'New Colletts from Old'

[lofty1966]

By way of illustrating my last post I was inspired by one of Mikkels projects in which he produced a V5 GWR PBV using some old Tri-ang coaches.

By using a hand fret saw slowly and carefully down the side of the guards duckets I managed to produce a virtually seamless joint between the two halves, even when partially sprayed the seam is not really seen.

Ok, it's an ongoing project currently and I will strip and repaint the cream panels as I'm not satisfied with them, but overall I've found the use of the fret saw to be a good way to remove far less plastic during this process.

See what you think carp or otherwise? : ))

 

image.jpeg

Looks superb !

One of my near future projects !

[bgman]

Looks superb !

One of my near future projects !

Thanks lofty, it's a nice little project as a filler and probably a good use of the old Tri-ang coaches.

[Prometheus]

May I also ?

 

https://srmg.org.uk/a-passable-passenger-brake-van/

 

My slightly ersatz PBV.

 

Tony

[lofty1966]

May I also ?

 

https://srmg.org.uk/a-passable-passenger-brake-van/

 

My slightly ersatz PBV.

 

Tony

Excellent job!

[81C]

Restored from yesterday I had to dash.

 

Lofty how many coach bodies are you using on those 70 footers I went through Russells coach book and it was working out to about 3 on each one I admire your pluck doing these you have been a lot more bolder than I would.

The A18 looks nice a full 1st class wouldn't go amiss on my layout again was that a cut and shut with 2 composites or a single coach with plasicard fillets ? I've 2 of them left for chopping.  

 

Bob

[HowardGWR]

Great examples here on this thread, well done all.

 

I have done what I said earlier and have taken an old pre Railroad mustard yellow D95 body and have filed down the 'hump' on the side of the roof.  I enclose (hopefully) photos.  One is of the filed roof body next to an untreated E127 composite that I hope to deal with too.  The D95 filing was by way of an experiment and I would not have been too sad had it failed.  Hopefully, although under flash, the disappearance of the shadow caused by the hump can been seen.  Earlier photos in this thread perhaps demonstrate it better. 

 

 

 The next photo is of the roof, shewing how the paint that is left on demonstrates which parts I filed.  The transverse lines and blobs were the roof joins and vents respectively.

 

 

 

 

The third photo shews the two bodies end on and the better roof shape is hopefully clear.

 

 

I used a 6 inch long, half inch wide file, so no huge file needed in the end and the plastic filed easily.  It took about 2 hours, including making a roof jig.  This was an aluminium Comet roof three cm long offcut which I adapted by sawing off the side edges of the offcut so that the remaining ellipse of the roof could be used to judge whether I had filed sufficiently and whether I had achieved the correct shape, as I went along. What is the correct shape (in other words is the Comet roof correct)?.  I checked that by placing the jig onto a new Hornby Collett and it fitted like a glove.  Hopefully Hornby got it right this time, otherwise they needn't have bothered!!

 

I had bought the new Hornby Collett release, most types, by advance order, as I was one of those, probably like you, who had for many years voted for these coaches in the annual polls.  They are rather fine and i can get rid of the double lining easily.

 

I am pleased with the results and will now go on with the ones I intended, including that E127.  In fact I may use the poor old D95 anyway.  I just need to paint the upper half in proper cream and replace the button with a crest transfer.  My modelling period is November 10th 1933.  

Edited November 25, 2016 by HowardGWR

[HowardGWR]

I forgot to mention, in the previous post, that I see as main advantage that the end joining panels are retained.  My first attempt was sawing off the roof,as described by a colleague here, and replacing with a Comet one but I sawed off the 'joiners' first and that was not a good idea, I discovered.  I have ended up with the two thickish sides that do not marry up with the Comet ends that I was hoping to achieve.  Had I retained the body intact, minus roof, that job would have been much easier, as I hope to prove with this current project.  It's difficult to explain, but the pre-Railroad sides are thick and don't tumble enough, whereas the Comet white metal ends do.  Had I retained the body in one piece I could have used the Comet roof and Comet end kit, much more successfully, as our colleague did, see earlier.

 

I may post photos.  I see from my last email that I can achieve this feat  - phew!

Edited November 26, 2016 by HowardGWR

[lofty1966]

Restored from yesterday I had to dash.

 

Lofty how many coach bodies are you using on those 70 footers I went through Russells coach book and it was working out to about 3 on each one I admire your pluck doing these you have been a lot more bolder than I would.

The A18 looks nice a full 1st class wouldn't go amiss on my layout again was that a cut and shut with 2 composites or a single coach with plasicard fillets ? I've 2 of them left for chopping.

 

Bob

Three railroaders for each 70ft (though bits are scavenged from other leftovers.

Two for the A18 and again leftovers recycled.

Very little goes to waste.

I cut two 0.5mm plasticard strips about 1 cm wide off a sheet and glue these inside the coach sides just below the windows.

It helps keep everything in line.

Some windows are filled in with plasticard and filler(far more economic than chopping more coaches)

[81C]

Thanks Lofty, for a big pile of old coaches I would get 2 bitsers the A18 is a must but the 70 footers I will leave for the moment building them would certainly use up all the old coaches. 

[The Fatadder]

Here's my attempt at a H33

 

Comet sides on an old Hornby body, frogmore battery boxes, comet gas tanks and roof details. The ends were recessed into the body (xurons chopping method) and corridor connections replaced with comet parts. I did find that by the time I had bought all the extra parts I wasn'tt far off a complete comet coach, which is the route I would go down next time (though I think a 70ft H26, the H33, the centenary pair currently in the to do pile and an LMS 12 wheel is probably enough dining stock to make up any formations for the forseable. I do fancy adding a sunshine stock restaurant at some stage however..... the build of mine was covered here http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/tags/blog/H33/

 

The other modification I did to mine which improves some angles was drilling out the vents in the rectungular cowling in the centre of the roof. It wasn't too hard and give the impression of a separately fitted component.

 

 

Re the comet rooves mentioned earlier, I think I'm right in saying that he profile of both this and the mjt part are wrong for GWR coaches (being a LMS/BR and lner profile respectively, but the MJT is closer. There was a thread on the scalefour society's website recently (open to non members) which covered it in some detail. I have a feeling only Dave Geen offers a true GW roof profile (vac formed or resin cast), though the metal extrusions are good enough for Mose (me included)

[Coach bogie]

I've only seen (and had) one type of roof from David Geen - this is a thin plastic, vac-formed, roof that I wanted to try on a Worsley Works Railmotor body. It would benefit from some reinforcement.

The vac forms come in two thicknesses. When David made them thicker, requiring less formers (non at all on the ones I have used), there were those who prefered the thinner styrene. Cannot please everyone!

 

Impressive use of older Hornbys. Not adverse to a bit of cut and shut myself,

 

but personally I am not that brave to attempt that complex a cut and shut.  I went for the easy option and a eBay £10 BSL South Wales body and a £5.00 A18 Hammond sides on and old BSL Collett. Well done all.

Mike Wiltshire

[lofty1966]

Thanks Lofty, for a big pile of old coaches I would get 2 bitsers the A18 is a must but the 70 footers I will leave for the moment building them would certainly use up all the old coaches.

When I get home I'll try to get some pix to make things clearer.

[lofty1966]

 

 

I am not that brave to attempt that complex a cut and shut.

 

South Wales BSL.jpg

artic A18.jpg

Mike Wiltshire

You don't fancy this then ?

[lofty1966]

Pix as promised.

Bit of poor measuring so a sliver of plasticard had to be inserted

Three different donors (want not , waste not

Bits from everywhere thrown in !

Window partially filed in with plasticard to save splicing in another piece of yet another coach

Finally an experiment to see if two chassis' can be spliced securely

[lofty1966]

Nice job on your stock Mr Fatadder and Mr Coach Bogie !

Liking them a lot !

[HowardGWR]

Re the comet rooves mentioned earlier, I think I'm right in saying that he profile of both this and the mjt part are wrong for GWR coaches (being a LMS/BR and lner profile respectively, but the MJT is closer. There was a thread on the scalefour society's website recently (open to non members) which covered it in some detail. I have a feeling only Dave Geen offers a true GW roof profile (vac formed or resin cast), though the metal extrusions are good enough for Mose (me included)

Thanks Fatadder, I will look up that S4 article (I am a member so may contribute there, if it could be useful).  Did you miss my blow by blow account earlier where I took a Comet roof and used it as a template (I called it a jig) to reshape the faulty pre-Railroad roof?  I tried out the template on the new Hornby Collett roof and it fitted like a glove.  So I don't get this 'LMS' bit.  When I ordered some roofs from Comet, a while back, the catalogue only mentioned one roof product and I ordered that.  My order was along with various bits and pieces for altering pre-Railroad era Collett coaches and your quote has made me wonder if the late Mr Brewer had more than one roof version, depending on the order requirements.  I can't imagine this was so.   He only listed one anyway, here it is from the suspended web site.

C10 Alloy coach roof section-285mm

3.60

 

 

So I will chase up that S4 Soc article but meanwhile, it's result that counts for me.  As I wrote earlier, either Hornby have made an error again with the roofs (!!), or the business about Comet 'LMS roofs' is a modellers' myth.  :-)

[Horsetan]

You don't fancy this then ?.....

 

That is excellent! Reminds me of the way that DCKits designed their kit range - all in sections, so it was like shuffling cards to achieve the diagram number that you wanted.

[The Fatadder]

https://www.scalefour.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=4777 Is the thread on question, along with a drawing showing the different versions and prototype

[lofty1966]

Used up my last bits on this flat ender last night.

I have 6 more railroaders winging their way across the Atlantic including a restaurant to be converted with the spare I have already

 

Really using up the dregs now

 

Ran out of time (bed was calling)hence the gaps in the roof and the window top.

Edited November 24, 2016 by lofty1966

[Coach bogie]

You don't fancy this then ?

 

I did this instead from 2 x Airfix autos.

 

 

Mike Wiltshire

[HowardGWR]

I did this instead from 2 x Airfix autos.

 

a28 cut and shut.jpg

A28 RM Drive.jpg

A28 RM Guardy.jpg

 

Mike Wiltshire

Mike, very nice, but could you remember what you were seeking to correct and what you did please?

[St Enodoc]

Just found this topic and very impressed by everyone's work. To throw in another example, here is my H33, which some will have seen before elsewhere in the deep recesses of RMweb:

 

I started off with the intention of just fitting Comet sides to the Hornby body, but got rather carried away and the only Hornby bits left are the roof (funnily enough, given the bulk of the preceding discussion) and interior mouldings.

 

From memory, the rest is:

 

New PCB floor with scratchbuilt trussing using 1 x 1 brass angle.

Airfix/Dapol B Set bogies.

Gibson wheels.

DG couplings.

Mostly ABS underframe castings with a few Comet (yes, I know the gas cylinders should be longitudinal but didn't when I did the job - heads you win, tails I lose).

Comet ends, gangways and buffers.

Comet T/grab handles.

Precision paint (brushed, except the black which is a car spray) and Pressfix transfers, including the lining.

 

I chickened out of the door hinges altogether.

[Coach bogie]

Mike, very nice, but could you remember what you were seeking to correct and what you did please?

Not a correction. I wanted to convert the Airfix A30 into an A28. To get away from the Airfix look I went for the original windowed van end.

 

It entailed a major revamp of the under frame to reposition the bogie mounts for 7ft bogies. Also all the fittings were in different places. I made all the Autogear from plasticard and wire. It was really an exercise to see what could be done for little money from a pair of coaches that cost a fiver each. I bought them to put the Airfix 9ft bogies under South Wales stock. I had the Airfix B set bogies from a broken coach given free. Bodywise the only major challenge was the flush drivers door. I used one of the van doors from the discarded body.The rest was time. I based the coach on an image in GW Auto trailers part II by John Lewis.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[Prometheus]

Just found this topic and very impressed by everyone's work. To throw in another example, here is my H33, which some will have seen before elsewhere in the deep recesses of RMweb:

 

20050608 003 ex-GWR dia H33 RC W9578W.jpg

I started off with the intention of just fitting Comet sides to the Hornby body, but got rather carried away and the only Hornby bits left are the roof (funnily enough, given the bulk of the preceding discussion) and interior mouldings.

 

From memory, the rest is:

 

New PCB floor with scratchbuilt trussing using 1 x 1 brass angle.

Airfix/Dapol B Set bogies.

Gibson wheels.

DG couplings.

Mostly ABS underframe castings with a few Comet (yes, I know the gas cylinders should be longitudinal but didn't when I did the job - heads you win, tails I lose).

Comet ends, gangways and buffers.

Comet T/grab handles.

Precision paint (brushed, except the black which is a car spray) and Pressfix transfers, including the lining.

 

I chickened out of the door hinges altogether.

 

I'm truly delighted that you made a mistake with the gas cylinders. It makes me feel so much better as otherwise your coach is far superior to mine !

 

Tony

[lofty1966]

Not a correction. I wanted to convert the Airfix A30 into an A28. To get away from the Airfix look I went for the original windowed van end.

 

It entailed a major revamp of the under frame to reposition the bogie mounts for 7ft bogies. Also all the fittings were in different places. I made all the Autogear from plasticard and wire. It was really an exercise to see what could be done for little money from a pair of coaches that cost a fiver each. I bought them to put the Airfix 9ft bogies under South Wales stock. I had the Airfix B set bogies from a broken coach given free. Bodywise the only major challenge was the flush drivers door. I used one of the van doors from the discarded body.The rest was time. I based the coach on an image in GW Auto trailers part II by John Lewis.

 

Mike Wiltshire

If you pinch the 7ft Bogies off a Railroad Collett they sit in the right spot for the wheelbase. (The pivot pin is off centre on them ) making life easier !

(Edit) They dont pop straight in . You need to fettle the pivot hole a little. (Can't remember exactly what I had to do....been a while) but I have to chop up a chassis for the A27 which uses 7ft Colletts so a quick relearning curve awaits.

Edited November 25, 2016 by lofty1966