New West Midlands Franchise - Standing Room Only?

[The Stationmaster]

When we did most of the ones we picked up were commuters,Richard, which rather makes my point... The rest is more about timekeeping, if GWR/LM/Chiltern services are on time then there's no issue, in fact the GWR trains are doing what they should, they are acting as "feeders" for Express trains (i.e. the "old" concept of the services and what we've now lost), just because they are late shouldn't mean we have to go backwards, we should instead be looking at ways of making them run on times (a novelty I know!)...

 

Caradoc, take a look at Table 51 (Crossscountry's timetable in BR days) and take a look at the stops, there are very few on some routes compared with today, hence they were "express" trains. Interestingly on the Bournemouths they stopped at Solihull roughly every 2 hours but didn't go via Coventry, but the rest of the stops were the same, Didcot didn't feature even then (1978 is the timetable I was looking at)...

 

There's also whether there's a "need" to stop, you mention Didcot but on the southbound Bournemouths there's a local 5 minutes after we leave and northbound there's no need anyhow as we follow a local into Oxford. Also it's quicker to run non-stop to Reading most times and change there for Plymouth/South Wales/Bristol trains than change at Didcot, I've had to check that one many times and invariably the answer is stay on to Reading. Didcot would only be a main junction if all of GWR's trains stop there but they don't and some SW services don't go via Didcot. If we did stop at Didcot it would only make overcrowding worse and slow the journey times which was the point I was making... Unless you mean by stopping Didcot we can drop the reversal at Reading and go round the curve non-stop in which case I'm all for it!!

 

Reducing the stops speeds up the journey times and reduces overcrowding but is not something the TOCs will consider as the key issue is that it reduces revenue which is more important than the other two...

 

But of course Reading is a major spot for passenger interchange and the numbers joining and alighting from XC services there are always considerable (even outside the commuting period).  Reading West would be a poor alternative with limited connectional opportunities, virtually no passenger facilities on the platforms (and no room to build them), and platforms which are really too narrow to handle the sort of passenger numbers travelling via Reading on XC trains.  But calling there would save a heap of time and remove the biggest constraint on the length of XC trains.

 

(But it would add a lot of time to my journeys to/from the Warley show so it is definitely a non-starter )

[Hobby]

It was said "tongue in cheek", SM! And I was certainly not intending stopping at Reading West, though that has been done during works to RDG so it's possible!!

 

(Of course we could stop everything at Didcot as requested and send all the our SOU and BMH non-stop to Basingstoke! Might help the timekeeping when we get delayed by freightliners near Southampton...)

Edited October 20, 2017 by Hobby

[Zomboid]

Whilst it's nothing to do with the West Midlands, diverting XC to miss Reading would need a new path through Basingstoke, as they always seem to sit for 5 minutes outside BSK.

It would allow shorter trains though, since in my experience there's about a 75% turnover of passengers at Reading who wouldn't be able to use XC any more.

[Hobby]

We have to wait to get onto the Southern, Z, same as we have to wait to join the ECML at Doncaster... They don't like us trespassing on their territory so do all they can to stop us!! 

[D854_Tiger]

But of course Reading is a major spot for passenger interchange and the numbers joining and alighting from XC services there are always considerable (even outside the commuting period).  Reading West would be a poor alternative with limited connectional opportunities, virtually no passenger facilities on the platforms (and no room to build them), and platforms which are really too narrow to handle the sort of passenger numbers travelling via Reading on XC trains.  But calling there would save a heap of time and remove the biggest constraint on the length of XC trains.

 

(But it would add a lot of time to my journeys to/from the Warley show so it is definitely a non-starter )

 

 

Reading is also the connection for Heathrow Aiport either the coach or the new Crossrail service also Gatwick Airport.

 

In fact the only time I ever visit Reading nowadays is to get to an airport, much more convenient when coming down from the Midlands (with luggage).

[Kelly]

If the new stock means more trains (ie not a single 4car unit) available for weekends to the NEC/Airport then it will be very welcome as currently the single 4car 350s are not enough by a large margin, especially when you consider there is now a new complex there with a casino and other new items being built, including the Hub for HS2 to go there, 8cars will more than be needed by the time that comes into use probably.

 

The demand at the NEC keeps rocketing with a large number of high profile shows moving there in recent years away from the London venues (in some cases due to the insistance by the London venues that organisers have to use the entire venue and use the venues security staff and increasingly banning events running ticket on the door events).

[The Stationmaster]

Reading is also the connection for Heathrow Aiport either the coach or the new Crossrail service also Gatwick Airport.

 

In fact the only time I ever visit Reading nowadays is to get to an airport, much more convenient when coming down from the Midlands (with luggage).

 

The current routes from Reading are either via Feltham and change to road transport, the RailAirlink coach (the most expensive simple option), Paddington and change to HEX (sometimes the quickest option but probably as expensive or more so than RailAirlink), Local train to West Drayton and change to service 'bus (arguably the best way but you could go one stop further and change to train instead of 'bus at Hayes).  The West Drayton/service 'bus option is definitely the quickest route from some Thames Valley stations but probably not from Reading. If you arrive at reading with luggage the coach is probably best and will remain so until teh western rail link is built (if it ever is)v

 

Crossrail won't make a ha'porth of difference to the options apart from possibly providing more frequent trains from Hayes into LHR but even then a lot depends on which terminal you use.  And of course where you're going by air from LHR, for example central Paris to Reading was quicker by train throughout before CTRL (aka HS1) opened but then on one occasion I even did York to Paris with a shorter overall journey time by rail than going by air (which would have meant train to Manchester Airport to start me off) - lunch on GNER, dinner in Paris

[D854_Tiger]

The current routes from Reading are either via Feltham and change to road transport, the RailAirlink coach (the most expensive simple option), Paddington and change to HEX (sometimes the quickest option but probably as expensive or more so than RailAirlink), Local train to West Drayton and change to service 'bus (arguably the best way but you could go one stop further and change to train instead of 'bus at Hayes).  The West Drayton/service 'bus option is definitely the quickest route from some Thames Valley stations but probably not from Reading. If you arrive at reading with luggage the coach is probably best and will remain so until teh western rail link is built (if it ever is)v

 

Crossrail won't make a ha'porth of difference to the options apart from possibly providing more frequent trains from Hayes into LHR but even then a lot depends on which terminal you use.  And of course where you're going by air from LHR, for example central Paris to Reading was quicker by train throughout before CTRL (aka HS1) opened but then on one occasion I even did York to Paris with a shorter overall journey time by rail than going by air (which would have meant train to Manchester Airport to start me off) - lunch on GNER, dinner in Paris

 

 

My preferred option with luggage is always International - Reading - Paddington - HEX and the one time I've used Gatwick the GW service from Reading.

 

You can usually do that with simple cross - platform changes that don't even involve so much as one staircase plus, once you get to Reading, there are loads of trains to choose from.

 

It seems a pity that at least one Crossrail service per hour from Reading couldn't reverse and become a via Heathrow service to Paddington but I guess there won't be enough of them and wouldn't be popular during the peaks.

 

What's really needed is perhaps a new hourly semi- fast IEP or electric Oxford service that could serve Slough, Maidenhead and Twyford to compensate, the current Oxford services are either fast or all shacks, there rather needs to be something in between.

[Zomboid]

There is a project for western access to LHR. No idea where that is with funding etc, but it would allow a train on the slow lines from Reading to run via LHR (5 & Central), missing out Iver and West Drayton IIRC.

[Paul.Uni]

I don't think this has been mentioned, services on the WCML will be branded 'London Northwestern'. A mock up of livery on a 350 is shown at https://twitter.com/railexpress/status/923820745460998145

[Zomboid]

Looks odd with the yellow only being on the corridor.

The rest of it is pretty unremarkable.

[James90012]

More details and another bash at the West Midlands Railway livery is here: http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/passenger/single-view/view/west-midlands-trains-announces-london-northwestern-brand.html

[D854_Tiger]

Looks odd with the yellow only being on the corridor.

The rest of it is pretty unremarkable.

 

After that West Midlands Livery, which looks like a naff shell suit, it couldn't have been any worse.

 

I'm not sure if a packet of mints spearmint livery is an improvement on the various toothpaste bus liveries we already have on balance yes, only because of the lack of yellow ends, but why not go the whole hog.

 

However, the ultimate crime, anything called London and North western should be black (perhaps a hint of red lining allowed) and it should be a law.

[D854_Tiger]

More details and another bash at the West Midlands Railway livery is here: http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/passenger/single-view/view/west-midlands-trains-announces-london-northwestern-brand.html

 

An improvement at least because they've got rid of the purple.

 

So what would you choose to decorate your living room with purple and orange or blue and orange.

 

Either way, it ends up looking like a Peruvian brothel.

 

Now if only the orange had been cream that would look nice and hey presto it's that rather nice and rather stylish old Birmingham Bus livery.

 

P.S, West Midlands Buses are being painted red or grey nowadays and do look rather smart, a hint of Midland Red perhaps but without looking as if they came by a job lot of surplus red paint.

[D854_Tiger]

Effectively one existing franchise is now about to become two, from a branding point of view, two liveries and two TOC names.

 

West Midlands Trains will get you to the heart of Herefordshire but probably not Birmingham Airport, most, if not all, services to Birmingham International being London and North Western.

 

On the positive side it all makes work for the model railway companies.

 

I bet once the local politicians find out their new local franchise won't even get them to their local airport they will start kicking up a fuss and us locals can all think of more than a few leafy suburbs around Birmingham that will be none too pleased to discover they just joined the West Midlands. 

 

But then amongst the ranks of us who really don't care, who doesn't enjoy a good **** stir of the harrumph brigade of chocolate soldiers.

[Kelly]

An improvement at least because they've got rid of the purple.

 

So what would you choose to decorate your living room with purple and orange or blue and orange.

 

Either way, it ends up looking like a Peruvian brothel.

 

Now if only the orange had been cream that would look nice and hey presto it's that rather nice and rather stylish old Birmingham Bus livery.

 

P.S, West Midlands Buses are being painted red or grey nowadays and do look rather smart, a hint of Midland Red perhaps but without looking as if they came by a job lot of surplus red paint.

The Coventry buses will likely remain blue even though operated by the same company. So blue would work on the units that serve Coventry. Blue and red?

 

Lnwr black is too austere for them.

[Zomboid]

LNWR didn't paint their carriages black, did they?

Most historic liveries don't really translate that well to a railway of multiple units. And the old companies would almost certainly have rebranded themselves over the years had they survived. I don't know about the others of the big 4, but the southern had olive green and then malachite during its 25 year existence, and BR had green, blue, and sectors in its near 50 year span (maybe the large logo era would count as another brand). I highly doubt the LNWR would be painting their trains like it's 1907 in 2017.

[D854_Tiger]

LNWR didn't paint their carriages black, did they?

Most historic liveries don't really translate that well to a railway of multiple units. And the old companies would almost certainly have rebranded themselves over the years had they survived. I don't know about the others of the big 4, but the southern had olive green and then malachite during its 25 year existence, and BR had green, blue, and sectors in its near 50 year span (maybe the large logo era would count as another brand). I highly doubt the LNWR would be painting their trains like it's 1907 in 2017.

 

I believe they had dark red and creme carriages.

 

I may be mistaken, but I'm just guessing that they never painted anything purple and orange.

 

I reckon green is OK though it's just that Southern kind of already own the copyright on that.

[John M Upton]

Another pretty appalling livery or two, maybe (although I doubt it) they may look better in real life.

 

Meanwhile, Birmingham buses - no other colours acceptable other than cream and dark blue thank you very much!!!

[Zomboid]

I believe they had dark red and creme carriages.

 

I may be mistaken, but I'm just guessing that they never painted anything purple and orange.

No, but in devising their colour schemes they would have used the fashions of 1840(ish) to 1923. Had they lasted until the 1970s they may well have tried orange and brown, and if they were around now then they'd be painting their trains in modern colour schemes.

Which is not to say that I like orange and purple...

[D854_Tiger]

No, but in devising their colour schemes they would have used the fashions of 1840(ish) to 1923. Had they lasted until the 1970s they may well have tried orange and brown, and if they were around now then they'd be painting their trains in modern colour schemes.

Which is not to say that I like orange and purple...

 

Well if the most famous long lasting airlines are anything to go by they are great ones for tradition.

 

Having grown big and successful, in the process establishing their brand to the point of making it iconic, the perceived wisdom is to never trash it.

 

Franchises though are here today, gone tomorrow, so I guess it makes sense to give the job to some student on a placement and humour them, up to a point.

[62613]

 

 

Either way, it ends up looking like a Peruvian brothel.

Information overload!

[Dave47549]

.

Edited October 4, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[John M Upton]

I believe the modern railway operator jargon used these days is 'Brands'...

[Covkid]

An improvement at least because they've got rid of the purple.

 

So what would you choose to decorate your living room with purple and orange or blue and orange.

 

Either way, it ends up looking like a Peruvian brothel.

 

Now if only the orange had been cream that would look nice and hey presto it's that rather nice and rather stylish old Birmingham Bus livery.

 

P.S, West Midlands Buses are being painted red or grey nowadays and do look rather smart, a hint of Midland Red perhaps but without looking as if they came by a job lot of surplus red paint.

 

They havn't "Tiger".  There are two liveries.  Spearmint for the LNW trains to Euston and ghastly purple and orange for the West Midlands area trains.