Hornby Announce Peckett W4 0-4-0ST

[Kaput]

Seems to be getting oddly common this year for Hornby to lower allocations a long time after orders have been taken....

[Chris116]

10 minutes ago, Kaput said:

Seems to be getting oddly common this year for Hornby to lower allocations a long time after orders have been taken....

The question has to be asked - Is it Hornby reducing allocations or is it shops taking orders for stock they have not been promised? Either way it is the customer who suffers and the retailer and manufacturer who go down in the customers estimation. I fear that getting a truthful answer from either side will be difficult, if not impossible! 

 

Sadly the situation encourages people to pre order from a number of shops and then cancel the excess orders once the customer receives their order from one of the shops. 

[PhilJ W]

One local trader had told us (before lockdown) that he wasn't taking pre-orders for Hornby as they couldn't or wouldn't be able to guarantee sufficient deliveries to cover them. However Hornby are taking pre-orders themselves for some models.

[Quarryscapes]

Well I've risked a Pre Order on Lady Edith, purely because of a family connection. My Grandfather worked at the Round Oak, though I doubt he would have been there at the same time as Lady Edith, being 12 when it was withdrawn!

[Stafford Railman]

Seen on the Hatton's website 'Lady Edith's might make an appearance in May 2021, I have a pre order two, in fact out of the last 7 loco purchases only 1 has been a big diesel!

[Paul.Uni]

Release dates according to the Hornby website:

• R3640 'Niclausse' Winter 2020-2021
• R3702 'Daphne' Winter 2020-2021
• R3703 'Bear' Winter 2020-2021
• R3825 Peckett grey Winter 2020-2021
• R3869 'Lady Cornelia' Spring 2021
• R3761 'Lady Edith' Summer 2021
• R3868 Crawshay Brothers green Summer 2021

[adb968008]

On 22/10/2020 at 18:27, Chris116 said:

The question has to be asked - Is it Hornby reducing allocations or is it shops taking orders for stock they have not been promised? Either way it is the customer who suffers and the retailer and manufacturer who go down in the customers estimation. I fear that getting a truthful answer from either side will be difficult, if not impossible! 

 

Sadly the situation encourages people to pre order from a number of shops and then cancel the excess orders once the customer receives their order from one of the shops. 

Is Hornby reducing allocation or are shops over ordering ?

 

As mentioned, 1 guy phoning 5 shops creates 5 orders, 4 artificial.

Now remove a Rail’s customer base, has that sent hundreds of people scouring 5 shops for an order creating hundreds of over orders, and are being stock adjusted as they go ?

 

If the orders are the same, but shops soaking excesses.. it’s still creates a shortage, but a happy one for Hornby, but a bubble of excess, with potential tied up cash risks for the retailer.
 

I for one think Pecketts are going to be oversold next year, but note their wheels are either green or red...PLA is the only one out there with a darker colour.

 

Edited November 29, 2020 by adb968008

[Cor-onGRT4]

Just in stock at Hattons "Niclausse"

[Steamport Southport]

Saint Niclausse just in time for Christmas.  

 

 

Yes. I do know it was named after the boiler rather than the chubby feller in the red suit.  

 

 

 

Jason

[rope runner]

I'd be very interested to learn how Hornby arrived at the livery for this most recent Peckett. 

 

I've handled the print of this at the NRM while looking for a photo of a NG prototype, the darker upper cab side honestly just looks like a re-touched photo and there's no examples from the colour photography world showing that Peckett's had different shades of green on their locos at the same time. 

 

Paul A. 

Edited December 11, 2020 by 1whitemoor

[bigherb]

25 minutes ago, 1whitemoor said:

I'd be very interested to learn how Hornby arrived at the livery for this most recent Peckett. 

 

I've handled the print of this at the NRM while looking for a photo of a NG prototype, the darker upper cab side honestly just looks like a re-touched photo and there's no examples from the colour photography world showing that Peckett's had different shades of green on their locos at the same time. 

 

Paul A. 

Look totally different colour and lining style to me, as though the cab top has been replaced from another loco.

[Steamport Southport]

Photo is here. Looks legit to me. Definitely a loco in use rather than brand new. Just look at the lower cabside.

 

https://anticsonline.uk/Product/Hornby-R3640-Willans--Robinson-Peckett-882-Niclausse-W4-Class-0-4-0ST-Peckett-Green-Livery-OO_N107340986

 

 

Jason

[adb968008]

33 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

Photo is here. Looks legit to me. Definitely a loco in use rather than brand new. Just look at the lower cabside.

 

https://anticsonline.uk/Product/Hornby-R3640-Willans--Robinson-Peckett-882-Niclausse-W4-Class-0-4-0ST-Peckett-Green-Livery-OO_N107340986

 

 

Jason

Dunno, it could be a shadow..

 

look inside the footplate, was it shaded different colours of grey from left to right ?  I would content the back of the footplate was darker below than above.

And the dome, was it lighter at the top, than it was at the bottom ?

if the loco was “in-use”, I doubt the footplate would be that clean.

That said I have open in front of me an original copy of Pecketts own 1930’s Manufacturers catalog, and in it is number 1519 (an 0-6-0) which looks to have a darker upper cab and a dull painted dome, it is the exception in the works photo examples I should add.

 

Theres a lovely picture of Swansea Harbour RNo10 with Royal Flags and Crest .. that would look great as a model.

 

 

Given the “freedom” seen on the MSC peckett, I’d forgive it here too, it looks nice regardless.

Edited December 11, 2020 by adb968008

[PaulRhB]

53 minutes ago, bigherb said:

Look totally different colour and lining style to me, as though the cab top has been replaced from another loco.

There’s no way it was outshopped with two different lining styles as bigherb pointed out. I reckon it is a different shade, which might be just because it’s from a different batch or they may have started out the same colour but by the time it’s been married to this loco the paint could have darkened from dirt in scratches or it just wasn’t cleaned up before the picture of the hybrid was taken. 

[Steamport Southport]

36 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Dunno, it could be a shadow..

 

look inside the footplate, was it shaded different colours of grey from left to right ?  I would content the back of the footplate was darker below than above.

And the dome, was it lighter at the top, than it was at the bottom ?

if the loco was “in-use”, I doubt the footplate would be that clean.

That said I have open in front of me an original copy of Pecketts own 1930’s Manufacturers catalog, and in it is number 1519 (an 0-6-0) which looks to have a darker upper cab and a dull painted dome, it is the exception in the works photo examples I should add.

 

Theres a lovely picture of Swansea Harbour RNo10 with Royal Flags and Crest .. that would look great as a model.

 

 

Given the “freedom” seen on the MSC peckett, I’d forgive it here too, it looks nice regardless.

 

How could it be shadow? Totally different style of lining and the colour is defintely darker. Have you even looked at the photograph properly rather than dismissing my post?

 

 The bottom of the cab side is full of dents and filthy. The Salter Dome is also pretty neglected. If that was a works photograph of a new locomotive I would be asking for my money back and buying a Barclay.

 

Also the worksplates would be polished on a new locomotives.

 

Looks like it got a replacement top half of the cab to me after an accident. Probably with a crane or something.

 

 

Copyright not known, but photo is on both Antics and Hornby websites. This one borrowed from Antics.

 

Jason

[Compound2632]

Perhaps the photo was taken to mark the fitting of the replacement upper cab? In any case, it would appear that Hornby's model is as faithful a reproduction of this locomotive in this condition as one is likely to get, working from a black and white photo. So you can't say the model is unrealistic.

[Hroth]

7 hours ago, Cor-onGRT4 said:

Just in stock at Hattons "Niclausse"

Better late than never, "Niclausse" was first announced in early May 2018, and expected by February 2019.  Thats Bachmann standards of dilatoriness!

 

(See page 117 of this thread...)

 

[rope runner]

1 hour ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Totally different style of lining and the colour is defintely darker.

 

The loco is evidently not photographed "as new" but on the other hand it has clearly only been out-shopped a few years prior, evidenced my general cleanliness and state.  The livery is leaf green, lined yellow on black backing on the upper portion of the cab. The green infill being a completely different shade on the model is something which I'm afraid is not correct to my mind - and if indeed this is "fresh" paint and the rest aged or faded (extremely unlikely) then that is not represented on the model. 

 

1 hour ago, Steamport Southport said:

Also the worksplates would be polished on a new locomotives.

 

An additional thing to note is that the plate affixed to the cabside is not a standard Peckett works plate for this period. It is also not a rebuild plate, as these were smaller. 

 

Copyright for the photo will be the NRM, better to link to it than post direct... 

 

Paul A. 

[rope runner]

I have consulted my copy of "Peckett & Sons Ltd: An album of official photographs" by A. Smith and can safely conclude it is a  trick of the photography and a shadow (or lightening of the lower half of the loco to show detail, done post-shoot) , this effect is doubtlessly reinforced by the change in lining style with a black background. 

 

An identical effect is seen on the official images for Wks no. 907, 925 , 959, 1055 and 1217 etc in the publication - and probably others, I stopped looking after that.

 

Paul A. 

[Compound2632]

13 hours ago, 1whitemoor said:

I have consulted my copy of "Peckett & Sons Ltd: An album of official photographs" by A. Smith

 

I would assume that Hornby are working from a copy of this volume too?

[Ruston]

3 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I would assume that Hornby are working from a copy of this volume too?

I would guess not, otherwise they too would have spotted the fact that many works photos have this darker area on cab uppers and cab steps. If it was a single photo then there are all sorts of arguments for it actually being painted a different shade, or the lining being different, such as a repair or weathering, but there is no way that Peckett's sent out so many engines with mismatched paintwork from new. I would say that they have worked from the one photo, without reference to other works photos.

The apparent difference in colour and lining must be due to lighting or something else in the photographic process.

 

Someone at Hornby has got this one wrong.

[Compound2632]

So, I recant my previous view. As this is a Peckett works photo and given the lack of shine, I'm now feeling that I'm looking at photographic grey. (As with No. 560, that Hornby also turned out in green - though green was most likely how it was delivered to the customer, certainly not grey. I haven't kept up with all the versions but I see Hornby have done one on photographic grey, numbered 614. The ideal model if you're building a model of the Atlas Works in January 1896 but otherwise not much use.)

[adb968008]

8 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

I haven't kept up with all the versions but I see Hornby have done one on photographic grey, numbered 614. The ideal model if you're building a model of the Atlas Works in January 1896 but otherwise not much use.)

No but it looks nice, I suspect that is what much of these Hornby liveries are about.

its not totally without precedent since 1896 though.

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/peckett-sons-works-no-1903-merlin-little-lady-0-4-0st/

 

Edited December 12, 2020 by adb968008

[Compound2632]

12 hours ago, adb968008 said:

No but it looks nice, I suspect that is what much of these Hornby liveries are about.

its not totally without precedent since 1896 though.

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/peckett-sons-works-no-1903-merlin-little-lady-0-4-0st/

 

 

But that preserved example isn't in photographic grey. I mentioned January 1896 specifically since that's the month works number 614 was completed. 

[adb968008]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

But that preserved example isn't in photographic grey. I mentioned January 1896 specifically since that's the month works number 614 was completed. 

Agreed, but as my first line said...

 

Quote

No but it looks nice, I suspect that is what much of these Hornby liveries are about

Hornby’s never always been 100% accurate, unless you can point me to the real Coke train ?

Edited December 13, 2020 by adb968008