A 'Wonderful Wagon': hmmmm......

[New Haven Neil]

I recall a club member building a Stotty (Nu-Sto) G5 using Poole wheels.  The looked very nice compared to the Romfords of the time, then he tried to run it.....oh.  He didn't have a layout at home, so it's first trial was in full view of the assembled throng. Sparks everywhere, but little motion!  It re-appeared with Romfords.

[Golden Fleece 30]

Getting back onto the topic.

 

I have just resurrected in the last couple of weeks my TT stock which is 99% Tri-ang but also found these which are Peco Wonderful Wagons but in TT3 size.  These will have been done in the early 70's and not seen the light of day since.  You will see I tried to use a soldering iron on the coupling pips as it left a little solder but the frames were glued onto the diecast base with Evo-Stick.  The coal wagon shows the plastic extension sides as mentioned elsewhere on here but the cardboard wrapper is coming away all over. I will see if I can remove it then reapply it.  The cattle wagon is a plastic body (with missing roof).  The cattle wagon has Peco's nylon wheels running in the nylon axleboxes which with a touch of silicon oil run very well.  The coal wagon has brass Jackson wheels fitted again just running in the nylon frames and again run very well after the silicon oil.

 

There may be a few 00 ones around but no TT as yet.

 

Garry

 

 

[sagaguy]

This is only wagon i can find until i empty my storage chest although it may be the only survivor from th 1960s.AIRC.it was 7/6d.I did build quite a few,it possibly came from Hamblings in Cecil Ct.London.i remember calling in there in the early 1960s & buying 2 or 3,it was pouring with rain & i bought a copy of the Evening Standard to wrap them in as i waited for the bus home.Happy days!.

 

                    Ray.

[Golden Fleece 30]

And here are some more I have found.  The coal wagon does not have the card lifting and again is fitted with metal wheels.  The low sided wagon is all plastic and I have no idea why this was made as it looks like a direct copy from the Tri-ang version (as did the cattle wagon).  This has it's own plastic wheels.  I have found another body casting but no solebars or buffer beams, hopefully one day they may appear.  At the moment I did not think I had this many.

 

It would be nice to get a couple now and build them to see how they turn out.

 

Garry

Edited September 10, 2016 by Golden Fleece 30

[sagaguy]

I had some Wonderful Wagons Conflats from about the same period but over the years,they resembled bananas,the casting warped upwards at both ends.

 

                 Ray.

[Il Grifone]

Peco did a TT series using the Tri-ang bodies on their underframe. This was probably an improvement, as Tri-ang's underframe was not up to much, but there was a premium in price IIRC.

 

My CONFLAT broke in two. Its remains are probably in my store of Peco underframe parts. I have quite a few so that probably explains why I can't find all the ones I had. The rougher ones were probably scrapped (I was less of a squirrel then.)

 

There was a series of containers as well (Possibly still available?) 'Lyons Tea'  is around somewhere. 

 

For what they are worth (not a lot and not very relevant) here are two ancient (c1971) and very poor (underexposed - seriously) of my first attempt at an EM layout. Their only claim to relevance is the repainted Trix mineral wagon copied from the Peco 'Parkend' one.

 

 

Trix Parkend Wagon  and Ratio OPEN C (hand lettered) plus K'S MR 3 plank (Letraset) in the background are a scratchbuilt Taff Vale van and A P.C. models 'toplight'

 

 

CCW clerestory and my '633' converted from a Tri-ang 'Jinty'. (This survives but is no longer EM - I made the mistake of 'saving' money and using 3 mazak drivers....)

 

Apologies for the quality - the slide is underexposed and was copied from a screen. I've mislaid the original, so can't try again using my slide copier.

 

There are a couple more, but I won't inflict them unless asked.

Edited September 12, 2016 by Il Grifone

[Il Grifone]

As promised, a few 'Wonderful Wagons'.

 

 

Two of the original wooden series (factory weathered is nothing new - 'Frank Jackman' was also available pristine) and a later one.

The first two have lost their printed solebars.

 

 

Three of the first metal bodied series.

 

The middle one is EM gauge and hence does not sit too well on the Dublo track.

 

 

Two salt wagons and the 'Colman's Mustard' van.

 

 

Two 'Mendip' (one renumbered and one heavily weathered) and a 'J. Cole'.

Our builder in Bristol was called Cole. I always wondered if he was related.

 

 

These two I bought ready assembled and can't be blamed (apart from the single link coupling - laziness).

 

 

I gather 'B.Q.C.' is 'British Quarry Company' but I think the colour is a flight of fancy - more likely red oxide or grey.

The other has been repainted and numbered as one of the GWR two container wagons. This was available in all four company liveries (I have a TT LNER one) and BR livery, but I believe I am correct in saying that the two GWR vehicles were the only 3 plank wagons to have diagonal strapping. They should also be fitted. I can't claim credit for the lettering; it's P.C. Models 'Pressfix' (I did it that long ago).

 

I have another (a third 'Mendip') repainted all over red. It was going to be 'Teign Valley Granite', but then Hornby brought one out....

 

There were also Merco lithos (Hambling's). I have Wood & Co. fixed to the body of an Airfix mineral wagon suitably filed flat (cost 50p). The underframe is getting a new body; the fate of the old body is undecided. Merco's idea of red oxide is a pale orange which reminds me there were some card overlays (forget the make) for P.O. wagons. Again the red oxide was orange, bright this time. I made the mistake of buying one ('Grove & Co.' IIRC. It ended up in the bin.... )

Edited September 13, 2016 by Il Grifone

[stewartingram]

Many years ago when I was into car repairs (I still am but the rust problem isn't so prevalent today), I used a lot of red oxide primer. It varied a lot in colour, from the orange end of the range to almost a maroon and shades of brown.

 

Stewart

[Il Grifone]

Many years ago when I was into car repairs (I still am but the rust problem isn't so prevalent today), I used a lot of red oxide primer. It varied a lot in colour, from the orange end of the range to almost a maroon and shades of brown.

 

Stewart

 

That's true, but I doubt the orange end of the spectrum ended up on wagons or stayed orange for long, even if it did. I am talking bright orange here. I'll put up a picture of the 'Wood & Co'. to show what I mean.

Edited September 12, 2016 by Il Grifone

[Nearholmer]

Are you sure that Wood & Co wagons weren't actually orange?

 

I've got an 0 scale one with LMC/Steadman litho papers on it, and that is orange, bordering on dark yellow, having been printed that colour when the real things were trundling about to be seen by all.

 

Kevin

Edited September 12, 2016 by Nearholmer

[Il Grifone]

It could well be the case (I wasn't around at the time!). It just seems unlikely.

 

The sheet is still available and still orange.

 

http://www.freestonemodel.co.uk/page25.htm

 

Why one needs four the same, considering the other sheets have different names. The red oxide seems rather on the red side too. (Charringtons etc.), but, as I said, I wasn't around at the time.

 

Investigation found a Farish version in yellow....

 

and Bachmann versions in a more muted orange.

 

http://www.vectis.co.uk/AuctionImages/340/41_l.jpg

Edited September 13, 2016 by Il Grifone

[sagaguy]

It really is amazing how these are still available after nearly 70 years  or maybe more!!!.It`s a pity that Merco smokey brick paper & arches are not still available,the had a charm all of their own.I remember Peter Denny of Buckingham Great Central fame putting out an appeal for more of this brick paper after it went out of print.

 

                        Ray.

[asmay2002]

Are you sure that Wood & Co wagons weren't actually orange?

 

 

 

Turton. "Private owner wagons - A First  collection" says that Wood &Co wagons were "variously described as bright yellow, yellow-orange, orange and orange-brown".  They weren't red oxide.

Edited September 13, 2016 by asmay2002

[Il Grifone]

It would appear that I was wrong (not the first time!). So yellow/orangey tending to brown it is. (It probably varied with time and weathered quite rapidly.) I'll probably keep the wagon body now, rather than chuck it.

 

I have a feeling that I have the yellow Farish wagon somewhere.

[5050]

Around 1960, when my sister married and moved to Kingston-on-Thames, I visited for a couple of weeks and took the opportunity of visiting (by train) Model and Tool Supplies in Raynes Park.  This was probably my first visit to a 'proper' model railway shop and I had saved pocket money for the experience!  I bought 2 Peco Wagon Kits, a Stafford Salt and an SR low-sided.  These would be my first attempt at 'scale modelling'.  I also bought a tube of Bostick Clear which I used to build them - for all the joints - and, the last time I found them lurking in a box of my modelling mementos, they were still apparently intact.  Both wagons have a cast body and I had them both finished in an afternoon, using a knife heated on the gas ring to melt the underframe 'pegs' inside.  They have had very little running.  My pathetic attempt at a layout was never completed - for various reasons.  Lack of finance to purchase the required amount of 'scale' Peco spiked track, lack of skill to built it properly (track, wiring, etc.) and the realisation that there were other things equally (if not more) interesting in life.

 

I will leave it to you to guess what they were..................................

 

Or are!

[Il Grifone]

More interesting than trains?    

 

 

Umm?  .... Nah!          

 

I did have a period* when I was a teenager, but I soon saw the light!

 

* Following the demise of Hornby Dublo and the real thing getting covered all over in a dreadful shade of blue.

[Prometheus]

And well, in spite of an earlier intention to never build another Peco ‘Wonderful Wagon’, here is a model of a Worthington brewery van. Actually, I didn’t build this one but I did restore it. Acquired with badly corroded wheels, a broken roof and a detached side, I re-wheeled it in new bearings and carefully reattached the detached side. The other side was not removable and although I was able to clean off some of the excess glue applied by the original builder, it is not quite as tidy a job as the restored side: it's tolerable though. The roof is another old Peco part from the bits box and has been cleaned up, painted and glued in place. Bachmann couplings have been attached in place of the originals and the shiny plastic chassis toned down. This van runs extremely smoothly and the sprung buffers and axle-boxes work well.

 

I know that these aren't everyone's cup-of-tea but they have a delightful vintage air and as long as great care is taken in attaching the paper sides, they can look quite convincing. If we don't rescue them, they'll disappear completely eventually, lost to a mass of out-of-the-box replacements. I'm beginning to find these addictive...

 

 

 

The usual problem encountered with second-hand Peco vans involves very poorly folded-over paper ends, the original builder having relied rather too heavily on lashings of some ghastly adhesive to hold the fold in place with the consequence that it has leaked out everywhere and spoilt the appearance completely. There's little to be done in those cases [unless you can obtain replacement sides] and I'm constantly surprised by just how bad these bodged jobs are: a carefully scored fold, held in place with PVA, provides a invisible joint. But it's easy to be critical.

 

Tony

Edited October 12, 2016 by Prometheus

[DaveF]

And well, in spite of an earlier intention to never build another Peco ‘Wonderful Wagon’, here is a model of a Worthington brewery van. Actually, I didn’t build this one but I did restore it. Acquired with badly corroded wheels, a broken roof and a detached side, I re-wheeled it in new bearings and carefully reattached the detached side. The other side was not removable and although I was able to clean off some of the excess glue applied by the original builder, it is not quite as tidy a job as the restored side: it's tolerable though. The roof is another old Peco part from the bits box and has been cleaned up, painted and glued in place. Bachmann couplings have been attached in place of the originals and the shiny plastic chassis toned down. This van runs extremely smoothly and the sprung buffers and axle-boxes work well.

 

I know that these aren't everyone's cup-of-tea but they have a delightful vintage air and as long as great care is taken in attaching the paper sides, they can look quite convincing. If we don't rescue them, they'll disappear completely eventually, lost to a mass of out-of-the-box replacements. I'm beginning to find these addictive...

 

The usual problem encountered with second-hand Peco vans involves very poorly folded-over paper ends, the original builder having relied rather too heavily on lashings of some ghastly adhesive to hold the fold in place with the consequence that it has leaked out everywhere and spoilt the appearance completely. There's little to be done in those cases [unless you can obtain replacement sides] and I'm constantly surprised by just how bad these bodged jobs are: a carefully scored fold, held in place with PVA, provides a invisible joint. But it's easy to be critical.

 

Tony

 

 

Peco still have most of the Wonderful Wagon card sides in stock, quite cheaply.  They also still have underframe kits as well as the various van roofs.

 

Davidin stock 

[Prometheus]

Thanks for that Dave - a new roof would be helpful. Alas however, they do not have the printed side that I'm looking for: the Craven Llewelyn coal truck.

 

Tony

[andyman7]

Did you get the Charles and Diana wedding special?

 

I bought one at the time, stored it for blooming ages unmade, then got rid of it in a rash clear-out moment, which I began to regret almost instantly.

 

K

The Charles & Diana one is the only one I ever made - it was the closest that the range ever got to modern image....long lost now but somewhere I have a photo of it posed behind an R075 BR Blue Hornby class 47....

[Steamport Southport]

The Charles and Diana wagon was the only one I ever had as well. I think they were giving them away when you purchased a loco in one of the model shops. Quite possibly Beatties.

 

I never built it as I thought that it might be worth lots of money if kept in it's box.  

 

No idea where it is though.

 

 

 

Jason

[locomad]

Wonderful I've been collecting these for years "Parkend" seems to be the most popular and very cheap too last load to many to mention was at a local model show last Xmas £1 for 10, usual box under the counter

 

They have a certain appeal as mentioned card tends to come apart at the corners but easy to glue back, found the springs on axles stick but super glue holds them in place which stops them rocking, tend to be a bit light just add weight, most previous owners add loads esp coal

 

I suppose now they are going to become collectable which I wonder will be the rare ones which might command the highest price might even get £1 for each one

[Il Grifone]

'Craven Llewelyn' was one of the original wooden bodied series and phased out when the metal bodies were introduced. The original series had both end door and side door wagons, AFAIK only 'Saxa Salt' survived into the metal era. I came across the expression "sought after" referring to these early wagons in a magazine from the sixties recently. Later wooden bodies were 5 plank and salt wagons. The wooden body was replaced by a metal casting with plastic extensions. Being nylon, nothing will stick them permanently.

 

As mentioned, some of the printed sides and other parts are still available. No metal bodies though, so scratchbuilding is called for. Unfortunately the original metal bufferheads have been replaced with a nasty plastic version.

 

Fitting wooden or T section end posts is a worthwhile improvement though matching the colour can be tricky. Also the solebars should really be painted too, as it was the usual practice for these to be body colour on wagons with wooden undeframes. The first series wagons had a printed strip for solebar detail, as the metal floor casting is smooth in this area.

 

Does anyone have a full list of names - I can only remember some of them? I seem to recall them listed in a catalogue I had once (Hamblings or W & H IIRC).

 

 

The Charles and Diana wagon was the only one I ever had as well. I think they were giving them away when you purchased a loco in one of the model shops. Quite possibly Beatties.

 

I never built it as I thought that it might be worth lots of money if kept in it's box.

 

No idea where it is though.

 

 

 

Jason

 

I kept Hornby's limited edition 'Pugh & Co.' wagon for the same reason.....

Edited October 13, 2016 by Il Grifone

[Steamport Southport]

Oh the Pugh & Co, London wagon. I've still got one of them as well and that's kept with all the model stuff that has sentimental value that I want to keep as it came.

 

 

 

Jason

[Il Grifone]

The 'Pugh and Co.' wagons were supposedly only available if one bought a Hornby locomotive. Mine came with my copy of the Hornby Dublo 'bible'; I assume the shop had a quantity left over. It's spent almost all of the intervening thirty odd years in its box. I must dig it out and give it a run. I can't remember which of the awful versions of the Tri-ang/Hornby wagon underframes it has. (IMHO, the original Trackmaster and first Tri-ang modification of these aren't bad*, but from then on....)

 

* These have wooden solebar strapping detail with solid grease axleboxes. Their 9' 6" wheelbase and 16' length rather limit their usefulness. The Trackmaster ones have quite decent 'scale' wheels, which unfortunately are zinc alloy and non-insulated.