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61656

Christleton Junction - 1986 - It’s back (or it will be)

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You could have oil trains off / to Stanlow running via Hooton (rev) and then Chester / Christleton to Crewe and beyond.

Thanks Beast. Were the Stanlow tanks 4 wheelers or bogie vehicles?

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Thanks Beast. Were the Stanlow tanks 4 wheelers or bogie vehicles?

 

Yes ! - either

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Yes ! - either

A bit more research over the weekend shows that this could have some interesting moves - and causes another headache in terms of insufficient electric loco stabling. I'm wondering if a centre road in the terminal platforms may be a solution.

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More progress on the boards to report, with boards 3 and 4 now assembled. Board 4 has the first open plan section, which wasn't as challenging as I'd thought. It's the next one along that really opens out the scenery though.

 

I did have some issues with the size of the board tops being slightly too big - it turns out the Victorian cellar wasn't built uniformly to tolerances of less than 1mm, so raising the board by 100mm meant it no longer fitted. I'll check the original warranty on the house, but you can guarantee I'll get no comeback from the builder!

 

I have in my head how the boards are going to be fixed together, but I'm keen to hear any views. There are a couple of issues in that I have no access to the board undersides or farsides - and indeed board 3 is entirely landlocked. My intention is to use metal locating dowels on the board ends and to have some form of clasp on the board tops which will be hidden under buildings etc.

 

Also, the camera is a great friend in keeping quiet about some issues with levels; board 2 has a distinct touch of the Lickeys that will need addressing! Tracklaying is another step closer though...

 

post-20618-0-25157600-1464860001.jpeg

 

post-20618-0-35805000-1464860015.jpeg

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A bit more research over the weekend shows that this could have some interesting moves - and causes another headache in terms of insufficient electric loco stabling. I'm wondering if a centre road in the terminal platforms may be a solution.

 

Remember that layouts evolved over the years, more often than not being derived from a pre 1900 layout so careful consideration as to what would originally have been provided and then become available after maybe 100 years of evolution yields a realistic plan. I quite like drawing out early layouts in pencil and then, using a rubber, winding the clock forward to see what would be left. All "what if?" of course.

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Remember that layouts evolved over the years, more often than not being derived from a pre 1900 layout so careful consideration as to what would originally have been provided and then become available after maybe 100 years of evolution yields a realistic plan. I quite like drawing out early layouts in pencil and then, using a rubber, winding the clock forward to see what would be left. All "what if?" of course.

I really like that idea, and it's something I'd already given a little bit of thought to. The diesel shed is on the site of the old steam shed (I have wondered about a turntable or a former one, but space is too limited), which is predominantly for trains reversing in the terminal platform or yard. So I have landed myself a pleasingly believable problem that changing traction on through trains wouldn't have happened in steam days and now there are no facilities to do it. The answer is probably to go look at places where that really happened.

 

I am going to sketch out the steam shed though, as that may help with my nagging doubt that it will look too conveniently like five sidings in the corner. You already have me musing an old steam shed with a low budget 70's diesel facility tacked on. Leeds Holbeck maybe?

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Board 5 is now constructed - something of a delay as I was on holiday on the footplate of a 45 (albeit the coal fired variety 45xx). It's starting to look a little bit like a model railway might appear now!

 

Board 6 is up next, which needs the top either reprofiling or recutting as the curve isn't smooth enough, then it's the really tricky hinged board 7.

 

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post-20618-0-80078500-1466194006_thumb.jpeg

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More progress to report and I'm pleased to say that all the scenic section baseboards, numbers 1 through 7, are now assembled.

 

Below is board 6, which is where the lines from Chester and Warrington come in over the viaduct and where the diesel depot will be in the corner. The left side of this board also has some uprights for where the road will pass underneath. Most of the viaduct will be filled in - either with a retaining wall or used as small business lets - which allows for support under the 6mm ply board top and gives plenty of space for point machines. Careful planning was required to ensure that the road has a clear run underneath the railway avoiding any point motors.

 

post-20618-0-98197600-1467365583.jpeg

 

The next photo gives a better view of the road; the first recess to the left of the board is for point motors and the road gies through the next 'portal'. You can see another portal for a road to the right of the board at the start of board 7. I've allowed space for a Faller car system circle, just in case. The uprights are all vertical, despite the illusion of wonkiness in the photo!

 

post-20618-0-97985100-1467365610.jpeg

 

This view shows the station throat and the whole of the open plan baseboard section, I hope to be able to keep a nice smooth flow to the tracks coming in and splitting into the platforms.

 

post-20618-0-40694900-1467365645.jpeg

 

This shot is from above the tunnel portals, the double junction (Christleton North Junction) will be in the foreground, where the Chester and Warrington lines split. I've had to do some rearranging of the track layout here to avoid the hinged section splitting any points or crossings in two; I also wanted to avoid any point motors in the hinged section. There is space for a now redundant signal box on the left and possibly the remnants of a former engineer's yard. Fairly common during the electrification and resignalling programme on the West Coast was to leave former signal boxes in use as a ground frame, and I may use this here, although I want to avoid doing too much in too little space

 

post-20618-0-91302400-1467365707.jpeg

 

Finally, a view with the hinged section raised. It's a satisfyling snug fit, albeit relying on wooden interlocks. With 4 tracks across each join, I'll be looking for some form of metal guides and electrical interlocking to minimse derailment opportunities.

 

post-20618-0-16340700-1467365722.jpeg

 

The next steps will be to fit the metal alignment dowels and toggles to each of the boards. That will be followed by a final check of the track layout on the board tops before placing the order for the pointwork.

 

It is also time to create some space for the fiddle yard, which means getting rid of the test layout - for a brief period at least, I'll have to organise a replacement bus service.

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Some nice progress Mate, the boards are looking great. 

 

Cheers Peter.

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I recently inspected the work of Mr 61656, finding baseboards and planning for the scenic section to be at an advanced stage.  Following the consumption of several pints of a liquid which bore no resemblance to the 'tea' I'd gone round for, we stopped the inspection and started playing with the scenics around the road overbridge under the station throat...  Tantalising or what?

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I recently inspected the work of Mr 61656, finding baseboards and planning for the scenic section to be at an advanced stage.  Following the consumption of several pints of a liquid which bore no resemblance to the 'tea' I'd gone round for, we stopped the inspection and started playing with the scenics around the road overbridge under the station throat...  Tantalising or what?

Should be a bl**dy picture or two there

 

post-7439-0-16108400-1468521965_thumb.jpg

 

You need to imagine that the Metcalfe station is a row of terraces, that the coaching inn is a corner shop and that the brick arch bridge is a girder.

 

post-7439-0-28330800-1468521982_thumb.jpg

 

And that the road goes all the way to the backscene, and that there's a backscene.  Gonna be 'the' shot of this layout when it's done though

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Should be a bl**dy picture or two there

 

http://1.1.1.4/bmi/www.rmweb.co.uk/community/public/style_images/master/attachicon.gifIMG_20160709_220923034 (1280x720).jpg

 

You need to imagine that the Metcalfe station is a row of terraces, that the coaching inn is a corner shop and that the brick arch bridge is a girder.

 

http://1.1.1.4/bmi/www.rmweb.co.uk/community/public/style_images/master/attachicon.gifIMG_20160709_221606165 (1280x720).jpg

 

And that the road goes all the way to the backscene, and that there's a backscene.  Gonna be 'the' shot of this layout when it's done though

Was the best shot of the peak really the one with the brick wall flying through the background? :)

 

The beer and the scenery shots did at least distract me from the terrifyingly large number at the bottom of the spreadsheet calculating the cost of the trackwork. I have managed to make a small saving to that number by some re-adjustment of the track at the Crewe end of the station; I had previously removed a trailing crossover from the Chester end of the station, which allows the through platforms to commence some 600mm further right (which is to say North West), but I hadn't taken that into account at the other end of the platforms. The extra space means I have a less compact electric stabling point and can save on one, maybe even two, three way points.

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Hi 61656

 

You asked a question about WTT on another layout thread, I posted there but thought I would copy the post on to your own layout thread (I can see why you asked the question now! :D)

 

"61656, on 14 Jul 2016 - 17:15, said:

..........................I really like your attention to detail - where did you get the working timetables from? I'd love to pour over the ones for Chester and the North Wales Coast in the 1980's. I think the research element of the hobby is one of the most interesting parts and it's always great to find out that there's some great rolling stock opportunity you didn't previously know about.................

Andy

Ebay is a good source for old WTT, one website I have had dealings with is http://britishrailwaybooks.co.uk, I'm sure others are available.

 

For Chester and the North Wales coast in the 1980s, you are looking for London Midland Region WTT, Section CH (Passenger & Parcels) and Section CV (Freight)

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Several of the better-composed shots were a little like our vision later in the evening.  Blurred...

 

 

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More progress to report and I'm pleased to say that all the scenic section baseboards, numbers 1 through 7, are now assembled.

 

Below is board 6, which is where the lines from Chester and Warrington come in over the viaduct and where the diesel depot will be in the corner. The left side of this board also has some uprights for where the road will pass underneath. Most of the viaduct will be filled in - either with a retaining wall or used as small business lets - which allows for support under the 6mm ply board top and gives plenty of space for point machines. Careful planning was required to ensure that the road has a clear run underneath the railway avoiding any point motors.

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpeg

 

The next photo gives a better view of the road; the first recess to the left of the board is for point motors and the road gies through the next 'portal'. You can see another portal for a road to the right of the board at the start of board 7. I've allowed space for a Faller car system circle, just in case. The uprights are all vertical, despite the illusion of wonkiness in the photo!

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpeg

 

This view shows the station throat and the whole of the open plan baseboard section, I hope to be able to keep a nice smooth flow to the tracks coming in and splitting into the platforms.

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpeg

 

This shot is from above the tunnel portals, the double junction (Christleton North Junction) will be in the foreground, where the Chester and Warrington lines split. I've had to do some rearranging of the track layout here to avoid the hinged section splitting any points or crossings in two; I also wanted to avoid any point motors in the hinged section. There is space for a now redundant signal box on the left and possibly the remnants of a former engineer's yard. Fairly common during the electrification and resignalling programme on the West Coast was to leave former signal boxes in use as a ground frame, and I may use this here, although I want to avoid doing too much in too little space

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpeg

 

Finally, a view with the hinged section raised. It's a satisfyling snug fit, albeit relying on wooden interlocks. With 4 tracks across each join, I'll be looking for some form of metal guides and electrical interlocking to minimse derailment opportunities.

 

attachicon.gifimage.jpeg

 

The next steps will be to fit the metal alignment dowels and toggles to each of the boards. That will be followed by a final check of the track layout on the board tops before placing the order for the pointwork.

 

It is also time to create some space for the fiddle yard, which means getting rid of the test layout - for a brief period at least, I'll have to organise a replacement bus service.

Boards look really good, but a question if I may, Will your lifting flap hinges be raised above board level? If not the track ends will surly snag at the hinge end.

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Boards look really good, but a question if I may, Will your lifting flap hinges be raised above board level? If not the track ends will surly snag at the hinge end.

Now I was sure I had accounted for that and have been managing in quiet contentment. However, now I look at the board I wonder if I have confused 'accounted for' and 'don't forget to account for'. I am also a little concerned that the words 'parliament hinges' appear to be unticked on the parts list. I think you may have saved me some later grief! Thanks.

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Now I was sure I had accounted for that and have been managing in quiet contentment. However, now I look at the board I wonder if I have confused 'accounted for' and 'don't forget to account for'. I am also a little concerned that the words 'parliament hinges' appear to be unticked on the parts list. I think you may have saved me some later grief! Thanks.

Happy to help Andy, other than that little hick-up, it's really looking very good, with some excellent woodwork.

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Happy to help Andy, other than that little hick-up, it's really looking very good, with some excellent woodwork.

post-20618-0-04724700-1468958544.jpeg

 

Sorted. And inadvertently corrected a misalignment that I didn't know I had!

 

In other news, an NCE Powerpro is now on order. Time to man up and order some track...

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Hi 61656

This looks like all the makings of a cracking layout. I love the scenario you've created which will give a good variety of stock synonyms with the area.

I have fond memories of the line from Crewe to Holyhead having spent many happy hours bashing 37's up and down there.

Shall be following along now and looking forward to more updates.

Cheers

Marcus

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They say an Englishman's house is his castle, and you could certainly begin to suspect that there is a medieval moat trying to work its way into the cellar! Having lived in the house for 10 years, this was very much on my mind before deciding to put a model railway in the basement. Experience showed that the cellar is usually dry throughout the year, with some moistening of the floor through the winter. This year though, the cellar floor hasn't really dried off during the spring and early summer. This could just be an unusually wet year, or possibly because my installation of the kitchen units has in some way impacted the ventilation.

 

I decided that things had come to a head and invested in a dehumidifier on eBay. There's some ancient Latin phrase about buyer beware for which the literal translation is 'thou shalt give up your Saturday fixing the wretched thing'. Anyway, Saturday wasted, I am now extracting water at about the rate of 5 litres per day. This seems like a staggering amount, but it is definitely having an impact. It looks like we can all relax as the little machine should keep the environment dry enough for modelling for a significantly cheaper sum than damproofing the cellar.

 

More positive progress can also be reported on the baseboards, with boards 6 and 7 now having their lower scenic baseboard tops fitted. The pressure is definitely on, as the track has been ordered. I did contemplate doing several orders to spread the cost, but decided to swallow hard and get it all in one.

 

Track and controller should arrive in the next 3 months, which aligns with my target of having something running by Christmas. Focus now is on finishing the boards with alignment dowels and catches, building the 3 fiddleyard boards and getting the track areas covered in cork. Exciting times.

 

post-20618-0-09237700-1469081950.jpegpost-20618-0-20408500-1469081972.jpeg

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Boards are coming along well now.

Thanks, they are all 'complete' along thr scenic section now. The alignment dowels and joining toggles are all fitted.

 

I just need to decide on underlay now.

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Some pictures showing the completed boards, before and after the cutting of the underlay. The underlay is 5mm compressed foam (Depron-a-like); it is currently laid loose whilst the test piece is glued. I'll give it a few days to check that the Copydex-a-like doesn't just eat through it, but it looks fine so far.

 

As the track will be at least a couple of months before ii arrives, it means that attention can now turn to the fiddle yard boards; these will be 700mm wide, which should give 14 roads in total. My intention is to lay a very basic fiddle yard arrangement initially as, ignoring the fact I can only fill 3 roads, I want to operate the layout a bit and see what I actually want. 10 tracks will probably be sidings and 4 through roads, to allow me to sit and watch trains go past every now and again.

 

Prior to building the boards I may address the issue that I am rapidly replacing useable storage space with baseboard, so a few shelves above the fiddle yard would probably be useful.

 

post-20618-0-25700600-1469650118.jpeg

 

post-20618-0-69930600-1469650125.jpeg

 

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post-20618-0-24356500-1469650146.jpeg

 

post-20618-0-31848800-1469650154.jpeg

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A bit more progress to report, this time with the first two of the three fiddle yard boards. Before I could start on these I had to clear the space ready for them, which had rapidly become a dumping ground. I was also running short of space to store stock, continuously moving it around, which didn't seem like a good idea, so I decided a couple of shelves above the fiddle yard woule be useful. They are temporarily being used to store various bits out of the way whilst the boards are being constructed, eventually they'll have tracks for storage of lesser used rolling stock.

 

With the shelves in place, work has commenced on fiddle yard boards 8, 9 and 10. The tops are cut for all 3 and the frames finished for 8 and 10. Board 9 is a relatively simple straight board, only the second one on the whole layout. The boards then need the alignment dowels and toggles fitting.

 

I've also started thinking about rail connections over baseboard joints. The lift out section will need some serious copper clad and screws due to the constant use, but I've decided to copperclad the edges of all the other boards too, so I'll glue and screw a small piece of strip wood at the edge of each board. I don't intend taking the other boards apart very often, but I suspect temperature changes will play havoc with the alignment if I leave it to luck. Fortunatley being a Victorian cellar, the temperature doesn't vary too much, being uniformly real ale temperature all year.

 

Finally, I've been working on an improved hinge design for the lift out section, including accounting for overhead wires, although that seems on the face of it to be in the same category as general relativity.

 

post-20618-0-36927100-1470422153.jpeg

 

post-20618-0-01573600-1470422163.jpeg

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I believe the phrase is "oosh", or something similar.  Shout when it's tracklaying time.  Glad to see the foam & copydex-a-like idea being used too; where did you go for more information to dissuade you from cork?

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