Dapol 08

[Hal Nail]

I don't want to complain but the 7mm drivers left testicle is too large, it is at least 50% overscale...

 

 

Someone will post supporting evidence in a sec...

[bazjones1711]

[YesTor]

"Bargain basement rate" was in the context of you wanting your cake and eat it (waiting for a perfect one before buying), not in the context of how much extra, or not, it costs to get the correct colour on the thing!!!

 

Come on please, if you've got an answer for my statement, please deliver one in the same context?

 

 

Could you please let me know where I stated that please, I've had a look but it's eluding me at the moment?

 

 

Apologies, typo, I actually should have typed bazjones1711 as opposed to Jintyman.  I have edited previous my post accordingly.

 

As for making a point "in context", with all due respect, I feel that maybe you ought to review your own initial argument, in that your prognosis was based on me supposedly "wanting a perfect model at a bargain basement price", when in actual fact I have made no mention whatsoever anywhere in this thread with regard to wanting anything at any given price.  At no point have I stated whether I feel the price to be too high, too low, or otherwise.  My point was/is with the VERY BASIC matter of either painting a grille BLACK or YELLOW.  This kind of issue, as others have highlighted, comes down to basic errors in or lack of communication, failure to check samples etc, or someone somewhere effectively being 'half asleep on-the job'.  I fail to see any relevance to price, "bargain basement" or otherwise, within my argument.

Edited September 7, 2016 by YesTor

[YesTor]

I think that people underestimate the importance of Ernie's point and the difficulty in what you are suggesting. Let me give you a (very plausible) scenario:

 

- All livery diagrams are correct

- All samples are correct

- production model is incorrect

 

Now what happens? It is simple to say that the factory should correct it - of course in a normal business/legal relationship that should happen, but now try enforcing that in China. If you have good relations with the factory they may or may not own up to their mistake (and the loss of face - important culturally) - if they do then great the corrections are made. If they don't or the models have already shipped (because the production samples were correct) then it might be too late to change things...

 

There are steps in the process where things can be stopped and remedied but it isn't inconceivable to work out how things happen (my example is based on a real life situation which was fortunately rectified!).

 

We shouldn't underestimate the difficulty of production across continents.

 

Cheers, Mike

 

I appreciate that different businesses may operate differently, however at the end of the day Dapol is the customer in this scenario.  I too regularly manufacture goods overseas for my own business (alas not model railways); however if, as in your potential scenario above, the "production model is incorrect" then I have a simple remedy, and that is, I don't pay the invoice for the goods until myself, the customer, am satisfied with the final product! 

 

Additionally, and importantly, if I, as the customer quietly accept any errors delivered then in the longer run I do myself no favours, as in effect I have already relayed the unspoken message that I will effectively allow myself to be trampled on and accept any old tat that is delivered and not utter a word of complaint.

 

From my own experience and self-awareness, I readily admit that in my own line of business some may find my manner objectionable, and indeed it's fair to say that when my supplier/manufacturer makes a glaring mistake, believe me they will generally know about it!  Difficult to please you may say, however I stand by my point that I am the customer and I'm paying, so I expect the job done right.  No more, no less.  And in this scenario Dapol should indeed be doing the same, and if for some reason they feel they are unable to raise valid issues then maybe they are working with the wrong manufacturer...

 

Of course, we are drawing many assumptions from the above, as it may well likely be Dapol themselves that made the error by submitting incorrect drawings, livery spec or whatever; in which instance Dapol would have no grounds to argue.  Alas, I guess that is something we shall never know...

Edited September 7, 2016 by YesTor

[Revolution Mike]

Great then you have thousands of pounds worth of tooling stuck in a factory where you will have paid for a large chunk of the tooling (perhaps all of it) and you can't get any models produced because you haven't paid your bill. Even worse it might be multiple sets of tooling for different models that you can no longer access!

 

You are of course right in theory but good luck with that strategy in real life.

 

Cheers Mike

[Greenmodelmonkey]

I appreciate that different businesses may operate differently, however at the end of the day Dapol is the customer in this scenario.  I too regularly manufacture goods overseas for my own business (alas not model railways); however if, as in your potential scenario above, the "production model is incorrect" then I have a simple remedy, and that is, I don't pay the invoice for the goods until myself, the customer, am satisfied with the final product! 

 

Additionally, and importantly, if I, as the customer quietly accept any errors delivered then in the longer run I do myself no favours, as in effect I have already relayed the unspoken message that I will effectively allow myself to be trampled on and accept any old tat that is delivered and not utter a word of complaint.

 

From my own experience and self-awareness, I readily admit that in my own line of business some may find my manner objectionable, and indeed it's fair to say that when my supplier/manufacturer makes a glaring mistake, believe me they will generally know about it!  Difficult to please you may say, however I stand by my point that I am the customer and I'm paying, so I expect the job done right.  No more, no less.  And in this scenario Dapol should indeed be doing the same, and if for some reason they feel they are unable to raise valid issues then maybe they are working with the wrong manufacturer...

 

Of course, we are drawing many assumptions from the above, as it may well likely be Dapol themselves that made the error by submitting incorrect drawings, livery spec or whatever; in which instance Dapol would have no grounds to argue.  Alas, I guess that is something we shall never know...

Well said!!! Again there's been more than enough time to get this right... years in making, not just the last few days prior to release, it's a real shame really.

[Greenmodelmonkey]

Great then you have thousands of pounds worth of tooling stuck in a factory where you will have paid for a large chunk of the tooling (perhaps all of it) and you can't get any models produced because you haven't paid your bill. Even worse it might be multiple sets of tooling for different models that you can no longer access!

You are of course right in theory but good luck with that strategy in real life.

Cheers Mike

Then they should have worked with the suppliers more closely to ensure there were no issues at all stages including making sure livery details and variations were correct. Also in my own small way I'm doing the same thing by deciding not to purchase several locos that were on order until they are acceptable. Just don't want waste my money for something that is not visually correct and spoils the overall experince of ownership. If nothing changes in terms of retrospective modifications to correct the apparent anomalies then I will just walk away and use the money I am are that is more suatable to mey personal requirements and expectations. I was not interested in the forthcoming Heljen 05 but they they may end up getting my money as the appear to be acting in a much more professional and open arrangement. Nice to see they have produced a decorated pre production model early enough to unable change to be made if required.

[Jintyman]

 

 

 

 

Really this isn't about "wanting our cake and eating it"

 

so in short, my money is staying firmly in my pocket until they get the livery correct on this one too.  If that means waiting for a later edition then so be it.

 

Oh dear, maybe I should start from the begining for you..........

 

You responded to my comment about wanting cake and eating it,.Obviously you'd taken exception to that.You then went on to say that your money was staying firmly in your pocket until they get it right

 

After I'd responded you'd commented about how expensive was it to get it right, which was out of context to my comment.

I simply wanted a response of sorts within the context of the comment that I'd originally made, which wasn't forthcoming.

 

It was you that brought 'money' up, not me, see above.

 

My original statement was about 'having your cake and eating it', nothing to do with your money, just a comment about a seriously good bargain and quality detail, but with a couple of errors in the livery, and should we be moaning and groaning about something that, along with the Terrier is opening a door into 7mm for so many more people than there was before. Now that's in context with my original comment.

 

You might have a penchant for making things right  and not accepting any errors as you've stated in a later comment, and that is to be admired and respected.

But that again is not as easy to work in the real world, just as Revolution above states, and I think he is a manufacturer as well, and would be 'in the know' of the issues involved. 

 

Jinty

 

Edited to say:  Seems like we're going round in circles quite a lot, I've got much better things to be doing than feeding ego's, so I'm off to do some modelling instead, and to clean my brushes ready for my two Dapol 08's!!!!

 

Regards to all.

Edited September 8, 2016 by Jintyman

[Willy]

For all you gripers here there is an MMP kit for a class 08 for sale on the GOG website for £160. All you have to do is; join the GOG, buy the wheels and motor, build it and then paint it and I am certain it will be absolutely perfect. The paint will be perfect for which ever loco you choose at what ever time and don’t forget it would have had a different shade of blue depending on how long it had been out of shop, etc. because some of them faded rater badly. They will also have the electrical trunking in the correct place but you will have to be sure and see a photo of the rear of the cab on your chosen loco, at your chosen time, just in case someone in the electrical shop didn’t reroute the conduit because it was more convenient to do so at the time! Also, did you get a photo of both sides of your loco, just to make sure! Meanwhile, the pragmatic amongst us will either ignore the various ‘problems’ or get a paint brush, or a modelling knife, and set about them and have an excellent loco up and running in the time it will take you to read the kit instructions.

 

I am no apologist for Dapol nor do I have any connection with them other than owning 2 very good little Terriers which were a fraction of the cost of a brass kit, or RTR brass, and to my mind, are excellent value and I have another one on order. If I were in the market for an 08 I would buy the Dapol without hesitation and if there was a minor ‘error’ I would either ignore it or put it right and get on with life. 

 

Willy

Edited September 13, 2016 by Willy

[alfsboy]

Lots of  clever efficient men on here .How come the country is in such a shite state.?

[Kickstart]

Hi

 

If the 08s have already been made and are being shipped then no chance that Dapol are going to correct a minor livery flaw. It would cost them a fortune, and they would be in a no win situation as they would be torn to pieces for the additional delay.

 

All the best

 

Katy

[jjb1970]

I think the discussion (which I’m enjoying, it’d be a bland world if a forum was only here for us all to agree with each other) is touching on an issue which is universal not just to model trains but other goods and services, namely that you can outsource work but you can’t outsource responsibility. If the “manufacturer” by which I mean the company who supplies the retail distribution network outsources their production to factories overseas then I fully understand the commercial logic behind such a decision. If those factories supply a product which includes avoidable faults, and if that product is accepted and passed to the retail market then the manufacturer is responsible for that decision, not the factory in China. Again, I can understand the logic of making that decision but I also do not accept excuses in trying the pass the buck to China. If Dapol, Hornby, Bachmann or anybody else make a decision to accept what is supplied from China then they have made that decision, as a consumer it is not my concern what happens between these companies and factories in China and just as these companies happily accept the acclaim when a Chinese factory produces superb products then they also have to take it on the chin when things don’t work out quite as well as they might. In fairness most of the time they do and it is quite unusual to see companies blame their factories (at least in public) and I don’t think most companies have a problem with this logic. In those unusual situations where you do see a company publicly try and say “don’t blame me, blame the Chinese” then I think that it is bang out of order.

[CME and Bottlewasher]

I don't want to complain but the 7mm drivers left testicle is too large, it is at least 50% overscale...

 

Seriously, can we let the model appear and then have some constructive criticism......

Thought it had, the blue one....mind you there appears to be confusion as the model shown is one of two versions??

 

I think that, as said before, on RMW, by the great and the good, not just little old me, that Dapol's communications, re forthcoming models, are dire, even their website is iffy (IMHO) - they are not helping themselves or their reputation by leaving everything to mystery and forum gossip.

 

RW may have been joking when he said what he said, but why havnt the lot from Dapol - the ones with MBAs - popped their heads above the parapet and made an appearance at Telford (did they?) - ie face questions and/or flak?

 

It is true to say that if there is a single problem that needs an answer to it, in a room full of 12 railway modellers/armchair experts there will be 12 different answers LOL!  But, there is a lot of expertise on RMW, some great modellers and I wonder if, when a query in the pre-pro, is hit by Dapol et al. how much research do they do - or do they just fudge it? I know from my own model-making that the internet isnt the be all and end all and that reference books are still required - so heaven knows why the Heljan MK1s are so wrong with the likes of Keith Parkin's books readily available. It is true to say that transposing drawings and the real world prototype into 1:43 scale plastic there has to be compromises (sometimes mm perfect measurements have to be compromised upon to get the model to look right in model-form, not to mention manufacturing considerations), but some of the errors on the Dapol 6 wheel tanks, the POWs et al were just that, errors, and not due to the confines of the manufacturing process. The Dog Kennel replicated some of the errors in a.n.other's Dog Kennel kit and then made them worse!? Each to their own though in terms of punters' choices, as building a brake van can be as challenging as a loco or a coach, having said that though, the kits are as easy as an old Airfix kit all it takes is time, patience and a little research.

 

The Dapol 08, is now, a fine looking model that runs well, but for those who cannot build and paint a kit, the finish, ie the paintwork, is of equal importance and with the BFYE version Dapol, if the display model is correct, picked a challenging area for a touch-in repaint and in YELLOW (can anyone read that? I rest my case    ) too, the worst colour to paint or try to over-paint with. The black roof - looks smart - but could be heavily weathered and/or repainted. Most blue and grey 08s faded so need to either be pre-painted 'faded' (blue or grey) or let down with a filter and then weathered.

 

If the production models have these problems then that is a lot more obvious than the dangley bits of a whitemetal driver, especially in the RTR market, true one can never truly please all of the people all of the time, but Dapol never seem to go the extra mile to delight. Having said this RW is on-board fully now (we will leave the business implications to one side for now) and hopefully school-boy errors will now, after the Terrier et al (all projects which RW had to tweak and/or accept as he took over half way through), be a thing of the past.....we hope......

 

Which one? There seem to be two livery versions for green, one with a grey cab + bonnet, one without. Double check your order. D3043 has grey cab, D3219 has grey cab and bonnet. Also we've not seen a green sample yet so hopefully those are indeed correct.

 

Dapol's digest site to the rescue!

 

https://digest.Dapol.co.uk/filedata/fetch?photoid=395 or https://digest.Dapol.co.uk/filedata/fetch?photoid=398

 

Quick edit: My bad, three green - 13282 is also grey cab + green bonnet

Thanks - I will do, I had let my order drift somewhat as it had been so long.....

 

When I worked in a model shop I used to tell  customers who moaned about small or indeed large  inaccuracies that they were deliberately included to allow the customer to feel superior .My boss used to tell people,who asked how good a model was that it wasnt perfect but I am sure you have the talent to make it so .

You have no idea how many customers brought their pile of glue encrusted crap to me to show all the mods they had done in the name of accuracy .I have yet to find a picture of a Tiger tank  covered with moulding lines , fingerprints ,glue and  thick paint  runs in bright yellow  and yes I have heard of zimmerit .

That is amusing and sometimes if one cant model it well, its best left alone, knowing where to start and stop with a model is key, relative to ones abilities.....

 

s-l225.jpg

Are they from The Hills Have Eyes   ?

 

I appreciate that different businesses may operate differently, however at the end of the day Dapol is the customer in this scenario.  I too regularly manufacture goods overseas for my own business (alas not model railways); however if, as in your potential scenario above, the "production model is incorrect" then I have a simple remedy, and that is, I don't pay the invoice for the goods until myself, the customer, am satisfied with the final product! 

 

Additionally, and importantly, if I, as the customer quietly accept any errors delivered then in the longer run I do myself no favours, as in effect I have already relayed the unspoken message that I will effectively allow myself to be trampled on and accept any old tat that is delivered and not utter a word of complaint.

 

From my own experience and self-awareness, I readily admit that in my own line of business some may find my manner objectionable, and indeed it's fair to say that when my supplier/manufacturer makes a glaring mistake, believe me they will generally know about it!  Difficult to please you may say, however I stand by my point that I am the customer and I'm paying, so I expect the job done right.  No more, no less.  And in this scenario Dapol should indeed be doing the same, and if for some reason they feel they are unable to raise valid issues then maybe they are working with the wrong manufacturer...

 

Of course, we are drawing many assumptions from the above, as it may well likely be Dapol themselves that made the error by submitting incorrect drawings, livery spec or whatever; in which instance Dapol would have no grounds to argue.  Alas, I guess that is something we shall never know...

By and large I agree. I understand that the factory, originally had everything so as to make a good 08 from day one. It's all about contract management after the contract and specs have been let. I believe, judging by other consumer goods made in China, that unless one has a water tight contract (both T&Cs and Specs) the Chinese take the pi  mickey. We have a sony product, great sound when it works, 50% of online reviews (of which there are lots) state the same problems, 50% state that it is brilliant, it's made in China and so TQM and Continuous Improvement seem alien to the Chinese? The Chinese used to be craftsmen but.....perhaps its a plot by pseudo communists (ie wealthy ones who eat MacDonalds and drink Coke - in the some are more equal than others vein) to bring down the west (I wouldnt put it past them - as the UK is  'at war' in terms of business - but we dont seem aware of such as a country - with Germany, France, China et al - all this 'win win' 'partnership sourcing' stuff is rubbish, its nearly always 'win perceived win' which is relative to who holds the lever of power in the business relationship).

 

Having said all of the above, the factory in question, as I wrote before, provides sterling service for other customers.

 

Great then you have thousands of pounds worth of tooling stuck in a factory where you will have paid for a large chunk of the tooling (perhaps all of it) and you can't get any models produced because you haven't paid your bill. Even worse it might be multiple sets of tooling for different models that you can no longer access!

 

You are of course right in theory but good luck with that strategy in real life.

 

Cheers Mike

 

I understand that was the case for one manufacturer in fairly recent times......

Well said!!! Again there's been more than enough time to get this right... years in making, not just the last few days prior to release, it's a real shame really.

I hate to say it, notwithstanding the general issues surrounding China making products (ie IIRC Yamaha musical instruments division have brought manufacture back to Japan), it is a shame and in many respects I am seeing this approach in many products, consumer goods including motor vehicles, yet the 'have what your given and be bl@@dy grateful for what you have' approach seems rife in 7mm RTR - my other half thinks its madness at the price points we pay (even £160 is a considered purchase for many). I have to say, I believe that swmbo is right.

 

Then they should have worked with the suppliers more closely to ensure there were no issues at all stages including making sure livery details and variations were correct. Also in my own small way I'm doing the same thing by deciding not to purchase several locos that were on order until they are acceptable. Just don't want waste my money for something that is not visually correct and spoils the overall experince of ownership. If nothing changes in terms of retrospective modifications to correct the apparent anomalies then I will just walk away and use the money I am are that is more suatable to mey personal requirements and expectations. I was not interested in the forthcoming Heljen 05 but they they may end up getting my money as the appear to be acting in a much more professional and open arrangement. Nice to see they have produced a decorated pre production model early enough to unable change to be made if required.

By and large agreed, but I was under the impression from a previous Post that the BFYE model was a production model?

 

For all you gripers here there is an MMP kit for a class 08 for sale on the GOG website for £160. All you have to do is; join the GOG, buy the wheels and motor, build it and then paint it and I am certain it will be absolutely perfect. The paint will be perfect for which ever loco you choose at what ever time and don’t forget it would have had a different shade of blue depending on how long it had been out of shop, etc. because some of them faded rater badly. They will also have the electrical trunking in the correct place but you will have to be sure and see a photo of the rear of the cab on your chosen loco, at your chosen time, just in case someone in the electrical shop didn’t reroute the conduit because it was more convenient to do so at the time! Also, did you get a photo of both sides of your loco, just to make sure! Meanwhile, the pragmatic amongst us will either ignore the various ‘problems’ or get a paint brush, or a modelling knife, and set about them and have an excellent loco up and running in the time it will take you to read the kit instructions.

 

I am no apologist for Dapol nor do I have any connection with them other than owing 2 very good little Terriers which were a fraction of the cost of a brass kit, or RTR brass, and to my mind, are excellent value and I have another one on order. If I were in the market for an 08 I would buy the Dapol without hesitation and if there was a minor ‘error’ I would either ignore it or put it right and get on with life. 

 

Willy

I have the MMP kit and I am looking forward to building it, if I make a good job of it, I may well sell on the Dapol 08 in due course, after all it is a creative hobby and RTR for me is a means to an end to save time, yet I have to say, the vast majority of of RTR I have bought, unless made by the cottage industry needs work doing to it and/or repairs! We wouldnt, as I have written before, accept it with a TV (ie having to repair such ourselves). I am beginning to wonder how many visits a 'sponsor'/designer/retailer makes to a factory/liaises with the manufacturers so as to ensure that the contract is performed correctly and the specs adhered to (thus contract managed post award/letting), I wonder if some of these 'buyers' (at that level) are lazy and just hope that the Chinese will get it right and that the punters wont whinge too much - and as wrong as it is, like the emperors new clothes ('cause it has a pretty paint job) it sells like hot cakes. IIRC, from a magazine interview with Dapol, their MD, at the time, said;- '....we leave it all to China, whilst we sleep, they work on the models.....' (in précis and not verbatim). Look at the POW fiasco it seemed to knock the sales of LH POWs (which were the better product).....to mind mind monetarism/capitalism doesnt work in the way that TPTB want us to think it works (there is a new form of insidious macro economics apparent that takes the view of; 'the needs of he few [the super-elite] outweigh the needs of the many', which we all 'allow/enable') - it only benefits those at the top of the tree, the rest is smoke and mirrors and we are all being boiled like - Charles Handy's - frogs.

Edited September 9, 2016 by CME and Bottlewasher

[bazjones1711]

If they painted the 08 all over blue in the first instance , then no one would be complaining or debating the issue , then if you searched the internet and found a class 08 with a black roof you could paint it yourself ! This applies to the trunking for the lights. As the MAJORITY of the class don't have black roofs why do it.

[F-UnitMad]

I was not interested in the forthcoming Heljen 05 but they they may end up getting my money as the appear to be acting in a much more professional and open arrangement. Nice to see they have produced a decorated pre production model early enough to unable change to be made if required.

That's a rather, erm... "optimistic" view of Heljan..?? Most of their 7mm diesels have had errors pointed out yet go uncorrected. They've been hard-to-correct dimensional things, too, not just painting issues - except for the Loadhaul Class 60, of course

[maq1988]

If they painted the 08 all over blue in the first instance , then no one would be complaining or debating the issue , then if you searched the internet and found a class 08 with a black roof you could paint it yourself ! This applies to the trunking for the lights. As the MAJORITY of the class don't have black roofs why do it.

 

 

I'm sorry this is great. In post 331 you said that a three year old could paint an 08 fully blue so surely Dapol should be able to, I assume so that statement was to reflect that the modeller should not have to 'correct' the model? Now you are suggesting that Dapol paint it completely blue and let the modeller 'correct' the model?

 

I would debate the issue, which side of the fence do you want to sit on? Does the manufacturer fix it or does the modeller?

 

Now to balance that out and be fair.  The only picture I can find of 08202 (of which this great cab debate rolls around) does look like it has a blue cab.

 

My bad again, I've found conflicting evidence that the roof of 08202 was both black and blue.

 

Link to Blue -> https://mark-beal-tmd.smugmug.com/RetrospectiveRail/Retrospective-Class-08/i-sLHHXsP

Link to Black -> http://www.railphotoarchive.org/rpc_zoom.php?img=0999000029000

 

- Should Dapol have researched this individual locomotive better? Yes.

- Should Dapol finish all 08s in the same livery and let the modeller fix it? No.

Edited September 8, 2016 by maq1988

[bazjones1711]

Can you spot the difference, one of these is Dapol's

The other is handmade ,my point being that one of them looks nothing like a coil, having seen posts about the communication problems or misinterpretation of either liveries or cad drawings with dealing with manufacturing in China, I don't think even China could get a coil wrong seems they are one of the top steel producers , so the blame must surely be with the likes of Dapol, Heljan , Bachmann , Hornby etc... for supplying the information about the models in the first place.

Edited September 8, 2016 by bazjones1711

[bazjones1711]

I'm sorry this is great. In post 331 you said that a three year old could paint an 08 fully blue so surely Dapol should be able to, I assume so that statement was to reflect that the modeller should not have to 'correct' the model? Now you are suggesting that Dapol paint it completely blue and let the modeller 'correct' the model?

 

I would debate the issue, which side of the fence do you want to sit on? Does the manufacturer fix it or does the modeller?

 

Now to balance that out and be fair.  The only picture I can find of 08202 (of which this great cab debate rolls around) does look like it has a blue cab.

 

My bad again, I've found conflicting evidence that the roof of 08202 was both black and blue.

 

Link to Blue -> https://mark-beal-tmd.smugmug.com/RetrospectiveRail/Retrospective-Class-08/i-sLHHXsP

Link to Black -> http://www.railphotoarchive.org/rpc_zoom.php?img=0999000029000

 

- Should Dapol have researched this individual locomotive better? Yes.

- Should Dapol finish all 08s in the same livery and let the modeller fix it? No.

My point is if the roof was blue to begin with then there would be no issue,or if the lighting trunking was as the position the majority of the class had again no issue, I would have been the first to congratulate Dapol for there effort if not for these errors

[maq1988]

My point is if the roof was blue to begin with then there would be no issue,or if the lighting trunking was as the position the majority of the class had again no issue, I would have been the first to congratulate Dapol for there effort if not for these errors

 

 

There would be an issue as not every blue 08 has a blue roof. If someone doesn't want to paint black bits yellow why should they paint blue bits black?

 

Here is 08202, the locomotive that has been modelled by Dapol that is in question ->  https://flic.kr/p/fKcnU8. It is bright yellow. It has a bright yellow roof. Should it be blue?

Edited September 8, 2016 by maq1988

[bazjones1711]

So Dapol got it completely wrong it should be completely yellow , at least they got the radiator colour correct!

Edited September 8, 2016 by bazjones1711

[maq1988]

So Dapol got it completely wrong it should be completely yellow , at least the got the radiator colour correct!

 

Now that I'll agree with!

 

I feel like I've now hijacked the thread. Is it an 08, yes. Are there livery mistakes that really should have been avoided, yes. There are 08s of many colours shapes and forms. Dapol might be able to make a killing by releasing an unpainted version with modular toolboxes / light trunkings and light box locations.

Edited September 8, 2016 by maq1988

[bazjones1711]

Dapol don't send this picture to China , they may just do it , it bid you farewell !

[t8hants]

You know I am just grateful that there is a rtr O gauge model at a price I might just be able to afford, and because I only use rivets for fastening and have no knowledge what so ever of what should be where, remain blissfully disinterested in whatever shortcomings it may have.

[Hal Nail]

 

I... remain blissfully disinterested

 

I'm going to use that in my next work appraisal.

[jjb1970]

With respect to some of the comments about China I think it is not really helpful to over generalise and despite a lot of percieved wisdom Chinese companies are fully capable of manufacturing world class products and there are plenty of extremely capable and clever people in China providing high end development and design services. There is no doubt that there are sharks in China and there are plenty of traps and pitfalls for the unwary, but that is true about doing business anywhere, including the UK. My previous employer does an awful lot of work in China classing ships and providing design verification and assurance services and whilst Chinese shipyards and equipment manufacturers are far from perfect (but then again neither are shipyards, engine builders etc anywhere else in the world) they do for the most part build to the agreed specification. Sometimes customers specify a minimum cost option (ie. they've asked for a cheap and basic ship provided with the cheapest equipment available) and then blame the yard for building what they've been paid to build. Which is a long way from this Dapol 08.

 

I think there has to be a sense of perspective and realism when considering models. I think it is correct to make Dapol aware if they've made errors as it is a part of product improvement to provide honest feedback. I also think that if it is fundamentally a good model then many modellers (me included) are happy enough to accept some faults. Whether or not the faults are acceptable is a personal decision.