Jump to content
 

SCC - Sparkshot Custom Creations - 3D Printed Loco Kits etc Various Scales


Recommended Posts

No worries, ChrisN.  :)

Everyone please look at the previous page for oodles of pics that may interest you.

 

For those that have already seen the oodles, please look at the last picture I posted, the 'bog monster' and zoom in on the Z threaded rod.

 

Looks like there is STILL a thick LUMP of grease.

 

Must have missed that one.

 

Upon seeing it in the photograph I checked the printer and confirmed the image accurate.  Finger and brush spread it about a bit.  

 

Maybe THAT is what is causing the diagonal line in almost every print.   Hope so as it could be cured now.

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Heya Gavin, so how does this material compare to FUD/FXD in terms of durability?

Just saw your post after I posted the post.....it seems very similar so far.

 

FUD/FXD is an acrylic based resin,  this is resin.....ya.  Seems comparable.  Bit of flex then piiiing!  Like FUD, if you crack a bit off the cuts are clean so a wee superglue provides a perfect join.

 

Sands beautifully.

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Any good?

 

Quibbles aside I'm really impressed.

I WANT to get things perfect for anyone who would want things but currently I don't know what is or is not fixable. Would things at the current level be acceptable to anyone if things can't improve? Less clean up and smoothing required than a Shapeways print, way cheaper...you're modellers right? :D

 

A very interesting set of posts echoing my own recent experience and thoughts. I was lucky that first print out of box was good, using stock resin and settings but am struggling to get consistent results and that will be a obstacle to offering to others or at least an understanding that 1/4 or whatever is a dud and allowing for that in pricing etc, material wastage and the like. Interesting last sentence, because that comparison should be the benchmark with anything sold on the basis that some finishing, sanding may be needed etc, that they aren't getting perfection.

 

I'd also be interested to know what your research on the possible causes of diagonal lines were as my recent prints have them too.

 

Anyway, keep up the good work!

 

Jon

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

To my mind, diagonal lines are a z-axis error, so it's an issue with that mechanism, either on the screw side (an obstruction requiring increased torque might be enough to cause the motor to drop a step) or on the controller/software side. If the line appears in about the same place each time (eg. 3cm from the build plate) to me it'd lean towards some sort of obstruction, a roughness or perhaps a burr on a part somewhere in the mechanism. If the line appears in very different places I might lean towards suspecting something electrical or software, which might be trickier to isolate and fix.

 

But I'd expect there are folk out there who know a lot more than I do!

 

Either way, the results are very promising.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm thinking that thick lump of grease I failed to notice yet then smooth evenly over everything might be it as it seems to be in most prints once and not repeatedly.  Lets hope so.  

 

3D printing is not injection moulding, etched metal or RTR and a bit of post print finishing is always needed.

 

However, I think we are getting close to injection moulded looks.  Certainly better than sanding as much as we are used to.

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

For a second I wondered if it might have been a wiggle on the vat, but I think that would create thinner 'undulations'. Fingers crossed on the grease - it'd be the easiest to fix!

 

I had no idea that went on on that Hub website, I'm sorry it happened to you.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

N Gauge LB&SCR E2 Extended Tank Attempt 2. Worked.

 

Basically perfect bar some vertical ridging. I did spread the excess grease around the Z screw so it is more even so I doubt that is what caused it,

however the prints were not printed at right angles to the bed. I am doubtful this should make a difference. Then again, maybe it does. Will try again tomorrow with different settings.

These settings will be saved though as to my mind they are close to perfect bar the quibbles.

 

Ok so here is the print with a Rule below for size comparisons. Tank sides look a bit....iffy.

wbDFCcb.jpg

 

xQkTvoe.jpg

 

z8q2cXw.jpg

 

2Ayb3Po.jpg

 

syPOB6M.jpg

 

 

After support clean up...

K1HjPJ1.jpg

xjuolnn.jpg

 

After some pip filing...

86DPcID.jpg

 

After a blasting of primer. Details are clearly seen along with those lines. They look bad but can barely be detected with the finger.

I still want them out if possible though.

YgXglmd.jpg

Ldystdc.jpg

YOKkxZn.jpg

ubiuP58.jpg

 

A FAIR COMPARISON

 

I brought one of these from Shapeways a while ago in their best material, the FXD / SFDP. I broke a step at some point and the cab beading has since been redesigned as you will see on my yellow one.

Other than that, both models have had no surface smoothing and just a bit of paint applied. Lets see how they compare...

 

Right from the off it is apparent the bunker on the Shapeways FXD is fairly rough. This is becasue when they melt the wax supports away it always leaves one side of the model rougher than the other.

At the moment it seems my models are following a similar theme, but I digress. The FXD bunker is pretty 'WSF' looking whereas my Photon print, other than the evidence of support pips is rather smooth.

VR0d51e.jpg

LztmUJU.jpg

 

Similarly, the top of the tanks on mine look rather smooth whereas the Shapeways print has long lines going across it, rather like my tank sides.

C6c0uMn.jpg

hsuI6AE.jpg

C6Pt9Nl.jpg

rOTqV7l.jpg

jwSnw4H.jpg

 

To be fair though, the Shapeways one I think wins on crispness here...just.

 

So, to finish off I'll leave you with a repeat picture to have the last 'word' so to speak, one without the visible lines.

UUXxwoT.jpg

 

Comments and advice appreciated. :)

 

Same applies, either at this current quality or a bit better (no lines if possible) is anyone interested?

They'd be cheaper.

 

Will be trying again tomorrow with settings where the print is parallel with the tray sides, then I'll resume 4mm attempts for the E2-X V2.

(In case anyone is wondering where the missing details on these prints are. I'll only attempt to print them once I'm happy with the bodies.)

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites

Looking very nice, comparable quality to the prints I'm getting from FormLabs machines (if I had a spare £5k kicking around, I'd have bought one by now, they're very good). I have experienced issues with additional lines appearing on some of my prints (see pic), and was told by the supplier that it was an optics issue with the printer, so I don't know if that helps with tracing your problem. Anyway, they reprinted it for me, so now I have to find uses for two of them...

 

post-25124-0-13574800-1542961069_thumb.jpg

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

While vaguely aware of Shapeways stuff and the scope for home printing, I have not followed progress. Looking at your E2 I can see enormous strides have been made.

 

Back 50 years or more, slotcar modellers were buying cheap clear acetate bodies and putting a chassis underneath. The more gifted were turning the cars into real jewels. Your example here is light-years more advanced, and surely more detailed than white-metal kits from my yoof. I am sure that many modellers could make it into a stunning model.

 

Impressed!

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, for the comments and likes etc.

 

N Gauge E2s attempt two.

 

The one I printed above was printed as a set of two. I did the same again but with different settings.

The result isn't too bad but I think the above example is better. On this one the buffers and tank undersides were not supported enough resulting in bowed lengths and missing buffer head bottoms, vertical lines along the tanks have gone yet the horizontal lines going through the tank sides in the E2 and wagon prints I did is back (*Sigh*) and the stepping is more obvious, although again not really bad. Bit of usual smoothing would sort it quick enough. The pictures make things look worse than reality. Remember, this is N gauge. Tiny.

 

Anyway... One didn't turn out. Scrap yard prop me thinks...

Z6plT4n.jpg

 

 

The other one turned out ok.

cJHNR0s.jpg

 

Rear stepping more obvious this time round

lLpgpUK.jpg

 

The higher more sharp angle one is the other one I printed the other day that I didn't show you, the lower more gradual angled one is today's' print.

ullQA59.jpg

 

Prime blast reveals the details and imperfections more, newer one on the right. They do look worse in the zoomed in pictures than reality and as usual a bit of smoothing sorts them, but for the sake of science and transparency here they are, warts and all.

P9C3ciH.jpg

 

Same thing, newer one on the right with worse stepping than previous attempt.

AC5f7IO.jpg

 

Previous...

ggPqciY.jpg

 

VS New...

k4ThqgZ.jpg

 

Previous...

zvXl75z.jpg

 

VS New...

Sucm7pN.jpg

 

Both

pSTPWTo.jpg

xsxgS9y.jpg

 

So, I do not believe the newer print is a right off by any means. They do look worse in the ptictures than reality due to light shadows and the zoomed in nature of things. That said I want them perfect. :(

 

Is it possible? Will all prints have a choice of vertical or horizontal lines going through them? It is looking like it so far. They don't take that long to smooth of but it isn't the point.

 

You can't even feel the imperfections 90% of the time they are that minor yet they look iffy.

 

Anyway, I'll revert to the older settings and make a tweak as I think the older settings made a better print.

 

What ye think?

 

Again, with these issues if I can't get them ironed out would anyone still be interested in obtaining any?

Although offering some things cheaper than Shapeways is my goal I'd like to get the quality to match too. So far it is looking like the general quality easily matches or is better than their FXD but with aforementioned quibbles included. Remedial smoothing is much less with these Photon prints in comparison, that's a plus.

 

I'm just now frustrated as I'm starting to doubt a print is possible with out at least something requiring a bit of remedial work.

 

Comments please! Could do with advice or thoughts.

 

I've had a word with Atso who has kindly advised on a few things so I can try them. In mean time I'm rather worried and frustrated. :(

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

If there are less imperfections than with FXD, which can easily be smoothed down, and they are cheaper then I would have no problems buying such a print.  When you buy from Shapeways you know that you have to do some cleaning up so why should people buying these need them perfect?

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I follow the same logic so hoping some may want some (Anyone PM/email me if interested). I now have 6 (8!) of them as have been doing more prints.

 

As to perfections, it is possible and people do manage to get perfect prints so likewise if at all possible I want them perfect. I'm all about quality.

 

I don't want to sell sub par items really (or full price at least) knowing the printer is capable of perfection.

 

Been printing at different angles. Even thickened up the tank sides for this latest one.

 

All prints have horizontal line going through it 50% through the print regardless of angle.

 

:-/

 

Dunno.

Edited by Knuckles
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks, Richard.

 

The sloping angle can't be changed mid print.

 

I tried another print yesterday at a different angle similar to above pictures and 50% through still got the line.

 

Today I printed one as a horizontal print (not generally advised) today and generally print is fine.

 

However, 50% through the print there was a line again.

 

Printing as we speak. Around 21:10 I'll probably have some more lines 50% through, even though it is at a very sharp 45 degree angle.

 

Before these N gauhe E2 prints I did the 4mm E2-X print. Half way through the print - line.

 

Before that I was printing wagon bodies...

 

You know what I'm going to say. 50% through....

 

:(

 

Wondering if it a software thing seeing as model orientation, height and scale seems to still invite the line half way in.

 

I do also believe the prints are better than most Shapeways FXD as the photographs show. But I want the lines out for us all.

Banging my head against the wall wasting a lot trying different things.

 

Help.

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Richard, appreciate that.

 

Today I printed the same thing twice at different orientations. Same line issue although further inspection reveals it could be bulging so I may add stretcher bars to the mesh and try again.

 

Now the one above that ye have all seen, this one...

k4ThqgZ.jpg

Sucm7pN.jpg

 

Now looks like this...

dbwKYRd.jpg

XYBke5m.jpg

 

I also printed the horizontal one previously mentioned and this 45 degree angled one that still had lines but was a fairly good print overal. Had 'plank' stepping though...

sHn1iJH.jpg

3OtGKcu.jpg

 

Now looks like this...

MxetX9F.jpg

sgMFWm6.jpg

 

So far I think the 30-35 degree angled prints seem best.

 

Now as to smoothing it was a case of initial coat of filler primer being wetted with a finger and lightly rubbing with a fibre glass brush/pen between the rivets, blowing the bits away and repeating. As you likely know, with filler primer having the area wet makes a bit of primer cream to fill areas.

 

It didn't take too long. Altogether about 5-15 minutes per print (I didn't time things) smooth, prime, smooth, prime...yay...etc.

 

So again. I heartfully do want these perfected, but if it doesn't happen then at least smoothing the print is still significantly quicker and easier than smoothing FXD and they'd be cheaper.

 

That's a plus.

 

Atso wrote a good 3D print article on smoothing in this months N Gauge Journal. Worth a read. :)

 

Any further thoughts on all this?

 

Got 10 of these now. Only neee the one! :D

Will try the stretcher bars. The 4mm E2-X had bulging where the lines are too so I am suspecting maybe the tank sides need bolstering up. Then again, the wagons I printed had the line in too. :-/

Edited by Knuckles
  • Like 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

Of course - a fold rather than mechanical. If that's what it is, then the same thing happened to me with an open wagon. Nice big fold on the diagonal. A load more supports, some diagonal to stop twisting did the trick too.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

No, not that, and it depends on the software you are using to create the supports. It looks like most of your supports are plain vertical supports with a few having the zigzag bracing. If you are able to manually add supports and move the end points of the supports around, place a support on the left side of the loco, then drag the base to the right, then place another on the right side of the loco and drag the base to the left so that the two supports intersect.

 

Hopefully this helps.

 

My previous duff version (I'd like to say original duff version, but I had a number of them - supports are a bit of an art). You can just about see the lines from top right to bottom left - these were folds in the model, which has caused the left hand side of the door to buckle. Also, the top edge has a curve on it. The wagon didn't have a floor and was printed upside down.

 

post-14192-0-16472900-1543173686_thumb.jpg

 

It and the one below were done in B9 Creator. In the future I'm swapping over to Moai Asura software as it becomes less buggy, which creates ladders (like your zig-zag supports) which is more stable.

 

After some advice, I turned the wagon the right way up, added the floor and a lot more support along with the cross-members.

 

post-14192-0-10634300-1543172672_thumb.jpg

 

That gave me this.

 

post-14192-0-51645700-1543173974.jpg

 

And here's the 1/2 painted wagon. As you were saying about your detail, I'm really pleased with mine - it's even possible to see the individual springs and the nuts holding the buffers to the beams.

 

post-14192-0-46039400-1543173341_thumb.jpg

 

Hope that helps.

 

Jason

  • Like 7
Link to post
Share on other sites

If you haven't joined the Photon facebook group yet, then I'd recommend it for getting almost any issue sorted:

 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/AnycubicPhoton/

 

There's a whole wide-ranging variety of users, from dentists to jewellerymakers and all in between who have usually encountered almost any quirk or problem with finish, supports and so on.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Apologies to all for my radio silence. Been quite busy past few days.

I've been a member of the Photon FB group since before I dived in and nabbed a machine. I have to say everyone there is very helpful and friendly so far.

 

With the wagon above, the ones I did were printed with similar looking supports but at a less extreme angle. The description of crossing the supports over I don't think is possible with the default Anycubic slicer, but I could be wrong. Many people have been suggesting I use this or that slicer instead but for now at least I'll keep using the same one. Only once I've concluded I need to really use another will I move on.

 

I printed an 'Abe' from Abes Oddysee/Exodus and it didn't have any lines so I'm still thinking the thin walls and tanks might be to blame as they bulged out a wee where the lines are.

 

For printing on the Photon obviously I don't have to worry about constantly pandering to Shapeways ever increasing conservative printing tolerances and worrying about thinning the walls to save cost so

I'll thicken the insides up a bit and add those aforementioned stretcher bars to lock the gauge and see what happens.

  • Like 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

Evening Folks,

 May I pick your brains  - I've just purchased a Photon and I'm having problems with printing. Using Anycubic grey resin, I can manage to print at 100 microns, but obviously at the expense of finer detail.

 My prints fail after a beep from the machine, then the x-axis stops moving but the machine seems to still be going through the motions of reading from the memory stick.

 I'm wondering what settings people are using, as I've seen some cracking prints on this site, so fine detail looks achievable...

Thanks,

Gaz.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...