Upcoming O gauge sale - End of the line at Marsh Lane

[MarshLane]

Check out this you can see how the interior is painted http://intentio.co.uk/ger-engine-shed-update/12803147_10153376957482256_1108651934669882152_n/

 

 

Mike,

Many thanks for that.  Lovely little shed  Could see that might fit one of the new Minerva Kerr Stuart's just nicely  No Rich, keep mind on subject hehe!  

 

Shed Update

No progress on the shed today, well except spray painting the pit steps black!  But thanks to the help of a good mate, we've managed to get all of my British OO gauge sorted out for going to auction or eBay, that will release a reasonable amount of funds for O gauge modelling!  Now just got to get a whole host of American HO listed on to eBay and sold, and hopefully the loco fleet, wagon fleet and layout in general will benefit!

 

The other good news, is a packet of DAS clay dropped through the door this morning, while Mr Courier delivered a rather large packet from C&L this afternoon, so tomorrow with the exception of an hour in the morning, and a couple of hours around teatime, should be a shed construction day all day - hopefully with track being laid on the base.  Now to learn about track laying and how to model DAS clay into these paviours!

 

Oh the experimental spraying of plastikard black worked well - although I need some better masking tape, think mine was cheap stuff from somewhere.  But we've moved forward a couple of mm!

 

Cheers

Rich

[Jintyman]

I'll look forward to your track building.

I find it a nice relaxing part of the hobby.

What sleepers are you using? I personally use Intentio's ply sleepering, great value and they do the required different widths for point work and plain track. Ply sleepering, C&L plastic chairs and C&L BH rail.

 

The shed is looking really good, and will be an impressive building once finished.

 

Jinty

[MarshLane]

Thanks Jinty

Looking forward to getting it finished and moving onto the layout proper! I decided to start with it, thinking I'd get distracted by trackwork, scenery and running trains if I did the boards first!

 

I'll have a look at Intentio's sleepers. I've used all C&L for the first time with C&L and Exactoscale chairs.

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Well progress has been made today, although not without its mistakes!  I'd decided it was easily time the some track was laid and having read so many threads on here about track building I was itching to have a go!

 

 

Having got the template printed out from Templot, i laid the sleepers out on top holding them in position with some double-sided sticky tape.  I pondered for a while how to secure the rail along the side of the pit, as obviously sleepers cannot be laid across the open space.  In the end, I decided  to lay them longitudinal for the pit length, especially as the floor of the shed will cover them up once the shed is finished.  

 

 

Then came the realisation of my first mistake, although not before having thought to myself that this rail seems remarkably flexible, thin and small.  It was then I realised that i'd ordered all 7mm items from C&L except the track, which was 4mm  Thanks to Pete at C&L for being understanding, we've resolved the situation - which was entirely my fault! So with no more track laying to be done before Tuesday when the new rail arrives, i sat and pondered some more, then realised that I could use the rail from Peco metre-length, and remove all the sleepers, so that was done.  

 

 

Chairs cut from the sprue and threaded onto the rail.  Now this was mistake no.2 because it wasn't until after i'd got them glued, that I realised some keys faced left and others faced right Again, its a learning curve and I know i'll make mistakes, but I should have been referring to the email from Martin Wynne with all its comments and suggestions, so thats a big one to remember for next time.  Then I did a stupid thing, the rail that was going on the left side, i glued on the right and vice versa.  Didn't realise this one until I was gluing the penultimate sleeper!  Drat it (or words to that effect) were muttered.  So third mistake to remember for next time is that the keys go on the outside of the rails and not the inside.  Thankfully all appears to work ok with when a wagon runs over. Will try a loco tomorrow, but i think i'll get away with it.

 

 

 

So mistakes made, lessons learnt, probably partly because of too much enthusiasm on my part, or not enough care taken ... but either way, Marsh Lane now has its first track laid. I've built my first bit of track and I'm quite happy that it just actually works!!  Its not the complicated requirements of pointwork, but its still something I thought for many years was way beyond my knowledge or skill level.  Just goes to show, anyone can do anything if they try ... and have the good advisers of rmWeb  The 0-MF gauges from Debs on here, are superb and I cannot recommend them highly enough.  

 

 

So thats the first line done.  I'm going to wait until next week before I do the track  for the second and see how it looks with the right rail, keys in the right way, and also on the right side of the rail.  Nothing is actually stuck to the shed floor yet (and there's still electrical connections to solder etc..)  so if I'm really not happy i'll do away with the first one and rebuild it.  In my mind though, I'm asking the question ... when the track is painted, weathered, and the shed floor is in, will anyone actually notice?

 

Rich

Edited June 10, 2016 by MarshLane

[Jintyman]

In my mind though, I'm asking the question ... when the track is painted, weathered, and the shed floor is in, will anyone actually notice?

 

Rich

No they won't.

 

My starting mistake was to fit the bullhead rail upside down on one side of a turnout and the right way on the other!!!!

Once you get out onto the outside of the shed track, you'll need to stain the sleepers. I use Rustins Dark Teak, but others use a darker colour. It's all down to personal preferance.

 

Jinty  

[Donw]

Glad to see you have made a start. Don't worry about mistakes. Ypu learn more from doing things and mistakes teach you what not to do. I wouldn't worry about having the keys odd ways. In real life the keys would be put in the other way round if they needed to. The gangers would note which way they fell out and put them in the other way. who can argue that they shouldn't be that way. The exception would be on a gradient where it would be unusual if they weren't facing up hill so the tendency for the rail to creep down hill would tighten the keys.

 

Don

[MarshLane]

Hi Jinty and Don,

Thanks for the replies and encouragement! Interesting you mention about the chairs on the uphill sections, would never have thought of that happening!

 

Jinty you mentioned staining the sleepers. My plan is to coat the lot in sleeper grime, let it dry and then mask off the ends and middle of the sleepers and respect with general rust. This is what I did on the test track although the that was using Peco track. Do you think the sleepers should still be stained?

 

I suppose thinking about it, if they were stained they wouldn't need spraying with sleeper grime? Or perhaps just lightly in different places to help the weathered look?

 

Rich

[Jintyman]

Hi Rich,

 

Personally I think they need staining to make them look more like a sleeper. It brings out the grain of the wood, which just all over spraying wouldn't do.

 

Here is a picture showing the sleepers on my photo plank, showing the sleepers (hopefully) stained in Rustins Dark Teak, which as I mentioned is a little lighter than others use, but it's a personal preference really (I have now started to soak the sleepers rather than painting it on and it comes out a touch darker).

 

 

I hope that shows the colour of the sleepers. I have misted some Humbrol track colour and then brushed a let down rust colour onto the side of the rail afterwards. 

Also something to think about is that your track in the shed area will be somewhat different to the track further away from the shed, so it may be more difficult for you.

 

Jinty

[Simond]

Do have a look at Newtz' thread, and Steve Fay's Cardiff Canton & Ranelagh Bridge threads.

 

Lots of inspiration there, and some outstanding weathering of loco shed track, and the ground in between.

 

David's photo plank shows lovely sun-bleached sleepers which are towards the other end of the colour scale. I had a discussion with Chris Klein, Martyn 3-link and a few others on here about sleeper colours a while back, and went looking on Google images. It's amazing the range of colours you will see, from blacker than the hobs of hell to very pale silvery grey, and just about every shade of grey and brown in between. Depends on where they are, what's running over them, and the weather, so I guess the best way is to find colour photos of what you want to represent, and try to copy what you see.

 

Best

Simon

[MarshLane]

Hi Rich,

 

Personally I think they need staining to make them look more like a sleeper. It brings out the grain of the wood, which just all over spraying wouldn't do.

 

I hope that shows the colour of the sleepers. I have misted some Humbrol track colour and then brushed a let down rust colour onto the side of the rail afterwards. 

Also something to think about is that your track in the shed area will be somewhat different to the track further away from the shed, so it may be more difficult for you.

 

Jinty

 

 

Hi Jinty,

Thanks for that,  Yes, looking at yours, I'm of the same opinion.  Do you spray/paint/weather your sleepers and rails before or after building the track?  On my test board that the loco shots were done on earlier in the thread, I masked off the edges and centre of the sleepers along the edge of the chairs, then spray painted the rails a rust colour, overall i think it worked, but I'm working if there's a better or more effective way?

 

Good point about the shed sleeper colours - that i need to look into.  I like the colour of your sleepers tho, can see them being like that in some little used siding or the like

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Do have a look at Newtz' thread, and Steve Fay's Cardiff Canton & Ranelagh Bridge threads.

 

Lots of inspiration there, and some outstanding weathering of loco shed track, and the ground in between.

 

David's photo plank shows lovely sun-bleached sleepers which are towards the other end of the colour scale. I had a discussion with Chris Klein, Martyn 3-link and a few others on here about sleeper colours a while back, and went looking on Google images. It's amazing the range of colours you will see, from blacker than the hobs of hell to very pale silvery grey, and just about every shade of grey and brown in between. Depends on where they are, what's running over them, and the weather, so I guess the best way is to find colour photos of what you want to represent, and try to copy what you see.

 

Best

Simon

 

Hi Simon,

Cheers.  I've been reading through the Newton shed thread, and follow Steve Fay's Ranelagh Bridge thread, but didn't know about the Cardiff Canton one - will have to go and find that!  I've been searching through most of the shed threads looking for ideas, and ways of doing things.  Much of this is new to me, although I've been involved with model railways for over 30 years, nothing has progressed beyond a bit of scenery and peco track!  So Marsh Lane is already far further that anything else i've done!

 

Thanks for the tips, i seem to spend my spare time on Flickr and rmWeb these days looking for realism shots!

 

Rich

[Jintyman]

Hi Rich,

 

I soak my sleepers in Rustins and then let them dry.

I then build the track, then ballast and then I mist over some track colour just over where the rail and chairs are, so the wood looks more natural in the middle and edges.

I then go along the rail sides with some let down (50/50) rust enamel paint and let it run onto the chairs a bit. If it looks too stark, I follow over with track colour in the airbrush again.

 

Trackwork is subjective, every single person will have a different outlook and view of things. That is mine, I'm not saying it's correct, but it looks ok to me.

I also look at Ranleigh Bridge and Newts thread and admire theirs greatly, but for my layout of Talyllyn, a more lighter look to the sleepers I think works.

 

Jinty

[Donw]

 

This was my choice

[MarshLane]

Thanks Don.

 

That's another option! I got some Sleeper Dye from C&L which I'll try and see how it looks. But I'll try yours and Jinty's ideas for the yard sidings.

 

Cheers

Rich

[MarshLane]

This is perhaps a silly question, but when I made the track last night, I glued the chairs to the sleepers, but didn't glue the track to the chairs .... Should I have done? Just come to remove the template and realised that the sleepers will move if I don't! But wanted to check before going and glue it!!

 

Rich

[Simond]

It won't work for your pit, but you can leave the template stuck to the sleepers, ad simply ballast over it.

 

Good advice from Martin Wynne...

 

Best

Simon

[John R Smith]

Rich

 

If you mean should you glue the rail to the chairs, then I would say don't with a capital 'D'. OK, it means you may have to slide the sleepers around a bit to align things correctly on the baseboard (but then I would have glued the sleepers and crossing timbers to the baseboard anyhow). But leaving the rail free in the chairs means that it is so much easier if in future you want to modify your track plan, insert a new turnout, etc. Most of my layouts in the past just sort of "evolved" and there were many track plan changes as a result.

 

John

[Donw]

I would recommend gluing the rail to the chairs except if your crossing and wing rails are separate items it could be possible for them to move and possibly cause a problem in that area. I prefer to make up a crossing/wing rail assembly  and expoxy that down onto the timbers which hold the essential bits in place

here is an example of the assembly

 

chairs can be chopped up to provide cosmetic bits around the crossing. 

Painting the rust colour on the sides of the rails tend to fix the chairs in place on the rail.

 

You can use a printed template ( templot) fixed in place held down with masking tape on the edges glue the timbers onto that (pva or Print stick) then once built the template and turnout can be placed onto the baseboard.

 

This 2mm one was built using just these few construction lines drawn onto a bit of printer paper so you don't need a fancy template I just used the lead from prototype table to mark it out.

 

 

 

[3 link]

Hi Rich,

 

I have to agree with Jinty regarding fitting the rail upside down, we have all done this at least once if we are honest. The rail head is not that much larger than the base until you look closer, also remember if you are using C&L fishplates that the square nuts face the outer side of the rail.

 

Martyn.

Edited June 12, 2016 by 3 link

[MarshLane]

Hi Simon/Don,

Thanks for the feedback. Didn't think about leaving the template in place, although somehow that feels like not tidying up afterwards! I think one of the learning points was I used carpet double sided tape to stick the sleepers to the template, which is probably too sticky! Shall try pritstick next!

 

Martyn: thanks for the tip. One of my upcoming tasks was to look at Flickr to see how they went on - you've saved me a job!

 

Rich

[MarshLane]

Rich

 

If you mean should you glue the rail to the chairs, then I would say don't with a capital 'D'. OK, it means you may have to slide the sleepers around a bit to align things correctly on the baseboard (but then I would have glued the sleepers and crossing timbers to the baseboard anyhow). But leaving the rail free in the chairs means that it is so much easier if in future you want to modify your track plan, insert a new turnout, etc. Most of my layouts in the past just sort of "evolved" and there were many track plan changes as a result.

 

John

Hi John

Thanks for the reply. I take your point, but you've intrigued me now ... If your gluing sleepers and crossing timbers to the baseboard and not gluing the rail to chairs ... How are you building point work and track from a template? As I discovered not gluing the rail to the chairs can give movement, so are you building on top of the template then being very careful in moving the trackwork to the baseboard, or is there another way that I can't think of? I'm assuming your working from a template?

 

Rich

[Simond]

Rich

 

I glue the crossing & check rails to timbers, as Don does. Link to one of my builds here. http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/79052-porth-dinllaen-in-0/?p=1846473

 

Hope it helps

 

Best

Simon

Edited June 12, 2016 by Simond

[John R Smith]

Hi John

Thanks for the reply. I take your point, but you've intrigued me now ... If your gluing sleepers and crossing timbers to the baseboard and not gluing the rail to chairs ... How are you building point work and track from a template? As I discovered not gluing the rail to the chairs can give movement, so are you building on top of the template then being very careful in moving the trackwork to the baseboard, or is there another way that I can't think of? I'm assuming your working from a template?

 

Rich

 

Hello Rich

 

Well, I'm probably in a minority of one here, but I have never used a template. So my methods may well seem a bit unorthodox these days - all I have ever done was just sketch out a track plan on paper but not to scale. Then I drew the centre lines of the tracks on the baseboard using a springy thin batten to get smooth curves. Next step was to cut and glue sleepers and crossing timbers to the baseboard using a spacing gauge (I used balsa, but ply seems to be the thing now). Plain track is easy, just thread the chairs and lay it using your track gauge. For points and crossings I laid the outside rail (stock rails) first, and where the inside rails intersect I built my crossing - then you just lay all the other bits to fit, as it were. Not very scientific, but I did some very complex track for "Maristow" this way and it all worked just fine. I used Peco rail and chairs.

 

I know, I know, you will all be shaking your heads in disbelief and horror and of course you would be right by today's much higher standards I am sure. And also of course I have never had the slightest clue what my crossing angles or leads were, or curve radii come to that. I just did it all by eye and if it looked right that was good enough.

 

John

Edited June 12, 2016 by John R Smith

[John R Smith]

Er, I'm not recommending my tracklaying methods, you understand, but just to show that it did work here is a photo of Maristow from 1974 with the track laid as above. This was the most complex bit which had a tandem turnout combined with a diamond crossing - it took me ages, but was fun really and yes it did run just fine with no derailments.

 

[BG John]

I did pretty much the same as John with this 4mm scale mixed gauge track, except that most of it was soldered to copper clad sleepers. I've used templates printed from Templot on more recent track though.