60009 Union of South Africa & 61994 The Great Marquess

[keefer]

personally, I wouldn't trust the cooncil to hit a cow's @rse wi' a banjo.

 

 

firstly we had the high streets suffering from edge-of-town retail parks; then when said high streets are dying a death, zero action to actually help the situation. it seems to be an overriding attitude of, not even 'we know best' but 'we're in charge and even if we make an almighty cock-up, we'll press ahead anyway.' and then divert attention with 'new shiny things'.

 

 

And yet they have consistently managed to find money for 'vanity' improvement projects

e.g. in Kirkcaldy the high street has had lovely Italian stone slabs/paving installed (twice on one section because it was breaking), over-schedule blockades of the east and west ends due to delays in sourcing the materials (with resultant loss of trade to the niche/individual traders in those areas).

 

replacement of a free-flowing 2-lane roundabout at wemyssfield with single-lane 4-way traffic lights, so that they could lay over-wide pavements in the area for the benefit of the unseen thousands of pedestrians making their way between the high street and the railway station/museum

 

 

building a smaller leisure centre on the site of one of the busiest town centre car parks, meaning the bigger, but redundant swimming pool complex stood derelict for ages before being demolished - earmarked for a wonderful cinema/leisure complex that so far, no cinema chains have expressed an interest.

 

 

the latest wonder-project (in conjunction with the local self-promotion body) is to give us a swanky new promenade boulevard which will involve making the roadway single-carriageway so there's plenty of room for pavements and leisure facilities.

 

I've actually heard of local councillors saying the traditional high street is dead, we just need to think of new, exciting things to put in its place.

 

The sad thing is, Cameron has this development for his own land and it's not just about 'the trains' - it's about the farm too and getting visitors interested in how it works and provides the produce for the consumer. in these days of more awareness, it's to be applauded and I think a lot of people would welcome the chance to see how a farm works.

I just wonder if this is really about the plans taking up valuable agricultural land, or whether there are too many posh nobs in the area who don't want too many tourists cluttering up their picturesque towns?

[pete_mcfarlane]

Whats wrong with that ?

That musuem looks very good.

The exhibits are good, but the museum itself is awful. Here's the thread where everyone rants about it: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/130977-glasgow-transport-museumriverside/?hl=%2Briverside+%2Bmuseum+%2Bglasgow

[scottishlocos]

All

 

Some of Fife Councils planning has been crazy and short sighted they built a new school that was full before it even opened then had to built a costly extension a year or two later.

 

They have approved thousands of new houses without putting in any real facilities.

 

Where they do put said facilities for said housing a new link road plan is cutting through a significant section of a well used country park breaking almost every planning guidelines in the book

[bobthesod4479]

Jason

 

you said earlier

 

Now they are being put in a shed which is not weatherproof and not open to the public. Apparently an enthusiast even paid for the repaint of Waddon and looked after it as it was stored outside for years in terrible Canadian winters.

 

Where did you get this complete load of tosh from?

[adb968008]

The exhibits are good, but the museum itself is awful. Here's the thread where everyone rants about it: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/130977-glasgow-transport-museumriverside/?hl=%2Briverside+%2Bmuseum+%2Bglasgow

8326 reviews on trip advisor with

 

67% rating at Excellant (5579)

24% at very good... (1998)

Against 1% that say its terrible.. just 87 people, who seem to be making noise.

 

Its 2019, museums arent just about rusty steam sheds full of bird guano.

Edited October 18, 2018 by adb968008

[TomJ]

edit - post removed as the post I was replying to no longer exists.

Edited October 18, 2018 by TomJ

[sir douglas]

This was a museum in Poland..until the owner ran out of money and slowly sold it for scrap, including national collection locos and some unique last survivors.

https://krzeszowiceone.pl/archive/2006/12/16/skansen-w-krzeszowicach.html

 

 

i'm gob smackingly shocked at that

[adb968008]

On 18/10/2018 at 16:13, sir douglas said:

i'm gob smackingly shocked at that

sadly its not unique to Poland, South African steam has faced similar.

From memory there were approx 20 locos there, which initially looked promising as a station musuem. But with limited income, debts built up, then security went, which lead to locals helping themselves, in somecase big chunks cut out, one unique National collection loco steamed itself in, left ultimately as a set of wheels remaining. Eventually PKP’s real estate team closed in, sold 3 more off for scrap to service the debts, then took 3 to PKPs Krakow shed (not quite sure why pleszow has a fleet of steam locos but they are still there today plus these 3), and assigned 8 to other musuems (Chabowka and Pyskowice).

I find this image sad... one being rescued, but for the other, this was all that was left, and that was before the scrap man arrived...it was once “tkh 5” a prussian t3 of 1885, unique and one of the oldest locos in Poland and arrived at the museum intact.

http://tozk.pl/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/318.jpg

 

Preservation has failed in the UK too, I rushed to Cosford a few years ago to capture these before they were lost..

 

 

 

sadly I was too late for this one..

 

 

It's not worth the rights and wrongs of failure, when it happens it happens. The best thing is to learn for it in the future.

the UK hobby has done exceptionally well to bring everything it has to preserved lines (from Butlins to 30053 from the US no other country has the amount of steam we do).. but with it comes an eventual burden shared by less but at least we have the knowledge and passion to plan for it, even if that means in the future it's not the 100% in steam on a preserved line or mainline as we would like.

Edited May 9, 2021 by adb968008

[number6]

i'm gob smackingly shocked at that

 

By the way, soaking the eyes of the lovers that to save other steam engines you need to sweat one or two copies.

 

Shocking [and the quality of Google Translate].

[EddieB]

This was a museum in Poland..until the owner ran out of money and slowly sold it for scrap, including national collection locos and some unique last survivors.

https://krzeszowiceone.pl/archive/2006/12/16/skansen-w-krzeszowicach.html

It was on my "to do" list, but I never made it to Krzeszowice.  For the record, here's a summary of its former collection, and their disposal/fate.

 

Ex-PKP locos

 

Ol49-15 - to Pyskowice

Pt47-101 - to Kraków Plaszow

TKt48-185 - to Chrzanów

TKw2-57 - to Kraków Plaszow

Ty42-85 - to Pyskowice

Ty42-118 - to Chrzanów

Ty43-1 - to Pyskowice

Ty45-158 - to Pyskowice

Ty45-345 - missing, presumed scrapped

Ty51-117 - missing, presumed scrapped

 

TKh100-5 - dismantled, remains to Chabowka (T3 type)

 

Industrials

 

TKp-2261 - to Pyskowice

TKp-3407 - missing, presumed scrapped

TKp-5905 - missing, presumed scrapped

TKp-26188 - to Kraków Plaszow

TKbb-2747 - to Chabowka

 

With the exception of TKh100-5, it seems quite a large part of the former collection was retrieved to other locations, and those that were dismantled for scrap are duplicated elsewhere in preservation.  While it is regrettable that any "preserved" locomotives have been scrapped, the situation is nowhere near as dire as that at the Chamdor site in South Africa.

[adb968008]

It was on my "to do" list, but I never made it to Krzeszowice. For the record, here's a summary of its former collection, and their disposal/fate.

 

Thanks for the list, i was looking for this earlier, i saw these three times, in 2002,2005 & 2007, certainly it looked no different to many other sad sites in Poland.. lines (or sometimes just a couple) of odd locos stored randomly around the country.

 

I was once offered an ol49 in Lublin for £4000 ! When I followed through, they refused to sell it to a foreigner, and subsequently they actually paid a scrap man to take it away instead, around this time period.

 

At least now some of the point the locos are getting tlc they need, the tkt at Tarnow, 52 at Katowice and ol49 at Rzeszow look much better than they used to, but there’s many more still in need.

Edited October 18, 2018 by adb968008

[eldomtom2]

For that reason alone i hope the A4 in Canada stays in Canada, its safe and allows resources here to focus on others.

The problem is that the CRM are having to make decisions on what they have the resources to maintain and what to give to others who hopefully can take better care of them, and 4498 and Waddon are going to be at the top of the "give-away list" considering their irrelevance to Canada (though 4489 might be considered to draw in the punters enough to worth keeping).

 

Just this month we have seen two tributes to major influencers of steam passing, Alan Peglers farewell last week, Dennis Howells is this weekend, whilst on monday this week Nigel Dobbing passed away, arguably Britains strongest overseas commercial voice for world steam and owner of the UKs largest Steam railtour charter company... with each voice lost, the influence of the hobby shrinks... will we see 200+ RTC tours in 2019 with its bias towards the few remaining preserved steam operators, or will his passing see more commercial steam from WCR making it even harder for those preserved groups to find work ?

 

This is just a repeat of the old "not enough young volunteers" debate, and like it I think it is perhaps overly cyncial. Steam locos still have a large appeal to many who don't remember steam working in commercial service (and that's pretty much everyone under 55), it's heritage diesels that are more at risk of people not being interested in them.

 

While it is regrettable that any "preserved" locomotives have been scrapped, the situation is nowhere near as dire as that at the Chamdor site in South Africa.

Regarding SANRASM, perhaps any efforts on getting back 4489 should instead be focusing on repatriating the last surviving British 3 ft 6 in gauge steam loco from Eskom? (Admittedly that's local bias )

 

Edit: corrected numbers

Edited October 19, 2018 by eldomtom2

[bobthesod4479]

4498?

 

Are they moving that to Canada,?

 

OR are they thinking of moving 4489 FROM Canada

 

 

C;mon lads get the numbers correct at least please

[Tomsontour]

60009 Union of South Africa Sunset by Matt Toms, on Flickr

 

Sometimes it all just comes together 60009 in full flight, whatever happens to the old girl, thank you for the memories and thank you Mr Cameron for making them possible