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Elizabeth Line / Crossrail Updates.


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If they have to add the words read when getting off the train from the platform side I hope they have stencils or transfers; or I can see some wonderfully jumbled messages appearing. But it makes sense that you have to mind the gap getting off as well as on the train.

Jonathan

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1 hour ago, Oldddudders said:

 

These stories will keep cropping up until the line is finally opened next year.

It's late (who could predict with total accuracy how long it would really take in reality?) .....and over budget (how many major infrastructure projects are within budget?)... but it's nearing completion and will serve London and surrounding areas for the next century.

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

..

Paddington Elizabeth Line Station has been handed over to TfL.

 

This video is a bit dull and stilted, but there is a tour down to the ticket hall and then the platforms, so we can get a good glimpse of the finished article.

 

 

 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hot on the heels of Paddington, Whitechapel station has been completed and the Crossrail platforms handed over to TfL.

Whitechapel is an interchange between London Underground, London Overground and the Elizebeth Line (Crossrail).

 

The London Overground platforms actually cross underneath the Underground lines at this location, so the Underground is overground and the Overground is underground...!!!!!

 

 

whitechapel_elizabeth_line_station_hando

 

whitechapel_elizabeth_line_station_hando

 

 

London Underground platforms, this way.....

 

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whitechapel_elizabeth_line_station_hando

 

 

Down to the Elizebeth Line....

 

whitechapel_elizabeth_line_station_hando

 

whitechapel_elizabeth_line_station_hando

 

 

 

 

 

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • 2 months later...

The current phase of the Crossrail project, Trial Running, is coming to a successful end.

This is where they've been running a live operation, to schedules and building up to full service levels, under operational conditions.

 

The final phase, Trial Operations, will be commencing in the next few weeks and should be concluded by February.

Trial Operations includes running around 150 live scenarios, will a full operational service and volunteer passengers for many of the exercises.

Full scale evacuations under a range of emergency scenarios, are part of this phase.

 

The window for going live is set between February to June.

 

If you're so inclined to spend time watching the latest London Assembly, Transport Committee hearing, which took place only a few days ago, there its a full update on progress so far and detail on all the issues involved.

The YouTube video is nearly 3 hours long., but it doesn't actually start until 18 minutes in.

The first hour is the most informative and there is so much information, it flies by.

 

 

 

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12 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

window for going live is set between February to June

Yes - painfully late. Worse, it seems gated as much by software debugging as anything - my profession. Not very impressive that the software is still being updated and tested this late in the project. I get the impression that the real issue is that of over-complexity of the whole system - perhaps this is the item to address for future projects.

 

Yours, Mike.

 

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1 hour ago, KingEdwardII said:

…..Not very impressive that the software is still being updated and tested this late in the project……


It’s entirely normal on large scale, complex, multi- integrated sysystems, especially where safety critical processes are involved.

 

1 hour ago, KingEdwardII said:

…..I get the impression that the real issue is that of over-complexity of the whole system - perhaps this is the item to address for future projects.…….


If you watch the video, Mark Wild, the Crossrail CEO, cites vast complexity of Crossrail, by its very ambition and nature, as well as complexity of the project and processes within the project, as 2 of the main factors why the  Crossrail programme went “off-course” and has taken so long.


The other main factor being the “mistake” of increasingly focussing on target dates and setting deadlines, which inevitably led to distortions in people’s mindset, behaviour and the way the project was led and run.


He points out that, as with all such large scale programmes, many lessons have been learned and that experience can only be useful for future large scale projects.

 

Crossrail may be “ painfully late”, but that shouldn’t be viewed as a negative thing, or as any sort of failure.

Yes the project went off the rails, but it has been recovered well and put in an even better place than it would have been otherwise.

All the design, planning and surveying in the world, cannot foresee all the realities of digging and constructing hundreds of feet underground, nor how the hundreds and thousands of contract interactions will work out on this scale.

The important thing is to get the job done and deliver a safe, robust, efficient and quality product, that has to be durable enough for the task it’s intended to perform.

Hopefully they’ve finally achieved that.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

“ painfully late”, but that shouldn’t be viewed as a negative thing, or as any sort of failure.

I tend to disagree with the idea that being late isn't negative. It is a failure somewhere along the line - often in the project planning and estimation stages. Although my understanding is that political pressures may have had a hand in things.

 

The lateness and the huge cost overruns have probably killed off CrossRail 2, so there are consequences.

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22 minutes ago, KingEdwardII said:

I tend to disagree with the idea that being late isn't negative. It is a failure somewhere along the line - often in the project planning and estimation stages. Although my understanding is that political pressures may have had a hand in things.

 

The lateness and the huge cost overruns have probably killed off CrossRail 2, so there are consequences.


At the outset, the timescales would have been nothing more than best calculated estimates, with the added parameter of the budget.

It’s also forgotten that nearly half of the cost overrun, was money included in the initial estimated cost, that was subsequently cut from the budget.

” we reckon it’s going to cost £10”

”OK, you can have £8 to do it”

…low and behold, it ends up costing £10.

In this case, it ended up costing quite a bit more as well. 
Partly because of the extended time frame and largely because it ended up being far more difficult and complicated in parts, than originally allowed for.

 

You are right about the knock on effect though.

TfL’s finances have been trashed by not realising the expectation of the EL revenue stream starting to be delivered on the original timescale.

That has caused a lot of damage.

Plus Crossrail 2 will be much harder to progress, even more so with the, as yet unknown, economic consequences of the pandemic on London’s longer term transport needs.


 

 

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Edited by Ron Ron Ron
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3 hours ago, KingEdwardII said:

I tend to disagree with the idea that being late isn't negative. It is a failure somewhere along the line - often in the project planning and estimation stages. Although my understanding is that political pressures may have had a hand in things.

 

The lateness and the huge cost overruns have probably killed off CrossRail 2, so there are consequences.

 

And we all know that project planners are so good at reliably estimating software complexity.  I hope the sarcasm is coming through ok.  I speak from vast experience of being a techie on huge programmes subjected to the wet finger/pin the tail on the donkey estimation techniques which so many planners seem to excel at. 

 

First priority should always be to get it right and in a choice between getting it right and being on time then getting it right should win every time.  The point that a lot of people don't get is that nobody remembers how late it was if it works well day in day out when it finally comes on line.  By contrast nobody gives two hoots it was on time if it breaks down every day.

Edited by DY444
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3 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

Crossrail 2 will be much harder to progress

I think that now, the political situation with respect to the North of England transport situation means that an expensive project in the south like Crossrail 2 cannot make progress until some serious improvements have been made there. Probably right too - the route from Liverpool via Manchester to Leeds and other parts of Yorkshire is pretty dire.

 

Yours, Mike.

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38 minutes ago, KingEdwardII said:

I think that now, the political situation with respect to the North of England transport situation means that an expensive project in the south like Crossrail 2 cannot make progress until some serious improvements have been made there. Probably right too - the route from Liverpool via Manchester to Leeds and other parts of Yorkshire is pretty dire.

 

Yours, Mike.

 

Indeed.

CR2 or any other large transport infrastructure programmes in the SE would attract a lot of heavy political and media flack, if substantial improvement schemes are not delivered in "the north" (whatever that is) .

 

 

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2 hours ago, DY444 said:

 

And we all know that project planners are so good at reliably estimating software complexity.  I hope the sarcasm is coming through ok.  I speak from vast experience of being a techie on huge programmes subjected to the wet finger/pin the tail on the donkey estimation techniques which so many planners seem to excel at. 

 

First priority should always be to get it right and in a choice between getting it right and being on time then getting it right should win every time.  The point that a lot of people don't get is that nobody remembers how late it was if it works well day in day out when it finally comes on line.  By contrast nobody gives two hoots it was on time if it breaks down every day.

 

I would say that to a degree it depends on the project. Certainly, for projects such as Crossrail or HS2, I'd agree better to be late and get it right than be on time and not work properly. However some projects such as Olympics-related infrastructure (or an IT project I was involved in a few years ago) have unchangeable deadlines, which isn't to say such projects can't/shouldn't be revisited after 'completion date' in order to ensure ongoing benefits.

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But I think that there is also a need in all projects to keep them as simple as possible, not be deviated from the agreed proposals when "good ideas" are floated later and have firm budgets which can be kept to, not as has been mentioned above, budgets which are then cut, or worse, "budgets" which are designed to get a project approved in the full knowledge of those preparing them that they are unrealistic but it will be too late to stop the project when the paymasters realise.

Perhaps I am biased, having worked in a profession (magazine and book publishing) where both deadlines and costs are unchangeable. How often have I worked half the night to get magazines out on schedule? Ask my wife!

Jonathan

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