Castle Aching

[Edwardian]

Oh, indeed, if it wasn't for the sprogs ...

 

I will look up that Somme prog, thanks. Should lighten the mood nicely. 

[Joseph_Pestell]

5 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

Confronting actual real reality is bloomin' 'orrible at the moment, isn't it?

TBH, its the children that keep me just-about on the right side of sanity at the moment.

 

Too right! I found myself, earlier today, recounting all the sh1t that I have encountered over the last 12 months. Hardly surprising that I am not coping too well. I don't think anyone would, even if they had started from a better place than I did.

 

I have always coped OK to date with not having children but regret it greatly now. Dealing with all this alone is dreadful.

[Compound2632]

23 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Anyway, I am also boning up on the Border Reivers. I am fascinated by the subject, having been up to the Wall recently for my first Covid-era tourist jolly, and picked up an intriguing and very readable book by Graham Robb on the Debatable Land. So, also I'm now tucking into the classic George MacDonald Fraser (he of Flashman) treatment of the subject, The Steel Bonnets.

 

Brilliant book. I hope it's not a spoiler for me to chuckle again over his concluding remarks that it was the Border Reivers who got to the moon: Nixon, Armstrong...

 

It's really confusing though that he seems unaware of the true circumstances of the murder of Sir Walter Scott (not the novelist) in an Edinburgh street when these have been laid out clearly by a fellow Scots novelist, Dorothy Dunnett, in one of her Lymond series.

 

Here's a cheering picture of cross-border co-operation:

 

 

That's a D508 leading.

 

23 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Today, I confess, is not a good day, but generally I'm managing to stay on the level. I am genuinely confused, though, about what I can and cannot do here in the "Protected Area" of the NE and have more or less given up trying to work it out. I think I can still go to the pub, so long as I don't sit next to myself.

 

If you were to take a walk out to your nearest Premonstratensian abbey this Sunday afternoon, you might encounter a fellow-enthusiast "testing his eyesight" after a trip to Durham...

 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Compound2632
Lymond not Niccolo.

[Penlan]

33 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

I haven't done any modelling, I'm afraid, just reading. Re-reading Tolkien at the moment, which, like Wagner, is basically all about death. The older I got, at each re-reading, the Lord of the Rings became darker.

Back in 1967, not long after I had moved into a Bed-Sit in Norwich, I went down with proper Flu.
I was basically in bed for nearly a fortnight.  Fortunatly the owner collected the rent every week in person, so when he came I was able to order food, etc., There was another flat, but they only spoke Spanish, so a bit difficult to ask for things, if I could have got out of the Bed-Sit door.
BUT, somehow I just happened to have all 3 volumes of 'Lord of the Rings' out of the Library at the time, and I read the lot during that 'Flu time'.  I also had only two LP's to play on my Dansett record player, I can still hear them when I see the words 'Lord of the Rings' or just 'Tolkien'.  I thought I'm now deaf it might help, noooooooooo.
.
When I was a boss and somebody said they had had Flu and returned to work 2 - 3 days later,

I could put them right as to what proper Flu is, 'Proper Job' as they say way down west.

Edited September 30, 2020 by Penlan

[drmditch]

Yes, both the advice and the rules for County Durham seem confusing for me in my 'bubble of one'. 

I'm re-reading large amounts of my library this summer/autumn, having been able to unpack some books after six years!

Haven't re-read 'The Steel Bonnets' for a while, and I can't remember whether the following story occurs in that book, or another book on the Durham Palatinate and/or the East March.

 

The Justices of the Assize (if it was Durham of course, they would be the King's Justices operating under the authority of the Bishop of Durham, operating on behalf of the king) who also I think assessed any taxes owing, were interested to see the number of barns burning while they made their journey. It would appear that tax returns had already been declared for such barns as having been 'burned by the Scots'.

 

I'm in the Fifth Century at the moment, and the end of what at school we learned as 'Roman Britain'.

 

Back to soldering.

[Edwardian]

10 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Brilliant book. I hope it's not a spoiler for me to chuckle again over his concluding remarks that it was the Border Reivers who got to the moon: Nixon, Armstrong...

 

Well, he opens with a Johnson, a Graham and a Nixon at a presidential inauguration ... 

 

10 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

It's really confusing though that he seems unaware of the true circumstances of the murder of Sir Walter Scott (not the novelist) in an Edinburgh street when these have been laid out clearly by a fellow Scots novelist, Dorothy Dunnett, in one of her Lymond series.

 

Here's a cheering picture of cross-border co-operation:

 

 

That's a D508 leading.

 

Very nice. of course what comes through loud and clear in the Robb book, and seems also to be part of GMF's thinking, is that the Borderers were the Borderers, and that was more important than nationality; the international border between England and Scotland was an obsession for Edinburgh and London and of B8gger all interest to them and of little relevance. Bit like the tribes of the NW frontier of India. 

 

 

10 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

If you were to take a walk out to your nearest Premonstratensian abbey this Sunday afternoon, you might encounter a fellow-enthusiast "testing his eyesight" after a trip to Durham...

 

 

 

A favourite spot ...

 

 

[Edwardian]

2 minutes ago, drmditch said:

Yes, both the advice and the rules for County Durham seem confusing for me in my 'bubble of one'. 

I'm re-reading large amounts of my library this summer/autumn, having been able to unpack some books after six years!

Haven't re-read 'The Steel Bonnets' for a while, and I can't remember whether the following story occurs in that book, or another book on the Durham Palatinate and/or the East March.

 

The Justices of the Assize (if it was Durham of course, they would be the King's Justices operating under the authority of the Bishop of Durham, operating on behalf of the king) who also I think assessed any taxes owing, were interested to see the number of barns burning while they made their journey. It would appear that tax returns had already been declared for such barns as having been 'burned by the Scots'.

 

Not come across that. Bit like the French after WW1 when the reparations inspectors came round!

 

2 minutes ago, drmditch said:

 

I'm in the Fifth Century at the moment, and the end of what at school we learned as 'Roman Britain'.

 

Back to soldering.

 

My immediate flippant reaction to that was, 'but what do you find to do in the 5th Century?'

 

Even as long ago as my undergrad days, professional historians scoffed at those who still referred to the 'Dark Ages' (loads of culture and learning, high status jewellery, Lindisfarne, blah, blah ...).

 

However, I  cannot think of any British centuries darker than the 5th and 6th AD. Certainly for both the historian (who has, basically Gildas) and the archeologist (who in this period can only prove the adage "archeology cannot lie; that is because it cannot speak") we are, when we can view anything at all, viewing it through a glass darkly.  The only reason the Arthur myth can, still, inhabit that space is because nothing else is there. We have no idea what happened. Plus, I imagine that the barbarian incursions in the second half of the 4th Century, followed by the Romans packing up and leaving, left the 5th century a pretty dark age at times.   The Dark Ages has always seemed to me an entirely apposite descriptive term.  Historians are as prey to silly fashions as anyone, so, if I wait long enough, I'm sure that the term will come back into fashion!

 

So, I'm curious as to your reading list? 

[Nearholmer]

If you want something "Dark Ages" that departs pretty rapidly from dull-old archaeology and solid facts, try "Camelot and the Vision of Albion" by Geoffrey Ashe. I'm sure 'proper historians' wouldn't touch it with ten barge-poles splinted together, but its truly thought-provoking.

[Regularity]

50 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Very nice. of course what comes through loud and clear in the Robb book, and seems also to be part of GMF's thinking, is that the Borderers were the Borderers, and that was more important than nationality; the international border between England and Scotland was an obsession for Edinburgh and London and of B8gger all interest to them and of little relevance. Bit like the tribes of the NW frontier of India. 

 

I have yet to meet anyone from Ulster who is less different from another person from Ulster, regardless of their "professed faith", than they are from either the Irish, the Scots, the English or the Welsh...

Plus ca change, hien?

[Edwardian]

28 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

If you want something "Dark Ages" that departs pretty rapidly from dull-old archaeology and solid facts, try "Camelot and the Vision of Albion" by Geoffrey Ashe. I'm sure 'proper historians' wouldn't touch it with ten barge-poles splinted together, but its truly thought-provoking.

 

Well, if there were substantial archeology and solid facts, that would be a start....!

 

I'm ready for anything, so I'll look it up, thanks. Actually, Robb's Debatable Land book ends, somewhat unexpectedly and off topic, with a great Arthur theory; his 12 battles were part of the Barbarian incursions through Hadrian's Wall c.180, and Arthur was the leader of said Barbarians.

 

This takes Arthur out of the 5th-6th Century Gildas slot (IIRC, Gildas never mentions 'Arthur') and, therefore, he is not a possibly Romanised Brit Christian fighting off pagan Saxons, but a Caledonian Brit trying to take back Britain from the Romans in the 2nd Century AD. Furthermore, that makes the 'Once and Future King of Albion' Scottish.

 

Just to confuse things even more, one of the few historical figures with an Arthur-like name was the commander of the Sixth Legion at the time of that Caledonian invasion, and who was responsible for stopping it!

 

One could imagine a 9th Century 'historian' hearing garbled tradition and really making a hash of it! In which case, it was all a load of B0ll0cks long before the Twelfth Century romancers got hold of it!   

 

No wonder Tolkein, having finished with Gwain thought, "Nah, that's as far as I go with this Arthur stuff. Now, Hobbits, they could be a 'thing'"

[Northroader]

Nice to see some activity on this thread, I was thinking if I could get our Jenny to do a pole dance or something to lighten the mood. The border rievers are a stirring chapter in history. Don’t forget the Great Western Armstrong family are direct descendants  of one family:

http://www.borderreivers.co.uk/Border Stories/Jock o' the Syde.htm

[Northroader]

Galashiels war memorial:

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, Edwardian said:

However, I  cannot think of any British centuries darker than the 5th and 6th AD. Certainly for both the historian (who has, basically Gildas) and the archeologist (who in this period can only prove the adage "archeology cannot lie; that is because it cannot speak") we are, when we can view anything at all, viewing it through a glass darkly. 

 

I understand that there is now considerable evidence for the climate having taken a thoroughly miserable turn as a result of a major volcanic eruption somewhere in Malaysia. 

[drmditch]

2 hours ago, Edwardian said:

So, I'm curious as to your reading list? 

 

Here are some of the re-reads:-

 

Start of Lockdown (in Spring!)

Watership Down - Richard Adams  - always lovely to re-read - every two years or so. I was worried about a hedgehog ('Yona') in my garden.

 

Then (for obvious topical reasons)

The Slave Trade - Hugh Thomas - largely concentrating on the Atlantic trade - well written and depressing.

The Scramble for Africa - Thomas Pakenham - also well written and possibly even more depressing.

(brief excursions into books by Basil Davidson (and others). I do like his 'The Black Man's Burden'.)

 

Then moving on, I realised that before I moved house I was half way though:-

The Penguin History of Modern China - Jonathan Fenby  - so obviously had to start again. Also quite depressing.

Then to cross reference with earlier stuff:-

China  A History - John Keay - so much we don't pay much attention to in the 'West' - including the problems of transliteration and translation starting wars.

 

And you were talking about the Dark Ages?

I can recommend;

Dark Continent   Europe's. Twentieth Century - Mark Mazower. - Very good, not read for a few years but will put back on re-reading list when recovered from the above.

 

New books include:-

More than a Woman - Caitlin Moran. Despite having very little in common with this lady, I enjoy and value her books. This one is deeply moving in part.

 

Obviously, other lighter books as well (a Lucy Diamond which was quite fun), and visiting C.S Forester again, which I haven't done for a few years. Curiously I found:

The Ship - a semi-fictionalised account of an RN warship in action in 1943. Strangely depressing now. Our values are now so different, and whereas there is much which is admirable there is also content which is disturbing.

 

So, happy to get back to first centuries of the first millenium CE. This was my initial idea at the start of the year. Started by picking up again

SPQR - Mary Beard. Always an enjoyable author to read. Then Gibbon:

Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire - as much for the prose as anything. Links to Forrester/Hornblower of course, and also to W S Churchill, but I haven't followed that path yet.

Then picked up some references in:

Empires and Barbarians  Migration development and the Birth of Europe - Peter Heather - excellent writer - will get back to after finishing:-

Roman Britain - Peter Salway - Good and interesting, but published in 1980, so perhaps need to find recent works on the subject.

 

Well, that's a brief summary, but you did ask! 

The delights in having a library!  (and I managed to fit in some more bookshelves this summer as well!)

 

Now, this is I believe a pre-grouping railway thread, so despite having posted some pictures of this elsewhere, here is my most recent construction:-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I wonder what the signalman will be reading between trains?

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by drmditch

[Nearholmer]

I am in awe of the quantity and quality of reading that goes on here. Possibly the only times in my life I've ever equaled it were when young and making many train rides for work/commuting, and for a few months over one winter when I was living alone in a very dull flat. For the other many years: too much work; too busy with family; or, both at once!
 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Nearholmer

[brianusa]

3 hours ago, Northroader said:

Galashiels war memorial:

 

Endangered species in these crazy times.!  He'll be following Colston soon, so hang on to your heroes.

       Brian.

[Adam88]

5 hours ago, Edwardian said:

Anyway, I am also boning up on the Border Reivers. I am fascinated by the subject, having been up to the Wall recently for my first Covid-era tourist jolly, and picked up an intriguing and very readable book by Graham Robb on the Debatable Land. So, also I'm now tucking into the classic George MacDonald Fraser (he of Flashman) treatment of the subject, The Steel Bonnets.

 

Pleased to see you posting again, I was starting to miss your erudite contributions.

 

I confess that the only work of George MacDonald Fraser which I have read is Quartered Safe Out Here, his memoir of serving in Burma with the Border Reivers.  He read it in installments on R4 and it was difficult to read the book without then imagining his Borders accent.  I found it extremely well written and it has acquired a reputation as being one of the finest books to come out of the war.

 

[Buhar]

8 minutes ago, Adam88 said:

serving in Burma with the Border Reivers. 

I think that might be the Scottish Borderers (6104) or the Border Regiment (6136) the Reivers were a more irregular bunch and liable to change sides if the price was right.

 

Alan

[Edwardian]

3 hours ago, drmditch said:

 

Here are some of the re-reads:-

 

Actually, I just meant what had you found on the 5th Century AD.

 

(though all v. interesting. The Pakenham is a v. good read. As is his Boer War)j

 

Quote

Empires and Barbarians  Migration development and the Birth of Europe - Peter Heather - excellent writer - will get back to after finishing:-

Roman Britain - Peter Salway - Good and interesting, but published in 1980, so perhaps need to find recent works on the subject.

 

I thought about trying Britain After Rome: The Fall & Rise, 400-1070 by Robin Flemming (2011), but in the end I just read Tom Shippey's piece on it in the London Review of Books (Link) and wondered if he hadn't done something of a Macaulay and produced a review better than the book itself. The more I read the more I came to the view that Flemming might update me on some recent developments, but was no nearer than anyone else to offering any more than the usual highly speculative supposition and that archeologists seem to indulge in the moment they put their trowels down (Parish archeologists please to forgive jaundiced historian used to the forensic exactitudes of the law!)

 

Quote

 

Now, this is I believe a pre-grouping railway thread, so despite having posted some pictures of this elsewhere, here is my most recent construction:-

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Superb!

 

Quote

I wonder what the signalman will be reading between trains?

 

 

The Regulations, I hope.

 

 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Edwardian

[Edwardian]

33 minutes ago, Adam88 said:

 

Pleased to see you posting again, I was starting to miss your erudite contributions.

 

Thank you

 

33 minutes ago, Adam88 said:

I confess that the only work of George MacDonald Fraser which I have read is Quartered Safe Out Here, his memoir of serving in Burma with the Border Reivers.  He read it in installments on R4 and it was difficult to read the book without then imagining his Borders accent.  I found it extremely well written and it has acquired a reputation as being one of the finest books to come out of the war.

 

 

The Border Reivers! Heaven forefend!

 

If I were in the habit of recommending books, I'd say "try his Flashman novels" 

 

20 minutes ago, Buhar said:

I think that might be the Scottish Borderers (6104) or the Border Regiment (6136) the Reivers were a more irregular bunch and liable to change sides if the price was right.

 

Alan

 

Indeed, so; the Border Regiment

[Edwardian]

47 minutes ago, brianusa said:

 

Endangered species in these crazy times.!  He'll be following Colston soon, so hang on to your heroes.

       Brian.

 

 

I wouldn't take on a Border Reiver, even a bronze one!

 

3 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

I am in awe of the quantity and quality of reading that goes on here. Possibly the only times in my life I've ever equaled it were when young and making many train rides for work/commuting, and for a few months over one winter when I was living alone in a very dull flat. For the other many years: too much work; too busy with family; or, both at once!
 

 

 

That got me thinking, what makes a flat dull, as opposed to living a dull life in a flat or living in a flat in a dull place?

 

Perhaps you meant there was little natural light, in which case all that reading might strain the eyes.

 

Otherwise, to have a flat that is, of and in itself, dull, seems horrendous. 

 

I'm off to cheer myself up on the Somme.

 

 

[Compound2632]

20 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

That got me thinking, what makes a flat dull, as opposed to living a dull life in a flat or living in a flat in a dull place?

 

There's a piece by Tchaikovsky, Souvenir d'un lieu cher, written after he'd been stung in some tourist trap. He seems not to have made good holiday choices - the Capriccio Italien opens with the bugle call he was woken up by every day at his hotel next door to a barracks. 

[Nearholmer]

While there's a lucifer to light your fag ........

 

A dull flat? One that's on a third floor, so feels too detached from the rest of humanity, nature, etc; one that is on a short lease, so has somebody else's choice of budget-range furniture; one that doesn't have a shed, or a garage in which to dismantle and tinker with things; a sign that says no dogs allowed; a place where if anything breaks, you phone someone else to come and fix it while you're out at work.

 

The only good things was that, come spring, everyone else in the block suddenly emerged and instantly formed a permanent cricket match on a nearby field - all Indian guys and their families on contract for a year with a big IT firm nearby.

 

 

[Buhar]

Those Clan and family names are still prevalent in the Disputed Lands close to their historic bases and many later rose to various sorts of legitimate prominence; Johnston, Little, Glendenning, Maxwell, Armstrong, Charlton, Milburn. They were a violent, lawless lot with little to commend in their behaviour although it makes for interesting reading.

 

Alan

[St Enodoc]

6 hours ago, Northroader said:

I was thinking if I could get our Jenny to do a pole dance

 

6 hours ago, Northroader said:

Galashiels war memorial:

Well, there's your pole. Now, where's Jenny?