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Dapol 08

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12 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

when was the last time you read a review that actually criticised a product?

 

Thanks for that. :huh: Not sensationalised enough? Daring to mention positive aspects?

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I’m not sure how we got from Dapol not replying to lambasting magazine reviews again but surely a polite letter to Dapol customer services explaining the round in circles problem for parts would be best? How long since the email was sent? They may be struggling at present to reply in good time too. 
On criticism, do we want magazines dropping to the tabloid level and trying to outdo each other on finding errors? I think forums cover that already! 
I admit critique may be a little softer than the other extreme of enthusiasm for the better features but it is inevitably a symbiotic relationship so they try to be more constructive than ‘keyboard warriors’ as they are trying to be positive about the wider hobby too. A review can only ever be written on the sample received so cannot hope to cover the odd ailments seen by a bigger selection on a forum, I’ve seen errors noted many times and I read plenty from “fiddly to assemble”, “a tight fit” and “necessary compromise” I’ve noted in reviews.

 

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I am afraid that magazines are seen as an easy target by some as they can't fight back - similar to manufacturers.

 

I would also say it unfair to say they are never critical, I have read some fairly harsh reviews over the years. We also have to be mindful that in most cases the magazine reviewers are "generalists", not necessarily having the level of knowledge that some on here have. I can comment with great detail about items such as the 2H, Lyn at the L&B and the locos I fire regularly. I don't expect every one here to have that level of knowledge and I don't expect the magazine reviewer too either. Likewise, I am not going to disagree with those that have demonstrated detailed knowledge of other stock that I have little experience of.

 

One final note. Magazines now seem far happier to mention social media and the views expressed than they used to - often noting where omissions / errors have been reported by that route.

 

Roy

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2 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

Thanks for that. :huh: Not sensationalised enough? Daring to mention positive aspects?

Nothing to do with sensationalism Andy, reviews need to be balanced, almost every review I recall in the “cons” list it says “nothing of note” and that would be fine but there are enough posts here to show not everything is rosey in the world of model railways.

 

Doesn't stop me subscribing to four mags every month though :D

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Well for starters the reviews are  generally based on a sample size of one, and presumably carried out several weeks before publication i.e. before the masses have  bought their new toys and had chance to complain on the internet about whatever they think is wrong with them.  Plus, as already pointed out, it's unrealistic to expect the reviewers to have in depth knowledge about every product they review. Folks can always come on here and try and sort out the real experts from those whose expertise is limited to sounding like an expert if they want more detailed review.

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It’s annoying yes but the simple fact is the 08 was out of guarantee and if Dapol did replace parts free out of warranty and are seen to do it by people thanking them on the net then everyone will expect it and set a legal precedent!
Every loco I buy goes on the rollers for half an hour each way and I sent a B4 back this year as it was completely dead, it was simply exchanged, the two O locos from Dapol both passed the test fortunately. I’ve had locos from Bachmann (std tank) and Heljan (Metropolitan) fail in the first few minutes running so I invested in rollers to make testing easy on the bench. The warranty terms are pretty universal and yes it shouldn’t happen but it can due to mistakes or design errors so we need to test models while covered by it. 

The first responsibility for faults is the retailer not Dapol so if the railcar had continuing faults why didn’t it go back to them? Initially they should swap a model while after, usually 1-3 months, it will be returned for repair. Beyond the first year making us pay for spares or paid repair is the only option for them without opening a lifetime warranty scheme. 

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10 hours ago, CME and Bottlewasher said:

 

Amen to that! I've been shot down for writing a lot less/more benign. A sad state of affairs all round! Make a sentence from the following; bite, feeds, them, hand, won't, the, that.

 

Shot down for expressing an opinion, surely not? :lol:

 

 

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1 hour ago, PaulRhB said:

 

The first responsibility for faults is the retailer not Dapol so if the railcar had continuing faults why didn’t it go back to them? Initially they should swap a model while after, usually 1-3 months, it will be returned for repair.

Because it was ordered directly from Dapol as I am a Dapol club member (won’t be renewing that now), apart from that  I believe the sound fitted Railcar was only available direct from Dapol.

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I think you’ve hit the nail on the head CME,

before this pandemic knocked my income to 1/4 what it was, I was “ 7mm curious “, having seen some great BR blue stuff on Blowers green.

 

However, If I’m going to spend £450 - 1000 on a loco ( weathering, sound etc ) , it’s got to be right , first time, in terms of shape and running and QC. And importantly if it isn’t , I want customer support inline with buying any item of that value. And , yes, I know things are difficult now, but that hasn’t always been the way.

 

Without Heljan and Dapol there wouldn’t nearly be the swell of interest, as the only other way in , diesel wise , seemed to be the JLTRT kits , which not everyone had the time and skill to master . But I just don’t have the faith in their products at present .

Edited by rob D2
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I have eight 'o' gauge diesels, the 3 Dapol 08's i have are yet to turn a wheel and being over two years old will probably be seized up by now :lol: The five others are all Heljans which fall to bits every time i take them out of their boxes, no matter how careful i am. It's a lot of dosh to spend for what could turn out to be static dust collecting ornaments. All mine are up for grabs so why not take a risk on a bargain...you never know they might run ok and bits might just stop falling off them in someone else's hands...but keep the super glue handy just in case.:lol: 

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There’s a lot more detail coming out and like I said before as retailer yes they should respond, especially with a club model as it’s only through them, but there are phone numbers and politely phoning regularly will get a reply. 

Equally moaning after the warranty period is up when it’s not been run has missed the opportunity offered and changing the terms opens up a whole new can of worms. 
As others suggested if you were repeatedly ignored a letter to BRM during the warranty period would likely get them to ask to ascertain facts and make Dapol aware of the possible negativity. Unfortunately ranting on the internet about it tends to be ignored as there are so many who would copycat fraudulently. It’s not honest modellers who’ve created this problem but a tiny minority but it’s hard for a manufacturer to change for one without coming under pressure for others. 
 

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23 minutes ago, CME and Bottlewasher said:

Was this referring to one of my posts?

Not specifically just a general response to the last page or so. I understand the frustration in people’s posts and that it helps to get it out but  sometimes discussing why certain parts are reasonable helps with calming down the anger and also making us think for the future purchases to catch these types of problems under warranty. 
Ignoring contacts under warranty isn’t good and I’ll take his word for it that is what’s happening but as other posts have shown there’s often more info info not initially stated, hence why I asked a couple of questions in previous posts ;) 

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4 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

 
Ignoring contacts under warranty isn’t good and I’ll take his word for it that is what’s happening but as other posts have shown there’s often more info info not initially stated, hence why I asked a couple of questions in previous posts ;) 

Oh thank you.........I like to think I am an honest and law abiding chap, if I say something it’s my word and that’s worth more to me than money.

 

As I stated in another thread about my woes with this Railcar, it had been back twice already as it had sound faults straight from the box, I had a quite patronising email back telling me I was probably using a type of controller which could cause this issue (which I am not, I had already told them I was using an ECoS in a previous email) and after the second return I was told there was not fault found, this time I decided to investigate myself (rather than send it back again) and I found that pig’s dinner, a dog’s dinner would be too neat, of a wiring solution.

 

I have since sent two emails to the same chap I was in contact with and got no replies, and tried twice ringing directly and the phone was not picked up, I don’t rant or get angry over things like this, just thoroughly disappointed that a company based in the U.K. which I have supported for a long time treats complaints in such a way.

 

Anyhoo that’s me over and out......:good:

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29 minutes ago, CME and Bottlewasher said:

These matters could all be avoided with the addition of quality control

They do but you can’t test every single one without paying extra and that’s where the warranty should back it up. 
It’s compromise to hit the price point that’s made their range so attractive. ;) 

 

Quote

 

and a sense of fair play.

They do usually, sorting the 68’s and other returns I’ve had to make but for some reason it can break down occasionally. It’s unfortunate and reasonably stated above by two people, as with many jobs the good done in customer service is often masked by a poor experience because it is more emotive.
It does sound like there’s been a failure somewhere in the case of the railcar but I’m afraid the original 08 cranks are a bit of 50/50 in responsibility due to the time elapsed but the faulty spares definitely should be addressed and might well lead to the original problem being solved if communicated to Dapol. 
I communicated the issue to both Heljan & Tillig with models that failed, didn’t receive acknowledgement but having past experience in manufacturing and retail jobs I wasn’t particularly surprised as they are very wary of admitting anything because of legal responsibility. That’s the world we have, it’s not unique to model trains. 
I’ve got 4 Dapol O locos, of three types and apart from the first terrier having the usual bits broken off in the box they’ve been superb quality. 

Edited by PaulRhB
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21 hours ago, Owd Bob said:

All mine are up for grabs so why not take a risk on a bargain

 

Feel free to message me with your bent bargains.

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A bit late to the party, but I wonder if this might help...

 

Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (link here) you have SIX YEARS (five years in Scotland) to make a claim against the retailer for the faulty goods (scroll down that link to the section "After 6 Months" and also the section "What if your warranty has run out?", however is is up you YOU to prove that the item was faulty (which may involve getting an expert to review the item and provide a written report - probably at some cost to you). Before 6 months after purchase the assumption is that the item was faulty from the start and you don't have to prove anything.

 

Whether you judge the time/effort and possible cost worthwhile is up to the individual.  Probably not for a loco costing say £150-200 but probably worthwhils if the loco was a weathered, sound-fitted item costing up to £1000-ish

 

Other links which may be of interest: Faulty Goods and Consumer Rights At 2015

 

In all cases, your contract is with the retailer and not the manufacturer (unless you are claiming under the manufacturer's warranty).  Further details are in the links posted above.

 

Hope this helps,

 

Art

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I know I am probably being lazy and it'll be somewhere in the 77 pages of this thread, but is there a simple way to identify which 08's the un-numbered BR Blue (08717 version) is suitable for? I am going snow blind looking through images on flickr!

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When I did my (other variation) 08 I used this thread to narrow things down, then looked at depot allocations to narrow things down regionally. Then you can start ploughing through the pictures.

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22 hours ago, Luke Piewalker said:

 

When I did my (other variation) 08 I used this thread to narrow things down, then looked at depot allocations to narrow things down regionally. Then you can start ploughing through the pictures.

 

That's the thread I was looking for last night and couldn't for the life of me find!! Thank you.

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On 20/09/2020 at 11:32, Art Dent said:

Under the Consumer Rights Act 2015 (link here) you have SIX YEARS (five years in Scotland) to make a claim against the retailer for the faulty goods (scroll down that link to the section "After 6 Months" and also the section "What if your warranty has run out?", however is is up you YOU to prove that the item was faulty (which may involve getting an expert to review the item and provide a written report

If new replacement spare parts exhibit exactly the same fault, it would be very difficult for Dapol to deny its a manufacturing defect.

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