Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 The Scene and Setting It’s late August and the sun bathes the lush countryside in warmth. Firebox weed blooms on the banks and in the fields, silage is being cut for winter feed. Smoke lazily drifts from the stone engine shed roof and on the platform the churns of fresh milk wait to be loaded on the morning train. A jolly tune carries from the bay road as a portly gent busy’s himself cleaning the windows of the old autocoach. This is the opening scene at Penstemon. Set somewhere in the heart of GWR Cornwall, the model will be a pastiche of the GWR in all of its chocolate box branchilne glory. Was this really how it was? Perhaps, but for my modelling aspirations it’s certainly how it will be at Penstemon. The Method Since beginning in model railways a couple of years back, for me one of the annoyances of the hobby has been the difficulty in obtaining what you need to create a model more true to the prototype. Making the transition from a toy to a model if you like. Should you wish to portray, as I do, a sweeping brush stroke of a time or place then it is very difficult to obtain all you need to do so. If you choose to be even more specific and offer an exact location at an exact time your challenge grows. Maybe you can get some of the stock you want RTR, perhaps there are some kits available and perhaps you have to scratch build but for a newcomer to the hobby, it’s not an easy road. In creating Penstemon my aim is to build a model using only RTP, available kits or scratch building using techniques which have been well documented in the railway media – by doing so I hope to create a model which any one viewing, if so inspired, can walk away and source what they need to build their own layout without trawling through ebay for months and paying a king’s ransom. In keeping with the ‘if I can do it, so can you’ mantra, the stock on the layout will be split. The 1930’s era will be the domain of my white metal and etched brass wagons, modified RTR or kit built engines and comet coaches – most not easily available (search Ebay for ABS, Fourmost or D&S and witness both scarcity and price) though I am happy to see Andrew at Wizard now producing Comet kits once more following the recent sad news. The big boys of the hobby seem focused in the main on the BR period, especially the transition between steam and diesel traction. To remain within my own imposed method, this era will be the second period for Penstemon and the one which I aim to initially show the layout when it’s completed. RTR (both out of the box and detailed/ modified) and kit built stock, where those kits are readily available (Coopercraft, Ratio etc). The Good, Bad and Ugly I have made a couple of attempts to build a layout prior to Penstemon. The first was a 6’ x 4’ traditional trainset where I realised almost instantly that this was not the way for me. The layout was donated to a local club who built on it for their ‘Thomas’ layout where it has been well received at their show. The second was a saga of error’s – as I learned more about the prototype and what aspects I liked, as I went to shows and looked at models which inspired me, my own layout morphed and morphed again. The results were some kind of Frankenstein’s Monster which bore no true resemblance to any of the things which it had tried to emulate as it grew. Another layout consigned to the bin. Penstemon will be attempt 3 and whilst I am sure I will continue to make more mistakes, I hope that with guidance from friends, my model club and the RMWeb community I can keep the mistakes to a minimum and enjoy building my slice of the GWR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Chambers Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Nice one Dale, it does look like you have studied the prototype and come up with a very convincing track plan.Look forward to the continuing saga! Perhaps you might ponder on finding a more definite location rather than "somewhere.in ......."-if a realistic timetable and traffic patterns are to be achieved, then "location" is vital IMHO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Nice looking plan. Just one point, my particular bête noir, is that coal bins were pretty rare in Cornwall, and I don't know of any that were positioned directly abutting the siding. I am also slightly concerned about the siting of the cattle dock, as they tended to be closer to the end of the siding. Access to the rest of the siding would have to wait until the cattle were moved, but I suppose it will depend upon the frequency of cattle movements if this would be a problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Looking very good to me Dale, I like the openness of the Plan and wish you well, I will be following with interest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Author Share Posted August 24, 2015 Thanks for the responses gentlemen, its all greatly appreciated. Nice looking plan. Just one point, my particular bête noir, is that coal bins were pretty rare in Cornwall, and I don't know of any that were positioned directly abutting the siding.I am also slightly concerned about the siting of the cattle dock, as they tended to be closer to the end of the siding. Access to the rest of the siding would have to wait until the cattle were moved, but I suppose it will depend upon the frequency of cattle movements if this would be a problem. I have to agree with you here Nick. I have poured over all four volumes of my GWR trackplan books and have not yet seen one terminus with coal bins as I have depicted on the track plan. As i understand things, a lugger would have taken tin or copper toward Wales and brought coal back on the return leg. That coal would be offloaded at a suitable quayside. I imagine from there it would be distributed locally by lorry or for points inland, by mineral wagons of the local factor? As penstemon is inland I have made the asumtion that domestic coal has been brought by rail fro the nearest coastal/river quayside. Is it the presence of the coal merchant in the yard scene that is not prototypical, or the use of coal bin's? The cattle dock was sighted as per Bodmin, a station which has been greatly inspirational in Penstemon. Original track plans tried to include the diverging branchlines but due to space constraint's, operationally I have to imagine that divergence is off scene - not ideal I grant you but I only have 15' of scenic length to play with. Movements will still be reflective of the Bodmin idea - down the branch can be found a couple of rural villages with associated halts/stations, a china clay quarry and terminating at a small coastal/river quayside and village (and coal factor's). This means traffic from the branch must arrive at Penstemon, run around and then depart toward the mainline. i honestly whish I could include the branch diverging on the plan but every time i have tried to add it, the layout looks contrived and squashed together. I take on board your comments Tim, about location yielding a more prototypical timetable. Through operating a friend's layout (Guisborough) and my own research, I have a basic understanding of what went where and at what time but I am weary of trapping myself into a constricting set of movements (and thus stock). I did give some serious thought to modelling a real prototype - the benefits are clear, but given the use of widely diverse building kit's alone and the method statement for the layout, Penstemon need's to remain a broad brush stroke - the flavour of a county, if such a thing can be done. A caveat to that would be my intention to entertain the public - and one aspect of that, for me at least, is in the suspension of disbelief. Our quaint rural town would see a limited number of trains per day but Joe Public likes to see plenty of diversity and action. That in part was what necessitated the back story for our branch line - it opens up interesting traffic movements. A plate wagon taking sheet metals to the marine yard for patching boats, perhaps a propeller for a fishing vessel, pit props in 5 plank opens for the mine... I know that a viewer well versed in the GWR will walk past Penstemon, perhaps raising an eyebrow - that goods shed was a XXX design and never seen in Cornwall, that signal box is too large/small for the number of levers at the station, and I have to accept that. I dont know enough myself to make a model to entertain that gent and had that been my intention I would be stepping outside of the method of the layout (too much scratch buildings etc), but I do want to entertain the less well informed, folks like myself who know a 45XX from a 4575. Off to cut up some timber now - time to make a start! D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 It's the provision of the coal bins/pens that is unlikely. There would probably be local coal merchants, possibly with a small office in the yard, but they would unload from the railway wagons straight onto the delivery cart, removing the need for storage, at least until the advent of the steel 16T wagons, which might take too long to unload without incurring some demurrage or siding charges. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Author Share Posted August 24, 2015 With the birch ply cut at my local timber merchants, work begins on the baseboards. I have already hit problems: a suitable flat surface! I put together three end board sections only to find a banana in them derived from the surface they were assembled on. Trying to find a perfectly flat surface is quite a challange, especially one big enough for baseboard assembly. Mr Wright made a suggestion at Pickering show yesterday of using a door. Norman S prowled around Tony's with a spirit level until a suitable door could be found but my darling wife would be less accommodating, even if any of my doors where found to be perfectly flat and true. before any more wood is wasted i have to find a suitable table top surface. Meanwhile the das has dried on my first attempt at foam board/das construction. Inspired by David Wright's modelling DVD's i thought it time to have a go myself. This cottage was built using 3mm foam board to a plan taken from the Wills Craftsman's range. Scribing will begin tonight at my club over tea and buscuits. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Great Western standard designs from the late 1890s, usually in red brick, could be anywhere on the system. There were other designs, however, that cropped up in disparate locations. Take the attractive stone buildings of William Clark. He was contracted on a number of lines including Abbotsbury, Dorset, the Kingsbridge Branch, Devon, and various lines around Shrewsbury and the Welsh borders. I don't know that he worked on a line in Cornwall, but he could have done so, which is all you need. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Author Share Posted August 24, 2015 Lovelly photo's Edwardian, many thanks for sharing them. My buildings list is as follows: Station and waiting room - Bachmann RTP Highley Station Signal box, cattle dock and goods shed - ratio plastic kit's Engine shed - Townstreet stone single road engine shed Water tower - Bachmann RTP from Kernow (St Ives) on pre-order Stables - to be scratch built Water Mill - possibly the Wills craftsman kit but I may scratch build this as its a significant non railway focal point Multi span Victorian girder bridge - i have started to scratch build this, pic's soon. Not sure at this stage how well it's going Farm - Townstreet once again Three area's remain in question. 1: At the front of the layout there is a large open area. At this time I plan to use this as livestock fields (possibly with some silage cutting going on to set the month too), setting the line in the scene as it were and giving more credence to the farm. but would a village scene be more interesting? Current thinking is to go with fields for now and see how the project develops. i can always bring in the bull dozers later. 2: At the back, especially to the middle and right, I think my trees and sloping road is a little stale. Could I use this space better? I want to avoid low relief buildings and softening the transition ot the back scene is a must. Jury's out on that one. 3: Finally the end of the layout around the station - no points for seeing the similarity with Bodmin here but is it right? There is some open space bottom right which I am thinking about a partial country pub built into the angle? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Author Share Posted August 24, 2015 Door from B&Q £24. Just need to get it home and I will have a flat surface to work on... Providing the door is flat to start with. Best check before I buy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 A very attractive station. Inherited, rather than a Great Western design, bit a lot of similar structures went up in the 1860s and 1870s across the national network, so it would be a harsh critic who would take issue with you. It's very tempting to model some local vernacular architecture, and the odd building to break the view of the passing trains might be an idea. On the other hand, the uncluttered spaciousness typical of rural termini where land was relatively cheap, might best be captured by open fields to the front. Field with a strategically placed barn? If Devon, a characteristic Linhay; Cornwall I'm not so familiar with. Front corner; a jubilee (1887 or 1897) clock tower around which local pedestrians and traffic can circulate? Background structure? I have often though about using this, a prototype built up a pretty steep bank: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 Great Western standard designs from the late 1890s, usually in red brick, could be anywhere on the system. There were other designs, however, that cropped up in disparate locations. Take the attractive stone buildings of William Clark. He was contracted on a number of lines including Abbotsbury, Dorset, the Kingsbridge Branch, Devon, and various lines around Shrewsbury and the Welsh borders. I don't know that he worked on a line in Cornwall, but he could have done so, which is all you need. That's where the inspiration for my Trebudoc Station Building came from, and that's set in Cornwall. Re the Coal Bin's, my Trebudoc was in Hornby Mag a couple of Months ago, and somebody wrote in to say that my Coal Bins were in the wrong place and should not be back against the Rails, I have since found evidence of several that were back against the Rails, especially with 16T Minerals unloading. Do what you see around and like the Cattle Dock, that IS how it was at Bodmin. All the best and Enjoy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 24, 2015 Author Share Posted August 24, 2015 Re the Coal Bin's, my Trebudoc was in Hornby Mag a couple of Months ago, and somebody wrote in to say that my Coal Bins were in the wrong place and should not be back against the Rails, I have since found evidence of several that were back against the Rails, especially with 16T Minerals unloading. Do what you see around and like the Cattle Dock, that IS how it was at Bodmin. Thanks Andy, Due to the split era aspect of the layout, I have to er on the side of the 30's practice. Its conceivable that practices may not have advanced too fast at some sleepy liitle BLT like Penstemon but going backward in time isnt an option. There were no 16t mineral's in the early era setting so i need to present practice as it was then. I am now thinking of a coal pile next to the hut with a couple of lad's filling sack's up from the pile. The cameo needs to be suitable for three scenes: no wagon, full wagon and empty wagon, so the pile and workers seems fitting. For those searching for a flat surface, Tony W was bang on yesterday - my new (and cheap) door is nice and flat. "proper job!" Off to the club tonight but hope to get back onto baseboards again tomorrow and this time they will be flat, straight and true.... maybe Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westerner Posted August 24, 2015 Share Posted August 24, 2015 It was good to chat to you at Pickering and I'm pleased to see that you have started a layout thread. I'm too tired to add anything more relevant at the moment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 That's where the inspiration for my Trebudoc Station Building came from, and that's set in Cornwall. Re the Coal Bin's, my Trebudoc was in Hornby Mag a couple of Months ago, and somebody wrote in to say that my Coal Bins were in the wrong place and should not be back against the Rails, I have since found evidence of several that were back against the Rails, especially with 16T Minerals unloading. Do what you see around and like the Cattle Dock, that IS how it was at Bodmin. All the best and Enjoy. As it was probably my letter in the mag, I would like to know where I might find examples of West Country coal pens with their backs against the tracks, so I can amend my theory accordingly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 As it was probably my letter in the mag, I would like to know where I might find examples of West Country coal pens with their backs against the tracks, so I can amend my theory accordingly. Hi Nick, Your probably right about Cornwall, I cant be sure, but you did state they never happened but I have found many examples of them backed against the tracks, but I will let it rest as this is not the place to discuss it. Your letter was not taken the wrong way by me, as I have learned from it, but it did happen, but maybe just not as often as I thought. All the best. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Holliday Posted August 25, 2015 Share Posted August 25, 2015 Hi Nick, Your probably right about Cornwall, I cant be sure, but you did state they never happened but I have found many examples of them backed against the tracks, but I will let it rest as this is not the place to discuss it. Your letter was not taken the wrong way by me, as I have learned from it, but it did happen, but maybe just not as often as I thought. All the best. AndyI think that must have been another letter, not mine. I know just enough about the real railways not to use the word "never"! I think the next month they published my response which developed the theme, which has been covered elsewhere in various threads on this forum. As an LBSCR enthusiast I am well aware of examples of bins by the tracks from pregrouping days, but there is little evidence of that precise scenario away from the SE of England. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 25, 2015 Author Share Posted August 25, 2015 Tonight's update has baseboard construction underway at last. The initial problems of a flat surface have been overcome with my nice new door. A quick trip to Screwfix filled up my screw bucket and I even grabbed a massive RUB from B&Q which was supposed to be for storing Christmas tree's in. For me it will be a dipping trough to be filled with Ronseal Rich Oak Fence Coat. Monday night's visit to the club allowed me a little time to have a stab at scribing in DAS. OK, it's not David Wright but I dont think it looks too bad for a first attempt... I am not sure what has happened to the left hand side but i think there is a bit which may be re-DAS'ed and scribed again. I can only assume that was later in the evening when my mind was drifting toward Cider and not modelling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 Having woken at the ungodly hour of 5:30 this morning, I used the quiet time to make a few changes to the plan. I have included the memorial as a trial fit - your thoughts gentlemen. I have also changed the platform/dock area and think this new arrangement looks a bit more natural. I have also binned the coal bins but with the new yard entrance (including foot paths) I cannot now find space for the stables building. This has to find a home somewhere as it is one of those railway buildings which, IMHO, would have been there in the 1030's, if even now in use as a garage for the delivery truck. D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew P Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 I like the idea of the Marmoreal and if the Road could the eye down the Street around the back of the Buffers that would be good. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ELTEL Posted August 26, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 26, 2015 Looks this layout is going to be one to watch. One point regarding flat surfaces to work on. Having had the same problem it was suggested to me a kitchen worktop off cut Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Posted August 26, 2015 Author Share Posted August 26, 2015 Looks this layout is going to be one to watch. One point regarding flat surfaces to work on. Having had the same problem it was suggested to me a kitchen worktop off cut Terry LOL, i had the very same idea. I built a bench many moons ago for my pray booth to sit on, keeping my painting area separate from my other bench. The top was an old kitchen worktop. I cleared all my junk off it only to discover that over time, it had bowed a little. only 3mm in the middle but enough to put everything out once more. Its this very bench that my nice new door is sat on Andy, i thought about doing some kind of building in that corner. Replace the memorial with a timber framed ye olde coaching house/inn on an angle? it would be a view blocker people would have to look around but i think It would look both out of place physically, and with the requirement to lop bits off to fit the angle, it would be a difficult build. At the moment I am leaning toward the memorial but remain open to suggestions... D. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium ELTEL Posted August 26, 2015 RMweb Premium Share Posted August 26, 2015 Yes I suppose they stay flat in a kitchen as they screwed down to the kitchen units which will help to stop it warping. Terry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jwealleans Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 That track plan is almost identical to Uppingham, which I've contemplated copying many times. One thing you might consider which is useful on that layout is that the goods shed doesn't extend over the tracks so a loco can run past. There's then a crossover much close to where your milk dock is so you can draw a goods train in and run round without having to use the platform road. I shall be watching. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gismorail Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 Looking like another interesting project in the making and yet another railway modeller constructing a layout in a cluttered room / garage .....what are we like as a breed just love it all....will follow with great interest best of luck Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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