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SCRATCH BUILT MODERN EUROPEAN STYLE WAGONS 4mm ish


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Does anyone else scratch build modern wagons? I have built a couple of hundred over the years, nothing proto typical, just generic, European style wagons. 4mm ish.

 

There are numerous variations of box opens, flats, tanks and covered wagons, usually built in batches.

 

The basic build is styrene sheet, Evergreen strips and brass and white metal fittings. The bogies are Bachmann picked up in bulk on eBay some years back.

 

I've never really seen anyone else interested in this kind of scratch building. I have loads of pictures of the various wagons etc. it would be good to get some feed back and also some fresh ideas.post-28700-0-98857400-1457273515_thumb.jpgpost-28700-0-74282000-1457273699_thumb.jpgpost-28700-0-18520500-1457273723_thumb.jpg

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Some very nice work there. I've done a few such vehicles, representing the sorts of things that have run to the UK over the past three or four decades. These have included French and Italian four-wheel ferry vans, VTG bogie ferry vans, VTG coil wagons (subsequently done by Hurst as a kit, and Dapol R-T-R) and Cargowaggon bogie flats (now done by Heljan). I've also done four-wheel twin single and double-deck car carriers.

There being few drawings available, most were built from my own drawings, using photos and BR Weight Drawings.

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Thanks for replying Brian, nice to get some positive feed back. I have never shared this with anyone before, as this my first time on any web site. Modelling of this type has always been really enjoyable. My only source of information has been the fantastic photos on various web sites around the world.

 

My son and I have made numerous trips to visit family in Denmark, driving through Europe stopping all over the place to film and photograph trains. Our modelling varies hugely but the modern wagons kind of fit in with a 'what might have been' had European wagons been far more active in the UK.

 

The drawings sound good, as so far I've always gone down the road of 'if it looks about right'. I have always enjoyed using styrene to make these models so having drawings would help no end. Getting generic wagon transfers was a problem before I found the Railtec ones. It would be good if someone could be convinced to produce enough to fill an A4 sheet, perhaps enough to complete 50 wagons. I'm not very techy so printing my own is not really an option.

 

Jon, the reason for freelance is because I never had the drawings and it was always easier just to make something that looked about right. Also below is an example of a what might have been wagon with a self unloading 360 unit mounted on the top of the wagon, designed to move along a rake of wagons moving along the top with drop in rails between them.

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They look great, why freelance - there are plenty of ferry wagons that could appear either side of the Channel, I've been building ferry wagons in 4mm - see

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/58076-ferry-vans-from-scratch/

 

Jon

Wow. Amazing stuff. Loving the Silver Bullets and the Grain Flow. Am I right in thinking that you cast the Silver Bullets in solid resin? Your twin axle vans are so detailed, really inspirational. Do you use super glue for the brass fittings?

 

I've built some bogie tank wagons using 35.5mm OD plastic waste pipe, with the ends made from nylon plugs used in office furniture. The result is ok however I would prefer a more rounded shape as per a TEA / TTA etc. I then tried super gluing the bottom of beer cans the ends of the pipe, however this requires a fair degree of accuracy when cutting away the excess. White metal ends are too heavy and styrene too time consuming. I have never tried resin, although the beer can bottom would make a good mould.

 

How did you make the brass doors / vents on your twin axle ferry wagons? Were the wheel sets and axle boxes etc from ready to run Hornby ferry wagons?

 

The bogies used on my wagons are of two types of ready to run, Y25s and another one used under bogie cement wagons (see the picture below). Both are made by Bachmann, bought cheap from eBay in bulk with out wheels or couplings some years back. Shame is I should have bought loads more at the time. Particularly the Y25s as masses of different wagons use them throughout Europe. It really is a pity that the major manufacturers don't sell a complete range of ready to run freight bogies without the wheels cheaply. So many wagons seem to change bogies either after upgrades or when they are overhauled.

 

 

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This one is one of four knocked up using the tops of Hornby SAA from the scrap box, cut and shut with a styrene chassis. The pipe load is from a packet of 50 black drinking straws bought in a Danish supermarket for a pound a packet. Again I should have bought more at the time as I haven't seen any black ones since.

 

I'd like to build a few of these. Does anyone know if these would fit the UK loading gauge? I believe it is an Eanos type, the day I took the picture it was used to convey scrap metal at Osnabrück. It appears to have no ferry markings. The bogies look to be of a Y25 type although again I'm not sure which type. Any help with this info would be greatly appreciated.

 

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Wow. Amazing stuff. Loving the Silver Bullets and the Grain Flow. Am I right in thinking that you cast the Silver Bullets in solid resin? Your twin axle vans are so detailed, really inspirational. Do you use super glue for the brass fittings?

The silver bullets are semi-solid, there is a centre plug that goes into the mould to reduce the weight and make it hollow, but if the inside followed the same contour as the outside it wouldn't be possible to get the centre p[lug back out again. The fittings are my own etched ones - I extended them at the wagon end so that they had a tail that could be glued into a hole to make them a bit more secure.

 

I've built some bogie tank wagons using 35.5mm OD plastic waste pipe, with the ends made from nylon plugs used in office furniture. The result is ok however I would prefer a more rounded shape as per a TEA / TTA etc. I then tried super gluing the bottom of beer cans the ends of the pipe, however this requires a fair degree of accuracy when cutting away the excess. White metal ends are too heavy and styrene too time consuming. I have never tried resin, although the beer can bottom would make a good mould.

Yes, Ironically rounded ends are more difficult than cone and truncated cone ends, I buy any cheap HO tanks that have a possibly useful end profile that I can either cut up, or modify. Tanks are very difficult to cast hollow unless they have a 'skirt' like the bullets.

 

How did you make the brass doors / vents on your twin axle ferry wagons? Were the wheel sets and axle boxes etc from ready to run Hornby ferry wagons?

The vents are my own etch, the axleboxes are as you have id's the Triang VIX, although I use so many I've cast a set in resin.

 

The bogies used on my wagons are of two types of ready to run, Y25s and another one used under bogie cement wagons (see the picture below). Both are made by Bachmann, bought cheap from eBay in bulk with out wheels or couplings some years back. Shame is I should have bought loads more at the time. Particularly the Y25s as masses of different wagons use them throughout Europe. It really is a pity that the major manufacturers don't sell a complete range of ready to run freight bogies without the wheels cheaply. So many wagons seem to change bogies either after upgrades or when they are overhauled.

Yes my favourite is the Cambrian Y25 - my first etch was an inner frame for the Cambrian that provides the structural strength which is a bit lacking in the plastic kit. I've never been very happy with the Bachman Y25 but I can't put my finger on why.

 

Jon

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Some interesting stuff there. The Eanos might not be too far from UK loading gauge; Tiphook had a fleet of similar wagons (now owned by Touax, I believe) purpose-built to UK loading gauge. Here are some links to sites that might be of interest:-

http://lapassiondutrain.blogspot.co.uk/   often has wagons and on-track plant featured, especially new types.

http://www.trenomania.org/fotogallery/index.php has a large section dedicated to wagons of both Italian and other European countries.

http://www.photos-ferroviaires.fr/index.php?/categories is a French site

There was another very good photo site, run by a Belgian chap, but it disappeared when the host went out of business. I think Jon used to look at it as well, so might know if it's reappeared elsewhere.

The other bogie type you're using is supplied by a firm called Barber, I believe; they seem to be replacing the Y25 and the German plate-framed types as the standard type on new-builds.

You might find dome ends for tanks available from one or other of the following:-

http://www.ema-models.co.uk/

http://modelshop.co.uk/

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Some interesting stuff there. The Eanos might not be too far from UK loading gauge; Tiphook had a fleet of similar wagons (now owned by Touax, I believe) purpose-built to UK loading gauge. Here are some links to sites that might be of interest:-

http://lapassiondutrain.blogspot.co.uk/   often has wagons and on-track plant featured, especially new types.

http://www.trenomania.org/fotogallery/index.php has a large section dedicated to wagons of both Italian and other European countries.

http://www.photos-ferroviaires.fr/index.php?/categories is a French site

There was another very good photo site, run by a Belgian chap, but it disappeared when the host went out of business. I think Jon used to look at it as well, so might know if it's reappeared elsewhere.

The other bogie type you're using is supplied by a firm called Barber, I believe; they seem to be replacing the Y25 and the German plate-framed types as the standard type on new-builds.

You might find dome ends for tanks available from one or other of the following:-

http://www.ema-models.co.uk/

http://modelshop.co.uk/

 

Brian, thanks for the info, I'll be going through this over the next couple of days. In the meantime I found this DB document that gives specific wagon types and has line drawings with some dimensions.

 

http://www.rail.dbschenker.co.uk/file/rail-deutschland-en/7982224/pu539VcqdBcmJnbjhCZTNS4G1ys/5509816/data/freight_wagon_catalog_v2011.pdf.

 

EMA Models are really quite something. I'll have to do some planning. First of all I need more wheels sets from Hattons.......

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Bachmann bogie mystery solved.post-28700-0-52141400-1457466762_thumb.jpg

 

This comes from a Network Rail safety bulletin found on the web, so not my picture.

https://www.safety.networkrail.co.uk/alerts-and-campaign/~/media/Home/New%20Structure%2017%20apr%202013/Alerts%20and%20Campaigns/Infrastructure%20Group%20Bulletins/NR%20Safety%20Bulletin%20318%20-%20Bogie%20Wheelset%20Lift%20Bracket%20Detachment.pdf

 

The bulletin makes interesting reading in its own right.

 

I use the Bachmann Brass Turned wagon wheels for these bogies. 36-034. IMHO they are relatively cheap and roughly the right size. Although the brake blocks need filling out a bit .

 

Here is another project.

 

Part one of two of a two wagon rail scrubber which uses a weighted hollow backed pad that has a small amount of isopropyl alcohol dispensed from a second wagon using a built in hypodermic syringe and a small length plastic tubing. The pad is made from an off cut of the green astro turfy type stuff they use for cricket nets. Built as a bit of an experiment it does seem work surprisingly well. These also use the TF25s.

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Bachmann brought out the RMC JGAs but I only picked up a few at the time. The shape has always really interested me so had a go at building a batch of seven to a more modern looking longer design. They have the Y25s but still require further detailing with hopper door hinge details etc. As usual I haven't got round to detailing any transfers.

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  • 1 month later...

Built a few more of these curtain hooded wagons. It uses a length of plastic waste pipe with 0.5mm styrene sheet formed over the top, then micro strip ribs.

 

Tissue paper is then glued over this with pritt-stick type paper glue. Once this has dried it can be sprayed with primer, which hardens the paper. In this case the red primer from a well known car accessory shop was the desired finished colour, however I have used other top coats in the past, each of these helps to add a harder she'll to the tissue paper hood. Varying the tissue paper thickness will give differing levels of creases. I've noticed that creases in the real thing seem to vary depending on age, the material used and even the colour / light reflected back.

 

The catches that secure the hood at each end need detailing further with a brass etch, although I have never done this before so if anyone knows of any readily available ones I would be interested.

 

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The scrap metal traffic on my layout has significantly increased recently. One evening, following the consumption of some apple based liquid refreshment, I cut up the empty cans with a pair of scissors and loaded up the wagon.

After a couple of weeks I noticed that the scrap metal flow had increased from wagon load to trainload volume and so I have had to build another six wagons to cope with the demand. These are simple styrene boxes with styrene strip ribs etc. Bogies are the usual ready to run type but have had a grease added to improve the free running and reduce the wear from the metal axle point.

 

Unlike the prototype wagon below the new wagons haven't yet been labelled up with the hire company name or the wagon code details.

 

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This is how the hooded wagons look before the tissue paper is added. The next batch will have the ribs spaced wider as I noticed that they are too close together on this lot. I really need to detail the latching system, probably using a brass etch, does anyone know if there is such a thing readily available as I don't have a clue where to start with creating one.

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If you fancy something a bit different, the Brazilian railway company Rumo ALL has drawings of their wagons available here

 

http://pt.rumoall.com/conteudo_eni.asp?idioma=1&conta=46&tipo=27585

 

The drawings are mostly for their metre gauge traffic, although there is at least one 5'3" gauge (1600mm) drawing there too.

 

Of course, it's unlikely you'd find them coming through the channel tunnel!

 

If I counted them up correctly, there are 73 drawings on the site - that should keep you busy for a while!

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Having read an interesting article about a French company who have recently designed a wagon for transporting articulated trucks with the tractor unit included. My son and I had a model of an 'Artic' so we thought that we would have go at making a wagon to carry it that fits within the UK loading gauge when compared with ready to run diesels. It was not easy to get the bottom of the underfame rigid. In the end we used a couple of pieces of flat bottom rail superglued into the sides

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JRA ex CTRL Spoil Wagon. One of two so far. Although I'm not sure where to get the transfers. It won't matter too much as it will end up looking distressed' anyway.

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If you fancy something a bit different, the Brazilian railway company Rumo ALL has drawings of their wagons available here

 

http://pt.rumoall.com/conteudo_eni.asp?idioma=1&conta=46&tipo=27585

 

The drawings are mostly for their metre gauge traffic, although there is at least one 5'3" gauge (1600mm) drawing there too.

 

Of course, it's unlikely you'd find them coming through the channel tunnel!

 

If I counted them up correctly, there are 73 drawings on the site - that should keep you busy for a while!

If you fancy something a bit different, the Brazilian railway company Rumo ALL has drawings of their wagons available here

 

http://pt.rumoall.com/conteudo_eni.asp?idioma=1&conta=46&tipo=27585

 

The drawings are mostly for their metre gauge traffic, although there is at least one 5'3" gauge (1600mm) drawing there too.

 

Of course, it's unlikely you'd find them coming through the channel tunnel!

 

If I counted them up correctly, there are 73 drawings on the site - that should keep you busy for a while!

 

Wow cheers for sending the link........this certainly will keep me busy. I've got to get the hang of scaling using a printer, although just the numerous designs will help with scratch building inspiration.

 

Just out of interest is this your field / country of modelling interest?

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Wow cheers for sending the link........this certainly will keep me busy. I've got to get the hang of scaling using a printer, although just the numerous designs will help with scratch building inspiration.

 

Just out of interest is this your field / country of modelling interest?

 

My main interest is actually a stretch of railway between Bedford and Cambridge in the 1930s. However, I have a Brazilian partner and in December we went over there to do the rounds of family and friends, and managed a few railway related outings too. I put up some photographs in another thread earlier this year http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/106106-brazilian-railways/ - it was while doing a bit of background research after the trip that I stumbled across those wagon drawings. That thread has photos of some of those wagons which should give you some idea of the detailing that isn't apparent in the drawings.

 

The motive power I saw running there were GE dash-7s and EMD GT22s on the modern line and an ALCO 2-8-2 on the heritage line - all set to metre gauge.

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The need to move new concrete sleepers to site during engineering possessions has lead to this new wagon being built. At present it is a one off but as the demand grows another couple are possible. post-28700-0-73883300-1463033568_thumb.jpg

 

The sleepers are cut from the ends of Peco track when preparing for laying. It took ages to impact adhesive them individually onto the brown colour battens. The yellow flat deck of the wagon is made from a piece of steel, this was used to add weight as it was found to be too light and was prone to derail when coupled with some RTR wagons. The straps are staples with small pieces of blue wire insulation, this was also a bit fiddly but was copied off of a prototype.

 

It runs on TF25 bogies and still requires the hand brake wheels, tie down loops and decals.

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  • 2 months later...

The book by John L Fox - Railway Wagon Plans - 1960 to the Present' was released a few months ago and after viewing it at the Ian Allan book shop near Waterloo I bought a copy. IMHO It is brilliant as I have been waiting for something like this for years and so buzzing with renewed inspiration I have been busy building.

 

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I chose to build KHA-Es as firstly.... I like them! And secondly I have built similar wagons before and so have fairly tried and test tested construction methods for this type, therefore there should be less frustrating 'reinventing the wheel' sessions during the build.

 

It basically revolves around a length of plastic waste pipe. The rest is styrene sheet and Evergreen styrene strips and channels etc. With the pipe glued to the 1mm base, each side has two 1mm thick pieces added which come up to just under the widest part of the pipe. These help to support the straight sides and prevent the outer .25mm styrene sheet, which represents the tarpaulin or hood, from deforming inwards.

 

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As this wagon drawing is 4mm / OO Gauge tthe measurements need to be adjusted very slightly as it is extremely difficult to repeatedly cut 0.8752mm accurately......especially with these eyes

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In the book the end detail of the wagon is shown in both 4mm scale and also enlarged to show the detail better. This was very useful when transferring the measurements due to the requirement to round some up or down a bit to avoid the reoccurring figures after the decimal point.

 

The white metal buffers were the nearest I had in stock from Genesis Models, they don't look too bad although they are very slightly too long and aren't sprung. The rest of the locking levers and details will be added later.......probably when I find time to do some etch brass ones.........hopefully.....possibly

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have worked on the body for an older cargowaggon from the 1950's, but need to find a longer 4 wheel chassis. Might bodge something, but not sure. Am possibly looking to build some more modern cargowaggons, but not sure. Your work looks great though, looks realistic and would fit in on a speedlink blockfreight working

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