Castle Aching

[Malcolm 0-6-0]

I simply blame vacuous "patriots" of the sort we see in a certain large nation who see flag waving as an antidote to every problem the politicians they admire create. Here we are in the middle of a pandemic and these same "patriots" are waving flags and demanding the end to self-isolation because it's a socialist plot. They are no different to those "patriots" of over a century ago who actually thought a malignant mess of blood feuds as was Serbia was worth the candle. One thing at least if they get their way then there'll be new infections and a few less "patriots" to create havoc. But enough of those thoughts 

 

 

[Edwardian]

8 minutes ago, Malcolm 0-6-0 said:

 

 

 

 

Excellent. To which I shall add the Sea Songs, part of the original military band version of the Folk Song Suite ...

 

 

[webbcompound]

All this highbrow stuff is all very well (and I am just as partial as the next person (on here), but if we are really concerned with what the majority of the passengers and population enjoyed listening (and singing along to), and what the soldiers undoubtedly sang in the trenches (The subalterns wind up Victrola playing classical music probably producing a chorus of raspberries) it is actually stuff like this 

 

I had had the subaltern's Victrola playing "The Lark Ascending" in best film cliche style, but although written in 1914 it apparently didn't premier until 1921

Edited April 19, 2020 by webbcompound

[Harlequin]

No apologies for suggesting another piece. Holst's "Brook Green Suite" is quintessential English Pastoral string music. (Sorry, also post-grouping .)

 

Sunshine, cornfields, hedgerows and oak trees in melodic form:

 

[St Enodoc]

7 minutes ago, webbcompound said:

All this highbrow stuff is all very well (and I am just as partial as the next person (on here), but if we are really concerned with what the majority of the passengers and population enjoyed listening (and singing along to), and what the soldiers undoubtedly sang in the trenches (The subalterns wind up Victrola playing classical music probably producing a chorus of raspberries) it is actually stuff like this 

 

Now we're talking.

 

The Galloping Major

Captain Ginjah

Does This Shop Stock Shot Socks?

Riley's Cowshed

Down on Jollity Farm

 

and loads more in the sheet music I inherited from my mother and her family.

[webbcompound]

Apparently "the Galloping Major" was a favourite of mine aged around 2yrs (though I'm not actually old enough to have listened first time round). If you know it you will understand why. And then I enjoyed the re-release of Jollity Farem by Mr Stanshalls excellent band whilst at Grammar School, especially as singing it appeared to cause immense irritation to all around. So to lift our spirits (There's a farm called Misery, but of that we'll have none")

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by webbcompound

[Compound2632]

There was a lot of cross-over. The interest in collecting traditional folk song fed into the English Pastoral school; traditional (mostly 18th/early 19th century) popular ballads, along with art poems in that style from Scott to Newbolt, were grist to the likes of Stanford and Parry - and Elgar - while the sub-Mendelssohnian style of second-rate Victorian composition degenerated into the sentimental ballads that infested every front parlour that could run to an upright piano.

 

One of the most surprising and effective English song cycles is Vaughan Williams' Songs of Travel, setting the poetry of Robert Louis Stevenson. It's just that little bit different to all those Housman settings - not that I'm against those, by any means. 

[Schooner]

6 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

effective

 

Absolutely this. Even without strong personal attachments to the cycle, they are fantastic settings.

[wagonman]

1 hour ago, Edwardian said:

Perhaps, though, we might stay in Norfolk by way of Vaughan Williams.  The opening of Rhapsody No.1 (1906, revised 1914 ) seems to anticipate (or reflect) the Fantasia (1910) and is surely heard in the Sea Interludes from Britten's Peter Grimes (1945)?

 

Anyway, the Rhapsodies are squarely in CA territory, both in time and place, as VW was apparently collecting Norfolk folk songs and drafting the composition in 1905-06, including a visit to King's Lynn in January 1905.  

 

I wonder if we'll see him on the Bishop's Lynn Tramway at some point!

 

 

 

...and a lovely selection of works by Norwich School painters...

 

 

 

[Andy Hayter]

10 hours ago, Malcolm 0-6-0 said:

 

I don't think it is a matter of political correctness that changes the view, it is instead the mass recognition of the reality of WW1. From 1815 until 1914 in Europe it had been a time of comparative peace and rising prosperity. Yes there had been various wars Crimea, those associated with the expansion of the Prussian state into modern Germany, Franco-Prussian etc. but these were small and didn't have direct impacts upon all the civilian populations of the states involved. They were also fought along the lines of what had been the traditional warfare forms i.e. set piece battles of short duration, clearly defined victors and losers and after the battles political moves to quick settlements of disputes. 

 

 

 

I think the population of Paris in 1870 would have disagreed with that.  Having to resort to eating cats, dogs,mice and rats then followed by the zoo animals - the horses having already been consumed - gives a view of how dire things became during the siege.  

The initial decision to not bombard the city was indeed to avoid the inevitable civilian casualties but was rescinded 3 months later when the city was extensively shelled.

[webbcompound]

40 minutes ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

 

I think the population of Paris in 1870 would have disagreed with that. 

And the populations of nearly every European country in the 1840s. The nobles decapitated by Galician peasants didn't have much to say about it afterwards though. The Austrian army appears to be paying per head in this painting.

[Donw]

1 hour ago, webbcompound said:

Apparently "the Galloping Major" was a favourite of mine aged around 2yrs (though I'm not actually old enough to have listened first time round). If you know it you will understand why. And then I enjoyed the re-release of Jollity Farem by Mr Stanshalls excellent band whilst at Grammar School, especially as singing it appeared to cause immense irritation to all around. So to lift our spirits (There's a farm called Misery, but of that we'll have none")

 

 

I remember listening to them on the John Peel radio show such delights as My pink half of the drainpipe, Intro outro and the delightful Brain Opera.

Don

[TT-Pete]

Many, many happy childhood memories of singing along to this with my Dad (much to Mum's annoyance):

 

 

[Hroth]

5 hours ago, Donw said:

I remember listening to them on the John Peel radio show such delights as My pink half of the drainpipe, Intro outro and the delightful Brain Opera.

 

Viv Stanshalls tales from Rawlinson End were good too! 

 

 

[Donw]

Recently I had cut out some extra munching because I was a little overweight and have lost about a stone. On the briefing today it was stated that the risk increased with the following factors

 

Over seventies are at increased risk.  

Males are at greater risk than females

Those overweight are at increased risk

 

My 71st birthday is in three weeks and I am male. Marions response was good job you lost that weight then. It is a good job after that annoucement I would have been put on a starvation diet until my weight was down. And there is little I can do about the first two. Admittedly the fact I gave up smoking at least 35 years ago  is a plus. The fact I get regular exercise daily is a plus.

Tesco delivery came to day. This one included a couple of bags of flour. First sighting of flour for weeks we were wondering where the hell it was all going. Should keep us going for a couple of weeks.

What exciting lives we lead.

 

Don

[robmcg]

Edwardian excellence...

 

2-cylinder Saint class 2975 'Viscount Churchill' about 1913. Built in 1903 as No.171 'Lord Palmer' as part of Churchward's experimental designs comparing French designs including 4-4-2s, it by the time of the picture it was re-named, had a 225lb cone boiler, superheating, top feed, and to all intents and purposes was your basic modern steam engine.

 

Why do people even pretend we have progressed in design, efficacy, beauty.

 

And we all know that everything real before 1936 was black and white... except of course pre-Raphaelites and other strange people....

 

Hornby Star and Hall to begin with.

 

[robmcg]

10 hours ago, Edwardian said:

 

Fascinating.

 

I had not heard of these albums - I will have a listen - but I had heard of The Young Tradition, as my father had this recording which always gave me goose bumps as a child .... 

 

 

And which, for me, has always had a wonderfully  bleak and mysterious North Country feel to it.

 

Through the Wonders of You Tube, I find that they also sang Dives and Lazarus, for which see also Vaughan Williams's variations (1939) .... 

 

 

I look forward to listening through Mainly Norfolk, which promises to reveal all sorts of unexpected lessons, such as the dangers of German piano tuners (!).

 

And a bit of Harry Cox, The Yarmouth Fisherman's Song

 

I quite like folk songs, even if they often follow the formulaic "As I went out one fair May morn ... never to return" format, and I am also mindful of Tom Lehrer's Theory of folk songs - Clementine!

 

Perhaps, though, we might stay in Norfolk by way of Vaughan Williams.  The opening of Rhapsody No.1 (1906, revised 1914 ) seems to anticipate (or reflect) the Fantasia (1910) and is surely heard in the Sea Interludes from Britten's Peter Grimes (1945)?

 

Anyway, the Rhapsodies are squarely in CA territory, both in time and place, as VW was apparently collecting Norfolk folk songs and drafting the composition in 1905-06, including a visit to King's Lynn in January 1905.  

 

I wonder if we'll see him on the Bishop's Lynn Tramway at some point!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

That picture, Sir, is exactly the type I use to draw rather well when I was 12 years old, in 6B pencil,  with such skill and aplomb that I was accused by teachers of taking an adult's work as my own, when the truth became known I was excused maths lessons and allowed free reign in the art room, being too far ahead in maths to be any use insuch classes.

 

I specialised in trans-Atlantic steamships in impossible, no improbable,  storm scenes, bows lifting dramatically, and so on.   It was just a phase. Then I was put into an academic stream in a High School...

[brianusa]

Irrespective of the political impact of these songs and hymns mentioned, its the music itself.  From the pastoral music mentioned to the Plymouth Royal Marines playing Valiant Heart followed by Sunset, should be a guaranty of goose pimples all over

     Brian.

Edited April 19, 2020 by brianusa
caps

[Nearholmer]

3 hours ago, Donw said:

This one included a couple of bags of flour.

Please post photos. I need to be reminded of what they look like, otherwise I might fail to recognise one when I see it.

[ianathompson]

1 hour ago, robmcg said:

And which, for me, has always had a wonderfully  bleak and mysterious North Country feel to it.

 

Fond memories of the Lyke Wake walk. The music seems apposite,

We left Osmotherly at  03.30am

Highlights included seeing the rising sun reflected in the windows of a HST on the ECML from Roseberry Topping,

rather offset by a simultaneous view of the orange smog over Middlesbrough visible at a turn of the head.

 

Re Vaughan Williams etc. If you want a good Norfolk tune try "King's Lynn".

The hymn tune was based on a fishing girl's tune picked up by Vaughan Williams.

 

It still gets a good airing in the Minster every so often. 

The previous (ex cathedral) organist set a mass to the tune which we usually sing at Parsh communion in Lent.

We also sing it at St Nicholas (when we decamp there), because that was the North End chapel.

The North End was the fishing community (although when I played football it seemed to have more than a fair share of London overspill nutters).

The relief chapel is the biggest in England and is usually mistaken for a Parish church by visitors to the town.

 

NB WHY IS THIS THE ONLY SITE THAT I USE WHERE TYPOS CANNOT BE EASILY DELETED BECAUSE THE EDITOR INSISTS ON DELETING EVERYTHING?

 

Ian T

[monkeysarefun]

2 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

Please post photos. I need to be reminded of what they look like, otherwise I might fail to recognise one when I see it.

I'm enjoying shopping here right now, mainly because of the unexpected nature of where things will pop up. Eg, go to service station to buy petrol, come out with a 5kg bag of flour (happenned last week). Go to local garden nursery to buy potting mix, come out with 48 rolls of toilet paper.. (weekend before last)

 

I also get to see different parts of the country on my search to find common household items. For instance I got to drive past the local train jail on my way to get some hand sanitiser.

 

 

Edited April 19, 2020 by monkeysarefun

[robmcg]

Dear Edwardian,

 

If you are going to show pictures of great beauty to accompany great music,, as in

 

 

and more dramatically,

 

 

could you please offer us some hope of balance with steam age deliverance, as per the GWR...?

 

 

Sincerely,

 

O V S Bulleid,  G J Churchward, and one other.

Edited April 19, 2020 by robmcg
foolishness

[Malcolm 0-6-0]

I must admit some mixed feelings about the Lyke Wake Dirge. Whilst if sung correctly it is a powerful work my earliest memories of it is in music classes early in high school where for some reason we were taught to sing it. Was it to drive home the grim forebodings of what was to happen as we got older, however, as it was sung by us, at least, a profoundly depressing piece.  

[Malcolm 0-6-0]

14 hours ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

 

I think the population of Paris in 1870 would have disagreed with that.  Having to resort to eating cats, dogs,mice and rats then followed by the zoo animals - the horses having already been consumed - gives a view of how dire things became during the siege.  

The initial decision to not bombard the city was indeed to avoid the inevitable civilian casualties but was rescinded 3 months later when the city was extensively shelled.

 

Well I think what I said still stands as this event however dire for the inhabitants of Paris the shelling was limited and resulted in quite low in civilian casualties. International mediation attempts were successful and the siege was raised letting in relief supplies. Plus during the Franco-Prussian War there was none of the prolonged slaughter as occurred on the Western Front in WW1 - basically because the Prussian forces were overwhelmingly better equipped and trained. The many household pets may have felt differently but their opinions were not considered in either that war or WW1.  

[Hroth]

5 hours ago, Malcolm 0-6-0 said:

The many household pets may have felt differently but their opinions were not considered in either that war or WW1.  

 

Or at the start of WW2 in the UK, when many pets were "put down" so they wouldn't suffer when the bombers got through, as they were expected to, and laid waste the country with explosives, fire and gas.