Castle Aching

[Regularity]

13 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Indeed, perhaps starting out as a Georgian tramroad.

Long tram road, from the Tyne to the Wash…

 

Actually, there is the possibility of coal coming along the coast from Newcastle, and being brought inland at Wolfringham Staithe, in competition with the railways. One man and his boat: cheap to run.

 

 

[Edwardian]

1 minute ago, Nearholmer said:

I can’t remember what date we invented for the line to Wolfringham Staithe, but it was definitely quite early.
 

Incidentally, the real place that it was inspired by was already an established quay and coal import point by the C18th, and probably earlier, despite serving only a very thinly populated hinterland.

 

I hadn't realised we had agreed a date, but your thoughts and Andy's and Stephen's all fit well. 

 

 

[Nearholmer]

Page1163 seems to be a recent version of the history of the area, and there you date the line to 1876. I think it had previously been dated earlier than that, but history is such an ever-evolving topic that it’s difficult to keep up.

 

It does have an earlier horsedrawn  tramroad already, so we’re good on that point.

[Compound2632]

19 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Thank you.  I had not thought the LNWR coal wagons would be of any use.  Now that I know better, I would certainly be grateful for a couple, though I think I should also like to learn how you treat them to gain D53s, as this seems more appropriate (I already have one made up as a D54).

 

My first attempt started here:

It was a bit of a faff. My second attempt using Archer rivet transfers, is here:

Close reading of LNWR Wagons Vol. 3 reveals that these 15'6"-long wagons were built from 1890 - some 3,000+ examples - the 1880s built ones being only 15'0" long (corresponding more closely to the RCH specification) as in the photo on the L&NWR Society's website page for these wagons. I have a plan for how to tackle this but haven't tried it out yet.

 

[Edwardian]

15 minutes ago, Regularity said:

Long tram road, from the Tyne to the Wash…

 

Actually, there is the possibility of coal coming along the coast from Newcastle, and being brought inland at Wolfringham Staithe, in competition with the railways. One man and his boat: cheap to run.

 

 

 

Yes, that would explain how the trade, once the source of incoming coal, was able to survive in some measure the flow of coal via the GN-GE Joint Ry from 1883.

 

5 minutes ago, Nearholmer said:

Page1163 seems to be a recent version of the history of the area, and there you date the line to 1876. I think it had previously been dated earlier than that, but history is such an ever-evolving topic that it’s difficult to keep up.

 

It does have an earlier horsedrawn  tramroad already, so we’re good on that point.

 

I am grateful to be reminded of the horse-drawn antecedent.  Perfect.  Quite happy for the WN involvement to be significantly before 1876 if that suits. 

 

The rest of the mineral activity, behind this strip of coast, developed by linking lines concerned with carstone and sand extraction, limestone quarrying and calcination and coprolite workings (now defunct) to the independent Norfolk Minerals Railway.

 

 

[Nearholmer]

See p401.

 

A thought has just struck me: when we first started "researching" the history of the Wolfringham Branch, I was still working full-time in central London, and I ceased todo that five years ago this month, so its taken at least that long to get this far!

[uax6]

The incoming wagons will be probably the biggest thing to try and get right, there are lots of photos of out of the way places where there are almost more foreign wagons than local ones. Theres a well known picture of Inverness post WW1, where there are wagons from almost all companies, with LBSC having more than one surprisingly. Now whether these are wagons that were loaned for the war I don't know (the Highland was chronically short of wagons to handle the extra war time traffic, so borrowed lots of wagons).

 

In one of the GER soc mags, theres a picture of a HR meat wagon at one of the GER coastal ports on the east side of Norfolk, so that implies some sort of Scotch meat traffic, and I'm guessing that there would also have been a Scotch seed potato traffic too (we had incoming Seed spuds coming down to Downham Market well into the speedlink era) . Then you have the herring fisheries movement as well, following the fishes movement around the East coast, so incoming wagons full of bits of barrels perhaps? 

 

Andy G

[ianathompson]

7 hours ago, Nearholmer said:

A really arcahaic, and superficially confusing, numbering system would be a great deal more fun.

 

Have you been looking at the AFK system?

This sounds familiar as the 'Person in charge'.

 

Not too sure about the qualifying adjective 'superficial' though!

 

Ian T

Edited September 9, 2021 by ianathompson
additional info

[Andy Hayter]

41 minutes ago, uax6 said:

The incoming wagons will be probably the biggest thing to try and get right, there are lots of photos of out of the way places where there are almost more foreign wagons than local ones. Theres a well known picture of Inverness post WW1, where there are wagons from almost all companies, with LBSC having more than one surprisingly. Now whether these are wagons that were loaned for the war I don't know (the Highland was chronically short of wagons to handle the extra war time traffic, so borrowed lots of wagons).

 

In one of the GER soc mags, theres a picture of a HR meat wagon at one of the GER coastal ports on the east side of Norfolk, so that implies some sort of Scotch meat traffic, and I'm guessing that there would also have been a Scotch seed potato traffic too (we had incoming Seed spuds coming down to Downham Market well into the speedlink era) . Then you have the herring fisheries movement as well, following the fishes movement around the East coast, so incoming wagons full of bits of barrels perhaps? 

 

Andy G

 

It is worth remembering that with the British fleet stationed at Scarpa Flow there will have been a massive traffic from all over the UK to supply said fleet.  This I suspect will have created a disproportionate mix of company vehicles which could well have perpetuated beyond the end of hostilities in 1919.

[Compound2632]

47 minutes ago, uax6 said:

The incoming wagons will be probably the biggest thing to try and get right, there are lots of photos of out of the way places where there are almost more foreign wagons than local ones. Theres a well known picture of Inverness post WW1, where there are wagons from almost all companies, with LBSC having more than one surprisingly. Now whether these are wagons that were loaned for the war I don't know (the Highland was chronically short of wagons to handle the extra war time traffic, so borrowed lots of wagons).

 

1 minute ago, Andy Hayter said:

It is worth remembering that with the British fleet stationed at Scarpa Flow there will have been a massive traffic from all over the UK to supply said fleet.  This I suspect will have created a disproportionate mix of company vehicles which could well have perpetuated beyond the end of hostilities in 1919.

 

Remember, please, that the pooling of open wagons and then vans came in during the Great War. This means that there is a much greater variety of goods wagons in post-war photos than in pre-war ones, which are invariably dominated by the home company's vehicles. In fact the variety of wagons visible is usually a very good indicator as to whether a photo is pre or post-war. See this topic for a full discussion:

 

[Caley Jim]

36 minutes ago, uax6 said:

.........and I'm guessing that there would also have been a Scotch seed potato traffic too (we had incoming Seed spuds coming down to Downham Market well into the speedlink era) . ......

The Strathearn area was (and I believe still is) a major seed potato growing area.  In his book 'Branch Lines of Strathearn' John Young states that 'in December 1860 it was reported that in the preceding six weeks between 8000 and 9000 Perth 'bolls' of potatoes had been sent by rail to southern markets.'   He also illustrates a number of wagon labels for potato traffic, from various eras, to places such as Nottingham and Hawkser on the LN&ER

 

Perhaps you could even justify a Caledonian wagon?

 

Jim

[St Enodoc]

7 hours ago, Northroader said:

OK, bright idea no.2, each type of wagon gets a prefix letter:

 

7 hours ago, Northroader said:

More common in Europe, 1st class A, 2nd class B, 3rd class C, passgr. vans D, then goods stock any number of  variations. I’ve only seen it in the IoM this side of the Channel.

Not forgetting London Transport, too.

[Donw]

You can get some anomalies. The Gasworks at Torquay apparently ordered coal by shipload which camefromthe North East to Kingswear and if I remember correctly it took three trains of coalwagons to transport a ship load to the Gasworks.  Probably made sense due tothe size of Torquay but it does conjure up the possiblility of a train of wagons marked Achingham Gas Co bringing a load from Wolfringham to Achingham. 

 

Don

[Edwardian]

30 minutes ago, Donw said:

You can get some anomalies. The Gasworks at Torquay apparently ordered coal by shipload which camefromthe North East to Kingswear and if I remember correctly it took three trains of coalwagons to transport a ship load to the Gasworks.  Probably made sense due tothe size of Torquay but it does conjure up the possiblility of a train of wagons marked Achingham Gas Co bringing a load from Wolfringham to Achingham. 

 

Don

 

It is tempting to give all operations their own POs, but in reality many would not purchase or hire branded vehicles, so I am trying to exercise some restraint!

 

One of the Devon gasworks, Plymouth, I think, was not persuaded to hire/purchase branded wagons until 1938.  Given they would have been effectively 'nationalised' during the war, one can't help but fear they proved a poor bargain.

 

The Achingham gasworks could, however, potentially permit short coal trains (probably with older and often dumb-buffered WN opens (perhaps still bearing the Dodo illiteracy mark in some cases)) to run from Wolfringham Staithe to Achingham via Castle Aching.

 

I wonder, though, what the daily coal requirement of a small town gasworks sustaining, perhaps, two gasholders, would be?  Of course, we could have a weekly delivery, which increases the chances of needing a short train's worth. 

 

There are large maltings in Achingham too ... 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Edwardian
Further thoughts

[Compound2632]

2 hours ago, Edwardian said:

probably with older and often dumb-buffered WN opens (perhaps still bearing the Dodo illiteracy mark in some cases)

 

Well, just so long as it doesn't get misinterpreted as a "condemned" mark!

[wagonman]

2 hours ago, Edwardian said:

 

It is tempting to give all operations their own POs, but in reality many would not purchase or hire branded vehicles, so I am trying to exercise some restraint!

 

One of the Devon gasworks, Plymouth, I think, was not persuaded to hire/purchase branded wagons until 1938.  Given they would have been effectively 'nationalised' during the war, one can't help but fear they proved a poor bargain.

 

The Achingham gasworks could, however, potentially permit short coal trains (probably with older and often dumb-buffered WN opens (perhaps still bearing the Dodo illiteracy mark in some cases)) to run from Wolfringham Staithe to Achingham via Castle Aching.

 

I wonder, though, what the daily coal requirement of a small town gasworks sustaining, perhaps, two gasholders, would be?  Of course, we could have a weekly delivery, which increases the chances of needing a short train's worth. 

 

There are large maltings in Achingham too ... 

 

 

 

 

When researching the PO Wagons of Somerset I tried to do an analysis of coal use at gas works: Cheddar with a population of under 2000 used £188 of coal in 1909 – at an average price of 15/- a ton that works out at about 250 tons, or one wagon load per fortnight. On the other hand, Clevedon, which pre-WW1 was a town of over 6000 people, used about 6000 tons of coal a year equivalent to two wagon loads per day averaged over the year. Presumably it had far more lights – how else to explain the discrepancy? Remember that the use of gas for domestic heating and cooking really took off post-war. The Clevedon Gas Co had several wagons of its own, despite which deliveries were also made in Lowell Baldwin wagons. I wonder how much coal they used at Fakenham?

 

The Achingham matings would, I hope, have used anthracite from south west Wales because of its low arsenic content if for no other reason. The big question is, did the anthracite go by water or by rail? Assume the latter and you get the opportunity to run one of those wagons with half a trade directory written on the sides!

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by wagonman

[wagonman]

3 hours ago, Donw said:

You can get some anomalies. The Gasworks at Torquay apparently ordered coal by shipload which camefromthe North East to Kingswear and if I remember correctly it took three trains of coalwagons to transport a ship load to the Gasworks.  Probably made sense due tothe size of Torquay but it does conjure up the possiblility of a train of wagons marked Achingham Gas Co bringing a load from Wolfringham to Achingham. 

 

Don

 

How often did the ship arrive at Kingswear? It's something I need to look into. Torquay Gas did not have their own wagons as they would have stood idle, possibly incurring siding rent, between ships. Renwick Wilton had the contract for many years pre-WW2.

 

 

[Edwardian]

Gasworks .... I suspect Peter Denny gave a fair few of us a yen for them.

 

This is Barnard Castle gasworks, c.1900, in a recreated view  by Charles Lilley:

 

 

Note that it's nowhere near the railway and that, like almost all town gasworks, it is long gone, save for the governor house, so visitors to Barney, no matter how good their eyesight, will fail to see it. 

 

Below is reproduced a short article from the Teesdale Mercury by Tony Seward.  Enjoy at your leisure, but the point of bringing it up here is that the article does give an indication of the volume of coal consumption by what must be a roughly comparable small town works  (utilising two gasholders at any one time), which might help us determine the likely volume of coal needed at Achingham.

 

"3,052 tons of coal were consumed in the ten years to 1849. In 1845, just over 222 tons produced 372,200 cubic feet of gas, but this ratio greatly improved as the plant became more efficient over the years".  So, in 1905 we are looking at a more efficient process, so the 1840s only really set an upper figure that we should be somewhere south of.  Now, that, if my maths are not awry, gives a weekly average coal consumption of 5.869 tones. Assuming even relatively modest increased efficiencies, and that suggests that a small town gasworks in the early 1900s might require half a 10-ton wagon load of coal a week!  Hardly time to start running block trains on the WNR then!

 

On the other hand, the Barney gasworks at that time (see article) may only have been supplying street lamps.

 

Note also the presence of an ammonium sulphate plant for converting the ammonia by-product into fertiliser for local farmers, as a further by-product to coke.  Both could be sold to offset the cost of gas production.

 

How much coal might a NE collier brig land at Wolfringham Staithe?

 

According to this, such a vessel was typically 250-300 tons.  I am sure that our Maritime Parishioners can confirm, but my shaky understanding that a vessel's given tonnage general refers to its cargo-carrying capacity, not the weight of a ship, which might seem helpful until one realises that maritime tonnage is a volume, not weight, measurement.  At least I think I have that right.

 

Of course, that is not the end of it, because there is a physical limit to the weight a ship can carry, regardless of the cargo volume  available (deadweight tonnage, I think this would be).  I understand that deadweight tonnage was at least measured in imperial or long tones (not nassty little tonnes), so I suppose if I knew the deadweight tonnage of a collier brig, I might be closer to knowing the weight of coal she carried?

  

Unfortunately, one commonly only sees references to the (volume) tonnage of a vessel. So, what a vessel's tonnage (volume) means in terms of a railway wagon's capacity expressed as laden weight for the chosen commodity (coal) is anyone's guess.  

 

Well, this site claims, on what authority I do not know, that "A typical collier brig [17th-18th C] could carry about 300–400 tons of coal"

 

So, ere, at least 30-40 WNR wagons' worth, if that's true.  I suspect many of the older WNR wagons would be more like 6-8 ton capacity. 

 

 

 

32 minutes ago, wagonman said:

 

When researching the PO Wagons of Somerset I tried to do an analysis of coal use at gas works: Cheddar with a population of under 2000 used £188 of coal in 1909 – at an average price of 15/- a ton that works out at about 250 tons, or one wagon load per fortnight. On the other hand, Clevedon, which pre-WW1 was a town of over 6000 people, used about 6000 tons of coal a year equivalent to two wagon loads per day averaged over the year. Presumably it had far more lights – how else to explain the discrepancy? Remember that the use of gas for domestic heating and cooking really took post-war. The Clevedon Gas Co had several wagons of its own, despite which deliveries were also made in Lowell Baldwin wagons. I wonder how much coal they used at Fakenham?

 

That's really useful. I am assuming that coal for the towns and villages generally comes from colliery, coal factor or local coal merchant wagons.

 

But, yes, logically anyone without the need of specialist coal, e.g. the maltings, could partake of the seaborne 'house coal'.

 

32 minutes ago, wagonman said:

The Achingham matings would, I hope, have used anthracite from south west Wales because of its low arsenic content if for no other reason. The big question is, did the anthracite go by water or by rail? Assume the latter and you get the opportunity to run one of those wagons with half a trade directory written on the sides!

 

 

 

 

 

Yes, indeed!  Some of those Slaters 1887 7-planks were branded for anthracite and I have one or two somewhere for CA. Pretty sure I have a Thos. Pascoe somewhere:

 

 

Gasworks Article

 

THE Roman Way picnic site by the river has recently been tidied up by a group of dedicated volunteers led by Roger Peat, as featured in the Teesdale Mercury last month.
Well known to local walkers and visitors, it features stone benches with sculptures of a sheep and a water nymph, and a pavement depicting river creatures, designed by sculptor Keith Alexander and children from Bowes Hutchinson’s School. The current name recalls the Roman road which crosses at this point.

As the years pass fewer will remember that, for well over a century, this parcel of land on the riverbank was literally a power house for Barnard Castle and the surrounding villages.
A joint stock company to supply coal gas was established in 1834, and the works opened the following year. Originally the gas was produced solely for lighting. The streets were illuminated by 82 lamps at a charge of £90 per annum, 18 being kept alight every night from dusk to dawn, the other 64 until 11pm every evening except Saturday – when they were allowed to burn until midnight. Two lamplighters are listed among the employees of the company in 1891, both aged 21.

 

Town gas

UNTIL the arrival of abundant supplies of natural gas in 1967, most towns and villages of any size in Britain had their own gasworks, providing gas to the community for heat, light and cooking. Gainford, Staindrop and Middleton-in-Teesdale all had gas plants, as did the private estates of Raby Castle and Rokeby Hall.

The process was discovered in the 1790s and the first company selling gas to the public was founded in 1812. It operated by heating coal to a high temperature in coke ovens. The off gases liberated by this carbonisation were then collected, scrubbed and distributed to the surrounding area by a network of pipes. Coal gas consists mainly of combustible gases including hydrogen, carbon monoxide, methane, and ethylene – quite a dangerous cocktail.

The scale of the operation in those early days is indicated by the fact that 3,052 tons of coal were consumed in the ten years to 1849. In 1845, just over 222 tons produced 372,200 cubic feet of gas, but this ratio greatly improved as the plant became more efficient over the years. It should not be forgotten that the costs were considerably offset by the sale of coke and other by-products resulting from the process.

 

The gasworks

THE key stages of the process were as follows:

 

Coal was delivered to the retort house, and fed into coke ovens by the stokers; the gas thus produced passed through a washer and de-tarrer for removal of tar and ammonia; then through four boxes of iron oxide for removal of hydrogen sulphide, and finally to the holders for storage.

 

The only building still remaining, to the north of the picnic area, is the governor house. This contained two Donkin “governors”, installed to regulate gas pressure in response to frequent complaints from customers about pressure fluctuations. Built in 1902-3, it was retained when the rest of the works was demolished in 1992, as supply pipes still ran through it.

 

There were also store houses, an engine house, a weigh cabin, a manager’s house, and an ammonium sulphate plant for converting the ammonia by-product into fertiliser for local farmers.

 

The gasholders

 

THE old town gas plants are mainly remembered nowadays, if at all, by the often impressive holders preserved as a feature in some towns and cities.

 

To the casual passer-by, they would have been the most arresting aspect of the works, often recorded in photographs and paintings of the period.

 

There were four holders on our site, built at different dates, but only two were in use at any one time. The first, east of the retort house, was demolished in 1899 and converted into a tar well.

 

The fourth, built around 1924, had a capacity of 150,000 cubic feet and by 1965 was the last one remaining.

 

Final days

 

WHILE we tend to romanticise what remains of old industrial sites, at the time many regarded them simply as eyesores, especially when they became derelict at the end of their working lives.
In our area, famed for its natural beauty, local photographers Elijah Yeoman and Harry Ward did their best to exclude the gasworks from views of the castle, using a massive holly tree to block it out.

 

Gas production ceased in 1952, and over the next 40 years the area became a post-industrial wasteland.

 

So councillors and local residents warmly welcomed the news (TM, April 22, 1992) that the last rusty old gasholder was to be taken down. But there was one final hurdle to overcome before the site could be converted into “a pleasant picnic area”.

 

The land had to be thoroughly decontaminated, and the polluted “soil with noxious vapours” removed by the gas company – a fairly major operation.

 

Accordingly, Cllr John Watson asked for an assurance that the road to the site would be restored completely after the work, as damage would be caused by wagons taking away the material.

 

Apart from the governor house, is there any remaining trace of all this activity taking place over so many years?

 

Well, perhaps – as you walk by you may just catch a whiff of coal tar in the air, a lingering ghost of the millions of cubic feet of gas produced here in former times.

 

Based on two unpublished booklets, ‘Barnard Castle Gas Company’ (2009), and ‘Gasworks in South West Durham and North West Yorkshire’ (no date), by Charles Lilley, archived at The Fitzhugh Library, Middleton-in-Teesdale. For information about the library’s resources and opening hours, go to www.thefitzhughlibrary.co.uk With grateful thanks to Mr Lilley, and to Cath Maddison and Derek Sims at the library for their help in preparing this article.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Edwardian
spelling

[Compound2632]

So there were seams of gas coal in the Durham / Northumberland coalfield. Interesting. 

 

The Gas Light and Coal Company was, I think, the first large-scale town gas manufacturer in Britain, established in 1812. I read that the company had a considerable fleet of ships - Newcastle and Sunderland-built steam colliers in the 19th century it seems - operated on their behalf by Stephenson Clarke (from some unspecified date). A large number of them were lost to German U-boats during the Great War.

Edited September 10, 2021 by Compound2632

[Edwardian]

42 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

So there were seams of gas coal in the Durham / Northumberland coalfield. Interesting. 

 

The Gas Light and Coal Company was, I think, the first large-scale town gas manufacturer in Britain, established in 1812. I read that the company had a considerable fleet of ships - Newcastle and Sunderland-built steam colliers in the 19th century it seems - operated on their behalf by Stephenson Clarke (from some unspecified date). A large number of them were lost to German U-boats during the Great War.

 

Often NE coal is described, I think, as 'house coal', whether this makes good gas coal, or, I suppose, coking coal (as gas appears to be a by-product of coking, or the other way around, depending on what you're into)  is a point I hadn't considered. 

 

However, as the Stainmore line owed its existence to the wish to take coke from the Bishop Auckland and Crook area to the steel furnaces in Cumberland, one might suppose a supply of coking coal in the Durham fields.  Similarly, I am reasonably familiar with Marley Hill, and I know that the colliery there had extensive coke ovens. 

 

Though, as I confess, I have not looked into this point.  

 

EDIT:  Marley Hill coke ovens.  These were the huge new facilities installed in 1908, prior to which there were traditional 'beehive' coke ovens on site.  I read somewhere that coking in the Durham field goes back to the 1850s (Stainmore route was early 1860s)

 

 

 

 

 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Edwardian
Picture

[Compound2632]

13 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

 

Often NE coal is described, I think, as 'house coal', whether this makes good gas coal, or, I suppose, coking coal (as gas appears to be a by-product of coking, or the other way around, depending on what you're into)  is a point I hadn't considered. Though that doesn't mean you have to be snarky about it 

 

However, as the Stainmore line owed its existence to the wish to take coke from the Bishop Auckland and Crook area to the steel furnaces in Cumberland, one might suppose a supply of coking coal in the Durham fields.  Similarly, I am reasonably familiar with Marley Hill, and I know that the colliery there had extensive coke ovens. 

 

Though, as I confess, I have not looked into this point.  

 

 

 

Sorry, snarkiness was not intended. I was merely noting a point in the enlargement of my knowledge of coal. Different seams produced coal of different types, so the same colliery could be producing house coal and gas/coking coal from different seams. I'm getting the impression that, at least in the 19th century, coke for industrial purposes was in greater demand than gas, so in some areas collieries had coking plants on site, with the gas either being released to atmosphere or burnt off. 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Compound2632

[Edwardian]

Just now, Compound2632 said:

 

Sorry, snarkiness was not intended. I was merely noting a point in the enlargement of my knowledge of coal. Different seams produced coal of different types, so the same colliery could be producing house coal and gas/coking coal from different seams. I'm getting the impression that, at least in the 19th century, coke for industrial purposes was in greater demand than gas, so in some areas collieries had coking plants on site, with the gas either being released to atmosphere or burnt off. 

 

I realised that in retrospect - it's just that I am entirely unused to you not knowing stuff  - so I edited.

 

I then added some pictures that show what a big operation colliery coking could become. That does mean, of course, that, as you say, coke was valuable on the area and gas wasn't so much, so, with a ready market in steelmakers, you might not have a great incentive to send coking coal south to gasworks. Yet, gasworks had to get coking coal from somewhere.

 

As I say, I haven't really looked into it.

[Compound2632]

5 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

I realised that in retrospect - it's just that I am entirely unused to you not knowing stuff  - so I edited.

 

There's a lot of stuff I don't know! I dare say a lot of it I don't want to know but, oddly, coal and its historical uses does not come under that heading.

[Edwardian]

 

1 minute ago, Compound2632 said:

 

There's a lot of stuff I don't know! I dare say a lot of it I don't want to know but, oddly, coal and its historical uses does not come under that heading.

 

 

Peter Denny's exploration of town gas manufacture is a wonderful and early example of a 'clerical' modeller, i.e. someone not associated directly with industrial processes, learning about them. 

 

Now that all such traditional industry and its methods have gone, I find that there is so much once-taken-for-granted knowledge that we now have to make some effort to recover. 

 

One can say that to some extent about traditional agriculture, but the essentials have not changed that much, even now, whereas a lot of Nineteenth Century industrial processes (which we need to understand in order to know the railway traffic they generated) are pretty much Dark Arts for many of us.

 

We had a fascinating discussion hereabouts concerning limestone ore calcification, and the carbonisation of coal to produce coke and gas (one man's by-product being another's product here), is another such fascinating, but now for many of us rather obscure, process.  

[Compound2632]

37 minutes ago, Edwardian said:

Peter Denny's exploration of town gas manufacture is a wonderful and early example of a 'clerical' modeller, i.e. someone not associated directly with industrial processes, learning about them. 

 

Wot, you mean like priests and sex?