Bachmann Midland 1P 0-4-4T

[MonsalDan]

If that's true about traction tyres then I'm very disappointed.

[Allegheny1600]

Traction tyres, how else can you expect such a small loco even with a metal body, to haul anything like a realistic train behind it?

All traction tyres are not created equal, some I have are quite old now and still in great condition - other, I admit, fall to pieces on a regular basis.

[Steamport Southport]

2 minutes ago, Allegheny1600 said:

Traction tyres, how else can you expect such a small loco even with a metal body, to haul anything like a realistic train behind it?

All traction tyres are not created equal, some I have are quite old now and still in great condition - other, I admit, fall to pieces on a regular basis.

 

 

It's a 1P. It's not going to be pulling the Midday Scot over Shap....

 

 

 

Jason

[Compound2632]

40 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

 

It's a 1P. It's not going to be pulling the Midday Scot over Shap....

 

 

 

Jason

 

But it ought to be able to handle six Ratio suburbans or four Hornby ones round 2nd radius curves.

[Steamport Southport]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

But it ought to be able to handle six Ratio suburbans or four Hornby ones round 2nd radius curves.

 

And what would be stopping it?

 

Traction tyres really shouldn't be necessary.

 

 

 

 

Jason

[daltonparva]

They also deposit crap on the tracks which quickly affects DCC running.

 

[MikeParkin65]

Does the Kernow 02 have traction tyres?

[Ben Alder]

42 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Does the Kernow 02 have traction tyres?

No.

 

[Market65]

The Hornby H and M7 have not got tyres either. I wonder why the Midland 1P has been fitted with them, when these other 0-4-4T’s have not been? I guess we’ll find out in due course.

 

Rob.

[PenrithBeacon]

The H and M7 are larger engines, so I would imagine that it's been possible to get a better balance over the drivers on these.

Cheers

[Compound2632]

Has there been any photo of the motor set-up?

[adb968008]

On 12/12/2019 at 23:45, MikeParkin65 said:

Does the Kernow 02 have traction tyres?

It doesn’t pull very much either.

[Market65]

The Kernow 02 I have really struggles to push and pull the two carriage Gate Stock. 
 

Rob.

[NHY 581]

Traction tyres or not, I will be buying more than one of these. Those who have an issue with them are welcome to kit build their own, do without or simply be quiet.

 

It's even being suggested that we cannot get spares for a model yet to be produced..........what!

 

 

I have no intention of forgoing a model of a locomotive I have been after for many years. 

 

This is a lovely, very well detailed model of a delightful prototype. Anyone who has a few examples know full well that Bachmann absolutely nail Midland locomotives, in much the same way as Hornby do a proper job on Ex-L&SWR locos. 

 

It's almost as if people are pleased to finally find something they can take issue with and make a noise about.

 

 

What next, wrong shade of black?  

 

C'mon people........

 

 

Rob 

 

 

[adb968008]

Schools and T9 happily have tyres, and spares.

 

i was not really interested in this loco until I saw the sample at Warley, now i’m Really interested in a MR Maroon one, I think an S&D version will be quite attractive too.

 

That it has tyres is actually a plus for me... I have a real trainset, with tough curves, uneven track & multiple gradients, .. so being able to use it is a benefit.

Edited December 14, 2019 by adb968008

[trevor7598]

7 hours ago, Market65 said:

The Kernow 02 I have really struggles to push and pull the two carriage Gate Stock. 
 

Rob.

Exactly the same as my 02, but it's more down to a gutless motor, than lack of traction with my example.

 

[No Decorum]

2 hours ago, trevor7598 said:

Exactly the same as my 02, but it's more down to a gutless motor, than lack of traction with my example.

 

Not to mention a weird transmission. Connecting rods flailing around at odd angles are far more noticeable than traction tyres.

[Compound2632]

4 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Those who have an issue with them are welcome to kit build their own, do without or simply be quiet.

 

... or improve the RTR offering themselves.

 

Actually, I disagree strongly with your third point: there is always a place for a critical appreciation of a model; if there is something that is wrong, it is right that attention should be drawn to it. Bad models are made when knowledgeable men to keep silence.

 

4 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

 

This is a lovely, very well detailed model of a delightful prototype. Anyone who has a few examples know full well that Bachmann absolutely nail Midland locomotives, in much the same way as Hornby do a proper job on Ex-L&SWR locos. 

 

 

Bachmann have done as well as the compromises of RTR permit with several models of ex-Midland locomotives in LMS and BR condition. They have issued the 3F and 4F (but not the  Compound*) in Midland livery; have they in fact made other changes to ensure that these represent Midland condition? This is the first time they have had a Midland-condition variant among the first issue of a model.

 

*The NRM Exclusive, of which I am a happy owner, represents No. 1000 in 1950s onwards preserved condition.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Compound2632

[trevor7598]

30 minutes ago, No Decorum said:

Not to mention a weird transmission. Connecting rods flailing around at odd angles are far more noticeable than traction tyres.

Probably better to have traction tyres on a model with a good chassis, than without on a dodgy DJM one.

I have avoided all of his models since, and quite rightly going by feedback from some of the other

commissions he was involved in.

I wish Bachmann well with the Midland tank.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

4 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Traction tyres or not, I will be buying more than one of these. Those who have an issue with them are welcome to kit build their own, do without or simply be quiet...

 

It's almost as if people are pleased to finally find something they can take issue with and make a noise about...

The traction tyre is an undesireable 'feature' in my book, and it was a happy day when it generally disappeared from RTR OO: Bachmann being the manufacturer who took the lead in this in the UK market. (I may be wrong, but I believe this is the first use of traction tyres on a newly tooled Bachmann OO product, after near 30 years of metal driven wheels.

 

The major strike against the traction tyre is that it prevents pick up from a powered wheelset, the very wheels on which pick up is most effective. If a good formulation of polymer has been used - as common in current HO - then at least we may hope that the crap creating propensity of cheapo past RTR OO traction tyre practise has been eliminated.

 

(Personally, if this was a vital model for me, I'd go for a replacement metal wheelset to eliminate the unwanted rubber.)

 

Now, a wake up call. Despite being a drysider, I have a Hornby M7, bought economically in the long ago as project fodder; but I haven't got around to doing anything with it. I operate it every now and again on ECS as a 'visitor' that somehow got onto the GN section. On level track it will start and move at a realistically slow speed (scale for 10 to 15 mph) 11 Bachmann mk1 coaches. These it starts with a realistic half turn or two of wheelslip 'all by itself' a neat effect you won't see with rubber on the rails. (Twelve coaches will see it slip a lot, and it won't start thirteen.)

 

Any gradient immediately throws it out of balance of course, and traction is much compromised. However I don't see much to complain of in this performance; and here's the kicker: Hornby's mechanism layout is far from optimal, a better weight concentration over the driving wheels is possible, were the motor in the firebox, and the decoder socket in the bunker. Optimal design choices in mechanism layout and materials can deliver on all metal wheels would be my suggestion.

[GWR8700]

12 hours ago, adb968008 said:

It doesn’t pull very much either.

It doesn’t need to.  I’ve not seen 1Ps pulling any more than 3 carriages in any photos.

[Compound2632]

9 minutes ago, GWR8700 said:

It doesn’t need to.  I’ve not seen 1Ps pulling any more than 3 carriages in any photos.

 

Look here: https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/lms/mrknpreg246.htm

 

In the Birmingham suburban area, most services were worked by 4 or 6-coach sets of 48 ft carriages (of the Ratio type) from 1908/9 until sometime around the 1930s; admittedly by the time W.L. Good was active, c. 1920, most photos show the 2000 Class 0-6-4Ts on these services but there's evidence of 0-4-4Ts working at least some - especially on the Evesham line.

 

The Manchester South District suburban services used 9-coach sets of these 48 ft carriages from 1902; until the introduction of the 2000 Class, as far as I'm aware these were worked by 0-4-4Ts. Manningham's horde of 0-4-4Ts had to pull the 6-coach clerestory sets of 1898-1902. From their introduction, the condensing engines worked trains from Moorgate out onto the Midland main line. These used 11 or 12-coach sets - but 4-wheelers!

[PenrithBeacon]

2 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

... I may be wrong, but I believe this is the first use of traction tyres on a newly tooled Bachmann OO product, after near 30 years of metal driven wheels.

 

...

Bachmann use them on the Wickham Trolley. They're pretty unobtrusive.

Cheers

Edited December 14, 2019 by PenrithBeacon
Grammar

[NHY 581]

3 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

... or improve the RTR offering themselves.

 

Actually, I disagree strongly with your third point: there is always a place for a critical appreciation of a model; if there is something that is wrong, it is right that attention should be drawn to it. Bad models are made when knowledgeable men to keep silence.

 

 

Bachmann have done as well as the compromises of RTR permit with several models of ex-Midland locomotives in LMS and BR condition. They have issued the 3F and 4F (but not the  Compound*) in Midland livery; have they in fact made other changes to ensure that these represent Midland condition? This is the first time they have had a Midland-condition variant among the first issue of a model.

 

*The NRM Exclusive, of which I am a happy owner, represents No. 1000 in 1950s onwards preserved condition.

 

Points noted and yes, critical appreciation is one thing but there are those on this site who go on ad nauseum. That's what I find hard to stomach.

 

Re the Midland/ ex- Midland locos, did I miss the 3F in Midland livery?

 

As in tender loco? 

 

Wouldn't mind tracking down one of these ( to re-badge to S&DJR...)

 

Rob. 

[Steamport Southport]

27 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

Points noted and yes, critical appreciation is one thing but there are those on this site who go on ad nauseum. That's what I find hard to stomach.

 

Re the Midland/ ex- Midland locos, did I miss the 3F in Midland livery?

 

As in tender loco? 

 

Wouldn't mind tracking down one of these ( to re-badge to S&DJR...)

 

Rob. 

 

There was a Midland 3F in the bargains recently. I went for the LMS version instead.

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/p/51180/31-627B-Bachmann-Class-3F-Steam-Locomotive-number-3520-LMS

 

There's currently a Midland 4F reduced at Kernow.

 

http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/p/51184/31-883-Bachmann-Midland-Class-4F-Steam-Locomotive-number-3848

 

 

EDIT: Seems that's wrong. I thought they had released a Midland version with large tender numerals. Seems not.

 

 

 

Jason

Edited December 14, 2019 by Steamport Southport