed (immediately above the Bury line viaduct) with a roof and also Red Bank with a roof ( immediately above the viaduct footbridge):

 

http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/image/epw048636

[Fairburn]

And Queens Road:

 

http://www.britainfromabove.org.uk/image/epw048631

[woodenhead]

Found these images from 1972 of Newtown sidings in use, you can see Red Bank in the background.

 

Taken from a road that no longer exists

 

 

 

As a challenge, might anyone know what this viaduct in Cheetham Hill/Crumpsall might be that is being demolished in the same year?

 

[jpendle]

A wild guess.

There appears to have been a mineral line that ran behind North Manchester General (Crumpsall) Hospital. It has a couple of overbridges according to the NLS map site.

 

Regards,

 

John P

[woodenhead]

Found this image from 1970 showing the rail bridge to Oldham Road Goods over the Miles Platting bank still in situ.

 

[woodenhead]

23 hours ago, jpendle said:

A wild guess.

There appears to have been a mineral line that ran behind North Manchester General (Crumpsall) Hospital. It has a couple of overbridges according to the NLS map site.

 

Regards,

 

John P

 

Thanks had a look for it on NLS maps tonight whilst also looking at this image of Openshaw including Gorton.

 

 

Whats interesting in this image are the buildings to the north of Gorton Tank - all rail served with a track out of Gorton over the Ashton Old Road, this tracks around the buildings with spans of sidings in Openshaw and meanders north till it reaches Philips Park where it ends alongside the LNW route from Park to Stalybridge, but seemingly was not connected nor was it a junction.

Edited September 2, 2021 by woodenhead

[65179]

10 hours ago, woodenhead said:

 

Thanks had a look for it on NLS maps tonight whilst also looking at this image of Openshaw including Gorton.

 

 

Whats interesting in this image are the buildings to the north of Gorton Tank - all rail served with a track out of Gorton over the Ashton Old Road, this tracks around the buildings with spans of sidings in Openshaw and meanders north till it reaches Philips Park where it ends alongside the LNW route from Park to Stalybridge, but seemingly was not connected nor was it a junction.

 

Try the 1:10560 scale OS map instead. This shows the Manchester Corporation Sidings as the end of the branch. The line was used by Manchester Corporation to move ash waste from Stuart Street Power Station ( the blank space on the 1:10560 map) to be dumped at Clayton Vale. Clayton Vale also became a more general municipal tip apparently.  1904 and 1907 are dates I've seen quoted for the line after a quick search for Manchester Corporation Sidings Clayton Vale. The line was subsequently extended as you can see on the map.

 

Simon

[65179]

A little more digging revealed this:

https://blog.mechanicallandscapes.com/2019/07/02/518-english-steel-and-manchester/

 

describing a late survivor, inlaid track once linking the two Armstrong-Whitworth works at the south end of the line Woodenhead identified, and shows maps illustrating how this in turn joined Ashburys sidings.

 

Here's an ESC shunter on its way to Ashburys crossing Ashton Old Road (Flickr image from billy_bottle): 

 

 

The southern Whitworth Street armament works became disused in the inter-war years while to the north of that the North Street Works later became part of the English Steel Corporation. The missing link on the branch is the line between North Street Works and Stuart Street Power Station. If Wikipedia is to be believed the branch was extended south from the powrr station to to the Clayton Aniline Co. site in 1916. Clayton Aniline was just across Clayton Lane from North Street Works.

 

Simon

 

[PenrithBeacon]

[PenrithBeacon]

The area around Crumpsall Hospital 1932

[woodenhead]

Which leads us to Martin Zero and how this area went from a green and pleasant area into an industrial zone

 

[johnd]

41 minutes ago, PenrithBeacon said:

The area around Crumpsall Hospital 1932

The branch to the  ICI chemical works where the local birds could be seen in a variety of colours !