'New Colletts from Old'

[Coach bogie]

If you pinch the 7ft Bogies off a Railroad Collett they sit in the right spot for the wheelbase. (The pivot pin is off centre on them ) making life easier !

 Thanks for that. I had considered it but I did not have any in stock, at the time. It was an exercise to prove to a sceptic, what could be done for under £20, thus if you make a mess it doesn't matter. There was free beer resting on the outcome.

 

Mike wiltshire

[Edwardian]

Superb conversions.  I am a great fan of recycling and re-combining RTR and kit bits in inventive ways and the result here have been excellent.

 

I possibly won't do too much with the Bow-End coaches; long before the new Hornby Colletts were released, I already had probably more 57' BSLs than could be justified in the coaching mix, and, for 70' vehicles, again, more than enough South Wales types in the mix.  That is by way of an explanation, or justification, for not having a go myself!

 

Where I think I have gaps, or types are under represented, it's with the flat-ended stock of the early 1930s.  I could do with a handful, including at least a couple of E148 brake compos.   Has anyone attempted these, I wonder?

 

One thing I must try is the K40 conversion.   

[Horsetan]

.....Finally an experiment to see if two chassis' can be spliced securely

 

Apart from the small traces of white styrene, I can't actually see the joins in this one. Where are they? 

[lofty1966]

Apart from the small traces of white styrene, I can't actually see the joins in this one. Where are they?

The join is a fraction off the centre line.It is braced inside where the metal weight would sit.

Flat across the chassis and then two pieces vertically in the well.

The piece of white plasticard in the pic is to fill a gap in the footboard.

The poor old doner must of had a rough life as it had buffers and coupling hooks missing as well, but for three quid who's complaining ?

If anyone needs a stock of BR Mk1 bogies , I can probably go wholesale ;-)

Edited November 25, 2016 by lofty1966

[lofty1966]

One of my A28's

Not as detailed as Mr Coach Bogies

[Horsetan]

....The poor old doner ...

Kebabed, was it?

[lofty1966]

Kebabed, was it?

Probably.

[81C]

Superb conversions.  I am a great fan of recycling and re-combining RTR and kit bits in inventive ways and the result here have been excellent.

 

I possibly won't do too much with the Bow-End coaches; long before the new Hornby Colletts were released, I already had probably more 57' BSLs than could be justified in the coaching mix, and, for 70' vehicles, again, more than enough South Wales types in the mix.  That is by way of an explanation, or justification, for not having a go myself!

 

Where I think I have gaps, or types are under represented, it's with the flat-ended stock of the early 1930s.  I could do with a handful, including at least a couple of E148 brake compos.   Has anyone attempted these, I wonder?

 

One thing I must try is the K40 conversion.   

I've a E148 (L/H)on the go I'm sorting the roof out at the moment a brake third was used making it just 1 water tank to remove and replace the 2 new one's required made out off plasticard with Comet filler caps, the bogie will be Bachmann 9' and Comet buffers corridor connectors, handles and anything else that needs plonking on. an E127 (R/H) will follow.

 

 

You can use most of the original seat with a bit of hacking.

Edited November 25, 2016 by 81C

[lofty1966]

I've a E148 (L/H)on the go I'm sorting the roof out at the moment a brake third was used making it just 1 water tank to remove and replace the 2 new one's required made out off plasticard with Comet filler caps, the bogie will be Bachmann 9' and Comet buffers corridor connectors, handles and anything else that needs plonking on. an E127 (R/H) will follow.

 

WP_20161125_17_48_13_Pro.jpg

 

You can use most of the original seat with a bit of hacking.

What are the dimensions of the window apertures, please.....wondering if I can cut n'shut this from Railroad stock

On the 70ft Stock the window should be 21mm but Hornby's are 19mm resulting in some compromises along the body.

Edited November 27, 2016 by lofty1966

[81C]

What are the dimensions of the window apertures, please.....wondering if I can cut n'shut this from Railroad stock

On the 70ft Stock the window should be 21mm but Hornby's are 19mm resulting in some compromises along the body.

Your in luck they are 19mm, have fun.

[Prometheus]

Picked up at Warley yesterday [along with yet another K's 4-wheel coach !] was [were ?] a pair of E128 Corr. Bk. Comp. sides for a fiver. They'll need rolling for the tumble home but I think could be stuck on a Railroad Collett quite acceptably from a 'layout coach' point of view.

 

Am I correct in assuming that the 1st compartments would have had curtains but the 3rds. not ?

 

Tony

[lofty1966]

Your in luck they are 19mm, have fun.

My razor saw is being sharpened as we speak....

Just need my donor/victim to arrive.

[HowardGWR]

Just an interim update on my pre-Railroad 'improvements' project - at least I hope they will be so-judged eventually!

 

To recap, I have a still intact one with the roof hump smoothed out and checked for diameter.  I did look at that Scaleforum article and the diagrams were interesting.  However, my filed roof is the same shape as the new Collett model and the Comet one and that's good enough for me.  Incidentally, David Geen does not list roofs (rooves?) as separate items on his website.  Perhaps he sells them at shows..

 

The old Hornby black bow-end piece clips on to a built-in former, as seen in the photo of my earlier post.  I'll repeat the photo for convenience.

 

I do want to keep that former in place throughout the project, if I can, for strength.  The next thing I noticed about the body, is that the tumblehome does not tumble enough (see above photo).  Although not separately noted on official diagrams, the distance between the base of each side has clearly to be less than 9 ft.  If you take a vernier caliper and measure the distance between the two sides it is nearly 9ft.  In fact such tumble as was achieved by Hornby was by just thinning the sides at the bottom on the outside (see end-on in photo).  I have interpolated the required prototypical distance as 8 ft 6 in from the drawings.

 

To achieve that, the former needs to be attacked with a fine saw to create a gap.  The two sides need to be brought in about a millimetre each at the bottom.  This is what I did.

 

A bit wonky with the saw on one side, but it doesn't matter there!  I am using an adjustable spanner (G clamp could also be used) to bring in the sides at each end by 2 mm in total so as to achieve the 8 ft 6 in width.  Tissue paper will protect the sides frorm the clamp and araldite type glue will be used to ensure a firm bond.

 

I'll write again  when (if) this is achieved.

 

Edit:  That last wheeze (with G clamp) did not work but I had another cunning plan so see next posting.

Edited November 28, 2016 by HowardGWR

[Horsetan]

... David Geen does not list roofs (rooves?) as separate items on his website. Perhaps he sells them at shows.....

Forget the website; that's old. I've never seen them on his paper list either, but he does have them available at shows. Here's the one I obtained for the Railmotor:

 

 

It's a slightly odd vac forming, showing a transverse ridge about two-thirds of the way along, suggesting that the mould may be in two parts, and one end (the one nearest the camera lens) is definitely not symmetrical.

Edited November 28, 2016 by Horsetan

[81C]

Another post gone AWOL    F IT

 

2nd attempt -------- I'm replacing the roof tanks on several coaches does anyone know what thickness Plasticard would be good to do the job.  

[HowardGWR]

Another post gone AWOL    F IT

 

2nd attempt -------- I'm replacing the roof tanks on several coaches does anyone know what thickness Plasticard would be good to do the job.  

I know this is heresy (modelling the model) but perhaps just look at the new Hornby and copy that (also for position).  The new Hornby has loads of 'rivets' going around the sides.

Edited November 28, 2016 by HowardGWR

[HowardGWR]

Forget the website; that's old. I've never seen them on his paper list either, but he does have them available at shows. Here's the one I obtained for the Railmotor:

 

image.jpg

 

It's a slightly odd vac forming, showing a transverse ridge about two-thirds of the way along, suggesting that the mould may be in two parts, and one end (the one nearest the camera lens) is definitely not symmetrical.

From the photo background we could conclude, erroneously, that you are an armchair modeller, Horsetan! :-)

I know different of course.

 

I presume these roofs are for 70 footers (that's what David does).  I know he will have nothing to do with computers, but I think his wife tells him what emails he has had, so one could ask for a quote that way.  I think the ellipse shape is the same for Churchward top lights, as for Colletts.  Is that correct?  

[Coach bogie]

From the photo background we could conclude, erroneously, that you are an armchair modeller, Horsetan! :-)

I know different of course.

 

I presume these roofs are for 70 footers (that's what David does).  I know he will have nothing to do with computers, but I think his wife tells him what emails he has had, so one could ask for a quote that way.  I think the ellipse shape is the same for Churchward top lights, as for Colletts.  Is that correct?  

There are two different roof sections provided in Vac form from David. In addition there are the resin roof sections. David is not available for the next week or so. What do you want to know and I will endeavor to answer?

 

Mike Wiltshire

[K14]

Am I correct in assuming that the 1st compartments would have had curtains but the 3rds. not ?

 

Tony

 

In an E.128, both classes would have had roller blinds on the quarter- & droplights. Curtains don't come in until the large windowed 'sunshine' Colletts.

When they're rolled up, they're all but invisible from the outside. The bottom edge of the leather edging **might** just show, so unless you want to model one or two in the down position, you're pretty safe to skip them altogether.

 

A brief history of GWR blinds:—

 

1926 to c.1934:— Woven brown cloth with GWR entwined monogramme in cream

c.1934 to c.1938:— Woven brown cloth with Roundel in cream

c.1938 to scrapping:— Coloured Rexine with embossed Roundel (later with B.R. in an oval). I've seen blue, brown, green & red Rexine blinds, so I suspect that they were colour-coordinated with the upholstery.

 

Blue & Red would fit with the 1st Class 'fruitbowl' patterns, green with 3rd Class 'shell', & brown with either 1st Class dark brown or 3rd Class 'fan'. Post-war red & blue in all depending on smoking or non-smoking & in the BR maroon era red for 3rds & blue for 1sts. Where curtains were fitted, pretty sure they followed the same principles.

Quite a lot never got changed. In later Collets (& Hawksworths) the blinds are hidden under panels & mean taking the world apart to get at them.

 

Pete S.

C&W Dept.,

GWS Didcot.

[Horsetan]

.....I know different of course.

My best work has been spread over many fields.

 

I presume these roofs are for 70 footers (that's what David does). ...

Yes, that is the primary purpose.

 

......  I think the ellipse shape is the same for Churchward top lights, as for Colletts.  Is that correct?

I haven't compared the two. I have enough trouble trying to catch up with the engines, never mind the rolling stock!

[HowardGWR]

 

In an E.128, both classes would have had roller blinds on the quarter- & droplights. Curtains don't come in until the large windowed 'sunshine' Colletts.

When they're rolled up, they're all but invisible from the outside. The bottom edge of the leather edging **might** just show, so unless you want to model one or two in the down position, you're pretty safe to skip them altogether.

 .............................

 

Pete S.

C&W Dept.,

GWS Didcot.

Great reply Pete.  What state is the C54 in, can you tell us?  I know Hornby measured it, but when I (with permission) tried to inspect it, it was so gloomy in the stock shed, even with the lights on, I got precious little out of it.  I could not get up into the coaches either. 

 

To be honest, I really wanted to view the Dreadnought C24 third, but I had the same problem.  I am just glad these priceless coaches are under cover though.

 

If one of us wanted a certain dimension, would you be prepared to measure it for us please?  I have estimated the tumbled home width at the base of the body panels on the C54 as (about) 8ft 6in or a bit less .  Any chance two of you could stretch a tape measure over it please?  There's a small £10 donation to the carriage fund possible, as gratitude.  I really wish there was a specific fund for either of the two above coach projects (C54 and C24).     

[K14]

Great reply Pete.  What state is the C54 in, can you tell us?  I know Hornby measured it, but when I (with permission) tried to inspect it, it was so gloomy in the stock shed, even with the lights on, I got precious little out of it.  I could not get up into the coaches either.

 

Had to look that up on the VCT's site (I know them by number more than by diagram).

5085 is in **relatively** good condition considering. That said it has a bulge in the corridor side caused by a cracked door pillar, a worrying rotten patch in the corridor & the state of the cant rail is unknown (Collett got the gutters seriously wrong on all his coach designs until the introduction of the large-window stock). Internally it's quite complete - most partitions are still in & there's a fair amount of interior trim despite the compartments being pretty gutted. It's a viable, but long-term restoration.

 

Keep an eye on the SVRA website - they're forging ahead with E.132 6045 at the moment:— http://www.gw-svr-a.org.uk/6045.html

 

To be honest, I really wanted to view the Dreadnought C24 third, but I had the same problem.  I am just glad these priceless coaches are under cover though.

 

Suggest you book on Castle's next RMWeb Didcot tour... such things could well be arranged (provided we can find the step ladder), otherwise it's pot luck that someone's around who's sufficiently un-busy to accommodate.

 

If one of us wanted a certain dimension, would you be prepared to measure it for us please?  I have estimated the tumbled home width at the base of the body panels on the C54 as (about) 8ft 6in or a bit less .  Any chance two of you could stretch a tape measure over it please?  There's a small £10 donation to the carriage fund possible, as gratitude.  I really wish there was a specific fund for either of the two above coach projects (C54 and C24).

 

In theory yes, but in practice probably not. I'm hoping to pop down later this week, but all my attention will be on applying a pair of gold leaf roundels to 1289 (condensation permitting), finishing off a batch of destination boards for the trailers & maybe doing some colouring-in on Shannon. After that I'll most likely be on winter recess until Feb/March next year – 15 feet of ash on top of a swamp is no fun at all in winter.

 

However... According to drawing 77747 of Feb 1926, a K.38 is:—

 

8' 6" over the bottom edge of the body panels,

9' 0" over the waist (and also stepboards),

9' 5-3/4" over handles, and

8' 11-1/4" over cornice (gutter) plates.

 

Those dimensions are repeated in 75495 (E.129 - 3/1925) and 81080 (E.127 7/1926), so I'd take them as being standard for the regular main-line BEs of the period. Cornish Riviera stock is rather different.

 

The only specific C&W funds are for the Super Saloons (9113 at present, then 2118, & 9112 last of all as it's the most complicated) & the Victorian Coach Project (290 & 975). I can see 3299 having a fund one day, but it won't be any time soon.

 

P.

Edited November 29, 2016 by K14

[81C]

I know this is heresy (modelling the model) but perhaps just look at the new Hornby and copy that (also for position).  The new Hornby has loads of 'rivets' going around the sides.

I have my doubts about the accuracy of Hornby's coaches the shell vents are too small so I left wondering if the roof detail is totally correct and I have not purchase

 any water tanks but I am in possession of a Comet roof plan for positioning items hence the request. 

[Siberian Snooper]

With regard to Collet coach gutters, Wally Watson, late of this parish was on the coach restoration gang at the embrionic DVR and they used to use fibreglass in the gutters. The mat was cut so as to be invisible from platform levels and from further away is undetectable unless a long lens is used.

[HowardGWR]

I have my doubts about the accuracy of Hornby's coaches the shell vents are too small so I left wondering if the roof detail is totally correct and I have not purchase

 any water tanks but I am in possession of a Comet roof plan for positioning items hence the request. 

Interesting (about the shell vents).  Have you made measurements and what was the difference?  From sideways, they perhaps don't look fat enough.  From overhead they look OK though.   I wonder if they were painted a typical browny colour (Hornby has them all white) whether that could make a difference? 

 

It's a funny thing with models.  Sometimes an exact model looks wrong, especially to we older types.  It seems that in the past, we all got used to podgy white metal parts, (vents could be an example) and thus judge these matters differently.