Building kits for Tyneside in the BR era. J24 and PDK D49/2

[Daddyman]

Thanks, Mike - possibly just me being slow that day. 

 

John, there are lots of photos of these if you look on the internet. Google something like "Derwenthaugh kitson" or "Consett kitson" or "NCB loco Derwenthaugh/Consett" and you'll find a few. I squared off the bufferbeams on mine, and changed the shape of the valance ends too. 

 

Here are the buffer beams: 

  

 

I also knocked this up for the safety valve cover. I wanted to try to imitate the rust-nibbled edges of the boiler clothing so made the circle in the tube very rough: 

 

You'll see that lots of the locos have holes in the top line of the cab front and rear. If I remember these are rivets in the kit, and I drilled them all out using the rivets dimples as a guide. I replaced the window rims with tube, too, to get a better fit: 

 

[Daddyman]

Also, if you're getting to the cab, you need to change the shape of the RH cab side sheet: none of the Derwenthaugh locos [CORRECTION: SEE PHOTOS LATER IN THIS THREAD OF NUMBER 46] had the shape supplied in the kit: I have photos of 41, 42 and 48 with the shape shown below (the kit is correct for the other side): 

In this photo you can just see there's a hinged flap, shaped like the other cab side, which can be positioned to close off the gap; but it was invariably left open.  

The other side of the cab was not and is still today not used: the doorway is blocked up with planks and used as a coal bunker. So the alteration to the aperture was not made on that side.   

Edited March 2, 2021 by Daddyman

[Michael Edge]

41 looks as if it's been altered at some time - 45 was the same shape as the kit, also at least some built by Kitsons and Hudswell Clarke. There are lots of differences between all these locos and they were more or less continually altered over their lives, I doubt whether any two remained the same for very long.

[rowanj]

I'm sorely tempted to have a go at the cab side modification, David, but I'm not sure I trust myself. One option, I suppose, would be to use the etch in the kit as a template for a scratch version and see how it goes.

Just for the avoidance of doubt, can you or Mike confirm where the cab sides go- on the floor or on the footplate?

I hope Mike isnt too ashamed of my efforts - I'm really enjoying building his kit.

John

[rowanj]

I'm sorely tempted to have a go at the cab side modification, David, but I'm not sure I trust myself. One option, I suppose, would be to use the etch in the kit as a template for a scratch version and see how it goes.

Just for the avoidance of doubt, can you or Mike confirm where the cab sides go- on the floor or on the footplate?

I hope Mike isnt too ashamed of my efforts - I'm really enjoying building his kit.

John

[Daddyman]

1 hour ago, rowanj said:

I'm sorely tempted to have a go at the cab side modification, David, but I'm not sure I trust myself. One option, I suppose, would be to use the etch in the kit as a template for a scratch version and see how it goes.

Just for the avoidance of doubt, can you or Mike confirm where the cab sides go- on the floor or on the footplate?

I hope Mike isnt too ashamed of my efforts - I'm really enjoying building his kit.

John

Scratchbuilding the side sheet is is a good idea, John - or just go slow and steady; you have done harder jobs on your builds; I don't think you have anything to be afraid of! Like you, I copied the kit part first when I did it myself. If you have a go, the modified vertical part of the cab side should be 8.5mm-ish wide. 

 

The cab sides go on the outside edges of the floor - that is, on the footplate. 

 

A photo here to confirm the shorter cab handrail is not vertical - took me ages to work out the trigonometry of that!

 

[Michael Edge]

That cab side looks as if it has been gas axed off - and not very neatly either. 

[Daddyman]

30 minutes ago, Michael Edge said:

That cab side looks as if it has been gas axed off - and not very neatly either. 

There was a lot of that going on - you'll have seen the pictures of the hole flame cut out of (at least) the LHS lower cab side for the cab-to-shore radio. Photo of the equipment - or at least the brackets - if anyone wants to model it! 

  

[Michael Edge]

I wondered what that hole was for!

[ArthurK]

The photo of the cab interior above  clearly shows a hinged plate folded back against the front cab sheet. my photo shows  it closed.

ArthurK

Edited February 27, 2021 by ArthurK
Additional comment.

[ArthurK]

3 hours ago, Michael Edge said:

I wondered what that hole was for!

Here is another view of that hole!

The gubbings in front of it looks like it may be a cover for it.

 

ArthurK

[rowanj]

I can hear the cries of "Chicken" ringing out. I did have couple of attempts at the RH cab side, but wasnt convinced I got it correct. I WILL persevere, as I want to build another of these locos in due course, but dont want to ruin this one. 

So the cab is as designed, and it went together well, The back is just posed there while I fit an extra couple of details to the interior when it's easiest to get the iron inside,

I'm truly grateful for all the advice I've had so far with the build.

[rowanj]

I got the boiler rolled, and cut out what was needed to get a Highlevel RR+ into it. I need to identify what I assume are the covers for the bunkers where they extend outside the cab. 

in the meantime, here are a couple of interesting  photos - an undated picture of 41 in NCB livery before the cab side alteration, and 46 in the condition as provided in the kit.

 

 

Edited March 1, 2021 by rowanj

[Daddyman]

Very interesting! Two super finds there! 

 

Also suggests the wheels were possibly black in the NCB livery. Note the tank balance pipe painted red too. 

 

46 has riveted tanks, too, rounded corners to the buffer beams, a one-piece dome cover, and no rims on the rear cab windows. I've blown up both pictures and the rear of the tanks has a flat top, meaning that the tank tops themselves are flat on both locos. 

Edited March 2, 2021 by Daddyman

[Michael Edge]

Different chimney on 46 as well, the more we look at these locos the more differences come to light!

Thanks for finding the photos.

[Pebbles]

You are just going to love this, but are the tanks wider on 41, or the cab narrower? 

[rowanj]

1 hour ago, Pebbles said:

You are just going to love this, but are the tanks wider on 41, or the cab narrower? 

Don't be silly, Pebbles -it's just a trick of the camera....please....

 

Mike- are there covers for the bunkers, where they extend out from the cab on each side, on the etches? I confess I can't spot them.

Edited March 2, 2021 by rowanj

[Michael Edge]

I didn't know whether these were covered or not when I built the first one but since then it has become apparent that the part immediately in front of the cab is (at least in most of them) actually the trailing sandbox with a filler and operating rod on the top - no parts provided for these.

The tanks are wider than the cab side sheets in the kit.

[Daddyman]

 

[Michael Edge]

Yes, I've got those photos now but didn't have much when I started on this design.

[Barry O]

one of these is my "roundtuit" pile..  I weathered the loco Mike has shown (to a photograph no less!) and also a P4 one built by Mike

 

 

 

There are some nice photos on this thread - and various colour shots of the locos at Derwenthaugh in a book on North Eastern Industrials.. so mine will be weathered but won't include the modified cab sides or the "telephone" box cut out.. I know my limitations!

 

This build really is getting me motivated to build mine.

 

Baz

Edited March 3, 2021 by Barry O

[rowanj]

The photos from Baz are really helpful, and if I can get mine half as good, I'll be more than happy.

 

Coupling rods are now fitted. You need, obviously, to use those provided for the extended wheelbase, John.!!

I couldn't resist checking how things looked with the boiler and a tank, chimney and dome in place. I used Blutack, but a puff of wind brings the whole house down.

 

There was no safety valve amongst the mouldings, so I'll need to PM Mike. I wasnt going to bother, but No 46 or the black No 41pictured earlier are  obvious candidates, given the shape of the RH cab side, and both are still carrying the original design. I know the chimney shape is wrong for 46, but it will be a less obvious issue in the event that I cant either modify what is in the kit or track something down in the spares box.

 

I'm also starting to think about livery. I'd quite like the NCB Green, and in the photos, it looks quite like LNER Green, Baz' shots look a bit darker, but I know photos can be deceiving. I'm also struggling to find a source or transfers - Railtec do a set which look possible, but dont include a 4 or 6, strangely enough.

 

 

Edited March 4, 2021 by rowanj

[Daddyman]

45 minutes ago, rowanj said:

I'm also struggling to find a source or transfers - Railtec do a set which look possible, but dont include a 4 or 6, strangely enough.

 

I spoke to them about this some years ago (2017) and got this reply: "But the point you make about a lack of 4/6/9 in the generic pack is certainly a useful one, so it's likely that the pack will evolve on a future print iteration to include these."  

[rowanj]

39 minutes ago, Daddyman said:

I spoke to them about this some years ago (2017) and got this reply: "But the point you make about a lack of 4/6/9 in the generic pack is certainly a useful one, so it's likely that the pack will evolve on a future print iteration to include these."  

I have .mailed them, David, so will see what happens. I was simply looking at the illustration of the sheet on their site, so it may have been updated.

Regards John

[Barry O]

The colour photo on the cover of a North Eastern industrials book (Book Law) shows No41 in almost a light blue NCB colour - the yellow and black wasp stripes are correct.. not sure if green turns to light blue over time.. but it looks a nice colour for the loco!

 

@Michael Edge can say what colour he painted both of these locos. The first one was the easiest to weather.. and it was a delight to do!

 

Baz

Edited March 4, 2021 by Barry O