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All new RTR PGA wagon in 4mm scale


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PTA for certain. I do think that there is a lack of the big bogie box wagons. And there are so many varients running around now that reuse older under frames or running gear.

 

Thanks Cheesysmith, it would allow one wagon to be used for both Iron Ore and Aggregates which makes it more viable. Also has a good time span.

 

Assuming you're looking at suggestions for a OO project, not N?

I ask as some of those are/have recently been kits available in N.  Perhaps maybe a wagon that's not very available in either scale would be good? 

 

Personally I like the sound of the O&K Hoppers, but rumour has it Dapol had them in the pipeline to follow with the 59, but who knows with Dapol eh?!

 

I second the PTA wagon personally.  Lima did one long ago for OO I believe, and TPM did a kit for N back in the day, but it has a long life and multiple liveries.

 

 

Cheers,

Paul

 

To be honest Paul, we are open to modelling something that has not been done before, whether in kit form or ready to run. Equally we are also keen to produce a model that has been offered previously but not necessarily since the advances in production which now allow highly detailed models.

That is also a consideration, are the big boys looking to release that in the future? No point duplicating something.

As yet I am not aware of what Dapol are planning to release to accompany their class 59.

 

As someone with an interest in departmental / infrastructure wagons, I'd be most interested in the YEA Perch, but I'm not convinced it would make the most commercial sense - how do you model a 600' long welded rail that is flexible enough to go round model railway curves.  I think some of the Pullman Mk2 coaches are in the ownership of West Coast Railway Company and still in use on Charters, so I'd also be interested in these if they were produced in that guise.  Aggregate wagons less so, but they would fit better with your existing PGA.

 

Dungrange, you and Cav are definitely on the same page, he is very keen on the YEA Perch! 

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Hi

For me

PGA > ARC/Yeoman any variant .. would sell a shed load !!

PTA > ARC/Yeoman

PFA > Cawoods/British Fuels

 

And for a left field selection

PHA/JGA > Bardon Aggregates

 

TW

 

Hi TW, an ARC or Yeoman PGA would probably prove popular, especially to go with Dapol's 59. Maybe Dapol are planning to release one?

 

A long train of Cawoods PFAs with a Large Logo 60 on the front would look good.....

 

I think the Bardon Hill JRAs? Would make a good model https://wagons.smugmug.com/JRA/i-S6sN5mt Bachmann may well have those in their sights.

 

I think the BBA would be a good choice , there are a few variations of decking over the years , plus conversions to BSA ( slab / coil ) that ran from Tinsley with slab to Immingham and back with coil , BLA mainly for South Wales traffic, BWA with 5 cradles , BBA with 6 cradles for slab / coil , BIA with 5 ex BOA cradles , then there's the covered version BWA, BXA . Sheerness Steel JXA would be popular ? Or the BVA coil / slab wagon again working from Tinsley.

https://wrightys.smugmug.com/Wagons

Link to some of the various types outlined

 

Thanks Baz, lots of variety. Also they ran in short or long rakes and also can be mixed with other steel wagon types.

 

For me, I've had two wagons at the top of my list for the last 20+ years, the ICI limestone hoppers is the first, which are now available in 'oo' gauge. My second is the UYV BR anhydrite hopper. Has the advantage of no current kit available, but is a single commodity wagon used on a tight diagram, but were used in bulk flows.

 

Interesting wagon the UYV, I have to say that I am not familiar with those. How many were made and what is their history?

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Personally, I would like anything that carried china clay in speedlink services - PRA' & PAA or STS 4w Clayliner tanks (TTA?). Yes, I know weve just had the Tiger Rail PBA' but what the hell - spoil us!!

Definitely agree, any of the boxes or hoppers from the Mendip quarry fleets would be great for those buying Dapol' 59 and would be interested in the Bardon PHA bogie hopper.

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Thanks Cheesysmith, it would allow one wagon to be used for both Iron Ore and Aggregates which makes it more viable. Also has a good time span.

 

 

 

To be honest Paul, we are open to modelling something that has not been done before, whether in kit form or ready to run. Equally we are also keen to produce a model that has been offered previously but not necessarily since the advances in production which now allow highly detailed models.

That is also a consideration, are the big boys looking to release that in the future? No point duplicating something.

As yet I am not aware of what Dapol are planning to release to accompany their class 59.

 

 

 

Dungrange, you and Cav are definitely on the same page, he is very keen on the YEA Perch!

 

Well I do have a soft spot for the YEA and I also have all of the measurements for the whole thing so would be an easy win for me! It could easily be run empty as they were only full whilst off out to lay track. Every other time they were empty!

 

There are some great suggeations here and of course nearer the time we will most likely run a poll.

 

In the meantime keep em coming!

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These would be my first choices, listed pretty much in order of preference:

 

PGA  ECC livery...  http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/procorpga%C2%A0

JRA Bardon Aggregates...  https://wagons.smugmug.com/JRA/i-S6sN5mt

 

PBA hopper...  http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/pbapha 

 

JGA Bardon Aggregates... https://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/UKRailRollingstock/J-/JGA-bogie-hoppers/JGA-Aggregate-Industries-bogie/

 

 

cheers

Al

 

Edited by YesTor
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Thanks Cheesysmith, it would allow one wagon to be used for both Iron Ore and Aggregates which makes it more viable. Also has a good time span.

 

 

To be honest Paul, we are open to modelling something that has not been done before, whether in kit form or ready to run. Equally we are also keen to produce a model that has been offered previously but not necessarily since the advances in production which now allow highly detailed models.

That is also a consideration, are the big boys looking to release that in the future? No point duplicating something.

As yet I am not aware of what Dapol are planning to release to accompany their class 59.

 

 

Dungrange, you and Cav are definitely on the same page, he is very keen on the YEA Perch! 

What am I missing here? Perch were part of a really complex train. Haven't many gone to make razor blades since after sitting in York rotting for years. I know some remain but as already mentioned getting a working train of loaded Perch would be very difficult.  http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/perchporpoise/e53dd0834 http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/perchporpoise

 

A ferry van.

 

Paul

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Interesting wagon the UYV, I have to say that I am not familiar with those. How many were made and what is their history?

 

They were built as a single batch of 150 wagons at BR Shildon works in 1954, to work from Long Meg anhydrite quarry on the Settle and Carlisle line, to ICI works in Cheshire and the North East.  Anhydrite was used in the manufacture of Sulphuric acid. The hoppers were open, but were sheeted to cover the anhydrite. According to Paul Bartlett who photographed a number in the mid 70s, at that time while many were withdrawn, some were used from Wellingborough into the mid 1980s. The n gauge society produce an 'n' gauge kit of this wagon (Kit No 20), which is fairly basic. 

Edited by rembrow
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What am I missing here? Perch were part of a really complex train. Haven't many gone to make razor blades since after sitting in York rotting for years. I know some remain but as already mentioned getting a working train of loaded Perch would be very difficult.  http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/perchporpoise/e53dd0834 http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/perchporpoise

 

A ferry van.

 

Paul

As I said in my post, they probably spent more time unloaded than loaded so no need to model a working one. An empty run would be fine. I am certainly having one in N gauge for my layouts.

 

Also why does the fact that many are now scapped have anything to do with it? We don't all model bang upto date. Most layouts are historical to some degree or other. I for instance find that I always model the 80s or early 90s.

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Alex/Cav,

 

Without going back to the start of the thread, didn't you state the intention to do the less shallow (bargeboard?) side panels version of the Redland PGA if the initial project was successful? I took this as a follow up thing.

 

I'm not creating fellas, it's just that on that understanding, half of my reasoning for buying the number of wagons I have is that I'd like a 50/50 mix of both types within a prototypical length train, same livery mix.

 

I lack the knowledge of such things, but I'd imagine the running gear is the same? If so aren't you half way there already?

 

Far be it for me to tell you how to run this enterprise, but I'd personally like to finish the train your initial release has made possible before I start wishlisting about others.

 

Best regards, Carl.

Thanks for your post Carl.

 

Whilst we have the ex-Tilbury and latterly Redland PGA on our list of wagons for the future which will go with our first PGA, in the short-term we are looking at something else. It is our intention to revisit the PGA in the future, when exactly at this moment in time we cannot say.

I like your suggestion. We have also discussed a similar idea of sharing chassis and parts that could suit several different wagons. Unfortunately it isn’t that easy once you start to research a bit deeper.

Sole bar, suspension, hoppers, underframe to name but a few differences.

 

Lots for us to think about for the future. A lot will depend on what the majority want.

 

Thanks for your input.

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Hello Alex and Cav

 

Congrats on your excellent first project I'm sure it will be a great success.

 

For the future can I suggest an MLA / IEA, simple(?) infrastructure box wagons that can be bought in multiples in Network Rail or EWS livery, or the PTA / JUA to replace the ancient Limby effort that has had its day.

 

Cambrian already make a BBA, which makes up really well, I would have thought it might be best to avoid duplicating existing relatively modern RTR or kits.

 

Thanks KDG, the PTA has been mentioned a few times, as has the BBA. Both would prove popular for their own reasons.

That is also another consideration, duplicating models. I know Dapol were also looking at releasing a BBA, not too sure if that is still the case in the future.

 

Might be worth creating a poll so members can vote here or on your own website! FY or ARC PGA get my vote, plus a good PTA hopper...new samples look good btw.

 

Thanks Pedro, that is a good idea. Maybe once we have the most popular choices a poll can be set up.

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Here is a list of potential contenders that we have been considering for our next project:

PBA Lime/Aggregate bogie hopper

BBA Steel carrier

Pullman Mk2 coaches

PFA - Coal Container

Another PGA

PTA Iron ore/Aggregate bogie wagon

PFB/KFB Warflat

PHA/JHA Orenstein & Koppel Yeoman bogie hopper

PHA Ex-RMC bogie stone hopper

YEA Perch

 

 

Some great wagon choices there! My vote would be (anything china clay orientated/speedlink) &

PHA/JHA Orenstein & Koppel Yeoman bogie hopper

PBA Lime/Aggregate bogie hopper

 

Of course I've got some PTAs & PFAs on my long term build desk so you're bound to go for those :) Seriously though the kit i have for the PFAs is quite basic so will be a good choice. Most of the old Applyby kits seemed to cover interesting prototypes so there maybe some options there.

 

cheers

Will

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Difficult. Most of those are on my wish list apart from the Mk2 Pullman.

Dapol did announce their intention to do the BBA many years ago but nothing since. They did the same with the Turbot and only resurrected it Warley in November. I also think Dapol will do something to go behind the 59 but they have not said what. I cannot remember from where but I do recall that it was going to be a bogie wagon. They may also ready have bogies in their tool set from other wagons they could use? Therefore while I would go for any of the large hoppers you suggest it might be wise to see where Dapol go. That said you can probably get something to market first.

 

The PTA would be great and as you say lots of liveries and a good time span. I would definitely get some to go with the forthcoming 59 and also for Llanwern and Port Talbot trains. Actually I would get rather a lot :)

I would not say no to the YEA either.

 

I think the Warflat (Shildon) might not sell as well as there is the Bachmann Warflat already. Some people will want both versions but it might dilute your potential market?

 

I would definitely go for the PFA and another PGA - I think you would sell a lot of Yeoman/ARC ones.

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Some interesting options listed.

As stated previously the PTA (variety of liveries & wide geographic spread) would be mutually beneficial to both modellers & these enterprising chaps taking this on.

I do like the idea of the Yeoman PHA but this doesn't have such diversity &!maybe a consideration for Dapol & their pending class 59.

Is it worth reaching out to Dapol to qualify this?

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Hello all.

 

Rather than a BBA, which exists as a decent Cambrian kit and possible Dapol future RTR, can I suggest the IHA covered bogie steel coil carriers. There are several different diagrams in use presently the Shimmns and Sfhimmns seem common in a variety of albeit very dirty liveries. Block trains mixed in with BYA wagons and shortish 6 wagon trains by themselves.

 

I recently bought a Roco HO scale one, which looks odd next to a Bachmann BYA

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Hello

 

I vote for the YEA. I have often wondered who would be brave enough to bring to market a critical rail system. The YEA Perch, Porpoise and Chute Welded Rail Carrier are seen extensively across the next work since the 1980s through to today. 

 

P0079L.jpg

 

P0080L.jpg

 

P0083L.jpg

 

Not withstanding, the YEA can also form a Snow and Ice Treatment Train (though geographically limited to the South)

 

sitt-dwg.jpg

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Interesting. The snow and ice treatment wagon in based on the propelling wagon which is different to the carrier YEA but to make a full LWRT set you may want one anyway. You can form a LWRT without a propelling wagon though.

 

Heres one of my 3d printed YEAs I have done in N.

 

post-6894-0-60398000-1520084654.jpg

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The TRL 135XX PBAs or later PHAs without the covers would be good. I converted one of these from a HO Atlas 3 bay cylindrical hopper model mainy years ago looka good.

 

Another PGA design would be good. Again I've got a few I need want to do. Ditto Grainflow PAAs reworking Lima model. How about PCAs?

 

Cheers Paul

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Put me down for some of these please.

 

I do think it would be nice to update the grain hopper.

 

Personally, I would like anything that carried china clay in speedlink services - PRA' & PAA or STS 4w Clayliner tanks (TTA?). Yes, I know weve just had the Tiger Rail PBA' but what the hell - spoil us!!

Definitely agree, any of the boxes or hoppers from the Mendip quarry fleets would be great for those buying Dapol' 59 and would be interested in the Bardon PHA bogie hopper.

 

It would be interesting to find out what Dapol have planned, as has been mentioned previously, there are quite a few options for wagons to go with their 59.

 

These would be my first choices, listed pretty much in order of preference:

 

PGA  ECC livery...  http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/procorpga%C2%A0

 

JRA Bardon Aggregates...  https://wagons.smugmug.com/JRA/i-S6sN5mt

 

PBA hopper...  http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/pbapha 

 

JGA Bardon Aggregates... https://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/UKRailRollingstock/J-/JGA-bogie-hoppers/JGA-Aggregate-Industries-bogie/

 

 

cheers

Al

 

 

 

A nice selection Al, if my memory serves me right, the ex-ECC PGAs were running up until very recently with VTG? 

The JRAs would make a nice model.

They were built as a single batch of 150 wagons at BR Shildon works in 1954, to work from Long Meg anhydrite quarry on the Settle and Carlisle line, to ICI works in Cheshire and the North East.  Anhydrite was used in the manufacture of Sulphuric acid. The hoppers were open, but were sheeted to cover the anhydrite. According to Paul Bartlett who photographed a number in the mid 70s, at that time while many were withdrawn, some were used from Wellingborough into the mid 1980s. The n gauge society produce an 'n' gauge kit of this wagon (Kit No 20), which is fairly basic. 

 

Thanks for the info Rembrow.

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Some great wagon choices there! My vote would be (anything china clay orientated/speedlink) &

PHA/JHA Orenstein & Koppel Yeoman bogie hopper

PBA Lime/Aggregate bogie hopper

 

Of course I've got some PTAs & PFAs on my long term build desk so you're bound to go for those :) Seriously though the kit i have for the PFAs is quite basic so will be a good choice. Most of the old Applyby kits seemed to cover interesting prototypes so there maybe some options there.

 

cheers

Will

 

I agree Will, we have had some very good suggestions to add to our list.

It is going to be difficult to make a decision....

 

Difficult. Most of those are on my wish list apart from the Mk2 Pullman.

Dapol did announce their intention to do the BBA many years ago but nothing since. They did the same with the Turbot and only resurrected it Warley in November. I also think Dapol will do something to go behind the 59 but they have not said what. I cannot remember from where but I do recall that it was going to be a bogie wagon. They may also ready have bogies in their tool set from other wagons they could use? Therefore while I would go for any of the large hoppers you suggest it might be wise to see where Dapol go. That said you can probably get something to market first.

 

The PTA would be great and as you say lots of liveries and a good time span. I would definitely get some to go with the forthcoming 59 and also for Llanwern and Port Talbot trains. Actually I would get rather a lot :)

I would not say no to the YEA either.

 

I think the Warflat (Shildon) might not sell as well as there is the Bachmann Warflat already. Some people will want both versions but it might dilute your potential market?

 

I would definitely go for the PFA and another PGA - I think you would sell a lot of Yeoman/ARC ones.

 

Thanks BR Blue, regarding Dapol's 59, there are quite a few bogie wagons as well as the different PGAs that ran with 59s, both Foster Yeoman and ARC.

 

It is points like you made about Bachmann's Warflat that have to be taken into consideration.

 

All food for thought thank you!

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The TRL 135XX PBAs or later PHAs without the covers would be good. I converted one of these from a HO Atlas 3 bay cylindrical hopper model mainy years ago looka good.

 

Another PGA design would be good. Again I've got a few I need want to do. Ditto Grainflow PAAs reworking Lima model. How about PCAs?

 

Cheers Paul

 

Hi Paul, I do like the TRL PBAs, would go nicely with some Redland PGAs!

 

https://transportsofdelight.smugmug.com/RAILWAYS/FENLAND-RAILWAY-FOTOS/CLASS-56/i-HGDsLtG/A

 

Also behind a pair of 31s!

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/billatkinson2/8227736030/

 

Which PCAs do you mean please?

 

 

Being a PEak forest fan how about variants og JGA (RMC colours) both the round body and JGA-K version

 

Nik

 

Ps or a Cleveland potash PAA (or I believe in ICI black)

 

Another JGA might be a popular one to add some variety to Bachmann's RMC wagon.

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Some interesting options listed.

As stated previously the PTA (variety of liveries & wide geographic spread) would be mutually beneficial to both modellers & these enterprising chaps taking this on.

I do like the idea of the Yeoman PHA but this doesn't have such diversity &!maybe a consideration for Dapol & their pending class 59.

Is it worth reaching out to Dapol to qualify this?

 

Thanks CB Rail, the PTA does appear like it may be a popular choice.

It might be worth asking Dapol, however, they may not wish to divulge that information. Probably worth a try though.

 

Hello all.

 

Rather than a BBA, which exists as a decent Cambrian kit and possible Dapol future RTR, can I suggest the IHA covered bogie steel coil carriers. There are several different diagrams in use presently the Shimmns and Sfhimmns seem common in a variety of albeit very dirty liveries. Block trains mixed in with BYA wagons and shortish 6 wagon trains by themselves.

 

I recently bought a Roco HO scale one, which looks odd next to a Bachmann BYA

Interesting suggestion KDG, thank you.

I used to like the Powell Duffryn Coil PXA wagon.

 

My five ,in no particular order

PAA/PGA Covered hopper...British Industrial Sand

PAA Grainflow

BBA

Polybulk Grainflow bogie wagon

CSA Flyash presflo

There are also chemical wagons,further steel wagons and ferry vans which would fill big gaps in my wish lists for the 1980’s....I could go on.

 

Thanks Troublesome Trucks.

 

I like the idea of the CSA Flyash wagons, 40 odd of those behind an Original Railfreight 58 would look great! Not too sure how popular they would be though!

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