Harbledown Railroad Heritage Line (Wisconsin Central)

[Chris116]

4 minutes ago, z4driver said:

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If the work as good as the video shows, we'll have to keep badgering for him to produce them for US sleeper spacing!!

I will keep you informed on here how they work and I agree that for future use we need to ask nicely for the Code 83 to be produced although I can understand why he has not done so at present.

[Chris116]

Three British buildings (metcalfe) built, some of my American stock found and the passenger stock now has a new name on one side. I am leaving the other side as the original as it means I can run twice as many trains with one set of stock! 

In case anyone is wondering where the name Harbledown came from, it was the name of a street near Parsons Green Station where I worked in the ticket office for three years. My main layout will be Ashcombe which is another street name near Parsons Green! 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Chris116
Extra photo and explanation

[Chris116]

Further boxes to be checked today as I am missing a number of Wisconsin Central wagons and at least one Wisconsin Central loco plus the original wagons I bought at Warley. 

 

Thought I had posted the above bit this morning but it is still in the new message section!

 

Checked through the boxes I knew I had and found some extra stock then opened the wardrobe I rarely use and discovered two large boxes of railway items including the missing American stock. Now I must look around for a suitable station building to go with the American side of the operation as the Settle and Carlisle building will not look at all right but is great for a preservation operation that just happens to have a J70 and a number of other small locos.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Chris116

[Chris116]

After a few days being kept busy by SWMBO, I go to have another look at the stock I have and realised that some stock has Kadee's while the Atlas SOO loco and some of the wagons have different couplings. That is not a problem just have to run trains that are fitted with the same couplings until I change everything to Kadee's. However the steam loco is a problem as it only has a Kadee at the back with a fake fixed thing at the front and I need to be able to haul trains in both directions so a Kadee is needed on the front. The steam loco is the Model Power 0-4-0T shown in a few of the photos above. I think a craft knife to remove the blob of plastic and then make sure I get the new coupling at the right height! Either it will prove a nice easy fix or I will be tearing my hair out!

Edited November 29, 2020 by Chris116
Spelling

[DanielB]

I'd invest in a kadee coupler height gauge. They are invaluable.

[Chris116]

6 minutes ago, DanielB said:

I'd invest in a kadee coupler height gauge. They are invaluable.

I have every intention of getting a kadee height gauge. Fitting them so they work without would be a nightmare. 

 

Thanks for the reminder.

[Chris116]

Kadee couplings and height gauge ordered from Hattons and Model Power MPW605 Silverado Station Kit ordered from Time Tunnel Models. They should arrive by the end of the week. Now I just have to find somewhere that I can buy five yards of Code 83 Peco flexible HO track. 

 

Having messed around with the backscene I have decided not to use the Gaugemaster items I bought. Instead I will paint it the same light blue as the walls in my bedroom/railway room. The problem with the backscene is that the station building will be against it which makes the perspective totally wrong. 

 

I have changed my mind and put the "Harbledown Railroad" name on both sides of the steam engine and heritage passenger cars. Once the Kadee's arrive I will sort out the front coupling on the steam loco and change the freight stock and SOO loco that have different couplings which means everything will couple together. 

Edited November 29, 2020 by Chris116

[Chris116]

Immediately after typing the above message I went to the Hattons website to move my Kadees from trunk to being delivered only to find that code 83 track is on order and expected before the end of the year. So 5 yards ordered to go to my trunk and once received then the track and couplings will be moved to being delivered. The delay in getting both will give me time to build the American station and sort out how the platform will change from low US style to the higher UK style. 

[F-UnitMad]

I haven't checked the list myself, but this link on the official Kadee website might help you find the best coupler for the Model Power loco.

I always found it a bit weird that it was quite common for US steam loco models to only have a working rear coupler, as if no one would ever want to run them pulling a train tender-first.

 

Edit - here you go; Kadee #27 - https://www.kadee.com/hocc_model_power.htm

Edited November 29, 2020 by F-UnitMad

[Chris116]

1 hour ago, F-UnitMad said:

I haven't checked the list myself, but this link on the official Kadee website might help you find the best coupler for the Model Power loco.

I always found it a bit weird that it was quite common for US steam loco models to only have a working rear coupler, as if no one would ever want to run them pulling a train tender-first.

 

Edit - here you go; Kadee #27 - https://www.kadee.com/hocc_model_power.htm

I agree it is strange that a tank loco which are designed to run in both directions should only have a coupler on the back of the model.

 

I had seen somewhere that I needed a medium Kadee so I have already got a pack of #5 on ordered from Hattons and placed in my trunk until the code 83 track arrives. Looking at the Hattons website I see that they do not appear to have any #27's. I note that both #5 and #27 are called medium so hopefully I can get the #5 to fit.

 

Having looked at the website you quoted above I have a lot to learn about Kadee's and I hope I don't make too many mistakes along the way!

[F-UnitMad]

11 minutes ago, Chris116 said:

I note that both #5 and #27 are called medium so hopefully I can get the #5 to fit.

"Medium" will refer to the length of the shank. The #27 has a more compact draftgear box than the #5, for where space is tighter behind the pilot beam.

The #5 is considered the 'standard' coupler that most HO stock is designed to take. There is a smaller 'scale size' knuckle version and 'whisker spring' versions which have built-in springs rather than the seperate brass spring of the #5. I won't quote #numbers as I've forgotten them exactly, not doing HO for a few years now.

 

[Chris116]

36 minutes ago, F-UnitMad said:

"Medium" will refer to the length of the shank. The #27 has a more compact draftgear box than the #5, for where space is tighter behind the pilot beam.

The #5 is considered the 'standard' coupler that most HO stock is designed to take. There is a smaller 'scale size' knuckle version and 'whisker spring' versions which have built-in springs rather than the seperate brass spring of the #5. I won't quote #numbers as I've forgotten them exactly, not doing HO for a few years now.

 

Many thanks for your help. I will see if I can get #5 to fit and if not will be going shopping again. 

 

I suspect that I will have a harder job to get the Kadees to fit my SOO EMD GP7 made by Atlas and the freight wagons, well they will be looked at carefully before I do anything on the diesel as I may learn from them.

[rodshaw]

The 'whisker' version of the #5 is the #148. As I recall, I found the #5s didn't fit on some of my Bachmann locos although they were fine on freight cars. I used #148s on the locos.

The smaller scale version of the #148 is the #158.

[F-UnitMad]

Depends on how old the models are; if they have the old "horn hook" type some work will be needed. The loco will also be Atlas/Roco, made in Austria. Put some photos up here & someone will be able to advise I'm sure.

Years ago the horn hook was the US 'train set' sort of coupler, but it was phased out around the same time that the Kadee patents expired, and clones like Bachman EZ couplers were made.

 

[Chris116]

The Atlas GP7 says it is "Made in China" and as you may be able to see from the third photo has the couplings fitted with a screw. The GP7 has the same couplings as those wagons that are not Kadee type fitted. A quick look at the wagons proved they also had screw fitted couplings which should make my life easier when replacing them. Everything will be replaced with #5's and then I will consider if shorter (or longer) shanks are required. 

[F-UnitMad]

The Atlas GP7 is a more recent model than the Atlas/Roco ones,  but not recent enough to have a Kadee/clone coupler. If you're lucky that screw might be in the right position for the centre hole in the Kadee draftgear box, and the height should be fine too, but it looks like you might have to trim off the side locating mounts on the Kadee 'box - a 2-second job if it's plastic, rather longer if it's metal.

[F-UnitMad]

Nice view of the real #378 here...

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=998326

[Chris116]

1 hour ago, F-UnitMad said:

The Atlas GP7 is a more recent model than the Atlas/Roco ones,  but not recent enough to have a Kadee/clone coupler. If you're lucky that screw might be in the right position for the centre hole in the Kadee draftgear box, and the height should be fine too, but it looks like you might have to trim off the side locating mounts on the Kadee 'box - a 2-second job if it's plastic, rather longer if it's metal.

I am keeping my fingers crossed on the coupling issue.

 

1 hour ago, F-UnitMad said:

Nice view of the real #378 here...

http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=998326

That is a nice photo. I have found a good number of photos of SOO 378, Milwaukee Road 974, Wisconsin Central 1562 and 2001. They are the four big diesels I have and always nice to more photos of them.

Edited November 30, 2020 by Chris116

[Chris116]

Looking at the stock box again and I am pleased to note that the Model Power D&RG Plymouth Industrial Diesel has Kadee-like couplings at both ends. Why didn't they do that for the steamer as well? I think I will be making that into a "Harbledown Railroad" loco so that the heritage operation has one steam and one diesel loco as a back up.

 

The stock that is giving me the most worry are the three Rivarossi Illinios Central passenger cars. They have loops like I used to have on my 009 stock and they are moulded onto the bogies with long bits of plastic. I don't think is is going to be easy to change them and I am also starting to think that they are too big for the layout as only two plus a loco would fit into the fiddle yard. I might sell them off and get three shorter carriages like the D&RG ones I have renamed to Harbledown Railroad stock.

[Sol]

One could look thru this list to see which coupler suits which loco   https://www.kadee.com/hocc.htm    and

https://www.kadee.com/documents/holist.pdf

[Chris116]

16 minutes ago, Sol said:

One could look thru this list to see which coupler suits which loco   https://www.kadee.com/hocc.htm    and

https://www.kadee.com/documents/holist.pdf

Thanks for the information.

[Allegheny1600]

On 29/11/2020 at 22:49, Chris116 said:

The Atlas GP7 says it is "Made in China" and as you may be able to see from the third photo has the couplings fitted with a screw. The GP7 has the same couplings as those wagons that are not Kadee type fitted. A quick look at the wagons proved they also had screw fitted couplings which should make my life easier when replacing them. Everything will be replaced with #5's and then I will consider if shorter (or longer) shanks are required. 

Hi Chris,

Nice loco! I’ve had a few Atlas locos of this vintage and your Kadee No. 5 or whatever, should fit that coupler box no problem.

Just unscrew the retaining screw and the box will come out in two parts, upper and lower (& the hornhook coupling!),  throw the hornhook away, pop the Kadee phosphor bronze centering spring in then the Kadee itself, reassemble, possibly with a puff of graphite powder and you’re done!

It takes less time than writing this!

Just make sure there are no burrs of plastic inside the box and that the Kadee swings easily in either direction and you should be good for years of maintenance free operation.

Cheers,

John

[Keith Addenbrooke]

Hi Chris, I’m following this with great interest - your project is ahead of mine, but I’ll have the same questions in due course: thanks for keeping us posted, Keith.

[Chris116]

2 hours ago, Keith Addenbrooke said:

Hi Chris, I’m following this with great interest - your project is ahead of mine, but I’ll have the same questions in due course: thanks for keeping us posted, Keith.

IT is a real learning curve for me having always been interested in UK railways, both real and model. I have found watching the Virtual Railfan live feeds on YouTube very helpful and the help I have received from people on here is invaluable. Good luck when you take the plunge. 

[Keith Addenbrooke]

21 minutes ago, Chris116 said:

IT is a real learning curve for me having always been interested in UK railways, both real and model. I have found watching the Virtual Railfan live feeds on YouTube very helpful and the help I have received from people on here is invaluable. Good luck when you take the plunge. 

Thanks Chris - nearly all the rolling stock I’ll need is either on it’s way, sourced but not yet shipped or here already.  When it’s all in one place I’ll do an audit, probably in the post-Christmas break.  Benchwork is the hurdle I need to overcome first though.