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DJM Dave

NEW OO gauge Crowdfunded Class 92 initiative

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To DJM Dave,

 

Can I give you some suggestions for the features of this new model you are proposing if you don't mind please. As I would like to help in a positive way if I can as I am seeking a brand new Class 92 with loads of power to either match or exceed that of the Hornby Class 60 with the mouth-watering detail similar to that of the APT-E that came out earlier in the year and I am willing to pay good money for a decent replica. As these brutes from what I have seen over the years haul a lot of wagons behind them and I am looking to stick one of these at the front of a long car transporter train of around 25 wagons that I am building up for a club layout. If I may, here is my proposal of features for the new Class 92 model that you might take into consideration :).

 

21 Pin DCC Ready OR DCC Fitted Legomanbiffo Sounds

Working Directional Lights With The Possibility Of Full Functionality Under DCC

Painted Brass Horns

Painted Brass/Metal Pantographs

Sprung Painted Buffers

NEM Couplers

Heavy Metal Chassis

Central 5 Pole Can Motor With Flywheel Drive

All Wheel Drive

Detailed Cab Interior With Illuminated Gauges (Speedometer, Brake) And Cab Lights

Easy Access To Cab Interiors To Add Crew/Driver Etc.

 

I know I am probably pushing out the boat for this and also I know that some of the features you have mentioned will be included anyway but rather than try to edit things about. I thought it would be simpler to just send you my ideas and suggestions that might guide you on making this locomotive. Also where and when can I register my interest in this model? As I am very serious in buying one of these Class 92's and in particular I would like a DB Schenker red one and a Serco Caledonian Sleeper one which would make me two please. For numbers. I would like 92009 "Marco Polo" for the DB Schenker model and 92038 for the Serco Caledonian Sleeper model please.

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To DJM Dave,

 

Can I give you some suggestions for the features of this new model you are proposing if you don't mind please. As I would like to help in a positive way if I can as I am seeking a brand new Class 92 with loads of power to either match or exceed that of the Hornby Class 60 with the mouth-watering detail similar to that of the APT-E that came out earlier in the year and I am willing to pay good money for a decent replica. As these brutes from what I have seen over the years haul a lot of wagons behind them and I am looking to stick one of these at the front of a long car transporter train of around 25 wagons that I am building up for a club layout. If I may, here is my proposal of features for the new Class 92 model that you might take into consideration :).

 

21 Pin DCC Ready OR DCC Fitted Legomanbiffo Sounds

Working Directional Lights With The Possibility Of Full Functionality Under DCC

Painted Brass Horns

Painted Brass/Metal Pantographs

Sprung Painted Buffers

NEM Couplers

Heavy Metal Chassis

Central 5 Pole Can Motor With Flywheel Drive

All Wheel Drive

Detailed Cab Interior With Illuminated Gauges (Speedometer, Brake) And Cab Lights

Easy Access To Cab Interiors To Add Crew/Driver Etc.

 

I know I am probably pushing out the boat for this and also I know that some of the features you have mentioned will be included anyway but rather than try to edit things about. I thought it would be simpler to just send you my ideas and suggestions that might guide you on making this locomotive. Also where and when can I register my interest in this model? As I am very serious in buying one of these Class 92's and in particular I would like a DB Schenker red one and a Serco Caledonian Sleeper one which would make me two please. For numbers. I would like 92009 "Marco Polo" for the DB Schenker model and 92038 for the Serco Caledonian Sleeper model please.

See Post #1 of this topic... Dave has listed the features he plans on incorporating!

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I know he is going to put a lot of work into this Class 92. But I thought I would throw some more ideas his way to help him out :).

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I know he is going to put a lot of work into this Class 92. But I thought I would throw some more ideas his way to help him out :).

But most of them he's already said he's doing. Are brass horns and cab lighting really a deal breaker? The latter is gimmicky to me anyway, cabs aren't really illuminated in use.

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Why add brass horns if they are being painted?  

Edited by thebritfarmer

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Why not? Seriously brass is more robust than plastic. So why not? The Hornby Class 60's use plastic horns and they can break off quite easily through handling, wear and tear. As where brass/metal is more robust and also its a premium model. So I don't see why not go for better quality parts and have a nicer product. Personally I think it will make the model look better.

 

For the record. I know Dave is going to add most of the features that I have wished for but I was too lazy to edit them out, so that's my bad I guess. Anyway I like cab lights because I think they do look cool at depots and stations and it is a feature that I love to see on layouts in "twilight" mode. So long as they can be disabled with a DCC function or a throw switch, that should make everyone happy as it will be there for those that want it. As for those that don't want cab lights can simply turn them off. Then everyone will be happy ;).

Edited by BritishRail60062

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Whenever the detail is separately attached it will always be prone to breakage. Unless the shell is brass with soldered horns why spend more when it isn't necessary. 

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Well if it works then I will buy the model if it meets my standards. But for me. Metal parts just look much nicer and more crisp than plastic. Just saying.

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Why add brass horns if they are being painted?  

 

For the same reason that there are manufacturers out there who specialise in producing brass and etched metal detailing parts, as generally speaking metal parts add a far superior appearance than the often poorly moulded plastic equivalent.

 

 

Why not? Seriously brass is more robust than plastic. So why not? The Hornby Class 60's use plastic horns and they can break off quite easily through handling, wear and tear. As where brass/metal is more robust and also its a premium model. So I don't see why not go for better quality parts and have a nicer product. Personally I think it will make the model look better.

 

I thought I was alone in thinking that the Hornby Class 60 plastic horns are perhaps the weakest feature of an otherwise superb model - almost always glued in at strange angles and snap off as soon as you touch them, it's incredibly rare to find a secondhand model with the horns still intact.  While on the subject, does anyone know who might produce suitable brass diesel horns?  I purchased some sets of the Markits diesel horns and while okay for Class 37 etc they seem to be too small for the Class 60.

 

The plastic cabside handrails on the Hornby 60 are also a little annoying, as they almost always bow in the middle and often include an unsightly moulding pimple.

 

 

Metal parts just look much nicer and more crisp than plastic. Just saying.

 

Agree totally.  I guess some people simply don't appreciate these finer touches that all contribute to differentiate a 'model' from simply being a 'toy'.

Edited by YesTor

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Bachmann’s East Lancashire Railway is a beautifully finished model but the horns are, let’s say, not good. Likewise, Heljan’s Kestrel is, I feel, a fine model badly let down by its poor plastic horns which sit in prominent positions.

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Agree totally. I guess some people simply don't appreciate these finer touches that all contribute to differentiate a 'model' from simply being a 'toy'.

Passive agressive much? So people who don't share your opinion aren't serious modellers? Simply playing with toys?! What a daft statement!

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To YesTor: I agree that things like metal horns and handrails look nicer than plastic and to be honest. When a premium locomotive is going to cost over £150 each. Metal parts like horns and handrails should be as standard as they do look more crisp.

 

Passive agressive much? So people who don't share your opinion aren't serious modellers? Simply playing with toys?! What a daft statement!

I don't think he being passive agressive. But when a premium model is going to cost over £150. Using metal for horns and handrails isn't going to hurt and I would be happy to pay for metal parts to have a better looking model in the end. I have suggested illuminated gauges in the cab consoles to Dave as well as some other features. But he hasn't acknowledge my suggestions. So wether he has taken my suggestions into account or not is his choice. I won't lose any sleep over it.

 

All in all, if his Class 92 meets my expectations. I will buy it, but if not. I will take a pass and wait for someone else to produce one instead as I am the customer and a professional business will listen to their customers. Having done a business course myself, it is the customer that keeps a company in business. I can take constructive feedback and positive feedback and I know that no matter how hard one will try. You won't please everyone but my suggestions I made to Dave are realistic ones in terms of metal pantographs, horns and handrails as metal parts for those features will make a better product.

 

However my suggestions are positive and constructive ideas such as using metal parts for some bit and bobs is because it will make the model look much higher quality and besides that. Metal is already used for wheels, pick ups etc on the innards of all model trains anyway for obvious reasons. So I don't think the cost of metal would be much more than plastic for finer detail parts like horns, handrails. brake pipes etc. Personally I don't mind about the brake pipes and the cosmetic chainlink couplers being plastic as those parts being plastic will be easier to fit and they do have a bit of flex. But a blob of plastic that looks like a horn that I have seen on some model trains in the past is no substitute for metal horns no matter how people look at that situation :).

 

Clearly there is people here that are happy to accept plastic for the horns and handrails and I don't personally have a problem with that as its their choice. But when a NEW model train is going to exceed £150. Metal pantographs, horns and handrails should be standard as I have seen other companies use metal horns and handrails on other model trains that I own and they do look a lot nicer than plastic and the cost isn't much different from the prices I have paid for model trains :).

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All in all, if his Class 92 meets my expectations. I will buy it, but if not. I will take a pass and wait for someone else to produce one instead as I am the customer and a professional business will listen to their customers. Having done a business course myself, it is the customer that keeps a company in business. I can take constructive feedback and positive feedback and I know that no matter how hard one will try. You won't please everyone but my suggestions I made to Dave are realistic ones in terms of metal pantographs, horns and handrails as metal parts for those features will make a better product.

 

If you were personally commissioning Dave to build you a model then yes the company will listen to your requirements but this isn't your commission it is Dave offering a Class 92 to a specification that will keep within a cost boundary.

 

No doubt he will look at your suggestions and take a view on them, if he does produce this model, you might be waiting a long time for another one if it doesn't meet your exact requirements.

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If you were personally commissioning Dave to build you a model then yes the company will listen to your requirements but this isn't your commission it is Dave offering a Class 92 to a specification that will keep within a cost boundary.

 

No doubt he will look at your suggestions and take a view on them, if he does produce this model, you might be waiting a long time for another one if it doesn't meet your exact requirements.

The model hasn't even reached CAD stage yet nor is there is a pre-order option on his site as I am waiting to place my expression of interest for the OO gauge version of the model. So its a bit early to say that :no:. Besides you (and some others here) are missing the point. My standards are high but are reasonable and having own a few models with metal parts like handrails and horns on them. It makes the models look much better in my opinion. This new Class 92 to sport those mentioned parts within the production margin is viable/possible judging at the pictures of the Class 71 that I have seen on his website that HAS metal handrails. So if that is anything to go by then Dave WILL be getting my custom and metal horns on the roof will make that Class 92 even better :).

 

I am coming off the roundabout now as my views are quite clear and concise and are not condescending. I am off down the pub now for meal and a pint and a bit of train photography. So I will catch you all later ;).

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All in all, if his Class 92 meets my expectations. I will buy it, but if not. I will take a pass and wait for someone else to produce one instead as I am the customer and a professional business will listen to their customers.

If you are going to think like that then you may well be very disappointed. If it doesn't meet your specifications but still gets produced then you will have missed out on the option to buy it as only the number requested will be made. Which brings the second point, which other manufacturer is going to make a competing model, where all of the people that want one, have got one, that is called bad business and commercial suicide! If the DJM model doesn't progress, then why would another manufacturer make a model that they may not sell enough of.

 

If it isn't up to the specification that you want, that's why there are aftermarket parts manufacturers that will enable you to make it better.

 

Alistair

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Passive agressive much? So people who don't share your opinion aren't serious modellers? Simply playing with toys?! What a daft statement!

 

Interpret my comment as you will, and apologies if you interpret it as you have outlined, however, my point was simply that plastic fittings for the most-part take on a 'toylike' appearance. Just my opinion.

 

 

I am coming off the roundabout now as my views are quite clear and concise...

 

Likewise. This is turning into one of those topics that goes around-and-around in circles.

 

At the end of the day it's great news that a Class 92 is being produced and I will definitely be signing up for a couple.  The very best of luck to Dave with the project.

Edited by YesTor

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If you are going to think like that then you may well be very disappointed. If it doesn't meet your specifications but still gets produced then you will have missed out on the option to buy it as only the number requested will be made. Which brings the second point, which other manufacturer is going to make a competing model, where all of the people that want one, have got one, that is called bad business and commercial suicide! If the DJM model doesn't progress, then why would another manufacturer make a model that they may not sell enough of.

 

If it isn't up to the specification that you want, that's why there are aftermarket parts manufacturers that will enable you to make it better.

 

Alistair

Another person that has FAILED to read my original post properly. I've already given Dave my input for consideration and I thought that would be the end of the matter. I fail to grasp why some people are making a big deal out of something that is push in a positive direction for a brand new product and I WANT this new model locomotive to be a SUCCESS. I only asked for metal pantographs, handrails and horns to make the model better which is a reasonable request and its like World War 3 on here. Seriously what is the deal here? I thought this was supposed to be a friendly and a civilised place to talk about model trains and learn from other members of the community? I didn't sign up here to be ripped apart over a harmless request to MAKE a product better by giving positive suggestions to the developer that is Dave.

 

No worries though. I will talk directly with manufactures with my suggestions in the future as then there will be no more mud-slinging matches over reasonable suggestions and I will keep my mouth shut as to avoid any friction. I wish Dave the very best of luck with this new Class 92 model which I will look forward to buying in due course. There will be no more replies here from me.

 

Bye bye.

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Good flounce.

 

So... Dave - expressions of interest, my (mouse) trigger finger is itching! How are things going...!? :)

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Hi everyone,

As promised here are the crowdfunded OO gauge models including product codes, running numbers and liveries.

 

There are 1 or 2 notable omissions but this is down to permissions, and / or not wanting to dilute the spread of models so that the minimum order quantity is reached rather than isn't.

As always, there will only be enough made of each model to satisfy demand, and only a few extra for spares / repairs. Therefore, like the class 71, you will have a truly unique model as, again like the 71, i will not be repeating the livery / running number combination.

 

'Expressions of Interest' will now open on my web site early next week, and i will let you all know here when it does.

 

cheers

Dave

 

Class 92 Crowfunded models.

DJMOOC92-001  92016 DBSchenker Red/Grey

DJMOOC92-002  92023 SNCF cab logo (triple Grey unbranded) 'Ravel'

DJMOOC92-003  92032 GBRf / Europorte livery

DJMOOC92-004  92001 EWS Maroon 'Victor Hugo'

DJMOOC92-005  92030 Railfreight Distribution branded Triple Grey 'Ashford'

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No Caledonian permission I suppose, shame, oh well that's me out. Pity but I have no interest in anything other than that one.

 

I wish you luck with it though

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92023 and 92030 the perfect livery choices for me. Really looking forward to this, so hoping there's enough interest!

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Surprised that there's no basic BR triple grey with arrows - most of the class had this for the majority of their lives so far! But should be a cool project for reworking the SNCF version and cheekily renaming!

 

Very much looking forward to the project taking shape :)

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Hi Dave. Before the expressions of interest page goes live, can I just ask if 92023 with SNCF marking can be changed to 92028 Saint Saens with SNCF marking? That way there is a triple grey version with BR-style nameplate and one with the lettering version nameplate.

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