Bachmann announce Class 117 and Class 121 at Collectors Club event

[SDJR7F88]

A running session feature the all new British Rail Class 117 DMU from Bachmann, in smart British Rail Green with Speed Whiskers, edited with Real Sound.
Sounds are provided by a number of fellow class members from my sound collection, captured at various Gala and Preserved Railways over the past few years.
Hope you enjoy!

 

[Grampus]

Evening everyone,

 

 this may be (probably) a daft question, but I wonder if I may have a problem with my  nice new 117? I have just unpacked the unit to check it out on my rolling road and, whilst the DMBS runs very sweetly indeed and lights up as expected, the DMS is as dead as the proverbial door nail: no lights, no movement; not even the hum of a stuck motor.  Am I missing something obvious?  Does the DMS need to be connected to the other vehicles electrically in order for it to run?  Or do I have a Friday afternoon example?  Very grateful in advance for any advice, please.  Many thanks, 

 

Paul

[Zunnan]

It needs to be coupled to the DMBS in order to work in any way shape or form. You can omit the TCL and run it as a 2 car without issue though but the DMS needs that connection to the PCB located in the DMBS in order to do anything.

[Grampus]

Zunnan,

 

thank you very much.  That puts my mind at rest somewhat.  I did wonder whether it might be something like that: the perils of being able to put the railway up for a running session only rarely at the moment, I guess.  Such a lovely model but a whole different level of complexity when compared to the last 117 I bought, back in the day!  Thanks again. 

 

Best wishes,

 

Paul

[Class 158 productions]

Few months of ownership of a 117, I caved and got a 121, fabulous models. As the months have gone by, has anyone had any issues with the speedometer cable, just wondering for longevity and if replacements could be sourced if a problem occurred. It’s a small feature, but looks very nice, especially as it’s pre fitted given most other ones are in the detail bag, cheers.

[robertcwp]

1 hour ago, Class 158 productions said:

Few months of ownership of a 117, I caved and got a 121, fabulous models. As the months have gone by, has anyone had any issues with the speedometer cable, just wondering for longevity and if replacements could be sourced if a problem occurred. It’s a small feature, but looks very nice, especially as it’s pre fitted given most other ones are in the detail bag, cheers.

I managed to break one of mine when removing a bogie to cut off the coupling box as it gets in the way of the bufferbeam details. I was aware I needed to remove one end of cable but it snapped when I tried to do so. All the others came out OK.

[acg5324]

Has anyone found an issue with the lighting functions on a DCC fitted class 121? With all the DIP switches on the underside set to on only one of the advertised lighting functions works as advertised. I can get all the functions to work but with F0 to F7 not F0 to F6 and on different function buttons to those in the instructions. Bachmann 22pin chip fitted and Gaugemaster Prodigy being used.

[Rich Papper]

Mine is the same. Bachmann chip and NCE Powercab. Everything works somewhere on F0 to F7 but not as per list. A case of 'I'm playing all the right notes, but not necessarily in the right order'. Don't mind too much though, some of my own installations are a bit like that.

Rich

[meatloaf]

My Blue/Grey 121 arrived today from TMC along with the Bachmann decoder.

 

When the postman handed me the box i thought it was empty it was really light.

 

Unplacked it and fitted the chip. Body removal was fairly easy. Runs great despite it being a bit of a lightwieght. Much lighter than my Dapol version

 

 

[meatloaf]

The 121, does it have a speaker prefitted?

[Kaput]

On 24/02/2021 at 21:45, meatloaf said:

The 121, does it have a speaker prefitted?

 

Yes

[meatloaf]

2 hours ago, Kaput said:

 

Yes

Cheers ive already got the blue / grey fitted with a Bachmann decoder.

 

I want a sound one now there out and my local shops offered to allow me to trade in my existing model, or split the sound chip out of one of the models. 

 

So ill see whats cheaper.

[adb968008]

comparison of Dapol and Bachmann 121...

 

 

in summary..

 

if you asked two different companies to make a model of the same train, to the same level of detail, undoubtably this is the result you would get.

looks..

 

There is precious little between them, when it comes to detail.

They both have detailed glazing, fittings, exhausts, lamp irons, underframes, roof vents, cab interiors... so if looks is all that matters, they are twins.

 

turn it upside, it starts to differentiate...

Dapol has a good rendition of the motor drive shaft, Bachmann has a working drive shaft.. though at expense of a bit of fictional space to hold the motor.

Bachmann has the speedo on the frame to bogie.

 

Dapol has several gears between the wheels, Bachmann has a trickledown gears...more on this later.

 

Bachmann has its bearing style pickups, Dapol has wipers..more on this later too.

 

how about inside..

 

this is where they differentiate, both have a raised floor, thus reducing the seat depthto compensate for power beneath them. Dapols lighting is driven by a roof mounted circuit board, Bachmanns has a frame mounted lighting board, screwed onto the seats..  

 

Getting to the Bachmann drive mechanism, isnt for the faint hearted, it takes 10 screws and 1 pin connector to get there, but its worth seeing a vital difference... the DCC chip... the instructions arent obvious on both the screws and the clips holding Bachmanns in..

 

now onto the motors..

 

Dapols is a hidden monster, it twin drives both bogies, and has oodles of power

Bachmanns is a visible minion.. its tiny, drives 1 bogie and its going for broke when it runs.

The Dapol frame is metal.

The Bachmann frame is plastic, with traditional (yet more ) screws holding weights in.

 

 

so how about the lights...

 

Lights off this is how the go..

 

Dapols has some light bleed through the body, end lighting of the destination blinds looks great...

Dapols blind illuminates very well, and looks more screen flush.

 

Bachmanns has less, but some,light bleed..

 

 

the destination blinds illuminate is a very prototypical way.

 

of note, on my Bachmann model the blinds illuminate both directions, but I note a discrete switch that looks to control it, on the chassis side, but requires body removal to slide it.

 

so how about stats...

 

Bachmann motor peaks at 0.1amp

Dapol motor peaks at 0.3amp.

Bachmanns speed is more than double Dapols speed.

 

Weight

Bachmann 188g

Dapol  377g

 

So why does a bigger motor, heavier chassis draw more power to move itself and ultimately strains at a higher speed..?

 

I suspect the answer lies in Bachmanns approach.. the single drive shaft, with trickle down gears, rather than twin drive with gears running along the bogie frame.

By removing 1 shaft, from the Dapol model, the motor speed doubles, the consumption halves, it isnt as fast as the Bachmann model, but it is very acceptable.

I think Bachmanns use of axle bearing cups doubling as pickups reduces friction marginally too, and improves pickup.

Both models pair well on detail, paint finish.

Dapols is let down by a motor/gearing that needs attention to get its best and I worry it could burn out in the future by strain.

Bachmanns is let down by a very small motor, which I don't know if it will stand the test of time either.

myself, 

Dapol: GW150, Green, Blue/Grey, NSE and Midline

Bachmann: NSE, Blue Grey

 

if I were to buy more:

Dapol at c£79-99 you cannot go wrong for the price.
Bachmann, c£120 it edges Dapol solely down to performance, but I am unsure longevity of the motor... I would buy both, there is little in it, though I did like the visible shaft and speedo on Bachmann too.

 

finally can I body swap. no.. right back to my opening line, they are Coke and Pepsi, very similar but completely different development paths.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 26, 2021 by adb968008

[meatloaf]

Has anyone got a video of the factory fitted sound 121 models? Looked on youtube but cant see anything

 

[meatloaf]

Picked a green sound fitted 121 up from trident trains today and the sound is really good. Its a zimo decoder also. 28 functions but the instructions dont say whose sound file is used. The supplied speaker sounds pretty good and the volume is fine. Im hard of hearing and i can hear it perfectly well.

[Danemouth]

Just now, meatloaf said:

Picked a green sound fitted 121 up from trident trains today and the sound is really good. Its a zimo decoder also. 28 functions but the instructions dont say whose sound file is used. The supplied speaker sounds pretty good and the volume is fine. Im hard of hearing and i can hear it perfectly well.

 

Does the sound work properly when run as a 2 car unit please? i.e. leave the centre car out. I would like this DMU but the fiddleyard only takes a two car unit.

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

[meatloaf]

3 minutes ago, Danemouth said:

 

Does the sound work properly when run as a 2 car unit please? i.e. leave the centre car out. I would like this DMU but the fiddleyard only takes a two car unit.

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

Not sure mate i got the 121 the single car unit.

[89A]

41 minutes ago, Danemouth said:

 

Does the sound work properly when run as a 2 car unit please? i.e. leave the centre car out. I would like this DMU but the fiddleyard only takes a two car unit.

 

Thanks,

 

Dave

Yes

Works fine as a 2 car unit. There could be a good market for the centre car on ebay.

Mark

[andyman7]

6 minutes ago, 89A said:

Yes

Works fine as a 2 car unit. There could be a good market for the centre car on ebay.

Mark

The ones that have turned up on ebay have fetched good money

[adb968008]

3 hours ago, andyman7 said:

The ones that have turned up on ebay have fetched good money

What are they useful for ?

[andyman7]

I've not been buying, but the interchangeability of first generation DMUs means all sorts of uses either as parts to adapt or as an 'odd' trailer. Obviously couplings needs adapting.

[89A]

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

What are they useful for ?

Potential to model class 115 Marylebone 4 car unit with modified body sides?

[Rich Papper]

9 hours ago, 89A said:

Potential to model class 115 Marylebone 4 car unit with modified body sides?

 

I would if I hadn't already with Lima bits. Biggest temptation for me would be a class 121 DTS. Would need the body from the DMS of the 117 (the end without the guards bit) and the chassis from the TCL (centre coach). And a bit of filler here and there.

[Gwiwer]

10 hours ago, 89A said:

Potential to model class 115 Marylebone 4 car unit with modified body sides?

Potential, yes, but it does depend upon how much you are willing to take a knife to a £400 unit.

[BR Blue]

Just got a blue grey one to go with my Kernow GWR liveried one. Absolutely excellent model and in my opinion Bachmann's best 1st generation DMU to date. Bachmann you have my permission to proceed with the 116