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Buckingham West


Richard Mawer
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Take a line from the corner of the room, across the level crossing as far as a point above the main loops, in a gradually falling gradient.

 

This is the original route of the road. From this point it then swings to its right, curving across the incline tracks and then more steeply downwards. It should leave the baseboard beyond the edge of the lifting bridge.

 

The road will need to leave the straight line to dog-leg over the level crossing.

 

This road line should then give you a substantial hill, with two double track entrances buried in cuttings.

 

Possibly.

 

The corner of the room is where the mic stand is resting. This idea would indeed make a much bigger hill and I could argue for a couple of tunnels. I didn't really want to lose such a large area from sight though. But thanks, it is all food for thought.

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Looking at the photos, it appears to me that the road surface at the centre of the level crossing is at the same height as the top of the pillar, but slopes down towards the front (and back) of the layout. If this could be levelled off, it should avoid having to slope the first bridge back up again.

 

With regards to the alignment of the road itself, in an ideal world, I would say the crossing should ideally be a couple of inches to the left to avoid a dogleg in the road. But assuming that moving the crossing is not an option, there are a couple of other ways round it:

 

1) As well as having a road on the intended course, a second road carrying straight on to the front of the baseboard over both lines would convert the dogleg to a T junction.

 

2) Alternatively, would you be able to bring the road *in front of* the bracket, at a lower height, thus making the top part of the bracket into the bridge parapet/an adjoining wall, though you would still have to find a way of hiding the pillar.

 

The level crossing is about an inch and half lower than the top of the hinge pillar. The crossing could be leveled easily, but it would be hard to relocate due to signalling. I like the idea of the road coming in front of the pillar at a lower level, falling from the level crossing instead of climbing towards the top of the pillar. I guess that could be a hillock or a building. Thanks.

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What about one step back and imagine which the topography would have been before the advent of the railway.

Then drive the track through the countryside working out cuttings, tunnels, levels etc.

Looking at the two pictures, how far to the right can you go in order to blend it in with that area as well.

Any chance of some pictures to the right?

 

Hi Kevin

 

I have sort of done this. This area needs to be one of general higher ground, the branch will be at roughly the level of the ground, so the two double tracks are in cuttings. To the left the branch runs into Brackley Road station which is on the level (but high in the model). To the right, the branch gently drops down grade to middle level, the main lines in the centre stay on the low level and the incline closest to the camera rises up from low to middle. So the basic scenery shape along there is a central cutting, but a stream passes at roughly right angles below all three formations about midway along. There will be a diagonal slight rise on the overall (before railway) topography so that the cuttings and embankment have a slight change of angle.

 

Its this high ground in the corner with the level crossing on the top which is leading to the requirement for two bridges in cuttings over the double tracks.

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I am very grateful for the comments and help guys.

 

I think I will work on the road falling down grade from the level crossing, around the front of the hinge pillar (rather than rising to go over the top). That will allow a lower bridge over the mainlines. I would still prefer masonry and will try some mock ups of something like:-

 

post-15300-0-22722300-1523277465_thumb.jpg

 

If that doesn't look right, I will go for brick abutments and steel plate girders.

 

The road can continue downgrade to the left and I can use a skewed bridge in front of the hardboard strengthener/bracket. The hardboard will project above it, but if I paint that sky blue I might get away with it. I can put the other bridge portal wall on the other side of it.

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Hi Richard..

 

You've been added to my follow list :) I've had a quick scroll through the last few pages and I'm very impressed! This is a very smart layout and in the right era and colour :)

 

I'll be catching up on all your videos shortly.

 

Cheers,

 

Scott.

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Hi Richard..

 

You've been added to my follow list :) I've had a quick scroll through the last few pages and I'm very impressed! This is a very smart layout and in the right era and colour :)

 

I'll be catching up on all your videos shortly.

 

Cheers,

 

Scott.

 

Thanks Scott.

 

Its got a long way to go on the scenic side, but it is up and fully running as an operational thing. And that's what this layout is about :- Timetable, Fast clock, Bell codes, Loco rosters, shunting to a system. We have some very enjoyable evenings. It works with up to 4 operators, but 3 is best. But I can also operate it on my own. Unlike DCC where the operator is principally the driver, on this layout the operators are principally signalmen.

 

I'm supposedly getting the miles of ballast down and finishing the backscenes, but I keep getting distracted.

 

Thanks for the kind words and for the interest.

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I've been back to the scene of the crime. My decision (#530 above) will not work as simply as I would like.

 

Following Kevin's advice the topography pre-railway would have been gently falling ground from the level of the Branch towards the inside of the curves. So there is no way the road would have risen to go over a bridge. So I am happy that the road has to come in front of the wooden post, not over it.

 

The mainlines (in the centre) are about an inch above those of the incline (double track to the left), but there is not much space between the two sets of lines. So the bridge over the mainline will still need to be tall or else the one over the incline will be too low to allow trains to pass. There is not enough space or any reason for the road to increase in height to go over the incline.

 

So I have two options of structures 1) a 2 or 3 arch viaduct type of structure to go over the mainline and the incline with the road at the same level or 2) two different bridges.

 

I f I choose a viaduct it will need to be straight and so could A) be in roughly a straight line from the level crossing and pass over the tracks at more of a right angle or B) have a bend in the road before the viaduct so it passed over the main line at a skew and the incline at a much greater skew.

 

The trouble with A) is that the viaduct would then be a long way forward of the hardboard bracket bridging the incline tracks and the wooden post and hinge. What do I do with those?

 

B) Would be better and I could set the viaduct against the hardboard using it as small backscene. I still have the wooden post sticking out higher than, and next to, the viaduct. So I still need to hide that somehow. I have no idea how.

 

All of that is assuming I can get the arches to look right and fit width-wise over the two different angles.

 

Going back to the idea of two bridges (so I can have different arch widths to accommodate the different angles of skew) I have a problem of what will link them. There is only a small shallow bank between the 2 sets of tracks. I guess it will have to be a short distance of brick/stonework to the height of the bridges over the slightly rising ground. At least I can set the bridge over the incline next to the hardboard.

 

Any ideas what I can disguise the wooden pillar as? It will be right next to the road and towering above it, but in the middle of the countryside.

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The pillar, the usual suspects would be, a chimney or a tree. What about some sort of farm structure around it? It's difficult to imagine until you start mocking it up. It's at this stage I get the old cereal boxes out and start to see how things would hang together.

 

I've this round the corner from me..

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilder%27s_Folly

 

You could build a random tower that drops over it.

 

(edited to add the folly link)

Edited by sjrixon
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The pillar, the usual suspects would be, a chimney or a tree. What about some sort of farm structure around it? It's difficult to imagine until you start mocking it up. It's at this stage I get the old cereal boxes out and start to see how things would hang together.

 

I've this round the corner from me..

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilder%27s_Folly

 

You could build a random tower that drops over it.

 

(edited to add the folly link)

 

Now there's a good idea! Thanks.

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WHAT A BANKER

 

I blame Daniel Riddoch. Some time ago, during an operating session, a couple of the heavier up goods trains got into trouble towards the top of the incline from Charlton Junction to Evenley near the S bends. Daniel said “You need a banker”. We laughed and gently pushed the locos up the final few inches.

 

post-15300-0-34173500-1523738936_thumb.jpeg

The incline and S bends.

 

 

Since then I was quite happy to give the heavier trains more power at the foot of the incline and “rush” the bank. But sometimes they still stalled at times and needed the hand of God. So I decided to sort out a banker.

 

There is an isolating break half way up the incline, just beyond the distant signal. Once the train is beyond that point, the control of the Charlton Junction section can be changed. In theory another loco can be separately controlled and run up to the rear of the train and push, just as long as the loco does not run past the isolating joint. By that point the train loco would be way past trouble. The only problem was where this loco would come from? There is no room on the visible section at the base of the incline.

 

I installed a point inside Banbury tunnel and a short spur. An old pannier (without a front coupling) sits on it. There is a new control panel with a Bachmann controller I had lying around and just 1 switch. Operating that, changes the point and frog polarity. It also changes the control of Charlton Junction to this controller.

 

post-15300-0-84750300-1523739121_thumb.jpeg

 

post-15300-0-35100000-1523739148_thumb.jpeg

 

post-15300-0-94171600-1523739223_thumb.jpeg

 

 

 

You can then bring the pannier out the tunnel, reverse it back over the junctions and send up the incline to assist.

 

post-15300-0-53762500-1523739428_thumb.jpeg

 

 

 

Upon its return into the hidden spur there is a diode over a isolating break which means it auto stops. The switch can be put back to normal.

 

post-15300-0-69932500-1523739499_thumb.jpeg

 

Just another bit of operational interest. And an operation I have not seen on any other layout - unless you know different.

Edited by Richard Mawer
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BACK TO THE BRIDGES

 

After the distraction of the banker it was back to the bridges and level crossing. The cereal packets have been out.

 

I’ve decided to make the bridge over the incline (left) a girder bridge. It has to be very wide because of the angle of the skew.

 

The other bridge (right) is over the mainline which has a lower track level. This, together with the height of the road from the level crossing (coming down to the girder bridge level) has made it into an odd shaped structure like the one I found on the internet. I found a few photos of real sloping bridges too. After a lot of trial and error with pen and then scissors I think it looks ok.

 

Th hardboard bracket above the girder will be painted as sky above the abutment of the bridge on the left will run into the edging of the board.

 

I am still struggling to decide what to do with the wooden post. But its an improvement. Now to cpnstruct from foam board and card.

 

post-15300-0-86950900-1523778428_thumb.jpeg

 

post-15300-0-30074600-1523778456_thumb.jpeg

 

post-15300-0-28031600-1523778474_thumb.jpeg

 

post-15300-0-74111800-1523778494_thumb.jpeg

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Can you make the arch on the right a shallower curve? This would give more depth to the roadway over the keystone area. The bridge probably doesn't have the parapets added, which will help with the 'solidness'.

 

Similarly, once the road bed and supporting beams are added to the girder bridge, the girders themselves look a little 'thin' - imagine how high (shoulder height?) they would appear to a pedestrian.

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Can you make the arch on the right a shallower curve? This would give more depth to the roadway over the keystone area. The bridge probably doesn't have the parapets added, which will help with the 'solidness'.

Similarly, once the road bed and supporting beams are added to the girder bridge, the girders themselves look a little 'thin' - imagine how high (shoulder height?) they would appear to a pedestrian.

Thanks for the advice. I have already added 4’ high parapet walls on the right hand bridge, so I will lower the arch by using a larger diameter curve.

 

The girders are going to be the preformed peco ones. I have them already. I simply drew round them.

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Just a thought with a very quick rough sketch.

Might not work but might give you other ideas

The hinged bit will take some thinking about but you will be able to use a straight line to extend the hinged joint out to the profile board..!

 

post-8925-0-24037400-1523781299.jpg

 

Light blue is a profile board - with possible access holes if needed

Green  - with arrows is the ground sloping down, scenery can hide a lot here

Black - road sloping down gently to profile board

Green - lines close together an embankment/cutting to a length that suits.

 

Two brick tunnel portals to one side.

 

Perspective a bit out but I'm sure you get the idea.....

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Just a thought with a very quick rough sketch.

Might not work but might give you other ideas

The hinged bit will take some thinking about but you will be able to use a straight line to extend the hinged joint out to the profile board..!

 

attachicon.gifP1.jpg

 

Light blue is a profile board - with possible access holes if needed

Green  - with arrows is the ground sloping down, scenery can hide a lot here

Black - road sloping down gently to profile board

Green - lines close together an embankment/cutting to a length that suits.

 

Two brick tunnel portals to one side.

 

Perspective a bit out but I'm sure you get the idea.....

Thanks Kevin. Its all good stuff. The photo/drawing works well. This idea has been suggested before too. I think it would work but I don’t want to loose quite so large an area from view. I would have treat the other side in a similar way as well.

 

What is missing from my photos is the cutting sides to the bridges, which changes the look too.

 

I’ll give this serious consideration though.

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Rich

 

We added a "branch" line around the outside of the club's O gauge layout some while ago. This incorporated a small station that had to be higher than the original part of the railway to enable the operator to couple/uncouple stock in the yard. The incline up to the station started at the end of a curve. As a result some of the locos struggled with the incline, often finding it difficult to get off the curve and onto the incline.

 

We decided that we'd need a banking engine so we added the necessary point and short siding on the outside of the curve.

 

The layout is DCC controlled so we were able to all but automate the operation of the banking engine by flicking a single switch to start the cycle.

 

However, we added a bit of a cant to the outside of the track around the curve where the new point was put. As a result we've now found that most trains can get around the curve and onto the incline without the need for a banker!

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Good Evening Rich

I have been following your problem for some time.  I am a great believer in trial fittings.
 

.The cereal packets have been out.


I am also a great believer in nice deep plate girders. Unlike brick and stone arches the sides do not need to be parallel and there could be all manner of construction and support 'off stage'.  However girders are almost invariably horizontal so your sloping bridge will just have to be masonry.

 

The hinge - it looks like a corn mill / animal feed mill - in fact any 1930s factory.  Might it be made wrap around and detachable / lift off when you need to lift the flap?

 

I shall continue watching with interest.

 

Regards

 

Ray

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