oldchap58 Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 Can anybody give me any hints and tips about detailing this model any ideas? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon A Posted November 6, 2016 Share Posted November 6, 2016 The best thing is to look at pictures of the real thing. There three excellent books on steam breakdown cranes. One by John S Brownlie the other two (A two volume opus) by Peter Tatlow. There are a small number of steam breakdown cranes in preservation. Gordon A Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 This one converted to EM for Carlisle, a few modifications, some painting and Barry O's weathering 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 This one converted to EM for Carlisle, a few modifications, some painting and Barry O's weathering Cowans Sheldon crane.jpg Why chains rather than ropes Mike? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCB Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 On mine, bought new 50 years ago, I chopped off the winding handles as they foul on sub 50 mm track centres and replaced them with gear wheels from a clock which retained the play value when my son was small, actually enhance it as the handles are so fiddly. Also used ships rigging from Cheltenham Model Centre instead of the green rope. A Mine is dirty black but now realise cranes were generally kept clean so repaint into lined black is planned. I guess someone will convert one to DCC with slewing, jib and winding motors? No? Though not. Maybe radio control with the receiver and power pack in a permanently coupled Ks GWR 40 ' brake? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Michael Edge Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 7, 2016 Chains left on from the original model, I didn't do a lot of work on this, the big handles were removed but the crane still works. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted November 7, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) There was an article describing a project conducted to motorize all the movements on a detailed HD crane in the August 2001 issue of Railway Modeller. It was operated using a dedicated control box on a wander lead but the author, Tony James, stated that he would have attempted digital control via four Zero One chips but for the cost. Todays multi-function chips would probably make it much easier. Well worth locating a copy before you start, I'd think as the mechanical aspects are covered quite thoroughly. John Edited November 7, 2016 by Dunsignalling Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peak experience Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Does it bear any resemblance to a prototype? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Does it bear any resemblance to a prototype? I believe it is based on a Cowans Sheldon design, but rather short in the jib (in order to negoiate 15" radius curves). http://www.bdca.org.uk/gallery/index.php/Miscellaneous-Images/CS-45T-Diagram And an ex-pat http://www.phantasrail.com/Iran/23%20DL%20Tehranu.jpg Edited November 7, 2016 by Il Grifone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 I did ask about this a long while back and I think some one said its based on a crane built for the LNER in the early1940s if I recall right Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldchap58 Posted November 8, 2016 Author Share Posted November 8, 2016 Thanks for all the replies found some excellent photos on the bca website with some mods should make up to a nice model the jib is to short but I can live with that! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold teaky Posted November 8, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 8, 2016 Please post your modified crane on here oldchap58. I'm sure I'm not the only one who'd like to see the modifications and the end result. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldchap58 Posted November 8, 2016 Author Share Posted November 8, 2016 Will post photos when done but it might be awhile before I get around to starting! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 Chains left on from the original model, I didn't do a lot of work on this, the big handles were removed but the crane still works. The previous owner must have changed the green string at some time then. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londontram Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 I believe it is based on a Cowans Sheldon design, but rather short in the jib (in order to negoiate 15" radius curves). http://www.bdca.org.uk/gallery/index.php/Miscellaneous-Images/CS-45T-Diagram And an ex-pat http://www.phantasrail.com/Iran/23%20DL%20Tehranu.jpg Looking at the model and the photo's and plans it seems to me it the runner wagon as well as the jib that's a bit shorter by about a cm or so but I cant see it being much more than that and as others have said its such a beautiful model especially considering its age and being metal has a lovely tactile feel about you can easily forgive the slightly shorter jib. I've had two at various times but as there out side my modeling period have sold them though I keep getting drawn back to them and would have another one in an instance. Hmm I'm off to ebay to see whats about Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Roger Sunderland Posted November 8, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 8, 2016 If you are looking for a truly prototypical crane can I suggest you have a look at "Wild Boar Models" website.A 3D printed model, very easy to build and after painting and weathering really looks superb. It's also the model that Bachmann are threatening to release but don't hold your breath on that one. Our model runs on the "Horfield" exhibition layout and never fails to attract favourable comments. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 (edited) Looking at the model and the photo's and plans it seems to me it the runner wagon as well as the jib that's a bit shorter by about a cm or so but I cant see it being much more than that and as others have said its such a beautiful model especially considering its age and being metal has a lovely tactile feel about you can easily forgive the slightly shorter jib. I've had two at various times but as there out side my modeling period have sold them though I keep getting drawn back to them and would have another one in an instance. Hmm I'm off to ebay to see whats about The runner wagon is the Dublo low sided wagon with a casting for the jib rest riveted on and a red finish. This might have been a secondary reason for the short jib, but they could have used the double bolster wagon instead. Removing the bolster castings would have enabled the release of a plate wagon. The crane tends to be rather expensive these days (it never was cheap!) and a decent example will probably cost around £30 - more if boxed and complete. The jacks are usually missing (and expensive) but are not required for a detailed example of course. I paid only £3 for my crane unit, but all the other bits raised the total price considerably. EDIT There's a faded example on eBay at the moment for £22.99 BIN - fine for detailing. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-Dublo-4620-Breakdown-crane-FREEPOST-/222278080689?hash=item33c0ce58b1:g:lTUAAOSwYIxX~LVzhttp://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-Dublo-4620-Breakdown-crane-FREEPOST-/222278080689?hash=item33c0ce58b1:g:lTUAAOSwYIxX~LVz and this one which is obviously an abandoned detailing project. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-Dublo-Breakdown-Crane-with-parts-to-make-the-correct-Hook-Rigging-Assy-/112189042955?hash=item1a1efcf10b:g:cAcAAOSwx2dYCQC5 There was also a packing van available as an optional extra, but, as a BR standard van, unlikely I would have thought. Edited November 8, 2016 by Il Grifone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonhall Posted November 8, 2016 Share Posted November 8, 2016 I wonder if any of the Wild Boar Fell 3d parts could help dress up the HD mechanism. Jon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 9, 2016 Share Posted November 9, 2016 I wonder if any of the Wild Boar Fell 3d parts could help dress up the HD mechanism. Jon Probably, but it is marked as sold out on the web site. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRAILRAGE Posted November 9, 2016 Share Posted November 9, 2016 This ones currently sitting at £16 with 15 bids and ends in around 9 hrs. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-DUBLO-2-RAIL-4620-BREAKDOWN-CRANE-SET-4318-PACKING-VAN-GOOD/311726914164?_trksid=p2047675.c100623.m-1&_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIC.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D38661%26meid%3D53a03bf620534b85ae74a0aeea0522cf%26pid%3D100623%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D112189042955 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldchap58 Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) Work done so far stripped back to bare metal and primed,removing the paint improves the detail as the rivets show up better(see jib photo),holes filled on crane body and teeth on main drive gears filed out Edited November 10, 2016 by oldchap58 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldchap58 Posted November 10, 2016 Author Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) Il Grifone I assume that this would be the Hornby dublo 21t bolster wagon not the bogie bolster wagon?To mod it you would need to remove the bolsters and I assume also the sides so that you would have a flat deck?There are a couple on ebay that are cheap it might be worth a shot! Edited November 10, 2016 by oldchap58 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold ikks Posted November 10, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 10, 2016 If you are looking for a truly prototypical crane can I suggest you have a look at "Wild Boar Models" website.A 3D printed model, very easy to build and after painting and weathering really looks superb. It's also the model that Bachmann are threatening to release but don't hold your breath on that one. Our model runs on the "Horfield" exhibition layout and never fails to attract favourable comments. Do you have a pic? Rgds.........Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted November 10, 2016 Share Posted November 10, 2016 (edited) Il Grifone I assume that this would be the Hornby dublo 21t bolster wagon not the bogie bolster wagon?To mod it you would need to remove the bolsters and I assume also the sides so that you would have a flat deck?There are a couple on ebay that are cheap it might be worth a shot! Hi oldchap58, The 21T double bolster is indeed the one I meant. Ideally the bolsters should be removed*, but they could be passed off as packing left on the wagon and the sides are quite low so could stay. The stakes can be eliminated without great difficulty. The main problem is that the solebars are too far apart and level with the sides. It might be easier to use the underframe from one of the other LWB vehicles and scratch build a body. Of course the wagon supplied by Hornby is fine for the jib as is. It is rather lacking in detail however (it was not one of the better Dublo wagons!). The real thing is here on Paul's invaluable site. http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/brdoublebolster * This could be tricky - the Dublo alloy is tough - and as the bolsters are hollow might leave holes in the floor. David Edited November 10, 2016 by Il Grifone Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldchap58 Posted November 11, 2016 Author Share Posted November 11, 2016 (edited) Never thought to ask are there any transfers available for cowans sheldon breakdown cranes will be painting mine black as red can be a bit of a nightmare to get to cover! Edited November 11, 2016 by oldchap58 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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