Stoke Courtenay

[Miss Prism]

Plated portholes are correct for 1930s.

[gwrrob]

The pipes are easily removed on the Bachmann 45xx John as I did it on one of mine.

[The Great Bear]

 

 

No wonder they say model railways are seldom finished.

 

Oh yes.

Edited February 11, 2017 by The Great Bear

[gwrrob]

The pipes are easily removed on the Bachmann 45xx John as I did it on one of mine.

 

Here's 4540 with portholes plated and pipes removed.

 

 

[checkrail]

Thought I'd finish off the 45xx saga by summarising some of the items I used in the 'tarting up' process.

 

Number plates are Jackson Evans/Modelmaster

 

Vac pipes were braided brass ones from Scale Link.  These are slightly disappointing in that the upright pipe seems far too thin (unusual - things are more often overscale).  They needed beefing up by slipping some insulation from old layout wire over them.  It's a pity the trusty old Romford braided pipes seem to have gone out of production.  NIS at Peters and elsewhere.  There was a pack on eBay the other week but I forgot to go back before the auction ended.  If anyone knows of a source of brass pipes that can be manipulated into that characteristic GWR shape I'd be interested to know.

 

Steam heat pipes were a 2 part brass item from Markits.  Lovely.

 

Screw couplings are Hornby spares x5069.  Very neat but not quite correct as they have a shackle at the top passing through the hook.  Designed for diesels I think. But very acceptable at a distance.  I put a drop of Roket Hot on the links to ensure they hung vertically instead of in an s shape - they're very light.  (I'm currently grappling with some exquisite - and expensive - Exactoscale items to see if I can persuade them into that typically GWR arrangement where they're hooked up below the left buffer.  This is for when I get onto tarting up the tender engines.)

 

Crew were 3-D printed figures from Modelu.  Really nice and a wide variety of poses available. Fun to paint too (albeit rather inexpertly).

 

Lamps are also from Modelu.  I find these tricky.  In removing the lenses I often manage to delaminate the little plastic lens from its reflector.  Or I offer up the lens/reflctor but then find it difficult to persuade it to get off my knife point and adhere to the lamp. I'll try to nudge it off with a cocktail stick but then it'll stick to that.  Or I'll slice it from the backing strip only to bring a trail of surlus gum with it, which I then can't get off the lamp without dislodging the lens.  And on the sorry tale goes....    Grrrr.  I need about 3 lenses per lamp to get it right.  Any hints & tips gratefully received!  But they do look nice.

 

Buffer beam numbers were a mixture of Fox waterslide and HMRS Methfix transfers (but not on the same buffer beam obviously!).

 

In regard to 4574 I thought the two words 'Great' and 'Western' were far too close together on Bachmann's 4539 (as they were on their 4555 which I guess replicated its preserved state).  I've always understood that following the First World War the practice was to leave a gap that would accommodate the crest or twin shields, which in the event were never added to tank or freight locos. I've since been persuaded elsewhere on this forum that this might not always have been the case, and have been pointed at a pic of a grubby 4539 in which the words do seem a bit closer.  But I was determined to model the typical, reflecting the numerous photos of GW tank engines in my albums, so the lettering had to go.

 

I was new to this, and found that using T-cut or IPA and rubbing with a cotton bud, or scraping gently with a cocktail stick, as many articles suggest I would often get through the green paint before the lettering had disappeared. And on one pannier tank (still under treatment) the lettering left a 'ghost' shadow.  But I blundered on and did a bit of touching up, and all was well.  I originally applied HMRS Methfix lettering, but didn't like the vivid yellow colour.  Fox do both gold and yellow versions, so I went for their gold - a better match for my existing Hornby and Bachmann finishes.  But their letters were far closer together than any locos I'd ever seen pictures of, so I had to cut them out and apply every letter separately.  Using some good 45xx illustrations in my books I faithfully copied the positioning of the letters around the vertical rivet runs on the tank side.  I'll leave you to judge how accurately I managed it but after a coat of Halford's matt varnish spray I'm reasonably pleased with it. Still lots to learn with all this stuff. 

 

Anyway, enough of prairies for a while.  Time to get back to King, Castle, Hall etc for the treatment.  But here's a last shot of the the two of them.

 

 

John C.

Edited February 12, 2017 by checkrail

[checkrail]

Here's 4540 with portholes plated and pipes removed.

 

4540 no pipes a.jpg

 

4540 no pipes.jpg

 

Nice pics Robin, and nice work.  Thanks for that.  A 45xx minus outside steam pipes might now be a future project.

[Captain Kernow]

Hi John,

 

So much, virtually everything, about this layout is just so good, perfect one might say, that I hesitate to offer any constructive criticism that may detract from that, but having admired the fact that you have been improving your Bachmann prairies, there is one aspect that does glare out a bit for me, and that is the retention of the chunky Bachmann front lamp brackets, especially those on the footplate immediately above the buffer beam.

 

What I usually do is to remove them (if they're fitted in the first place) and make my own, usually using some 0.75mm brass or nickel silver strip. I usually superglue the new lamp irons to the loco, but if you're using removable lamps, you may wish to solder a short section of 0.3mm brass rod behind each bracket, and sink the rod into a corresponding hole drilled in the footplate. That should make them more robust in terms of removing and replacing the lamps.

 

Otherwise, it's all just stunning. The track work is immaculate (in terms of alignment, top and general 'flow'), and is nicely coloured. Full marks for installing point rodding and signal wire runs as well!

[Limpley Stoker]

Thought I'd finish off the 45xx saga by summarising some of the items I used in the 'tarting up' process.

 

Number plates are Jackson Evans/Modelmaster

 

Vac pipes were braided brass ones from Scale Link. These are slightly disappointing in that the upright pipe seems far too thin (unusual - things are more often overscale). They needed beefing up by slipping some insulation from old layout wire over them. It's a pity the trusty old Romford braided pipes seem to have gone out of production. NIS at Peters and elsewhere. There was a pack on eBay the other week but I forgot to go back before the auction ended. If anyone knows of a source of brass pipes that can be manipulated into that characteristic GWR shape I'd be interested to know.

 

Steam heat pipes were a 2 part brass item from Markits. Lovely.

 

Screw couplings are Hornby spares x5069. Very neat but not quite correct as they have a shackle at the top passing through the hook. Designed for diesels I think. But very acceptable at a distance. I put a drop of Roket Hot on the links to ensure they hung vertically instead of in an s shape - they're very light. (I'm currently grappling with some exquisite - and expensive - Exactoscale items to see if I can persuade them into that typically GWR arrangement where they're hooked up below the left buffer. This is for when I get onto tarting up the tender engines.)

 

Crew were 3-D printed figures from Modelu. Really nice and a wide variety of poses available. Fun to paint too (albeit rather inexpertly).

 

Lamps are also from Modelu. I find these tricky. In removing the lenses I often manage to delaminate the little plastic lens from its reflector. Or I offer up the lens/reflctor but then find it difficult to persuade it to get off my knife point and adhere to the lamp. I'll try to nudge it off with a cocktail stick but then it'll stick to that. Or I'll slice it from the backing strip only to bring a trail of surlus gum with it, which I then can't get off the lamp without dislodging the lens. And on the sorry tale goes.... Grrrr. I need about 3 lenses per lamp to get it right. Any hints & tips gratefully received! But they do look nice.

 

Buffer beam numbers were a mixture of Fox waterslide and HMRS Methfix transfers (but not on the same buffer beam obviously!).

 

In regard to 4574 I thought the two words 'Great' and 'Western' were too far apart on Bachmann's 4539 (as they were on their 4555 which I guess replicated its preserved state). I've always understood that following the First World War the practice was to leave a gap that would accommodate the crest or twin shields, which in the event were never added to tank or freight locos. I've since been persuaded elsewhere on this forum that this might not always have been the case, and have been pointed at a pic of a grubby 4539 in which the words do seem a bit closer. But I was determined to model the typical, reflecting the numerous photos of GW tank engines in my albums, so the lettering had to go.

 

I was new to this, and found that using T-cut or IPA and rubbing with a cotton bud, or scraping gently with a cocktail stick, as many articles suggest I would often get through the green paint before the lettering had disappeared. And on one pannier tank (still under treatment) the lettering left a 'ghost' shadow. But I blundered on and did a bit of touching up, and all was well. I originally applied HMRS Methfix lettering, but didn't like the vivid yellow colour. Fox do both gold and yellow versions, so I went for their gold - a better match for my existing Hornby and Bachmann finishes. But their letters were far closer together than any locos I'd ever seen pictures of, so I had to cut them out and apply every letter separately. Using some good 45xx illustrations in my books I faithfully copied the positioning of the letters around the vertical rivet runs on the tank side. I'll leave you to judge how accurately I managed it but after a coat of Halford's matt varnish spray I'm reasonably pleased with it. Still lots to learn with all this stuff.

 

Anyway, enough of prairies for a while. Time to get back to King, Castle, Hall etc for the treatment. But here's a last shot of the the two of them.

 

Prairie tanks 045-min.JPG

 

John C.

I do like your wire coupling loops on your praries - really unobtrusive. I wonder if they would work as well fixed behind the buffer beam of a 4-6-0 - given the overhang from the driving wheels.

To get the perfect GWR screw link front coupling hitched up to the left buffer base is really difficult- could this be an opportunity for 3D printing?

Edited February 12, 2017 by Limpley Stoker

[checkrail]

I do like your wire coupling loops on your praries - really unobtrusive. I wonder if they would work as well fixed behind the buffer beam of a 4-6-0 - given the overhang from the driving wheels. 

 

​I suppose if it didn't work you could try mounting them on the bogie?

To get the perfect GWR screw link front coupling hitched up to the left buffer base is really difficult- could this be an opportunity for 3D printing?

 

Reviews of the new Hattons/DJM 48xx suggest that this comes with such a coupling (and there's apparently a corresponding little hook on the buffer beam).  Just what we need.  I've emailed Hattons to ask if it will be available as a spare.  Answer was, 'No plans, but would consider'.  The more people who contact them the more likely this will be I guess? 

[checkrail]

Plated portholes are correct for 1930s.

 

Thanks Miss P. for this guidance.  My real doubt was not so much whether they were plated over by the 1930s, but whether the last (1924) batch, up to and including 4574, ever had the porthole windows in the first place.  I don't think the 4575 variant did.

 

John C.

[checkrail]

having admired the fact that you have been improving your Bachmann prairies, there is one aspect that does glare out a bit for me, and that is the retention of the chunky Bachmann front lamp brackets, especially those on the footplate immediately above the buffer beam.

 

What I usually do is to remove them (if they're fitted in the first place) and make my own, usually using some 0.75mm brass or nickel silver strip. I usually superglue the new lamp irons to the loco, but if you're using removable lamps, you may wish to solder a short section of 0.3mm brass rod behind each bracket, and sink the rod into a corresponding hole drilled in the footplate. That should make them more robust in terms of removing and replacing the lamps.

 

 

 

Thanks Captain, for this suggestion and for very kind words.  Yes, they are a bit beefy.  I'd vaguely considered gently filing them down, but your idea is better.  I had tried attaching the lamps with Tacky Wax, but some of them didn't survive the first circuit of the layout and have not been seen since.  So one or two have ended up being glued on with a spot of UHU.  But locos can look daft with lamps permanently at both ends, so installing scale size brackets and hooking the Modelu lamps thereon, just like the real thing, seems the way to go.

 

That just leaves another modeller's dilemma.  Does one want to lean over with tweezers to change lamps at the end of every journey when one's leaned over backwards to eliminate the 'hand of God' from every other aspect of operation?  Like most modeller's dilemmas I guess it will eventually be resolved by a modeller's compromise!

[checkrail]

NOTE: in post #230 in regard to 'Great Western' lettering I meant 'too close together' and not 'too far apart'.  Apologies for any confusion.

[The Fatadder]

I think I have decided my solution to the lamp issue, one 4575 and b set will have lamps on one end while the other will have the opposite. When taking photos I will just make sure the right loco and coach is used for the shot.

 

I really like your removable idea, but the screw couplings are fiddly enough. Suspect my dyspraxic fingers might object to an even more fiddly task doing the lights as well

[Miss Prism]

Thanks Miss P. for this guidance.  My real doubt was not so much whether they were plated over by the 1930s, but whether the last (1924) batch, up to and including 4574, ever had the porthole windows in the first place.  I don't think the 4575 variant did.

 

Hmmm, good point. Dunno. (Haven't got my Russell books to hand at the moment, although I'm not sure they shed much light on this for the small prairies.) 1924 is right on the cusp of the 'porthole blanking' era. The earliest photo I have found with a previous porthole being blanked over is on 3267 Cornishman, in June (July?) 1924, and was the subject of a works grey picture, so the decision not to incorporate them on new build will have been taken sometime before this. Therefore I'm tending to agree with you that 4555-74 (lot 226) did not appear with them. I don't think the RMweb thread on the Bachmann 45xx introduction is accessible anymore, but there was some discussion about the portholes there. (And Bachmann did an perfect parallel-chimney prototype, unfortunately not making it into the production batches.)

[Captain Kernow]

That just leaves another modeller's dilemma.  Does one want to lean over with tweezers to change lamps at the end of every journey when one's leaned over backwards to eliminate the 'hand of God' from every other aspect of operation?  Like most modeller's dilemmas I guess it will eventually be resolved by a modeller's compromise!

Difficult one that, and in the end I stopped doing it at exhibitions, as using 3-link and screw link couplings was already sufficient 'botheration' for me and my operating team!

[checkrail]

Hmmm, good point. Dunno. (Haven't got my Russell books to hand at the moment, although I'm not sure they shed much light on this for the small prairies.) 1924 is right on the cusp of the 'porthole blanking' era. The earliest photo I have found with a previous porthole being blanked over is on 3267 Cornishman, in June (July?) 1924, and was the subject of a works grey picture, so the decision not to incorporate them on new build will have been taken sometime before this. Therefore I'm tending to agree with you that 4555-74 (lot 226) did not appear with them. I don't think the RMweb thread on the Bachmann 45xx introduction is accessible anymore, but there was some discussion about the portholes there. (And Bachmann did an perfect parallel-chimney prototype, unfortunately not making it into the production batches.)

 

I was resigned to having this wrong on 4574, but wasn't sure whether I'd ever get round to doing something about it.  But I'm off the hook.  I've recently found two 1930s photos of 4591, of the later 4575 version, with portholes!  So I'm sure that 4555-74 would have had them too.

 

John C.

[checkrail]

Locomotive detailing at Stoke Courtenay continues, albeit slowly as I try to refine my skills, sometimes finding out the hard way how not to do things. Last month I told you the tale of two prairies.  Today it's a tale of two Halls.

 

 

I'll start with 5975 'Winslow Hall', formerly Bachmann's 'Kinlet Hall'.  In the shots below it's seen heading east towards Stoke Courtenay with a fitted freight.

 

 

As with the prairies detailing consists of real coal, lamps, crews, etched number & name plates, new vac pipes (not so keen on the Bachmann ones) and dummy screw couplings. Fall plates on both Halls are made from matt black paper, stuck to the edge of the cab floor with double-sided Scotch tape to overlap the tender front but allow sufficient flex to avoid any interference that might compromise smooth running. 

 

Apparently 5975 was a Newton Abbot engine in 1938.  I've not found any pre-nationalisation photos of her, but given her build date (1936 IIRC) I guessed that she would have been outshopped with a 4000 gallon tender with 'shirt button' totem.  It took a while to get the printed 'Great (crest) Western' lettering off the tender, and as usual I brought some green paint off with it.  This was remedied by a few thin coats of Railmatch GWR loco green over the central panel after masking off the lining.  A few sprayed coats of Humbrol satin varnish covered a multitude of sins.  Somehow I think that this more minimalist insignia diverts attention a bit from Bachmann's rather heavy handed lining.

 

John C.

 

(Edited to read 'Newton Abbot' (not Laira) as 1938 home of 5975.)

Edited March 11, 2017 by checkrail

[checkrail]

Here are a couple more of Winslow Hall.

 

 

Don't think I've used this angle before.  Works quite well after cropping out the layout fascia board.  Would work even better with a better camera.

 

 

One strange thing about the Bachmann Halls is that both of mine (of widely separated dates of manufacture) have the ejector cone left in unpainted black plastic.  What's all that about?  Is it cost cutting, or an oversight, or did Bachmann genuinely think they were black?   But easily remedied with a fine paintbrush, especially as you can get an offcut of printer paper behind it to avoid getting paint on the boiler.  (Now someone will tell me that they were actually painted black!)

 

John C.

 

 

 

 

[gwrrob]

Here are a couple more of Winslow Hall.

 

 

 

  Would work even better with a better camera.

 

John C.

 

What camera are you using out of interest John ?

[checkrail]

What camera are you using out of interest John ?

 

It's a Canon Ixus which my wife bought for holiday pics and suchlike.  I could probably do better if I applied myself to finding out more about it.  About time I heeded the old adage, RTFM.

[Limpley Stoker]

It's a Canon Ixus which my wife bought for holiday pics and suchlike. I could probably do better if I applied myself to finding out more about it. About time I heeded the old adage, RTFM.

RTFM--Is that a radio station?

 

Love the pics though.

Edited March 8, 2017 by Limpley Stoker

[checkrail]

I'll continue to talk a lot of Halls.

 

The two shots below show Winslow Hall pulling through the up platform at Stoke C.  I think the elderly lady with her neck craned forward has just twigged that this isn't actually her train.

 

 

 

And the next two show it heading away towards Newton Abbot and Exeter. (In the first shot you can make out the fall plate and the crew.)

 

 

 

Have given the camera lens a good clean since these were taken.  When I take some more I'll be able to see if it's made any difference.

 

John C.

 

 

[St Enodoc]

It's a Canon Ixus which my wife bought for holiday pics and suchlike.  I could probably do better if I applied myself to finding out more about it.  About time I heeded the old adage, RTFM.

I've got one of those too. I did RTFM and I'm no wiser. If you find out how to increase the depth of field manually, please let me know!

[dhjgreen]

I've got one of those too. I did RTFM and I'm no wiser. If you find out how to increase the depth of field manually, please let me know!

As far as I can see this is not a feature on this range of cameras. It is usually only found on DSLRs and something called a Bridge camera (between a compact and a DSLR). The setting to look for is Av on Canon or A on Nikon. It allows you to set the aperture, hence depth of field, and takes care of the shutter speed for you.

 

I know, more expense.

Edited March 9, 2017 by dhjgreen

[Anglian]

I continue to enjoy seeing your photographs. Fabulous layout.