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Triang EMU, anyone ever modified one?


simon b
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Hi all, has anyone ever converted the old Triang emu into something more realistic? I was tempted to make a single car motor luggage van to run alongside the Hornby emu's, but interested to see what people have done with the old girl?

 

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I'd quite like to build something to run with this lot.

 

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I know of someone many years ago modifying a pair of driving cars into a passable 2 BIL. The front end is almost pure BIL (the drivers windscreen needs filing out a bit), but the length is too short (this guy used sections from a centre coach to extend the length), and the side profile is almost pure BR standard. The gentleman who did the conversion left the profile as is but opened out various windows for the corridor sides and filled and filed the surplus doors. The compartment side window shapes remained pure BR,

Another possibility, one I attempted (again many years ago) is to make a 4 EPB, using new front ends (scratchbuilt in plasticard in my case), joining offset 'halves' of coaches to make more accurate lengths for the coaches. The whole lot was powered by a Lima HO scale class 33 motor bogie. The compartment spacing of the Triang units is really too wide, so one ends up with one less compartment per coach, but is passable.

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I have a set of 3 that had the wheels replaced with finescale, and were painted in a version of the old CPR diesel scheme.

Any masochists want to see it?

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If Simon doesn't mind us hijacking his thread to a degree, I'd love to see some pics of the unit, David.

Simon: you could consider converting two driving coaches into a stores or de-icing unit.

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I have a set of 3 that had the wheels replaced with finescale, and were painted in a version of the old CPR diesel scheme.

Any masochists want to see it?

 

 

If Simon doesn't mind us hijacking his thread to a degree, I'd love to see some pics of the unit, David.

 

Simon: you could consider converting two driving coaches into a stores or de-icing unit.

 

Love to see it guy's, the more pics the better!

 

Now a de-icing or stores unit is something I hadn't thought of, that would be a good excuse to blank various windows out ect. Perhaps use the center car to make the driving ends nearer the correct length.  

 

A quick google come's up with a few 2 hal departmental units, so something along these lines could work.

 

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Pic borrowed from: http://www.bloodandcustard.com/HAL001.html

 

 

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Above 3 pics from: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/39263-2-hal/page-4

 

 

 

4920893989_81f8a63f10_b.jpg

Pic from: https://www.flickr.com/photos/74009/4920893989

Edited by simon b
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One of these de-icers:

http://www.rail-online.co.uk/p378816305/h3382FC45#h3382fc45

 

would be a better match for the Triang one than the HAL-based departmental units I reckon.

 

Those were based on older style SUB units. The Triang units would certainly capture some of the character of those.

 

Then again, the Triang ones were a bit fictional, so a fictional de-icing or stores unit could be just as appropriate.

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I found that mine have been subjected to an attempt at paint removal.

post-6938-0-52361700-1467862773.jpg

 

post-6938-0-06890700-1467862799.jpg

 

post-6938-0-73950400-1467862808.jpg

 

Underside. TriAng wheels have been replaced, but it never ran very well.

 

 

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Simon. the wheels were fitted when I bought it. The trailing axles have the turned brass ones (I think) and the axle ends are in bearings. The driving wheels are spoked (first time I noticed) and one is different from the rest.

I think I bought this in the early 70s or earlier.

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Love to see it guy's, the more pics the better!

 

Now a de-icing or stores unit is something I hadn't thought of, that would be a good excuse to blank various windows out ect. Perhaps use the center car to make the driving ends nearer the correct length.  

 

A quick google come's up with a few 2 hal departmental units, so something along these lines could work.

 

image014.jpg

 

post-509-0-44699000-1313692107.jpg

 

post-509-0-53824600-1313692124.jpg

 

post-509-0-39724300-1313692147.jpg

 

4920893989_81f8a63f10_b.jpg

Simon.

 

I think you need to credit these shots if they are not yours!

 

Dave

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Many years ago I replaced Triang motor and other bogie with a Lima unit. It meant that I could run it on code 100 rail track. I also created a semi permanent connector more reminiscent of the single central buffer. I still have it, it was repainted in better green, but until Hornby brought out their own 2Bil in blue I had planned on converting anothe and painting it blue.

I remember being passed by an old emu unit London side of Basingstoke.Only registered when I saw the rear cab end, so did not take in what the rest looked like. This must have been late 70s , more likely early 80s. When did thee departmental units continue in use. It might seem sacrilege but converting one of the cheap on offer units now might be better than converting an old Triang unit. Only trouble for me is that I am currently only interested in the period 69-71 , the final years in public use. I suppose if any had been converted whilst others were still in public use, I could justify one. Then it would have to consider time of year, and not certain on that yet for my model.

Edited by rue_d_etropal
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Simon.

 

I think you need to credit these shots if they are not yours!

 

Dave

Your right Dave, that I should as they are not mine. 

 

These were the first ones that popped up in a google image search, so I've found and posted a link to which website they are linked to. As it turn's out 3 of them are your own!, I hope you didn't take offense to my borrowing of them?

 

Simon.

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  • 2 years later...

My main intervention was to lengthen each of the bodies by one compartment; an old suburban composite coach was slaughtered for the purpose. This seemed to have the exact same profile as the other coaches but in reality the center coach has a slightly different profile from the driving bodies and the composite. So on the center coach the fit isn't perfect. To minimise the number of cuts, back ends were exchanged between cars. This operation was finished surprisingly quickly, not more than two afternoon sessions including the roofs. Two of the discarded buffers are installed as centre buffers on the center coach, as per the prototype.

The lenghy work was the detaling and painting that followed.

Apart from many scratch-built parts, I installed replacement driving wheels from Tony's Store, a dummy driving bogie and buffers from the Hornby Brighton Belle, Bachmann Bulleid bogies (center coach still to be done), headcode stencils from Roxey Mouldings. The green is Humbrol Rail color Southern Green acrylic (but I had a hell of time spraying it, the result has an orange skin, this is the best I could do with it). Decals are self-printed. The lamp is replaced by a led but I will reduce the resistor as the present light seems a bit dim (any one know of a photo where you can see how bright it should shine?) New interiors were built in card and detailed with the old Peco Kitmaster card kit (scans of these abound on the web) -- the colors aren't precisely right but it looks nice and I can live with it. Flush glazing is from South-Eastern Finecast; fitted slightly un-flush because as intended it made the bodies look more like the post-war EMU generation, too smooth for the pre-war types. This was done by inserting strips of thin card between the edges of the glazing and the coach body, so that the glass surface on the outside recedes a little. The door and front windows have just plain flat plastic glass.

Obviously the model is still a mixture of types, as much as the original Triang was. To have some sort of guidance I took the South-Eastern units of 1925-26, no's 1496-1524 as reference, as they seemed to come closest in appearance. Several of these served as de-icing units after their passenger lives. The main differences are the number of compartments (8 not 6) and the tumblehome which is more pronounced on the model than on the real units (making the model more elegant than the real thing, in my opinion).

I left the motor in place since I find it a piece of historic mechanics in its own right, with a charming way of running that suits the image you want for these antique units. I suspected however the magnet had lost some its force; I don't have one of those re-magnetising machines but attaching a couple of strong neodynium cube magnets for a while (bought cheaply from China) had a noticeable positive effect too. I expect I will have to repeat this every once in a while. The running direction had to be reversed to comply with the modern standard, which was more work than you might expect (and involved drilling the hole in the bogie body visible in the picture, to insulate the pick-up from the body).

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Edited by janw
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My inspiration to experiment with this model was one of 'Mike's Movies' on youtube:

where I was impressed by the smooth running of the old motor and the genuine, vintage image of the whole. Just a joy to watch.

Here you can also see what a game-changer a simple good paint job already is for this model.

 

And obviously the 'Frankland' layout on this forum was another main impetus. What fantastic inspiration that is!

Edited by janw
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The lamp is replaced by a led but I will reduce the resistor as the present light seems a bit dim (any one know of a photo where you can see how bright it should shine?) 

 

 

On the assumption that the light referred to is the one that illuminated the head code panel, the answer is that they were surprisingly dim in reality. Remember that most steam locos had only oil lamps at the front (and even Bulleid's electric loco lamps weren't much brighter). The level of illumination then was in total contrast to today's brightly lit railway, on stations as well as on trains.

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Yes indeed. I'm trying to remember what was behind the 'opal' glass diffuser, and I think it was six bulbs, two series strings of three in parallel, each of about 40 or 60W. For reference, each compartment had a series string of three bulbs. As becasse says, not only was everything in black and white, it was blooming dark at night, and that has really only changed significantly in the past c40 years, very much so in the past c20.

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@Bécasse and Nearholmer --  Many thanks for that information. I conclude that I should leave the resistor as it is; the brightness of the head code is indeed comparable to that of a steam loco oil lamp (an original that is, not a modern model one (-:  )

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My main intervention was to lengthen each of the bodies by one compartment; an old suburban composite coach was slaughtered for the purpose. This seemed to have the exact same profile as the other coaches but in reality the center coach has a slightly different profile from the driving bodies and the composite. So on the center coach the fit isn't perfect. To minimise the number of cuts, back ends were exchanged between cars. This operation was done surprisingly quickly, not more than two afternoon sessions including the roofs. Two of the discarded buffers are installed as centre buffers on the center coach, as per the prototype.

The lenghy work was the detaling and painting that followed.

Apart from many scratch-built parts, I installed replacement driving wheels from Tony's Store, a dummy driving bogie and buffers from the Hornby Brighton Belle, Bachmann Bulleid bogies (center coach still to be done), headcode stencils from Roxey Mouldings. The green is Humbrol Rail color Southern Green acrylic (but I had a hell of time spraying it, the result has an orange skin, this is the best I could do with it). Decals are self-printed. The lamp is replaced by a led but I will reduce the resistor as the present light seems a bit dim (any one know of a photo where you can see how bright it should shine?) New interiors were built in card and detailed with the old Peco kitmaster card kit (scans of these abound on the web) -- the colors aren't precisely right but it looks nice and I can live with it. Flush glazing is from South-Eastern Finecast; fitted slightly un-flush because as intended it made the bodies look more like the post-war EMU generation, too smooth for the pre-war types. This was done by inserting strips of thin card between the edges of the glazing and the coach body, so that the glass surface on the outside recedes a little. The door and front windows have just plain flat plastic glass.

Obviously the model is still a mixture of types, as much as the original Triang was. To have some sort of guidance I took the South-Eastern units of 1925-26, no's 1496-1524 as reference, as they seemed to come closest in appearance. Several of these served as de-icing units after their passenger lives. The main differences are the number of compartments (8 not 6) and the tumblehome which is more pronounced on the model than on the real units (making the model more elegant than the real thing, in my opinion).

I left the motor in place since I find it a piece of historic mechanics in its own right, with a charming way of running that suits the image you want for these antique units. I suspected however the magnet had lost some its force; I don't have one of those re-magnetising machines but attaching a couple of strong neodynium cube magnets for a while (bought cheaply from China) had a noticeable positive effect too. I expect I will have to repeat this every once in a while. The running direction had to be reversed to comply with the modern standard, which was more work than you might expect (and involved drilling the whole in the bogie body visible in the picture, to insulate the pick-up from the body).

 

 

What a great conversion, very impressive

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My inspiration to experiment with this model was one of 'Mike's Movies' on youtube:

where I was impressed by the smooth running of the old motor and the genuine, vintage image of the whole. Just a joy to watch.

Here you can also see what a game-changer a simple good paint job already is for this model.

 

And obviously the 'Frankland' layout on this forum was another main impetus. What fantastic inspiration that is!

 

What a difference a decent paint job does and it seems rewheeling works well,

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Yes indeed. I'm trying to remember what was behind the 'opal' glass diffuser, and I think it was six bulbs, two series strings of three in parallel, each of about 40 or 60W. For reference, each compartment had a series string of three bulbs. As becasse says, not only was everything in black and white, it was blooming dark at night, and that has really only changed significantly in the past c40 years, very much so in the past c20.

 

Yes, my recollection is that there were two series strings of three bulbs, the idea being that if one side "blew" the other side provided sufficient light. If both sides blew the procedure was to open the "cupboard" door into the cab and there was provision for mounting a oil hand lamp (or later a Bardic) to illuminate the head code - and, yes, I have seen it done, once.

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  • 6 months later...

A short video of the model running on the H0-layout of the Hague Modellers Club, the Netherlands. No third rail but overhead power lines and the fourth coach is a repainted Triang R749, not a correct combination. But it moves.

 

Edited by janw
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