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Hornby Princess Coronation Class (Duchess)


Dick Turpin
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The smokebox number plate and nameplate from City of Coventry is on the wall in the stairwell of Coventry station, along with a colour photograph of the loco.

 

It's been there as long as I remember, perhaps put up when the loco was scrapped as the station was brand new then.

 

If you're visiting, it's the stairs between platforms two and three.

 

Coventry station is due to be rebuilt, sadly so in my view as the station is iconic of its time.

 

I hope the loco plates reappear in the new station when it finally sees completion.

 

All the best,

 

Keith

Not quite. The current station was built between 1959 and 1962 whereas the locomotive was withdrawn from service in 1964 and scrapped in 1965 after a failed attempt by the local newspaper to raise enough funds to save it.

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I'm excited too, and very much looking forward to these locos. I'm not a penny pincher and am very much of the mindset to support our model shops.

Just wondered why you would order direct from Hornby at £189.99, whereas for instance, the price from Rails of Sheffield is £149.50, that's £40 cheaper.?

Bob

Maybe because the price won't go up. And may even come down, but I wouldn't hold my breath. And you get it before the shops! But I ordered mine form Hornby so I can use PayPal. So it's payed for already as the money is in a specific account just for PayPal. Just need the train now! Looking forward to XMass

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Maybe because the price won't go up. And may even come down, but I wouldn't hold my breath. And you get it before the shops! But I ordered mine form Hornby so I can use PayPal. So it's payed for already as the money is in a specific account just for PayPal. Just need the train now! Looking forward to XMass

I've never known Hornby to increase their price on a pre-order, however they recently revised their T and Cs and appear to no longer guarantee the RRP advertised.

I think it is a case of watch this space.

Edited by Black 5 Bear
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  • 3 weeks later...

Ref. the term Semi--it was the word used for the Coronation class by all (or nearly all) trainspotters in the Stafford/Norton Bridge/ Crewe area when I was in attendance 1954-1959.

On a quite different note--although I am a great admirer of the splendid proportions of these rather magnificent locos. I am not fully au fait with all the detail differences between class members---but if you look on the Hornby web site covering the latest livery pictures of the initial 3 releases you will see Atholl with a SINGLE chimney---I cannot find any evidence to support this--is this in fact so ?-----and is this a clue as to what might next be on the development line---as far as I know Princess Royal class had the single version.

Interesting?

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The class, up to and including (4)6234 were built with single chimneys. So, (4)6220 to (4)6229 were originally streamlined with single chimney, and (4)6230 to (4)6234 were originally non-streamlined with single chimney. Those engines were fitted with double chimneys between 1939 and 1944.

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I wonder if there is any description somewhere of the evolutive changes to Hornby's previous Duchess model.

 

Looking at this link, it has a 2003 model vs a 2011 one. http://www.modelrailforum.com/forums/index.php?autocom=custom&page=Hornby-BR-Duchess-Class

 

The 2003 version seems to share elements with the former tender drive version. I can see from the photos chassis elements and even the tender body dates from the tender drive one, even though the loco body is clearly new.

 

Indeed looking at a 2011 version which I own and comparing with tender drive City of Liverpoool, whilst there does not appear to be any tooled part between them, none the less the way the body fixes to the chassis is the same points.

 

I conclude that while the last batches of Hornby's previous Duchess shares not part with the tender drive one, none the less those from the first loco drive ones in 2003 do.

 

Will the new Duchess use the current tender that is entirely retooled or a new tooling I wonder...

Edited by JSpencer
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New tooling for the tenders, they are tooling 6 versions, bascially all variants. That was confirmed for me by emails with the Hornby development team.

 

In regards to the old tooling, the bodies, loco and tender, have been the same since 2003, in 2008 or so, Hornby made the trailing truck "fixed" like the A4. I have no idea when they put the decoder in the tender, but they changed the tender to loco drawbar when that happened as well, that must have been after 2010. But the body toolings for the loco drive models are all the same and were basically all new from 2003 onwards.

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  • 2 weeks later...

After reading the Hornby mag write up on the forthcoming models, it says that the semi streamlined sloping smokebox can now be modelled.

Of the first 3 models promised, only City of Brum was built as a streamliner. Is this model coming with a sloping front, or is that version for a later release.?

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After reading the Hornby mag write up on the forthcoming models, it says that the semi streamlined sloping smokebox can now be modelled.

Of the first 3 models promised, only City of Brum was built as a streamliner. Is this model coming with a sloping front, or is that version for a later release.?

Don't know what Hornby Mag is on about, Hornby have had the sloping smokebox for years on the 2003 onwards livery, hell they released City of Liverpool with one either last year or the year before.

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Don't know what Hornby Mag is on about, Hornby have had the sloping smokebox for years on the 2003 onwards livery, hell they released City of Liverpool with one either last year or the year before.

My Princess Alice in LMS black has a sloping smokebox.  It came that way as, I think, City of Manchester, before I renamed it.

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Looking at the livery drawing and photo of the real loco on the Hornby site, it looks like City of Birmingham is being modelled in it's non-sloped front form.

https://www.Hornby.com/uk-en/shop/locomotives/locomotives-by-class/princess-coronation-class/br-4-6-2-city-of-birmingham-princess-coronation-class-modified-with-tts-sound-1.html

Alex

Yes well it would be.I believe the Hornby team paid a visit to Think Tank in Birmingham for the scan etc.not long ago.46235 is and has been for many years a static resident there and before that at the Museum of Science and Industry just up the road.She is in "as withdrawn" condition in the city that gave her name.All of the class eventually received the circular smokebox front.
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Don't know what Hornby Mag is on about, Hornby have had the sloping smokebox for years on the 2003 onwards livery, hell they released City of Liverpool with one either last year or the year before.

With respect I don't believe the journal in question is always entirety accurate .

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Yes well it would be.I believe the Hornby team paid a visit to Think Tank in Birmingham for the scan etc.not long ago.46235 is and has been for many years a static resident there and before that at the Museum of Science and Industry just up the road.She is in "as withdrawn" condition in the city that gave her name.All of the class eventually received the circular smokebox front.

 

Not strictly true. It used to move up and down it's track at one point.

 

 

 

Jason

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As an aside, I was in Birmingham a couple of weeks ago and planned on popping in to Think Tank to have a quick look at 46235 as I had bit of time to waste.

 

Not at that price I wasn't. No problem about paying for things, But £13? Blimey.

 

 

Maybe I would pay that if I was going to be there all day. But not for a flying visit. I went to the pub instead.

 

 

 

Jason

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As an aside, I was in Birmingham a couple of weeks ago and planned on popping in to Think Tank to have a quick look at 46235 as I had bit of time to waste.

 

Not at that price I wasn't. No problem about paying for things, But £13? Blimey.

 

 

Maybe I would pay that if I was going to be there all day. But not for a flying visit. I went to the pub instead.

 

 

 

Jason

 

I'm afraid that is a sign of the times.It is a building that houses a large number of priceless transport treasures apart from which it is an excellent interactive learning facility for all ages.Another factor which you maybe unaware of is that Birmingham City Council is in severe financial difficulty for a variety of reasons many (but not all) of them self inflicted. The newly opened and rather wonderful Library Of Birmingham has had its opening hours drastically cut annd many of its staff have faced either cuts in working hours or redundancy. A couple of reasons why you are faced with an entry fee which you find unacceptable. If we want such facilities we must face the cost of them.Sorry but there it is and it won't get any better any time soon.

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Perhaps before being over critical of Hornby magazine, it may be worth looking at their articles, as it may be that it is a mis understanding of what they have written. In the Jan 2017 edition they covered the Warley announcements incl the Stanier Coronation. These are the quotes about the models offered.

 

'and the model is planned for release in the third quarter of the new year and will allow Hornby to model all of the class after removal of the streamlined casing including the final two delivered under Ivatt'

 

and from a quote ascribed to Hornby researcher Paul Isles 'The Duchess has always been a Hornby locomotive, but previously we haven't had the tooling to do the last two and that is what has driven the choice. This is completely new tooling from the ground up and the old tooling has been withdrawn'

 

Further Hornby mag relevant comment in the same piece ' The new tooling caters for all variations without streamlined casing, including 'semi' streamlined locomotives with the original slope fronted smokebox, with and without smoke deflectors, Ivatt locomotives and more'

 

So my reading of the article is that.

 

1. The model will be all new tooling.

 

2. The tooling will be able to produce all versions of the non streamlined locomotives including the de-streamlined 'semis' and Ivatt versions

 

3. For the first time the Ivatt versions will be able to be produced.

 

For me its clear that they were covering what was being built into the new tooling for model options and the only version that they specifically state as being produced for the first time is the Ivatt version, which is correct.

 

They also covered this again in abbreviated format in the March 2017, covering the arrival of the first model sample, stating 'The new Duchess tooling will allow Hornby to cover the final two Ivatt Duchess class locomotives as well as the Stanier production locomotives in conventional form'. Which I've read as the tooling will be able to produce all non streamlined versions.

 

Hope this clarifies, if there is other Hornby mag material that I haven't seen, can someone enlighten.

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Not strictly true. It used to move up and down it's track at one point.

 

 

 

Jason

Yes it did indeed. It was moved by rams, I believe. The display has been rather mocked but I found it a tremendous experience to be so close to a huge, moving steam loco even if it did only move a few feet and not under its own power.

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I'm afraid that is a sign of the times.It is a building that houses a large number of priceless transport treasures apart from which it is an excellent interactive learning facility for all ages.Another factor which you maybe unaware of is that Birmingham City Council is in severe financial difficulty for a variety of reasons many (but not all) of them self inflicted. The newly opened and rather wonderful Library Of Birmingham has had its opening hours drastically cut annd many of its staff have faced either cuts in working hours or redundancy. A couple of reasons why you are faced with an entry fee which you find unacceptable. If we want such facilities we must face the cost of them.Sorry but there it is and it won't get any better any time soon.

All the more reason to take the cash and release 46235 for restoration to mainline condition!

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