apt-e Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Hi all, I've been playing with a new model, this afternoon. I think its done......... New design model, new way to build, all new N gauge version. What do you think people, been a long slog to get this designed and built. Sorry its taken so long. Stay safe everyone 1 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calnefoxile Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 2 minutes ago, apt-e said: Hi all, I've been playing with a new model, this afternoon. I think its done......... New design model, new way to build, all new N gauge version. What do you think people, been a long slog to get this designed and built. Sorry its taken so long. Stay safe everyone Brilliant Paul, When can we order them?? Cheers Neal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 Another nice model. Good job you've done there. Did the prototype run with an 04 and a Toad or were those RTC Lab coaches de rigeur? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 (edited) Lol, its all I had to hand, as I have never run N gauge before. Order book will be open once I've worked out costing. It is difficult to print due to size of the parts and uses a good amount of my time. Please excuse my rubbish paint job lol.. I hope you think its worth it, lol. PoP 2, hsfv1, lab4 in both sizes next. Edited January 16, 2021 by apt-e 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 No worries - I was just curious, and I wasn't going to order a N gauge one anyway, not my scale. I have only got as far as assembling the body shells of the OO one, still got to do the underframe & bogies. I have a Hornby Lab 10 coach in RTC red/blue that I will run with it. They also do a CCT stores van and a Landore breakdown coach in those colours. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 You can use a Clayton class 17, 25, 45/46, 47, 50, 87 to pull the pop train. They used pretty much was to hand at the time. Lab 3 and a barrier coach was mostly top and bottomed on most mainline test runs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted January 14, 2021 Share Posted January 14, 2021 3 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said: I have a Hornby Lab 10 coach in RTC red/blue that I will run with it. That's a good start, although POP never ran in that formation. We had to have one coach with bar couplers on one end so that the nearest POP vehicle could tilt, otherwise it would de-rail the vehicle coupled to it if they only had buckeyes. In the real world POP ran with Lab 3 at the north end of its consist as a minimum, and usually with Lab 3 on the North end and either Lab 10 or Lab 23 on the south end, both of which had the high power generator sets to run all of the POP systems. In the early days Lab 3 had a gennie too, but it wouldn't pull the skin off a rice pudding and there was not enough power to run the Mk II tilt packs that we fitted later on. That's Lab 3 in the foreground and Lab 10 furthest away in the pic. That north and south end is reference to running on the Test Track by the way, North = West as far as the RTC is concerned. 1 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted January 15, 2021 Share Posted January 15, 2021 Thanks for that info. As an outsider who never even saw this set I am inevitably guessing at what happened back in the day and may well have failed to see things you just took as common knowledge. I realise of course you were all working, not just enjoying the ride in the open air with the wind in your hair! I don't know what jobs the staff needed to do though, but I expect the tasks and the crew required would have varied quite a bit between journeys. I assume there was a load of measuring and recording equipment of various types and some controls to adjust degree of tilt and its responsiveness and any other variables you might be able to influence and study - would that have been monitored/controlled from PC3/4 cabins, or from what I assume was the relative comfort of the lab coaches. using cabling to transfer the data? There is no corridor connection, so you would have been stuck for the whole journey in whatever vehicle you had boarded and would have need some sort of intercom if you needed somebody to do something on another vehicle. I had naively assumed the couplings were something akin to those on the type of tippler wagon that can be emptied whilst still coupled to the rest of the train. I take it these bar couplers weren't rigid then but had some rotational freedom? I am a bit puzzled though as if the couplings had to allow one of the vehicles to tilt, why wasn't it just as necessary for the other end to do the same? There doesn't seem to be much up top on these vehicles except the large ballast weights, so I'm guessing your tilt packs were built into the bogies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 Hi Michael, I am sure Mr Tilt will expand on this when he gets chance, but for now, the tilt packs are actually in the large cabins along with a kitchen table and a chair lol. Kit is one of the very few people that when he starts telling a story, you get drawn in. He has more stories than you could imagine about his time on the APT project. I've been so lucky to get to know Mr Tilt and to call him a friend. His support to the apt group has been off the scale. Long live the APT. Regards Paul 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 (edited) Oh yes we WERE enjoying the ride in the open with the wind in our hair! In transit back and forth to a test site we often rode on the outside of the cabins, on the down wind side of course, and sometimes even on a test run too. As POP train tested the whole bogie system, not just the tilt side of things, some tests were directed at the wheel loads, some at the spring deflections, some at the air spring's performance, etc. etc. and during those runs we tilters didn't have much to do, so why not enjoy the fresh air? See the 'POP Train Party' pic below. Usually the only staff aboard PC3 & 4 were the Tilt Development crew, but sometimes we had guys from the Air Spring side and sometimes the Brake System guys were in there too, but as POP train never went anywhere without the tilt system running there always had to be someone in the cabins to keep an eye out for it. Indeed, at one stage POP Train had a notice on the doors which said 'This train may not be moved without Kit Spackman being on board'. The very first time they tried that without me there the train went off the end of the Test Track and it took some weeks for it to be recovered! The tilt control system was fully automatic, within limits, and was contained in a small box, maybe 9" x 9" x 5", but the hydraulics that it controlled were in a socking great power pack maybe 6' x 4' x 3', all of which were inside the POP Train control cabin. We didn't do any actual data collection or measurement aboard POP Train, all that was carried out aboard Lab 3, where they could monitor any 16 of 64 channels of data with our on-board computer, while the rest were either recorded on tape or printed out on UV paper recorders. There were LOADS of cables connecting PC3 & 4 to Lab 3, see the attached pic '07' taken during the Lockerbie tests, and these increased in number steadily during the train's life. We certainly did have an intercom that ran the entire length of the train, including the loco crew and the guard as well, as if anything went wrong they needed to know about it pretty darn quick, and sometimes it did! But the lack of a corridor connection on the POP vehicles didn't stop us going into Lab 3 or the gennie vehicle, we just stepped across the gap to their corridor connection from the end of the POP vehicles. It was only about a foot wide so it was easy, even at 100 mph. Of course these days the Health & Safety Police wouldn't even have let us BUILD POP Train, let alone run it as we did! See pic 'Mind the gap' below. The bar couplers we used were those that started off on the Freightliner flats, and they were literally bolted together with four BIG bolts, and they were free to rotate around their ends along their longitudinal axis. We had to have one fitted to one end of each match vehicles, be they Lab 3, Lab 10 or 23, or even the two 10T mineral wagons that we used as match vehicles in the RTC Yard and elsewhere. Changing the couplings on the coaching stock was a thankless and time consuming job, and everyone HATED to do it, but if it wasn't done none of the coaches could be used on normal test trains. We used the same bar couplers on Hastings Coach (Lab 4) as well, for the same reasons. You can see the bar coupler quite clearly in the pic of Hastings (Hastings 3) under the loading gauge test bridge on the Test Track. In the early days we ran POP Train as a 3 car set, just Lab 3, PC3 and PC4, with nothing on the south end. Lab3's teeny weeny gennie could just provide enough power to run the equally small Mk 1 tilt packs so we didn't have need for the big gennies then, but that meant that PC4 couldn't tilt when the loco was hauling us from the south end, so PC4 had a normal buckeye fitted at that time. When it became apparent that the Mk 1 tilt packs were worse than useless we redesigned them with a MUCH larger tank, pump and valve gear and therefore needed a larger gennie, thus the use of the second coach on the south end, and we could tilt PC4 going in both directions. The ballast weights simulated the weight of the turbines, resistor banks and other auxiliary gear that would be aboard PC1 & PC2 eventually, but the brake, tilt and air spring packs were all inside the cabins on the POP vehicles, which meant there was precious little room for people or any other creature comforts. As Paul has just said, we only had a kitchen table and chairs to sit on, comfortable it wasn't! The business end of the tilt system, the tilt jacks themselves, were mounted between the bogies and the body, and only connected to the bogie frame by on e bolt each. We could disconnect those four bolts and lift the entire vehicle clear of the bogies for lab test work, and often did. I hope that answers most of your questions, but as Paul suggests I could go on and on, and on and ON, if need be. Regards Kit 07 POP Train Party Mind the gap Hastings 3 Edited January 16, 2021 by Mr_Tilt 3 1 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 (edited) Hi all, The N gauge PoP 1 kits are being printed. Bespoke, not mass produced model. Kit includes : N-wheels all metal wheels 6.2mm Dapol NEM pocket + shims Graham Farish 379-401 couplings 1 x bag of liquid gravity (enough for all bogies) PoP 1 PC3 PoP 1 PC4 2 x E1 bogies 1 x E1/t bogie with steering beam. Perspex for Windows. Construction skill - medium to hard. Kits are available at £115 inc p & p. Update, due to a good number of orders I can now do them for £90 inc p & p. Model parts colour may vary, and will need some sanding and painting. Please contact me at Leadleykits@gmail.com To order a kit or more information. Stay safe everyone. Regards Paul Edited January 17, 2021 by apt-e 1 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 17, 2021 Share Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) Hi all, Due to enough orders to cover my time (3 months) I can now do the kits for £90 inc p & p. If anyone still wants the n gauge model please email me at leadleykits@gmail.com All orders already placed will be completed at the new price. Thanks to everyone for the support on this project. Stay safe Regards Paul. Edited January 17, 2021 by apt-e Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 18, 2021 Share Posted January 18, 2021 (edited) Hi all, First three kits completed, more on the way. I've been asked , so, printing takes around 8 hours per kit. Each kit after printing, due to the raft printing system required needs around 1 - 2 hours post processing to get to this point. Never thought N gauge would be so difficult. Just working on the instructions now so these first three kits should be posted out later this week. Stay safe everyone. Regards Paul. Edited January 18, 2021 by apt-e 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Hi All, I have just uploaded the instructions for the N gauge model, URL is also included in the model box. http:\\www.apt-e.org\leadleykits\N Gauge\pop1\Instructions-N.docx Keep you going in the meantime. A quick video of the model running around my test track. http:\\www.apt-e.org\leadleykits\N Gauge\pop1\test2.mp4 Models being packaged today, so I will contact people who have ordered a model shortly. Stay safe everyone. Regards Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calnefoxile Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Just watched the video Paul, looks great and can't wait to get mine ordered. Also had a quick look at the instructions, a bit preemptive I know but couldn't help myself, and they look simple enough to follow, whether that translates into an easily built model I'll have to wait and see I think my only questions would be around Paint Colours and transfers?? What colours are needed & where can the transfers be obtained?? I'm going to assume Steve @railtec-modelshere?? Well done by the way it runs really well. Neal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 (edited) Hi Neal, Here are the paint colours I used on the final prototype. Left to right :- Hunbrol Acrylic RC 411 bogies Humbrol Enamel Matt 87 ballasts Humbrol Enamel MET 56 All the outside frames Humbrol Enamel Matt 99 Buffer beams Any black for outside window frames and vents on large cabin roofs. Bulkheads are printed grey colour but Humbrol Enamel Matt 147 is also good. Pipework is already white as printed. As the train was 99% of the time never washed, anything around these should see you right. Transfers, I am sure Steve at railtec could help us out. Hope this helps, and glad you enjoyed the video. Regards Paul. Edited January 20, 2021 by apt-e 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Tilt Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 99% never washed? More like 110%! Until we stripped it to add the skins to build POP2 of course. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 20, 2021 Share Posted January 20, 2021 Lol,nice one Mr Tilt..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 21, 2021 Share Posted January 21, 2021 (edited) Evening all, First batch of models posted today. Anyone wanting one but hasn't emailed me at leadleykits@gmail.com should do so. I can add your name to the waiting list. Stay safe everyone. Regards Paul. Edited January 21, 2021 by apt-e Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 Hi all, Spent the last two days working on HSFV1. Still got lots to do, and a number of corrections but not to bad so far. This is the first build and very rough. I am designing the 00 at present, but the build system will also work for an N gauge version, if anyone is interested. More progress to come. Stay safe. Regards Paul. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 25, 2021 Share Posted January 25, 2021 (edited) Updated sides........ A lot better.... Edited January 25, 2021 by apt-e 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pwr Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Looks good Paul. Did you every think any more about those SA bogies for an O gauge POP? Paul R Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 Hi Paul, Yes, I have started on the sa variant bogies. I am doing some research on them as there are questions about the outer edge version. I will keep you posted. Regards Paul. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 I think after more work, and a chat with Mr Tilt, I am happy with the sides design. Done a first draft on the buffer beams and buffers. Just printing a couple of test body frames with mounts for the wheels, again first draft. More to come............ 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
apt-e Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 (edited) Another little update........ Need to check ride level and a few other things.. .. Edited January 26, 2021 by apt-e 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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